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X3 E83 (2004 - 2010)
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  #1  
Old 10-27-2013, 10:59 PM
Hatzenbach Hatzenbach is offline
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P0174 (and sometime P0171) what next?

Hi,

I am getting either P0174 or P0174 AND P0171 every other day (I read and then delete then with a code reader)
I already replaced the intake boot a few thousand miles ago when I had the same symptoms which took care of it (until now)
Next thing I did was to clean the MAF which didn't help
The car feels down on power

What are the next logical steps to do?
O2 sensors?
Replace MAF?

Thanks
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  #2  
Old 10-28-2013, 12:04 AM
wowturtleswow wowturtleswow is offline
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try checking the intake manifold for a leak in the gasket, letting air seep through.
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  #3  
Old 10-28-2013, 04:29 AM
todd92 todd92 is offline
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There are plenty of threads on lean codes. Search.

It can only be intake leaks (which can occur multiple other places than the intake boot), fuel pump failing or pre-cat O2 sensors getting lazy.

If the codes appear at start up/idle it's leaks or fuel pump. The idle may also be rough. If the codes appear during cruise it's most likely the O2 sensors.

I don't get why people clean MAF sensors and/or replace them. They almost never fail and you can damage them cleaning them incorrectly, creating a new problem in the process.
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  #4  
Old 10-28-2013, 04:49 AM
joylove joylove is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todd92 View Post
I don't get why people clean MAF sensors and/or replace them. They almost never fail and you can damage them cleaning them incorrectly, creating a new problem in the process.
You have to be quite a gorilla to break them once you know they are a bit fragile. A cotton Q Tip and a dose of IPA or other electircal cleaner turns contacts that look like the image below, into bare metal wires.

[Yes this is from a Toyota, and yes there is a second hidden sensor on this unit]



The difference in the functionality between a clean sensor and a contaminated one can be significant, which is not surprising considering how they work and the power they have over the A/F mixture.

Last edited by joylove; 10-28-2013 at 04:51 AM.
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  #5  
Old 10-28-2013, 05:15 AM
todd92 todd92 is offline
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How do suppose a MAF gets dirty? Unless you're driving around with no air filter and then you've got much bigger problems.
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  #6  
Old 10-28-2013, 08:04 AM
Hatzenbach Hatzenbach is offline
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Is there a way to check O2 sensors, or is it basically just replacing them?
I am at 90k miles, so they're probably at the end of their lives

About the MAF: I cleaned it with electronics spray cleaner and I did this as in my other car (Boxster) they are notorious to get dirty, so figured why not?
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  #7  
Old 10-28-2013, 08:29 AM
Burning2nd Burning2nd is offline
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Couple of things ... Forget the o2's your looking in the wrong spot
Don't clean your maf in the future ... It's a sure fire way to be buying a new one

Fix your air leaks ... You have vacume leaks that is all
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  #8  
Old 10-28-2013, 11:09 AM
codog2 codog2 is offline
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I was getting the 171 & 174 codes (came on twice this summer (july)within two weeks of each other).

Cleaned the MAF with MAF spary I bought at Autozone - CEL hasn't come back since.
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  #9  
Old 10-28-2013, 08:31 PM
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Ishniknork Ishniknork is offline
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Hatzenbach-

More than likely you have a cracked intake boot. The cracks are usually on the pigtail that goes to the idle air control valve.
The second place to look is the CCV valve hoses. There are 4 of them but the most likely one to fail is the bottom one that drains oil back to the dipstick.
Check out this thread for the intake boot replacement...

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=499471

...and here's some video and pictures of the CCV stuff
http://blog.bavauto.com/8003/diy-vid...lation-system/
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  #10  
Old 10-28-2013, 10:59 PM
Hatzenbach Hatzenbach is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishniknork View Post
Hatzenbach-

More than likely you have a cracked intake boot. The cracks are usually on the pigtail that goes to the idle air control valve.
The second place to look is the CCV valve hoses. There are 4 of them but the most likely one to fail is the bottom one that drains oil back to the dipstick.
Check out this thread for the intake boot replacement...

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=499471

...and here's some video and pictures of the CCV stuff
http://blog.bavauto.com/8003/diy-vid...lation-system/
Thanks,

as I wrote in my initial post I replaced the intake boot a couple thousand miles ago, so I rule that one out. OK, replacing CVV looks like a major PITA
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  #11  
Old 10-29-2013, 03:01 AM
wowturtleswow wowturtleswow is offline
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to answer your question about checking the o2, you can check it by reading the voltages right at the o2 sensor or by observing them with a scan tool. but check for leaks first. KISS keep it simple stupid
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  #12  
Old 10-29-2013, 08:19 AM
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mlukas161 mlukas161 is offline
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Can you pull the DISA out and visually inspect the flap? That may be a culprit and its a free and easy check.
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  #13  
Old 10-29-2013, 09:05 PM
Hatzenbach Hatzenbach is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wowturtleswow View Post
to answer your question about checking the o2, you can check it by reading the voltages right at the o2 sensor or by observing them with a scan tool. but check for leaks first. KISS keep it simple stupid
what's a good range for the voltage?
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  #14  
Old 10-29-2013, 09:05 PM
Hatzenbach Hatzenbach is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlukas161 View Post
Can you pull the DISA out and visually inspect the flap? That may be a culprit and its a free and easy check.
sounds easy enough, thanks
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  #15  
Old 11-01-2013, 05:39 PM
Hatzenbach Hatzenbach is offline
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quick update:
couple of days ago it occurred to me that I forgot to reset the SES light after cleaning the MAF. (I thought I had, but going down memory lane I am now pretty sure that I forgot).
Low and behold: I reset the SES a couple of days ago and no new SES light since (usually it came back within 24h), keeping fingers crossed....
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  #16  
Old 11-02-2013, 11:28 AM
wowturtleswow wowturtleswow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatzenbach View Post
what's a good range for the voltage?
on a warm engine, it should fluctuate between 200-800 mV, and never over 1V
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