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E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #176  
Old 07-25-2012, 12:25 PM
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champaign777 champaign777 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fernanm View Post
could this bushing connecting to front tie rod be the cause of my shimmy ? I have replaced some many bushing/controlls arms and road force balancing yet the shimmy exist. All oem on car. The gap on this bushing concerns me that it is worn out but could it really be noticeable with a consistent shimmy at even low speed ?

[IMG]Photobucket[/IMG]
You are correct
this will give very slight feeling of steering wheel shimmy on any speed !!
not a vibration !!

I cant explain the feeling but it's like your steering wheel is not hard in your hands and you feel every road unperfection
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Last edited by champaign777; 07-25-2012 at 12:30 PM.
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  #177  
Old 07-25-2012, 02:20 PM
fernanm fernanm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acoste View Post
It's worn but I don't think that could cause anything when going straight.
Are you talking about a vibration or you just don't feel the suspension tight enough? This bushing could cause a feeling like that when hard cornering. Rear ball joins also cause "loose" feeling.

I would check the following things in this order: rim runout out of spec, road force balance with tire-rim matching, wheel centered on hub, control arm bushings, ball joints, tie rod and steering rack play, rotors, wheel bearings. Struts cause vibration only if they are really really bad.

If you had driven the car with vibration for a long time, the tires can be unevenly worn and cause vibration even with good suspension.
Thank you for the guidance. The vibration I am getting is at all speeds including under 40mph it very subtle but at 55-75+ its worse , on a scale of 1-10 around a 4. Feels more like bouncing then a shake. I suspect if could have to do with something in driveshaft or steering rack. I had new front rotors/ 4 (rear)+4 (front) control arms put in already and made no difference. Two sets of new tires Bridgestones and now Continental DSW.
Rim straightening at two different places. Road force balancing two different places.

The car never had this problem before 130K now has 138K and never in in accident. So I had had about 8K of this problem.

Last episode I went to three places in one day. BMW specialist shop for suspension inspection, said nothing wrong with my suspension its your tires they have a hop on them they also said not to put the Continental DSW on my car. Went to the tire place of purchase, they spin them and say no its all your rims.Went to a different rim straightening place this time (RimPro) and they said only one rim was bad and straightened it and noted that one my tire was lumpy. Went back to tire place and they put the lumpy tire on road force and said it was able to balance. Tireplace told me to get an another alignment to see if that will fix it ? (WTF) I know about cars and alignment has nothing to do with this I would sure hope not. Car drives straight already. I originally did not when this first started at TownFair Tire hope they did not screw me in all this.

My bearings don't make any noise nor do the struts been bouncy when going over big dips on the road. I absolutely love this car it is mint always garaged and inside is like new sport. Absolutely stunning but this will may make be unload it. I have been going to reputable shops only one of them was a BMW specialist going to another shop as the last hope http://www.aceperformancesystems.com/.
Keeping my fingers cross.
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  #178  
Old 07-25-2012, 02:36 PM
fernanm fernanm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by champaign777 View Post
You are correct
this will give very slight feeling of steering wheel shimmy on any speed !!
not a vibration !!

I cant explain the feeling but it's like your steering wheel is not hard in your hands and you feel every road unperfection
Correct the vibration is at any speed gets worse at higher speed it shakes/bounces both the steering wheel and driver seat and I do feel every road imperfection.

You are on the money with the description of what I am experiencing its not so much a shimmy but a bounciness. Think you may be right about this bushing being the culprit. Thank you much man!
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  #179  
Old 07-25-2012, 02:56 PM
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champaign777 champaign777 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fernanm View Post
Correct the vibration is at any speed gets worse at higher speed it shakes/bounces both the steering wheel and driver seat and I do feel every road imperfection.

You are on the money with the description of what I am experiencing its not so much a shimmy but a bounciness. Think you may be right about this bushing being the culprit. Thank you much man!
+ sway bar LINKS
yap , bounciness is the right word , post us updated
I replaced my front sway bar with EOM M sway bar together with new OEM bushings and the steering wheel feels just right now
It feels the same as my fried 2009 535i with 35k miles

And don't forget we talk about car with a healthy suspension where bounciness is the only LAST issue
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would check the following things in this order: rim runout out of spec, road force balance with tire-rim matching, wheel centered on hub, control arm bushings,
ball joints, tie rod and steering rack play, rotors, wheel bearings. Struts cause vibration only if they are really really bad.
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Last edited by champaign777; 07-25-2012 at 07:17 PM.
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  #180  
Old 07-26-2012, 12:08 PM
sublimed sublimed is offline
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I know I'm new but I just wanted to say THANK YOU to the author of this thread. I just went through the biggest PITA overhaul on a car in my life and it wouldn't be complete without you. I also think my car shakes have been cured and most defiantly the wanders. I will say everything I replaced was shot. I don't think one thing was causing my walking and shaking problems but here is what I did and it worked for me.

The car has 130k

Front control arm all were very loose and were replaced at 90k I don't know if the after market ones are just junk or if it was a cause and effect thing but they only had about 40k on them. So I replaced them.
I did the front brakes and rebuilt the calipers did a huge bleed and now my pedal feel is back and no pulse.
I replaced the front steering rack with a low mile used rack. The old one leaked and had noticeable play when compared to the newer one.
The entire rear suspension in the same way as this tutorial. Most of the same parts were bad. When pressing in the new ball joints slow and steady is the only way without them binding.
The engine and tranny mounts were GONE The drivers side engine mount was the only one that was still one piece.

I had a couple break downs and fbomb fits along the way but it is done. Again I want to say thank you to the author of this tutorial you saved my sanity!!

Last edited by sublimed; 07-26-2012 at 12:13 PM.
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  #181  
Old 08-15-2012, 03:46 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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The last post to this thread was almost three years ago.

Just as the past three years has seen the technology drop the price of code scanners to less than $20 today, I opened three tool-related threads today to find out the following:
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  #182  
Old 03-16-2013, 01:19 PM
mjbennett9 mjbennett9 is offline
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CN90,

I was admiring your screw type jack stands. I did a quick google--very expensive! oh well. But question since it looks like you have a few jack stands on the car. Did you also put jack stands at the normal change tire points (just behind the wheel well at the rubber pad points? or just sub-frame? I'm probably over doing it, but was thinking jack stands at tire changing points, and either another set of jack stands at sub-frame, or maybe even two bottle jacks at sub-frame. I own one set of jack stands but looking to get a 2nd or bottle jacks for a little more money. Or would you reverse it? i.e. two jack stands on the sub frame and a bottle jack on each side at the tire changing points?

If there's room, I'll also use my racing jack from HF to put under the engine jack point too (extra security blanket). :-)
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  #183  
Old 03-16-2013, 07:06 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjbennett9 View Post
I was admiring your screw type jack stands
See also:
- How and where to jack up the BMW E39 with pictures of jack pads & jacking points (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) & jack stands (1)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cn90 View Post
In addition to the 3-ton jackstands above, I also have a bottle jackstand for quick job, extremely sturdy because it is solid steel!
It is rated for [b[5 tons[/b] and is $34 at Harbor Freight; very easy to adjust. I have used it a lot and like it.

http://www.harborfreight.com/5-ton-s...ack-99953.html

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  #184  
Old 03-17-2013, 08:29 AM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Harbor Freight no longer carries Screw Jack.

Norther Tool sells it for $50:
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/too...duct_200318899


Just google "Torin Support Jack - 5-Ton, Model# SJ05".
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  #185  
Old 03-22-2013, 04:13 PM
josemedeiros007 josemedeiros007 is offline
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Bisltein Sport Struts, or Koni Sport Struts that are externally adjustable?

CN90: Excellent write up, and post. It was very helpful in replacing my lower control arms.
What struts do people prefer Bilstein Sport Struts, http://www.bilstein.com , or Koni Sport Struts that are externally adjustable, http://www.koni-na.com/index.cfm ?
Ride Quality differences?
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  #186  
Old 03-25-2013, 07:05 PM
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For the record, so that others find this more easily, the following was updated today for a '99 528i/5-spd M52TU:

Quote:
Originally Posted by pleiades View Post
Rajaie has a great write-up over at Beisan Systems on changing out e39 thrust arm bushings with the arms still installed on the car. I'm posting my experience here (long) in case anyone else might be thinking of trying Rajaie's approach.

Conventional wisdom is that you need to remove the thrust arms and replace the bushings with a shop press. If you are pulling the arms, though, you probably should be prepared to replace them outright as removal can damage the ball joints. I decided to give the "bushings only" Beisan procedure a shot for several reasons.

- I'd just replaced my struts a couple weeks back and didn't want to lift them out of the hub to pop the arm ball joints.
- I know the arms are at end-of-life but their ball joints are still good.
- I'm cheap. Perhaps the cheapest e39 owner, ever....

I installed a pair of Rein aftermarket bushings made in China. They seem identical in build to the Boges I pressed out. I may end up replacing the entire thrust arms within a year or two anyway but that depends on how well these Reins hold up.

The Beisan procedure calls for a 5-ton 3-jaw gear puller, a special pipe cap, and a press sleeve. I already had the puller. Since I have an i6 car, I bought the 1.5" socket weld cap recommended in the procedure from a local industrial plumbing supplier for $7, and tried to order the press sleeve tool through my local BMW dealer. [Note: the procedure calls for different-sized or psi-rated caps & BMW sleeve tools for the i6 and v8 cars....]

However, my local dealer refuses to order any "tools" so, before placing an order online, I investigated the O.D. specs for socket weld couplings and found that certain 1.5" couplings (full or half) in the 3000 psi category have an O.D. of 57.25 mm -- about .75 mm less than the BMW press sleeve but still wide enough to match up well with the outer steel shells of the bushings. My local plumbing supply had one 3000-psi "full" coupling in stock, for $5. A "half" coupling might be preferable (they're shorter) if your puller is on the small side. If you visit a plumbing supply to get socket weld fittings, take your calipers....

I followed the Beisan procedure pretty much as written. (Aside: Rajaie mentions a hidden, hard-to-reach screw that's holding the front of the air duct on the driver's side. I accessed it from the front of the car bumper, pulling off the small grille piece, loosening the brake duct and getting a socket on it in plain sight.)

All the pre- and post-press steps of this procedure take far more time (hours) than the actual press work, which will be over in only minutes if all goes well. Pressing these bushings in and out of the arms with the tools described was a piece of cake even though I had to do it on my back (of course, with the car on jackstands). I'd say the only thing "hard" about it is getting the sleeve, cap, and puller all lined up and sorted on the thrust arm, but even that is nothing to fuss about.

I've been out and about with the car, have not yet gotten an alignment, but have driven on the expressway at 85 mph and have no vibrations or shimmies (my car didn't have any beforehand). At that speed, the car feels really settled, as if it were going much slower .... Now I know why these cars need an autobahn.

Some Observations

Whether you are replacing the arms entirely or just doing the bushings, you still have all that pre- and post-install work involved.... For the actual bushing press work, using the Beisan approach, after I had the control arm unbolted (bushing end) and lashed to its adjacent tie-rod with thick twine, I spent approx. 10 minutes total per side pressing the old bushing out and the new one in. The time factor here really boils down to how smoothly you are able to line up and center or square all the pieces (puller, cap, sleeve) against the thrust arm. When pressing the new bushing in, I made sure the puller jaws grabbing the other side of the thrust arm would not interfere with the leading edge of the bushing as it came through and exited the bore.

The rubber chambers in the old original (1999) Boges I took out were cracked in several *inside* and outside spots and had leaked out all their fluid (only dried residue inside). I didn't notice the inner cracks until I cut one bushing in half (cross-sectional) with a hacksaw to see how they're constructed. The outer shells are stainless steel and the square inner core the bolt passes through is aluminum.
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  #187  
Old 04-07-2013, 01:59 PM
Takechan Takechan is offline
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Did this.

Cost me 12 hours and a sore wrist. Even thought I prepped all the bolts and nuts with WD-40 a few days prior to the R&R, I ended using all day with a pickle fork, wrenches, and a big hammer

The only ball joint removal tool available (which I bought) was too small!

Thanks for the DIY - it runs pretty straight but the steering wheel is pointing left I'll get it aligned on Monday.

When tightening the bolts on the bushings I lowered the car unto two jack stands which rested on each hub - I had lots of room to fit a torque wrench
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Last edited by Takechan; 04-07-2013 at 02:01 PM.
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  #188  
Old 05-29-2013, 01:56 PM
bmw4te bmw4te is offline
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Hi all,

About to approach the front suspension overhaul ...

Has anyone used the Meyle HD Control Arm (the whole thing, not just the bushing) ? Both Meyle HD and Lemfoerder control arms are roughly same price so a bit undecided which one to buy.

I know EAC does a Meyle HD bushing + Lemfoerder control arm combo but it is just too expensive (like $100+ more). For that difference in price, I would rather take my chances.

Thank you.
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  #189  
Old 05-29-2013, 04:45 PM
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GSA1 GSA1 is offline
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Go with Lemforder. Its OEM. They will be good as new. HD bushings are nice, not necessary
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  #190  
Old 05-29-2013, 10:41 PM
josemedeiros007 josemedeiros007 is offline
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I just replaced my lower and upper control arms ( also called Thrust arms on Rock Auto ) and I used Moog control arms that I bought from Rock Auto for about $50.00 each. When I can afford to replace the Thrust arm bushings with Meyle HD bushings or Poly Urethane Bushings I will.

My lower factory control arm snapped in half while driving and making a U-turn, granted the Thrust arm bushings were gone ( unknown to me at the time ), and the vibration I had at highway speeds was misdiagnosed by the alignment shop as a bent wheel which is not bent.)

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/att...5&d=1369888663

If I had the money, I would have replaced my control arms with the Meyle control arms with HD bushings.
http://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw-...FSeCQgodTwwAbg



BMW E39 Thrust Arm Bushings Replacement
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  #191  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:46 AM
jnyost jnyost is offline
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The Meyle control arms have junk ball joints and the OEM Lemforder arms have bushings that are fluid filled and fail early. That's why people run the Lemforder arms with the HD bushings. It's the best of both worlds.
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  #192  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:06 AM
caryalon caryalon is offline
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I've used the Meyle HD arms - they were great. Better bushings and a 4 year warranty.

Not sure why there's a perception that the ball joints are junk - not my experience.
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  #193  
Old 06-21-2013, 12:13 PM
stecz stecz is offline
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front-end alignment question...

As I'm rebuilding the suspension, I don't see any provision for camber or caster adjusement, Do I just need to worry about toe?

Also, re: the rotational alignment of the strut and the lower spring seat... The only thing I can see that matters on that is that the spring seat doesn't hit the tire and it doesn't hit the inside of the strut tower, correct? I don't see how it could affect suspension geometry, but wanted to make sure I was looking at it right.

Why they didn't just make the darned thing round, I'll never know.
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  #194  
Old 01-26-2014, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stecz View Post
I don't see any provision for camber or caster adjusement, Do I just need to worry about toe?
The answer is covered, in gory detail, over here:
- Which of the dozen alignment specs are adjustable on the BMW E39 (1)

I know most people don't weight the car, during these alignment tests, but if you want ballast, water seemed to work well for me.
- One users quest to diagnose uneven tire wear on the inside edge due to excessive and uneven alignment camber & toe (1) (2)




See also:
- Which of the dozen alignment specs are adjustable on the BMW E39 (1) (pdf) & cn90's front (1) (2) and rear (1) wheel alignment DIYs & how to keep the steering wheel (SW) straight during home alignment (1) (2) & what tools measure rear camber at home (1) (2) and what tools measure front/rear toe at home (1) & what tools lock the steering wheel & brake pedal at home (1) & the theory of alignment with weights (1) or without adding weight (1) (2) (3) & philosophically why most people prefer to let a professional alignment shop align their suspension (1) & what expensive equipment is used at the stealer to align your suspension (1) (pdf) & Internet references for how to DIY caster, camber & toe at home (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) (11) (12) (13) (14) (15) (16) (17) (18) (19) (20) (21) (22) (23) (24) (25) (26) (27) (28) (29) (30) (31) (32) (33) (34) (35) (36) (37) (38) (39)
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  #195  
Old 01-31-2014, 10:48 AM
Dewight813 Dewight813 is offline
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Great DIY...
I just did Bilsteins on my 2003 525i and what a difference. I did the control arms and drilled rotors/pads. I have 160k on the car and it drives better than new.
Great shocks, not stiff, improved handling and ride. I was afraid I would loose the smooth ride on the highway, but the old shocks were definitely shot.
Paying the extra freight on better shocks is worth it, especially with all the work that is involved with the labor.
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  #196  
Old 02-02-2014, 06:23 AM
Eurobahn Motorsports Eurobahn Motorsports is offline
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Thumbs up

Yes it's definitely worth it at end , Don't Forget to get a wheel Alignment Done
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  #197  
Old 02-03-2014, 03:16 PM
Dewight813 Dewight813 is offline
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Yes, I had the garage do the alignment. Save a lot on tire wear with the alignment, which should be done after our severe winter months too. The pot holes in PA are really bad this year.
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  #198  
Old 03-25-2014, 01:15 PM
josemedeiros007 josemedeiros007 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by josemedeiros007 View Post
I just replaced my lower and upper control arms ( also called Thrust arms on RockAuto) and I used Moog control arms that I bought from Rock Auto for about $50.00 each. When I can afford to replace the Thrust arm bushings with Meyle HD bushings or Poly Urethane Bushings I will.

My lower factory control arm snapped in half while driving and making a U-turn, granted the Thrust arm bushings were gone ( unknown to me at the time ), and the vibration I had at highway speeds was misdiagnosed by the alignment shop as a bent wheel.)

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/att...5&d=1369888663

If I had the money, I would have replaced my control arms with the Meyle control arms with HD bushings.
http://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw-...FSeCQgodTwwAbg

I just replaced my passenger side upper thrust arm & lower control arm, and was wondering what might be causing this wear on the thrust arms, I know that this sounds crazy, but it looks like some one took a die grinder and ground the control arm in hopes that it would snap while I am driving. I checked the inner wheels and see no scraping marks, which should be there if that was what caused the gouge on the arm. All four control arms I replaced have a BMW logo, and part number on them so they are probably the original upper and lower control arms.
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  #199  
Old 05-14-2014, 10:26 PM
LaMaison LaMaison is offline
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  #200  
Old 07-19-2014, 08:04 PM
Herb40 Herb40 is offline
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Bent shaft of DS control rod during (planned) replacement

I am doing a front brake job (rotors and pads) and replacing the thrust arm, control arm, and sway bar end links on my '97 528 (213K miles). Five of the six ball joints pressed out fine with the HF tool (the two tie rod BJs have to be removed, too). However, the last one, the DS control arm BJ didn't pop out. I had the nut flush with the end of the shaft and was pressing there, but the shaft bent rather than press out.

I realized too late what was happening. The nut was removable but the curvature of the shaft was severe. I knew it would not be removable as-is. So I removed the nut and sawed off the shaft just above the big washer under the nut, hoping that the curvature did not extend all the way down. The washer was removable, but the curvature extended through it and all the way down to where the shaft enters the sleeve in the steering knuckle.

I replaced the thick OE washer with a thinner one and sawed the shaft off again above that washer, leaving about 3/16" of shaft above the sleeve. I cleaned up the shaft with a Dremel tool and tried pressing again, but to no avail. The deflection of the shaft at the top of the sleeve is between 1/32" and 1/16" (that is, about 3/64"). The fork end of the HF tool is too narrow to allow the sleeve to press out, and the BJ shaft won't move through the sleeve because of the bend.

I figure that my only options are to press out the sleeve with the BJ attached, or to remove the knuckle and take it to a machine shop. I'm trying to do this "by myself" so don't like the machine shop approach, especially since I have already done about 3/4 of the work on that side. I can buy the BMW BJ tool for $149 + $15 shipping, but I do not know whether one of the two forks is wide enough to allow the sleeve to be pressed out. Does anyone know whether this is possible? That sleeve will be unusable, of course, but I figure that my local indy shop (very cooperative and happy to help) will be able to order a replacement. Does this sound like a reasonable approach, or is there something I am missing? Thanks in advance for your help (and I've been using a lot of it already, what with Blubee's brake info and CN90's front end DIY!)

Last edited by Herb40; 07-19-2014 at 08:10 PM. Reason: correct typos
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