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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
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  #26  
Old 05-16-2014, 09:16 PM
AM5161 AM5161 is offline
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nothing works from frm

.

Last edited by AM5161; 05-29-2014 at 08:47 PM. Reason: .
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  #27  
Old 05-17-2014, 05:40 AM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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Originally Posted by AM5161 View Post
I have been stuck with this problem for weeks. BMW specialists say theres no communication with the FRM. Dealer will charge me 150 per hour to inspect which is very expensive. Everything was fine until one mechanic played around with the fuses because the car was not starting then finally with a boost it started but then this problem came up. No lights, backup camera, signals, windows dont go down from front, etc..

Exactly how was it boosted?
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  #28  
Old 05-17-2014, 06:10 AM
AM5161 AM5161 is offline
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I

Last edited by AM5161; 05-29-2014 at 08:45 PM. Reason: I
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  #29  
Old 05-17-2014, 06:23 AM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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I wasn't there myself and obviously no one wants to say they were the one to mess it up. I had both right side doors changed since my old doors had pot lights under the handles so we used the original wiring harness. I live in toronto have been to 4 specialists so far and nothing. If my frm is fried they should atleast tell me so I can get it fixed.

Doors changed?
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  #30  
Old 05-17-2014, 07:32 AM
AM5161 AM5161 is offline
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A

Last edited by AM5161; 05-29-2014 at 08:44 PM. Reason: a
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  #31  
Old 01-23-2017, 08:13 AM
Caspido Caspido is offline
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FRM suspects

Hi guys, am driving a bmw e87 118i.
am also having the same problem whereby all my windows can't open or close, am getting a sign that these a door open while all doors are well closed, My front lights are always On, can't even lock my car using the car remote, indicates light are also. Not working. But my roadio is working just fine also as the fan

Last edited by Caspido; 01-23-2017 at 09:03 AM.
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  #32  
Old 01-23-2017, 08:31 AM
gogglespisano gogglespisano is offline
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Originally Posted by Caspido View Post
Hi guys, am also having the same problem whereby all my windows can't open or close, am getting a sign that these a door open while all doors are well closed, My front lights are always On, can't even lock my car using the car remote, indicates light are also. Not working. But my roadio is working just fine also as the fan
Most, if not all of those functions are controlled be the JBE. I had a wiper relay that broke inside and the metal bouncing around shorted out the power and fed it back to the JBE. That killed the door locks and windows.

Fortunately I was able to replace the $1 chip on the JBE to fix it.



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  #33  
Old 01-23-2017, 09:04 AM
Caspido Caspido is offline
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Does this mean my footwell module (FRM) needs to be replaced
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  #34  
Old 01-23-2017, 09:13 AM
gogglespisano gogglespisano is offline
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Originally Posted by Caspido View Post
Does this mean my footwell module (FRM) needs to be replaced
I can't say, but in my case the problem was only in the JBE. The JBE drives things like locks, windows, mirrors, washers, wipers and picks up sensors for many of them.
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  #35  
Old 01-23-2017, 09:56 AM
Caspido Caspido is offline
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But my wipers work's just fine, that's what surprises me,Ey.
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  #36  
Old 01-23-2017, 10:00 AM
gogglespisano gogglespisano is offline
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Originally Posted by Caspido View Post
But my wipers work's just fine, that's what surprises me,Ey.
It may not be the JBE. The JBE drives the locks and windows, but isn't in complete control of them. There are other modules involved in the end to end control of the windows, locks, etc.

In my case, not all of the the things that the JBE controls were affected. Different chips drive different parts of the car.
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  #37  
Old 01-23-2017, 10:04 AM
Caspido Caspido is offline
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Thanks bro, I'll get my Machanical to check it out tomorrow then will give you feed back.
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  #38  
Old 01-23-2017, 12:36 PM
fdriller9 fdriller9 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gogglespisano View Post
Most, if not all of those functions are controlled be the JBE. I had a wiper relay that broke inside and the metal bouncing around shorted out the power and fed it back to the JBE. That killed the door locks and windows.

Fortunately I was able to replace the $1 chip on the JBE to fix it.



The JBE is a power distribution module. It only supplies power. It does not control any of those features.

FRM controls windows, side mirrors, and lighting. CAS controls door locks.
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  #39  
Old 01-23-2017, 12:40 PM
gogglespisano gogglespisano is offline
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Originally Posted by fdriller9 View Post
The JBE is a power distribution module. It only supplies power. It does not control any of those features.
The JBE is not just a power distribution module.

The JBE may not logically control the locks, windows, etc., but it absolutely has the driver chips that turn the motors/solenoids on/off. That's confirmed by the documentation and the actual hardware that I've personally repaired. It also is the direct input of several switches.
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  #40  
Old 01-23-2017, 12:44 PM
fdriller9 fdriller9 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gogglespisano View Post
The JBE is not just a power distribution module.

The JBE may not logically control the locks, windows, etc., but it absolutely has the driver chips that turn the motors/solenoids on/off. That's confirmed by the documentation and the actual hardware that I've personally repaired. It also is the direct input of several switches.
Those are solid state relays. They are only switching power, based on control logic from other modules.
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  #41  
Old 01-23-2017, 12:52 PM
gogglespisano gogglespisano is offline
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Originally Posted by fdriller9 View Post
Those are solid state relays. They are only switching power, based on control logic from other modules.
They are not solid state relays. They are open collector drivers. Quite distant electronic part cousins. They are controlled through the communications bus to the JBE, a non-trival bit of hardware and far more than a solid state relay. If you're going to use that definition of power distribution, that they only switch power, then the only things you would consider controllers are the switch inputs.

As I said earlier, they are not the end to end control, Many subsystems of the car use multiple modules to run windows, locks, headlights, etc.

To only consider the input or primary logic module when troubleshooting a malfunction is very short sighted.
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  #42  
Old 01-23-2017, 01:03 PM
fdriller9 fdriller9 is online now
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The drivers are only processing inputs and making status available to other modules over various CAN networks. The relays are what actually control power distribution and are controlled over CAN by other modules.

I'm not here to argue. If you want to read more about JBE, look here: http://www.bimmerscan.com/bmw-junction-box-jbe/
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  #43  
Old 01-23-2017, 01:08 PM
gogglespisano gogglespisano is offline
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You actually confirmed what I said about the bus communications, but for the end to end control, any failure point will cause a malfunction.

If you want to read about the "solid state relays" which are actually open collector drivers, you can read about them here. There are no solid state relays in the JBE.

http://www.st.com/resource/en/datasheet/ulq2004.pdf
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  #44  
Old 01-23-2017, 01:45 PM
gogglespisano gogglespisano is offline
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My case is actually a good example of why you need to consider more than just the most related component to the symptoms.

My symptom was wipers, door locks, windows became intermittent, but would all work at times, for many days.

How many techs would have said the wiper relay was the problem? My guess is none.

First of all it was intermittent so they probably would have returned the car and said they found no problem. At some point they might have replaced the JBE since all of those items are driven by the JBE. They would have been partly correct, but the problem would have persisted.

The wiper relay still functioned. The small piece of metal that broke off was not essential to it's operation, but bouncing around inside the relay would cause a circuit without fuse protection to get a hard short. The fuse for wipers is after the relay, not between the relay and the JBE.
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