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Z4M: Is this kind of pad wear normal?

3K views 24 replies 6 participants last post by  pal 
#1 ·
I just took off the XP-10s from my Z4MC front brakes and noticed that the outer pads were more worn compared to the inner pads (3/16" vs about 4/16"). Is this a normal wear pattern?
 
#2 ·
That's the opposite wear pattern I see with my PF-01 track pads; slightly more wear on the inside pad.
We have "floating" calipers with a single inside piston. I find that keeping the guide pins clean and unlubricated as well as cleaning out the bushings with alcohol maximizes the sliding/floating feature of these calipers.
Of course I'm changing out brake pads 10 or 15 times a year so it isn't hard to keep everything clean. :thumbup:
 
#3 ·
My inner PF-01's wear more quickly on the inside as well.
 
#5 ·
Strange that the behavior seems to be pad specific. I switched to Hawk HT-10s for the front and will report back on how these wear.

The moral of the story seems to be that floating calipers may cause uneven wear on the inner/outer pad.
 
#6 ·
The moral of the story seems to be that floating calipers may cause uneven wear on the inner/outer pad.
May? Its a definite if you are pushing them at all. They also cause uneven leading edge/trailing edge wear. Even with perfectly lubricated slide pins.

The XP-10s aren't helping either considering how ridiculously fast carbotech pads wear.

Multi piston is your friend, duit.
 
#8 ·
I got 7 track days (5.5 really as 1.5 of them were rain events so not much heavy brake use) out of the XP-10s before they were down to about 3/16" pad depth. I think they are good pads but to me they felt a lot like an on-off switch and hence I am trying the Hawk HT-10s.

blau335 - I am having a little better luck with fade and pedal feel since I switched to Brembo LCF 600+ for fluid (from Motul RBF 600). Its still not perfect, but better. Planning to install a set of the Tyrolsport caliper stiffening kit this winter to see if it helps a bit. Else, I will probably go to the Stoptech 4 pot front kit- I just wish I had a good machinist around here that could make a Stoptech/Brembo/Porsche caliper work with the stock rotors :(
 
#10 · (Edited)
I got 7 track days (5.5 really as 1.5 of them were rain events so not much heavy brake use) out of the XP-10s before they were down to about 3/16" pad depth. I think they are good pads but to me they felt a lot like an on-off switch and hence I am trying the Hawk HT-10s.

blau335 - I am having a little better luck with fade and pedal feel since I switched to Brembo LCF 600+ for fluid (from Motul RBF 600). Its still not perfect, but better. Planning to install a set of the Tyrolsport caliper stiffening kit this winter to see if it helps a bit. Else, I will probably go to the Stoptech 4 pot front kit- I just wish I had a good machinist around here that could make a Stoptech/Brembo/Porsche caliper work with the stock rotors :(
You can get a kit that does work with the stock rotors..... UUC makes a Wilwood 4 or 6 piston kit that uses the ZCP/CSL rotors but as Blau stated the stock rotors are expensive. You could try some aftermarket rotors like "Racingbrake" rotors (http://www.racingbrake.com/Z4M_s/3370.htm) which are two piece but the stock size. The beauty of these is you can reuse the hat and just replace the rotor therefore saving a chunk of change.

I myself have never really encountered much fade even when I have had the rotors glowing red. I have a pic of the rotors glowing ferrari red which I'll have to post in this thread when I get home Currently I am just running ATE Superblue and the XP10s. On track where I get no fade my friend in his m3 gets someslight fade but i think it might be due to his fluid (Motul RBF 660)

Why would you want them to work with the stock rotors? They are overpriced and not all that great relative to the stoptechs.

I only got 12 hours from xp-13s (i think that was their designation) I went through 3 sets before giving up and getting real brakes. Some of it was because of leading edge wear and having to throw them out "early"

One set did not even last 3 hours though, I did not even check because it's unthinkable and was down to the metal (very effect braking agent by the way). This was on sebring short course though, which is brakes brakes and more brakes.
Holy only three hours? Now that is some fast brake wear! And you were also running the XP13 which is supposed to he higher performance then the xp10. I guess it was sebring though. Funny you say the metal is a effective braking agent! My buddy with the m3 ran through a set of HT10s and we didn't know untill we took the wheel off (in this case the outside pad had some meat left but in the inner one was shot) that he had no pad left. Only problem is the metal rotor and metal pad and the best of friends
 
#9 ·
Why would you want them to work with the stock rotors? They are overpriced and not all that great relative to the stoptechs.

I only got 12 hours from xp-13s (i think that was their designation) I went through 3 sets before giving up and getting real brakes. Some of it was because of leading edge wear and having to throw them out "early"



One set did not even last 3 hours though, I did not even check because it's unthinkable and was down to the metal (very effect braking agent by the way). This was on sebring short course though, which is brakes brakes and more brakes.
 
#11 · (Edited)
Why would you want them to work with the stock rotors? They are overpriced and not all that great relative to the stoptechs.

I only got 12 hours from xp-13s (i think that was their designation) I went through 3 sets before giving up and getting real brakes. Some of it was because of leading edge wear and having to throw them out "early"

One set did not even last 3 hours though, I did not even check because it's unthinkable and was down to the metal (very effect braking agent by the way). This was on sebring short course though, which is brakes brakes and more brakes.
They don't make an Xp13. You shouldn't be using anything higher than a XP10 on stock bodied Mcoupe anyway.

If you are going thru brake pads in 3 hours it might be a driver issue. Maybe you over brake.:dunno: Considering there are hundreds of drivers running Carbotechs on full race cars with more downforce and grip, it could be possible that you were doing something out of the ordinary.

You could also have not had the pads properly installed. If not bedded properly they glaze or chunk.

I have 6 track day and 8K street miles on Xp10s front and Xp8s rear. I just decided to replace them and there is still some useable pads left on the front. The rears are gone.
 
#13 ·
Silver you can't say you shouldn't be using anything higher then a certain temp brake pad and then theorize overusing the brakes as the criteria for overuse is going to change with a higher temp pad.

However. I've mentioned this before, and I thought in this thread, I did overuse the stock brakes. However a lot of people at the track corroborated that the carbotechs don't last as long.
 
#16 ·
They fade like any other pad out there. The just take longer to get there. The only time I have heard of premature wear on the carbotech has been with improper bedding. Cabotech is aware of this and now offers pads that are already pre-bedded. They charge extra for this and you have to tell them specifically what you want.
 
#17 ·
Great discussion. Just want to point out that the fade I am referring to is fluid fade; the Carbotech XP10s almost never faded for me. I also got about 5.5-7 track days and a few thou DD miles on them.

F360C - thanks for pointing me in the direction of UUC. I spoke to them and their Superlite Wilwood based 6 piston kit does indeed use the stock rotors. I may end up with that setup down the line. As for rotor prices, Stoptech or Brembo rotor rings are around the same price as new OEM 2 piece rotors from places like Tischer that list them for around 210-220 a piece. Plus I think the stock rotor design and the Racing Brake design are better than the Stoptech or Brembo.
 
#18 ·
new OEM 2 piece rotors from places like Tischer that list them for around 210-220 a piece. Plus I think the stock rotor design and the Racing Brake design are better than the Stoptech or Brembo.
The stock and especially the racing brake designs are definitely not better the stoptech.

More importantly the full upgrade gives you bigger rotors and a bigger pad face which means much decreased temperatures, which compounds to less chance of fade and less pad wear. The rotors will last much longer too and be much more resistant to cracking.

If you do more than 5-10 track days a year you should really consider them.
 
#21 ·
I've been pretty happy with the stock brakes so far on track except for some fluid fade and the pedal feel. I can work around the fade and deal with the pedal feel, but would rather not- esp. since I have had fixed 4 pots on prev cars. I think an aluminium multiple piston caliper with stock rotors should help me resolve both my issues.
 
#22 ·
I noticed on the UUC website that you also have the ability to upgrade from the stock CSL rotors to PFC direct drive rotors which are one of the best out there. I think if I ever go to this kit that I would use the stock rotors on the street and then use the PFC on the track.
 
#25 ·
OK - I have an update after using the Hawk HT-10s for about 6 track days. My driver side pads are worn a lot more than the passenger side ... I understand that the floating caliper design leads to uneven wear. But, is it partly related to types of tracks - e.g, a a clockwise track with more right handed turns causes driver side to wear more or something along those lines??

BTW, I love the HT-10s and am going to try the DTC 60's for the front next since one side is worn more than what I would be comfortable with at an HPDE. Unf the other side still has decent pad left.

Looks like my next modification is a fixed caliper kit for the front.
 
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