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E63 / E64 6 Series (2004 - 2010)
The E63/E64 BMW 6 Series builds on BMW's sporty heritage with aggressive lines and an incredible motor to back the design up. Available in coupe and convertible trims with a standard 4.8 liter engine producing 360 horsepower and 360 lb-ft of torque, the 6-series is a popular choice that exceeds expectations.

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  #101  
Old 06-03-2010, 06:56 AM
avoiceoreason avoiceoreason is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spot0814 View Post
I just put the car in a reputable local non-BMW service garage. So I am awaiting a call from them on what it's going to have to cost to fix the 'Conv Top not Locked" issue. Will post my cost estimate when I get it. I'm sure I don't want to pay BMW dealership service costs. I'm going to try to get the exact fix details for future DIY options.
Like I recommended to bayboss, I would still encourage you to call BMW NA and ask them to fix it. The worst that could happen is they would say no. The best is that they fix it and have one more record of this issue w/ the 650s.

Some posters here have noted that BMW NA has sent out reps into the field to examine some of their cars to try to figure out this problem. They are well aware of it and they may be willing to in good faith fix it without charge. Again, worth the phone call I think.

Keep us up to date on your progress/problems!

As for me, I am now on week two back from the shop without a recurrence. I have garaged it, parked it in 95 degree full sun, had it outside overnight in 40 degree weather (big temp swings hear in PA in the past two weeks), and no issues. But just to reiterate, I have not seen any relation to this issue popping up for me and weather. It has literally happened every 3-4 months after a fix, or seasonally.

I was thinking the other day that the last time this happened was when I closed the top without the engine running. Someone has mentioned battery issues here before, I wonder if there is any correlation? Not sure why there would be, but who knows.
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  #102  
Old 06-03-2010, 06:10 PM
bayboss101 bayboss101 is offline
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Well i just got off the phone with BMW na, and there is nothing they can do other then document my problem. Even though I only have 26k on the car. I'm gonna pay the 1540.00. But they said that's not a gaurntee it will fix it. I'll keep u guys updated. We don't have many options in this tiny island! Thank you guys. Much appriciate
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  #103  
Old 06-08-2010, 12:11 PM
avoiceoreason avoiceoreason is offline
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Originally Posted by bayboss101 View Post
Well i just got off the phone with BMW na, and there is nothing they can do other then document my problem. Even though I only have 26k on the car. I'm gonna pay the 1540.00. But they said that's not a gaurntee it will fix it. I'll keep u guys updated. We don't have many options in this tiny island! Thank you guys. Much appriciate
Sorry to hear that, and disappointed in BMW too. They should stand by their product, and this issue is clearly a design flaw. Yet they have failed to take responsiblity and are sticking the buyer with the repair bill.

As for me, I am now past week three and no problems. Given the typical time period between it flaring up again I figure I will be back here ranting about this issue come September.
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  #104  
Old 06-08-2010, 02:28 PM
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Without going through all 5 pages...
Did you try the BMW regional rep at all....?


I'm out here in northern cal and I cant even imagine anything like that actually happening out here...
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  #105  
Old 06-10-2010, 03:07 PM
Spot0814 Spot0814 is offline
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Got my car back, a local Houston place European Cars LTD fixed my top quickly and cheaply. Changed out and adjusted one sensor. Hope it holds up. Sensor/labor and some other stuff done for under $500.
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  #106  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:12 PM
docpaulo docpaulo is offline
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unfortunately just joined the unlocked club... the heat wave 98+ last 3 days must have caused it...
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  #107  
Old 08-16-2010, 06:09 PM
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I have a temporary fix solution (if you get tired of beeping noices everytime you go over 20mph): manually lower rear window (refer to your manual) and again, manually, start unlocking the roof. In this order. Wen you unwind the roof locking mechanism and see the sky a little - press "open roof" button and it will go down all the way and start working for some time. Note that it's extremely difficult to roll the rear window down manually. It will feel like you almost goin to break something in there or break the wrench rod. I went his route couple of times this summer. Good luck!
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  #108  
Old 08-16-2010, 07:33 PM
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TopDownInFL TopDownInFL is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petros2r View Post
I have a temporary fix solution (if you get tired of beeping noices everytime you go over 20mph): manually lower rear window (refer to your manual) and again, manually, start unlocking the roof. In this order. Wen you unwind the roof locking mechanism and see the sky a little - press "open roof" button and it will go down all the way and start working for some time. Note that it's extremely difficult to roll the rear window down manually. It will feel like you almost goin to break something in there or break the wrench rod. I went his route couple of times this summer. Good luck!
+1 - This works to reset the top.
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  #109  
Old 08-17-2010, 02:31 PM
EmM HoLLa EmM HoLLa is offline
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Just bought mine.. And I was scouring this forum before I bought it and never clicked this thread. Silly me.. I park mine outside.. Hopefully this doesnt come back to bite me during the winter months.. Im under CPO warranty so hopefully that counts for something but I will be keeping and eye on this.. We have had a very hot summer with multiple days of 100 degrees and I havent had any issues.. So hopefully I do not have any going forward.. Im keepin my fingers crossed...
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  #110  
Old 08-17-2010, 04:36 PM
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petros2r petros2r is offline
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You'll be ok. Especially with the cpo. This car does not require much maintenance.
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  #111  
Old 08-18-2010, 08:52 AM
docpaulo docpaulo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petros2r View Post
I have a temporary fix solution (if you get tired of beeping noices everytime you go over 20mph): manually lower rear window (refer to your manual) and again, manually, start unlocking the roof. In this order. Wen you unwind the roof locking mechanism and see the sky a little - press "open roof" button and it will go down all the way and start working for some time. Note that it's extremely difficult to roll the rear window down manually. It will feel like you almost goin to break something in there or break the wrench rod. I went his route couple of times this summer. Good luck!
I did this with some modifications...

rolled down the windows... had to use a wrench with the allen as it takes a bear to roll it down...

then I unlocked the convertible top but since I had no assistance I could not lift the top off the windshield... (so no I didn't see any sky)

I then went out the car and used the actual key to lock/unlock the top (turn the key and don't let go)... and the top started to store itself into the trunk and I then relocked it using the key and the top closed and the fault warning was gone...

so I wonder if just unlocking the windshield lock mechanism may be all that's needed for the above reset (may eliminate the need to roll down the rear window....

next person to have this problem give this modification a try and let us know if it works...

thanks

(got this idea since I noted that even with the fault on, turning the key made the light turn green for a few seconds and I heard a few things clicking like it wanted to move the top)
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Last edited by docpaulo; 08-18-2010 at 08:54 AM.
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  #112  
Old 08-23-2010, 03:42 PM
T645CI T645CI is offline
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645CI Top Frustrations

2005, 43,000 miles, has been in the shop 4 times in last 14 months for this. This last trip, I had to wait the weekend for the loaner car, and they could not duplicate the top not locked signal. I went to pick it up after 4 days, you guessed it, belt up, start the engine, and the light is flashing. So I hit the button and error message arrives! It's now 4 additional days later, and they say they "reprogrammed the car". They have previously replaced sensors. One time I had to drive 15 miles with it open 3 inches, on a holiday weekend, and couldn't get into the trunk or get the windows to up or down. I am so sick of this issue! I live in Oregon, I only get to use the top a short time, and yet when I do, I hold my breath and it's like playing the lottery. Will it work? It's been in the dealership the entire month of August now, because of taking it back 4 times for transmission problems. They installed a complete new transmission at 43,000 miles, thank Goodness I still have the extended warranty until January. It now drives like a BMW again, rather than a 300,000 mile truck. I've had an M-Z3 and and X5 and did not have mechanical issues. In anyone's experience, did "reprogramming" help this? It certainly did not help with the reprogramming of the transmission. The dealership has been responsive but only to the extent, we can't duplicate it, we can't fix it, we can't undo the sensors because that will void your warranty, we can't put new brakes on just because they are squeeling and driving you crazy in your convertible and no we can't put aftermarket brake pads on because you have to have the sensors that tell you when you need new brakes. Um, I can tell when I need new brakes, hello? I've bought 7 of those run flat tires at $500 per in the 4 years I've had the car. Those are my major complaints, and they add up to unreliable and time to get out before the warranty is up.
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  #113  
Old 10-10-2010, 06:16 PM
Skarv Skarv is offline
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Did you ever get any DIY info. The fix in the bulletin is quite trivial... if I only knew where to start looking on the top. Would rather not tear the whole thing apart if I can get aimed to the right place... front rail, Pillar, right or left, etc.

All help appreciated.
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  #114  
Old 10-10-2010, 07:54 PM
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TopDownInFL TopDownInFL is offline
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^ It's not a DIY fix. The sensor issue requires adjusting the sensitivity of the sensors. The only DIY's we can really help with is trying to work around the issue by essentially putting the top into various states of open or close and retrying to open (or close as the case may be) to get the car to begin working properly (albeit potentially temporarily...).
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  #115  
Old 10-11-2010, 05:40 PM
bayboss101 bayboss101 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarv View Post
Did you ever get any DIY info. The fix in the bulletin is quite trivial... if I only knew where to start looking on the top. Would rather not tear the whole thing apart if I can get aimed to the right place... front rail, Pillar, right or left, etc.

All help appreciated.
I didn't get any diy info. I ended up taking it to the stealership and it was a hall sensor that cost 78.95 and 900.00 in labor. Problems been fixed for awhile 1100.00 later. Super Wack!!!
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  #116  
Old 02-08-2011, 06:35 PM
bizpoop.com bizpoop.com is offline
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Oh no....top sensor problems

I have a 645ci and have had next to no problems with it. Until now. My extended warranty JUST expired and now the top went haywire. Window would not work, trunk will not pop, lights, chimes, etc. Dealer gave me the news today. Sensor that tells the computer the top is not locked is bad and it's $647 to replace. There's GOT to be a by-pass on this sensor right? I don't need the car to tell me that the tops not locked. I'd see that.
Can these non dealer guys fix this for less???
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  #117  
Old 02-09-2011, 10:51 AM
Spot0814 Spot0814 is offline
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Convertible Top Not Locked

I'm still having problems with mine. It's currently in "Convetible Top Not Locked" chime mode. I'm bring it in today since my local shop says to not do the top manually or try to fix it myself so they know what codes came 1st.

Past problems:
Bought used at 80k miles so not sure if it had problems before. The 1st time it happened I brought it into local European Auto Ltd and they said the sensor was bad and changed it out for like $250 fix ($150 for the sensor).

But 2nd time I read this forum and found out how to manually put top down. I also found on this forum a BMW service bulletin that detailed how to modify the top roof sensor mounting bracket to elongate the attachment holes. This I guess allows the sensor to fit closer (hopefully senses correct alignment) for less gap. Once I did this mod, I learned on this forum how to use the crank when top is closed to slightly open it, then use the key in the door lock to make the top go up and down. This worked for a few months.

3rd Next problem happened so I brought it in to my local European Auto Ltd place and they checked it and found the limit switch in the trunk top storage (more space/less space) box was loose. They tighten it and reset it and it worked for another couple months. $57/fix

4th time problem - I will know the answer soon as I'm hoping to get car to European Auto folks today.



They ask
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  #118  
Old 02-09-2011, 12:32 PM
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645/333 645/333 is offline
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Interested question

I note that all of the people having this problem seem to be in the States, have you asked any of the European users if they have the same difficulty?
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  #119  
Old 02-10-2011, 01:54 PM
Spot0814 Spot0814 is offline
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Never looked but probably can't read their strings. Mine is the back roof sensor again. Going to have to try to elongate holes on sensor mounting bracket more. Wish someone would make a hardtop replacement for our soft top and I'd just can my convertible top.

BMW - Engineering precisely to fail after warranty for years and years of repair bucks/$'s. No wonder why they pay for all in warranty servicing unlike Mercedes as their advertising says. My favourite engineered to fail module was one on the 3 series where after warranty when you get your oil changes done at Jify Lubes, etc where they didn't reset your Oil service light (LEDs) in the dash, then the yellow 3 LEDS would come on and then the red 3 LEDS would come on and eventually this over current drain would fail the same module that controls idling. So you go to junk yard after junk yard and every Idle control module had same input power diode failed. Go figure they were just not smart or didn't test that long.

So their moto should be "BMW - Engineered to Fail past Warranty" When I retire, I'm going to research and write a manual on all their sneaky little fail after warranty designs.
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  #120  
Old 02-10-2011, 02:46 PM
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Yorgi Yorgi is offline
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That's an interesting story, and I believe it because nothing would surprise me when it comes to German electronics. I've never heard of this problem though and I've been driving the 3 series since '89 (E30). What I don't understand is what is the difference between having 3 RED LEDs running all the time (no reset done after change) vs 3 GREEN LEDs running all the time (dealer oil changes with reset). I would expect the circuit running the LEDs would be identical for RED vs YELLOW vs GREEN.

This never happened to me because I change my own oil and reset my own service lights.
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  #121  
Old 02-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Spot0814 Spot0814 is offline
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Idle control module failures

Here's a description on the design on the 3 series in the 80s E30. You have a power feed input transistor to the Idle Control Module that also has the Oil Service LEDs control circuit in it. The Oil service panel of LEDs had several Green, think it was 3 Yellow next followed by 3 or so Red (Don't remember the exact number for each color). After an oil service at the dealership where they reset the module none are on. Then in some increment number of miles for example say 1500 miles, 1st green comes on, 3000 miles 2nd green, 3500 miles 3rd green 6000 miles 4th green, 7500 miles 5th green, 9000 miles 1st yellow, 10500 miles 2nd yellow, 12000 miles 3rd yellow, 13500 miles, 1st Red, 15000 miles 2nd Red & 3rd red 16500 miles. Remember these are my ballpark guesses. So if you had your oil changed at a BMW service center, you get to yellow and you change your oil and they reset it back to green so between oil changes you never have more than 1 or 2 yellow lamps on on the circuit. Now you go out of warranty and you either change the oil yourself or you paid Jiffy Lube or other drive In oil change shops that didn't have a BMW reset computer capability. So then you just watch your own Mileage and change oil every 5000-7500 miles. But since you can't reset the oil change lights they eventually end up all lit up on 100% of the time and with that lamp load and also driving other stuff like Idle control circuitry, the input transistor area of the Printed Circuit Board overheats. Higher the heat the lower the reliability of EEE parts. You put this in southern hot climates and it happens quicker (Idle control box is behind/above glove compartment so this is less of an influence on reliability. So next thing 20-40k miles past warrenty, many of these modules fry the EEE PCB input transistor. Usually EEE parts are much more reliable than that. Maybe it's a flaw in their design or maybe they are just very smart guys. I'm guessing it's the latter as millions in Idle control modules sales will prove this. All we need is a lawyer that can paper trail the number of idle control modules built minus the number of 3 series cars built and see how much at $300/unit comes out to be.
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  #122  
Old 02-22-2011, 10:38 PM
Skarv Skarv is offline
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I just had to come back and report on some insane BMW policy. My convertible works well now, essentially $900 later. Not surprising given what I've seen elsewhere in this thread. What is insane is that the car is a CPO so I figured... no problem except the problem of going down there and the headache of leaving it with them for over a week.

So here is the deal. According to BMW of Mountain View, and I would imagine BMW corporate as well, the convertible top is not part of the CAR!!!!!!!!!!!! It is an accessory and hence NOT covered. I simply could not believe what I was hearing. If I could get the ear of a BMW exec and point out to them that this could well be my last BMW because of this kind of chicken sh....t. First they have a convertible top that clearly has design issues. So much so that they have issued a bulletin, and changed several of the parts, and changed how they are mounted. It fails, and I go in to get it fixed. Not only do they not apologize for this shortcoming on one of their flagship vehicles, but they proceed to screw me on the fine print in their CPO contract. This is simply stupid marketing. And imho dishonest. Would a cabrio 6 be a complete "CAR" without its convertible top? NO. End of discussion. It is not an accessory, it is part of the car.

Adding insult to injury, it took them 40 minutes to get the thing out of the garage.

Again, no apology. We're supposed to be honored to be at the holy BMW dealer.

I would love for one of their reps to contact me if they see this. I'd love to have them make this right, and I'd love to talk with them about the marketing image their dealer is putting out for their brand.

Hrumph.
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  #123  
Old 02-22-2011, 11:44 PM
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Mind boggling story.

I would get a lawyer to send a nasty letter asking for the $900 plus lawyer fee plus car rental for a week. I don't think they would have a leg to stand on in court - convertible top not part of the car???????
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  #124  
Old 02-23-2011, 07:51 AM
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That is such BS! Not a part of the car!? Did you put the convertible top in yourself? Ohh! how I wish some dealer would sell me that story. This is where I like to spend money. Fighting this morons and not giving them the satisfaction of taking my money or taking me for a fool. And I would not care if it cost me twice as much in lawyer fees. I would send a formal letter of complaint to BMW NA and request some type of compensation for your cost associated with their non convertible 6 series cabriolet.
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  #125  
Old 02-23-2011, 08:37 AM
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You definitely need to escalate this one to the BMW NA as this is complete BS! take it all the way up the chain with phone calls first, document the conversations, then if no love write your own nasty letter to BMW NA - if that still doesn't work, go with a local attorney and have him/her send a demand letter to BMW NA as described in the prior posts.
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