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Car Navigation, Audio & Electronics
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  #1  
Old 08-15-2014, 12:02 PM
choggy choggy is offline
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Mein Auto: BMW 330ci
Help with Audio Processor Selection

I've got a 2013 X3 F25 and upgrading my sound system. I'm installing MBQuart Speakers, JL Audio Sub and amps. I'm looking for a recommendation on a processor. I'm considering the Audison Bit Ten and the JBL MS-8. I'm looking for the best soundstage, eq and time alignment. Thank you in advance.
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  #2  
Old 08-15-2014, 12:18 PM
xx xx is offline
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Mein Auto: E83 X3 and E70 X5
I use an Eton DSP8CAN and it works great.
(No idea about the other models ... too many of them out there and I can't test all of them)
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  #3  
Old 08-18-2014, 01:34 PM
mightycrown mightycrown is offline
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Mein Auto: Bmw 320d f31
Quote:
Originally Posted by xx View Post
I use an Eton DSP8CAN and it works great.
(No idea about the other models ... too many of them out there and I can't test all of them)
Would you tell us how you did your install. does this unit come with any harness to connect to Idrive? loooking forward to hear from you
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  #4  
Old 08-18-2014, 03:41 PM
xx xx is offline
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Hi, the Eton company provides the harness on the dsp/amp side only. On the front side I ordered the Technic custom cable. I remember I saw some cables/extensions made by Dietz on some Euro websites but I couldn't figure it out which one is mine since I didn't take apart my stereo to look behind it before ordering all the parts. So I just ordered the Technic set. It turns out the Technic set conveniently comes with long extension cables going to/from the front CIC/idrive to the rear where I installed the DSP/amp. Since you are in Europe, maybe you can ask the stores which extension or interface cables they have for your front/idrive/CIC, or you might have to contact Technic and he can give you several options depending on how many speakers/amps you like to hook-up, or would like to separately power the two woofers under the front seats (I did... extra cables). This Eton processor/amp has the ADS Blackfin processor and TI-Burr Brown chip in there (probably wasn't advertised anywhere but it's hiding inside the box).
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Last edited by xx; 08-18-2014 at 03:43 PM.
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  #5  
Old 08-19-2014, 01:55 AM
mightycrown mightycrown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xx View Post
Hi, the Eton company provides the harness on the dsp/amp side only. On the front side I ordered the Technic custom cable. I remember I saw some cables/extensions made by Dietz on some Euro websites but I couldn't figure it out which one is mine since I didn't take apart my stereo to look behind it before ordering all the parts. So I just ordered the Technic set. It turns out the Technic set conveniently comes with long extension cables going to/from the front CIC/idrive to the rear where I installed the DSP/amp. Since you are in Europe, maybe you can ask the stores which extension or interface cables they have for your front/idrive/CIC, or you might have to contact Technic and he can give you several options depending on how many speakers/amps you like to hook-up, or would like to separately power the two woofers under the front seats (I did... extra cables). This Eton processor/amp has the ADS Blackfin processor and TI-Burr Brown chip in there (probably wasn't advertised anywhere but it's hiding inside the box).
Hello, XX
Thanks for your reply.I m in between of choosing this Eton or Helix PP 82DSP. Both are very good all in one unit. I can get all the cable sets for the Helix. But eton like you said only have the harness to the AMP side, and I know Technic is not too keen to supply to Europe
How is your experience with eton DSP/AMP in terms of power delivery, and signal processing. You probably have the base unit with 6 speakers which really sucks, mine too. It sends highly tuned signals to speakers. So DSP is essential for aftermarket installation to balance the signals.
How did you calibrate your speakers? Did you use your ears or a sound meter?
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  #6  
Old 08-19-2014, 12:46 PM
xx xx is offline
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huh what that Technic guy is suddenly not equally nice to everyone?? Just tell him it's the same paypal, same post office and he can be Mr Worldwide!! Heís probably reading this and will get mad at me for making it sound too easy lol. Yeah that Helix is pretty nice too. I checked it out several times before I got the Eton. In the end I still picked Eton because it's good stuff and I have a car loaded with Eton speakers. For a moment I was about to install another brand of underseat subwoofers, but changed mind after seeing it and quickly ordered/installed the proper Eton ones.

The Eton guys also published all the DSP/amp wiring info which makes it flexible to configure/experiment/install if thatís what you like to do (some donít want to do all this). I think I didnít see the wiring info for the Helix/Match because they probably want everyone to use their specific cables for specific vehicles to make theirs a fast/easy install. Since I have the Eton wiring info I can experiment with it and ordered even more Eton speakers lol (just arrived... this will be a new center channel soon lol or can turn it down if I donít want it later). The amp/power from the Eton is plenty loud and clean since I'm using it for midbass/mid/highs. I have various filter/crossover/frequency settings that donít drain all the ampís power Ė so thatís how it gets real loud for the range that they play. I also have a separate amp for a large JL sub though.

The signal processing is the fun part. It's parametric type and this requires some thought. It is powerful and easy to use after some initial learning curve. I use a portable RTA to tune it... itís actually the AudioTool app on my phone (premium version, few dollars), Dayton imm6 microphone (calibrated, with datapoints file) and a matching TRRS extension cable to string the mic away from the phone. The Eton people put the "end user" software on their website and I was first using it and had some basic questions. The Eton person was helping and also emailed me a nice "master user" software. Whoa.... it unlocked more features! I now have more types of outputs, and even several surround modes so that I can make it sound like i'm driving a really big bus using the club/concert/stadium settings. Each has variable time/size settings too or can just turn everything off for the regular small/dry studio sound.

The other basic DSP stuff like time alignment is probably the same as all other brands - straightforward/easy to use. After time alignment, it actually made the stage higher. Other than the pink noise for tuning, I tried a bunch of other test tracks too. One of these days I will post all the new/recent photos of this DSP/etc on another audio site. Iím still adding stuff and was thinking I should do it after completing everything (hopefully in the next few weeks ha ha). bye.
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  #7  
Old 08-20-2014, 06:40 AM
mightycrown mightycrown is offline
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Thank you for your reply. Technic is very helpful, even without purchasing his harness. He has given me some very good advices on device options and installation. I will probably stick with the helix one. A dealer in Norway can supply it with a very good rate. But Eton definitely is my backup plan. Regard wiring, I'd like to keep it as minimum as possible, although I decided to undertake the biggest mode ever just for me). I will cut up the centre dash and install a centre speaker. Ye I got the eton under seat mid-bass set. Havn't tested them yet but the number looks good How is your experience with them. The helix does provide some alternative for extra sub and amp. There are 4 channels which can be used for additional speaker. and an RCA for subwoofer signals
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  #8  
Old 08-20-2014, 03:29 PM
xx xx is offline
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Yeah the Helix should work very nice too! The Eton underseat speakers sound good and gives a good kick in the seat ha ha. The construction/material is just super. But otherwise it works the same as the factory ones but can safely handle a lot more power here. Are you going to split/send 2 of the 8 channels to the underseat speakers? This way we can run it low like 35Hz or 40 and up to 150 or 180Hz. The front seats will naturally filter/block-out the higher end and so it'll sound like 40 to 100 or 120 either way. Then the door speakers can play from 100 or 120 Hz to 20k since these speakers are small and they don't need to play the lower frequencies (wont rattle the doors too). Hey does your new f31 have a speaker opening on the dash or why do you have to cut it or did you mean tear it apart? A few weeks ago I took apart the center/dash/vent area (it looked like a nasty surgery or something) but finally got to prewire for the center speaker. I'm still working on the speaker bracket now and trying to decide to modify the empty plastic bracket, make/cut a new aluminum/MDF bracket, buy another bracket or design/print a custom one (too many good choices lol but started on the design just for fun).
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  #9  
Old 08-21-2014, 02:07 AM
mightycrown mightycrown is offline
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Great choice of mid bass then Yep, I will run new wires from helix to power the eton USB. I understand that I will need to enclose the parallel wirings for the under seat woofers and front door speakers. I will splice wires to the original connection under seat woofer. Have your changed any rear speaker?. I plan to put in some coxia 3 ways speakers. dont know if that gonna improve the sound, they are cheap anyway. My F31 does come with the housing for mounting centre speaker under the dash. But I must cut it open to fit the speaker grill. Very strange your wasn't prefabricated from factory. My choice of centre speaker is Pioneer TS G 1033i or similar, maybe a more powerful BOSS 4 ways. But doubt my amp will keep it up. It is rated at 125W RMS my amp is 55 . I bought a pair of Focal K2 100 sets for the front doors. Will begin my install in Sep
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  #10  
Old 08-21-2014, 01:26 PM
xx xx is offline
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Mein Auto: E83 X3 and E70 X5
Yeah we'll have to jump the parallel wiring for each underseat woofer's connector if it's the 4-wire type to send the sound to the door (the 2 pins on "each side" of the 4 pin connector).

Yes I changed the rear speakers too the same time as the fronts. I use the same Eton B100N model (and same center soon) because I want all of them to voice-match. It is good/important to do this for the 3 fronts speakers if you can for tonal similarity, as it probably helps in the imaging... we don't want the singer's voice or instrument to change in pitch/sound or wander as the frequencies/range change. We might be able to correct it with software/equalizer but that might take too long and there just might be some inherent characteristics of different speakers that we just can't alter... so I just use the same hardware everywhere to make it easy. For the back, I actually didn't install the tweeters for these rear doors but just the midrange only. I think we really don't want the back speakers to be sizzling but kind of muted/low in volume/level so that it doesn't distract the up-front music. The rear door signal is actually a bandpass type on mine (normal BMW method - they just like to do this; anyways check yours too to see if it's the same or different). I think saw something like 75 or 85 Hz to around 6 kHz bandpass via the RTA app here. Some people don't like rear speakers but I don't mind (need it to hear the park/bumper sensors too ha ha, and now for the surround stuff too).

For the front center they gave me the normal grill with perforations/tiny holes (it turns out all the X5 models use this same grill). They also put a blank plate inside there. So what I have to do is modify the plate or make a new plate (plus add the wiring). Yours looks like more work but should be ok and a fun project too.
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