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in the wet

2K views 21 replies 12 participants last post by  PhilipWOT 
#1 ·
Ive been slowly slowly pushing the edge in the wet. Ive noticed that my 318is will no go sideways in 1st gear. I dont know why but when its in second it just flings out. The thing that really gets me is that its not a nice and easy gracefull slide.... But more a voilent slide and when it slides it will kick out one way and then violently fling out the other way. Thats right it fishtales extreamly violently. Normal or is it something that shouldnt happen? i mean ive seen my cousin go nutz in a 6L v8 and its very gracefull. My car is extreamly sharp and voilent like i said. Its also very very very hard to get it to oversteer :eek:

For example today i pushed it and it kicked out to the right and i counter-steered it abit and then all of a sudden it just kicked out the other way and then it just goes back straight. Im scared that one day by accident it will just keep fishtaling it and ill lose it. Maybe its just my tyres....

2nd time its happened.....
 
#3 ·
i think its cause i back off the accelerator and counter-steer.... But still it just throws me around!!

And practicing here in australia is hard. If a coppa see's u doing that they will impound ya car for 24hr. 2nd time they impound it for a few months. 3rd time they auction the car off and u get nothing!
 
#5 ·
True. Not if you want it to keep it powersliding.
Backing off will get your tyres gripping again.

With your counter steering, you can avoid a fishtail instantly by only turning as far as your rear has kicked out the other way. If you overcorrect steering, when you reconnect with the road, you'll be pointing too far the opposite way.
A few weeks back I saw a guy do this about 8 times down the road getting faster and faster but keeping his fishies. Clearly he was getting further and further out of control. Eventually he slid off the road onto grass; lucky he didn't roll it, sliding sideways on grass.

Anyway, yes you DO counter steer, or 'turn into the skid', but the purpose is to keep the front wheels pointing straight down the road. This requires a feel for 'steering wheel vs. tyre direction', which will come in time.

Cos where you point them wheels... ultimately that's where they will go.
 
#6 ·
I part read that as you wanting to recover, rather than deliberately slide.
Actually, if a power slide is your aim, then pointing the wheels just part of the way back between your slide angle and the road centre line is ideal. This gives you enough steerage to keep the rear wheels loose until your ground speed is so high the tyres can't maintain torque-slip. Effectively: gently easing off the steering, rather than off the power.
 
#7 ·
If you wanna deliberately slide, hammer it and keep the front wheels pointing straight, no matter which direction your car's pointing. You have to be real quick, cause your ass-end will fling around crazy fast since your car is so light. To recover, let off the throttle with the wheels pointing straight. DON'T brake, unless you wanna lock up all 4 tires and start skidding.
 
#8 ·
comon Dom, you have big fat tyres with small sidewall. Those in general give good grip and then give it up rather suddenly. You can't avoid that. Correct me if I'm wrong Pete.

But surely, more practice as Pete says.
 
#9 ·
Yeah, like they've said, the reason its so violent is cuz you let go of the throttle. Lets say you want to drift, then end it gracefully. When you're done, you want you wheels pointing straight ahead, and you slowly, partially ease off the throttle. You want it to have less skid, but not stop skidding, as you want to slide into the new direction gently. Once you're finally in the right direction pointing straight ahead, then you can again slowly ease off the throttle till you gain traction. I recommend you go watch some videos of donuts and slides done well, and watch how - if they're graceful - the wheels will keep spinning until a few seconds after they've started going 100% straight.
What you're doing is letting the wheels regain traction partway through the skid, and even if you think you're going the right way, you still have circular momentum as well, and when you let off the gas, the wheels grip real fast and all the circular momentum of the chassis stops (but of course you still have it and the suspension has to deal with the fact that the body still has it as well, so the car gets thrown around a bit).
 
#10 ·
yeah i gottah fight it back. I for somereason just automatically let go of the accelerate and counter-steer. I will get some practice though. There is a roundabout near my house where its extreamly wide and the chances of hitting something are LOW
 
#11 ·
yeah i gottah fight it back. I for somereason just automatically let go of the accelerate and counter-steer. I will get some practice though. There is a roundabout near my house where its extreamly wide and the chances of hitting something are LOW
Not a good idea Dom. If you want to get noticed by the police that is where you will be noticed most.

Is there not a quite industrial estate where there is no traffic at weekends or something similar. Ideally you want a place that is not on a through road.

Even better is save your pennies and treat yourself to a proper trackday, well worth the money and so much fun. With a professional driver beside you you will also learn much much quicker.
 
#13 ·
Ive been slowly slowly pushing the edge in the wet. Ive noticed that my 318is will no go sideways in 1st gear. I dont know why but when its in second it just flings out. The thing that really gets me is that its not a nice and easy gracefull slide.... But more a voilent slide and when it slides it will kick out one way and then violently fling out the other way. Thats right it fishtales extreamly violently. Normal or is it something that shouldnt happen? i mean ive seen my cousin go nutz in a 6L v8 and its very gracefull. My car is extreamly sharp and voilent like i said. Its also very very very hard to get it to oversteer :eek:

For example today i pushed it and it kicked out to the right and i counter-steered it abit and then all of a sudden it just kicked out the other way and then it just goes back straight. Im scared that one day by accident it will just keep fishtaling it and ill lose it. Maybe its just my tyres....

2nd time its happened.....
That is the nature of the E36. Try this: next time, when you begin the slide and the car gets sideways, when you instinctively want to let off the throttle, just keep in nailed to the floor and straighten the car with the steering wheel instead. When the car is straight again, let off the gas easily then upshift and smoothly drive out of the slide.
Make sure you have alot of room to work with too, because I can almost promise you won't get this right the first time, and there's a very good chance you won't put the car exactly where you meant to.
Once you get a good feel for it though, the E36 slides very predictably. It takes a bit more finesse than my previous Nissan 240xs's, but it is just as much fun and I think the E36 actually handles the higher speed power-slides better than the S13.
 
#14 ·
Happened to me many times Dom, practice makes perfect dude !

But, do me a favor and don't practice in places where you might get caught, don't ask me why !!!

I'm too sleepy to repeat what the guys said, but Phantom and Jason's reply are the most accurate and correct of all . +1 Guys !

Good luck going sideways !!!
 
#17 ·
well let me give u an update
One of my best mates had a mazda rx-7 s2. I wanted one but im over them now. Anyways he had a problem with the steering. The steering would not return itself to the center when u let go of it. It would stay there and it was up to the driver to bring the steering back in. Anyways he decided to go sideway. It kicked out and then all of a sudden the rears gripped and it threw him to the other side. (what my e36 does to me). Anyways because of the steering problem he didnt have enough time to bring the steering back and counter-steer it the opposite direction. The rear end decide to GRIP again when his wheels where dead straight sending him straight into a tree..
He is alright but the car is totalled.

I dont think ill be trying it anytime soon. The misses also warned me to be sensible orelse.....

I know now not to let go of the accelerator. Ill be better prepared incase it happens to be again by accident. Thanks guys
 
#18 ·
If your wheels suddenly grip when you're inexcplicbbly pointing at a tree, I highly recommend you get off the accelerator.
One of my best mates had a mazda rx-7 s2. I wanted one but im over them now.
That's ok, we all have our moments. I once wanted a series 4. I won't tell if you don't. :)
 
#19 ·
If your wheels suddenly grip when you're inexcplicbbly pointing at a tree, I highly recommend you get off the accelerator.
I did that once and sometimes getting off the accelerator quickly enough is easier said than done. :yikes: I was able to get it fixed but that old Karmann Ghia was never quite the same afterwards.

I guess it's a natural thing to want to be able to control your car in a skid, especially at your age Dom, and I don't think it's an entirely bad thing as long as you use good judgment as to when/where. A familiarity with how your car reacts can be very useful when you accidentally find yourself in a skid someday. Do make sure you do your practicing in a safe location, both for you and innocent bystanders though. Others here have suggested places that are much safer than on public roads such as deserted parking lots, or ideally, a track and possibly with an instructor at first and I think that's a great suggestion. IMHO, much better to spend your money on improving your own abilities as a driver than on aesthetic upgrades for your car so hire a pro at a track to help you develop good habits and I don't think you'll ever regret it. It's knowledge you'll be able to draw upon for your whole life.

If you're going to do it anywhere off a track, make sure you scout the surface pretty thoroughly before you even begin. If one tire drops into a wide crack in the pavement or into a pothole while it's sliding sideways, you could suddenly find yourself doing cartwheels and somersaults and that's no fun in a car! And even if that doesn't happen, you can bend a wheel or worse.

Be smart about it, and have fun!:)
 
#20 ·
Very wise advice.
 
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