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E63 / E64 6 Series (2003 - 2013)
The E63/E64 BMW 6 Series builds on BMW's sporty heritage with aggressive lines and an incredible motor to back the design up. Available in coupe and convertible trims with a standard 4.8 liter engine producing 360 horsepower and 360 lb-ft of torque, the 6-series is a popular choice that exceeds expectations.

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  #1  
Old 12-01-2005, 08:55 AM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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New Wheels, Exhaust and ECU Upgrade

I didn't care for the OEM wheel on the 6. It's a little to sedan-ish looking for a Grand Touring car with this kind of spirit.

I went with Hartge Classic I wheels in 20", with Dunlop SP Sport Max tires. I normally would have installed Michelin PS2 tires like on several of my other cars, but the very knowledgeable Tire Experts said that they had had some balancing/reliability issues with the PS2s in the 20" size.

I'm very happy with the look (get many compliments & comments) and I've noticed no increased ride harshness, perhaps due to the tires are non-runflats (in case of a nail, I have a large can of tire goop and an electric pump in the trunk. In case of a blow-out I have the BMW Roadside Assistance plan and an AAA Plus account ..... just like my spare-less Cayennes).

I do believe I have better handling....turn-in seems more responsive, a little less understeer. Not that this car will be going to the track (well, I might take it out to PIR once, just for fun). But for daily driveability, I'm pretty happy.


Photos:

http://www.986host.com/gallery/TTCarrera/IMG_1105

http://www.986host.com/gallery/TTCarrera/IMG_1104


I also installed an Eisenmann exhaust (Race version). Very happy with the deep, throaty warble at idle and low speed take off. At WOT, it sounds mean, big-block V8 sound. Very, very pleased.

http://www.986host.com/gallery/TTCarrera/IMG_1109

http://www.986host.com/gallery/TTCarrera/IMG_1111

http://www.986host.com/gallery/TTCarrera/IMG_1051


Next performance upgrade: I pulled my ECU and sent it to Upsolute for a remap ....it should be back tomorrow. I used Upsolute on my 911 Turbo and I was very happy with the increased HP & tourque, plus the remap was smooth and aggressive all the way through the power band. Have had it in for over 2 years with absolutely no problems or issues. Hoping for similar experience with the 6.

I'll let everyone know how I feel about it.


(And BEWANG, I also got my Fiesta Bowl and Holiday Bowl tickets ordered and my air/hotel reservations to both cities bought & paid for.....depending on which unlucky team gets to play the Ducks).
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  #2  
Old 12-01-2005, 09:25 AM
SmoothCruise SmoothCruise is offline
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Nice. I like the rims. Too much bling for my taste, I prefer a little less, like, Hartge Classic II and a more subdued finish. But, your's looks nice and different from all the other 6ers that have ellipsoidal rims like mine!

Exhaust looks cool too.

I also like your tiled garage floor. I would never think to tile my garage floor.


Now, onto some questions:

1. did they have to cut into your rear apron to fit the extra pipes? Was that all they had to do?

2. I hear some hartge rims you may have to meddle around with the tire well to get the tires to fit, was that the case with you?

3. You gonna get your car super charged as well?


Thanks for the pics and keep us updated.
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  #3  
Old 12-01-2005, 10:51 AM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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Cool

Yes, the apron was enlarged with a rotary rasp fitted to a dremel. It's polyuerathane, cuts pretty easily, I was told by my mechanic. He did a perfect job.

No clearance issues with the 20" Hartges. The Classic I in 20" is a perfect fit, including the offsets (F18 mm/R 22 mm). If you went to the Classic II in 20" or 21" you might have some offset issues that will upset the geometry of the suspension and impair handling. You could use spacers to compensate, but then you're adding un-sprung weight to the suspension setup. You would probably also have to cut away some of the wheel-well plastic in the front, as well.

The Classic IIs are nice, but I prefer a deep-hubbed rim with a bowed-out spoke that then bows back into a fairly wide lip. That looks best to my eye when the car is moving around a corner or through a parking lot (Although I can't see the wheel when I'm driving the car, other people can .... lots of broad surfaces that catch & reflect light. Many people seem only choose rims based upon how the car looks while it is parked).

In addition, IMHO, the 2-piece wheel look is more consistent with a performance application .... something that I was looking for ..... rather than a more conservative 1-piece wheel look. While the I is a reasonably-priced faux two-piece wheel, the II is clearly a 1-piece and looks more value-oriented as well.

I acknowledge that the I may be more blingie looking to those that are used to seeing a lot of bling. Especially if you're used to seeing a lot of rice-rockets in your neighbrhood. In mine, German & Italian performance is the standard you have to live up to and Hartges are acknowledged and accepted as a standard.

I: http://www.hartge.de/html/classic10.html

II: http://www.hartge.de/html/classic2.html

The Classic II finish may look more subdued to you, but the I and the II have the same finish. Mine may appear to shine more because they were polished and Zaino'd before they were mounted.

All you guys detail your wheels, don't you?
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  #4  
Old 12-01-2005, 10:55 AM
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Really like the exhausts but i'm not a fan of Hartge wheels. They just look to "plastic" to me
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  #5  
Old 12-01-2005, 12:10 PM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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I felt the same way until I saw them in person. They look like they are milled out of a solid block of titanium.
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  #6  
Old 12-01-2005, 12:13 PM
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GeneArch GeneArch is offline
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I like the wheels & exhaust. I would bet they look even better in person
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  #7  
Old 12-01-2005, 01:31 PM
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Love the looks of the quad-exhaust. Great job! But not used to seeing the wheels, as you said, not used to seeing bling-ish styling but probably looks a lot better in real life than in photo.

Last edited by 650iOzBoy; 12-01-2005 at 01:36 PM.
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  #8  
Old 12-01-2005, 02:21 PM
SmoothCruise SmoothCruise is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
Yes, the apron was enlarged with a rotary rasp fitted to a dremel. It's polyuerathane, cuts pretty easily, I was told by my mechanic. He did a perfect job.
I'll go check out the pictures again, the cuts are symmetrically perfect, I hope?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
Many people seem only choose rims based upon how the car looks while it is parked.
Yes, good point. That's what I do. I think I'll have to consider how it looks while moving. Perhaps you can provide videos too?



Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
In addition, IMHO, the 2-piece wheel look is more consistent with a performance application .... something that I was looking for ..... rather than a more conservative 1-piece wheel look. While the I is a reasonably-priced faux two-piece wheel, the II is clearly a 1-piece and looks more value-oriented as well.
"Value oriented" by that you mean cheap? If so, I guess. One thing I don't like on the I is the chrome (or the shiny) lip. I prefer 'sheen' over 'shine' (if sheen is a word. I hope you understand.)



Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
I acknowledge that the I may be more blingie looking to those that are used to seeing a lot of bling. Especially if you're used to seeing a lot of rice-rockets in your neighbrhood. In mine, German & Italian performance is the standard you have to live up to and Hartges are acknowledged and accepted as a standard.
Bling might be too strong a word. I just prefer the more conservative II look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
I: http://www.hartge.de/html/classic10.html

II: http://www.hartge.de/html/classic2.html

The Classic II finish may look more subdued to you, but the I and the II have the same finish. Mine may appear to shine more because they were polished and Zaino'd before they were mounted.
It's a good thing you showed the picture of the rims on your car. They look entirely different on a car vs off a car. Thanks for that. It would be really nice if we can try on rims for our car like we do clothing. hah! Imagine that, maybe I should send this idea to Richard Branson, of Virgin Records fame. I think this is a good idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
All you guys detail your wheels, don't you?
Yeah, I mostly just wash them, I don't wax them. I use to, but I didn't feel like it made it any easier to clean them. I did an experiment once, I took some WheelWax, picked my front right rim. I put wax on half the rim, in a half circle area. The next experiment I put wax, alternating by each spoke. In both experiments I could not visibly tell which area of the rim had wax on it. I knew because I took notes, but visibily there was no change. There **maybe** some, if you really look carefully, but it's not worth the effort.

From that, I don't wax rims anymore.
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  #9  
Old 12-01-2005, 07:16 PM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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Quote:
"Value oriented" by that you mean cheap? If so, I guess.
No, not cheap. I probably should have used a different term. It's an old perception by many people that a 2 or 3 piece wheel was often more expensive because of the precision machining, milling and tapping rquired to have all the parts come together and still be a perfectly round, balanced, and strong wheel.

That is no longer true, as modern technology can fabricate a 1-piece wheel and achieve the same results. In fact, some 1-piece wheels are very, very expensive ... especially if very strong AND very light.

To my eye, a 2-piece or 2-piece-looking wheel just looks higher-tech. It may look blingie to some. To me, I look at a wheel like a Hartge or a Radenergie and I can almost smell the ethenol in the race garages and paddocks.
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  #10  
Old 12-01-2005, 09:10 PM
INTREPID INTREPID is offline
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I like your new wheels. Where did you get them and how much did they cost?
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  #11  
Old 12-01-2005, 09:21 PM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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Call Peter, the owner of Wheel Experts.com. I paid $3140, including shipping. They just moved from Houston to Dallas ... don't know the phone number but I'm sure it's on their website.

He's very knowledgeable about the wheel and the BMW 6 (he has a cabriolet), he'll tell you what the best tire sizes & brands to get (he sells tires, but told me that I'd get a better price from Tirerack.)
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  #12  
Old 12-01-2005, 09:22 PM
INTREPID INTREPID is offline
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http://www.wheelexperts.com Thanks!
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  #13  
Old 12-01-2005, 09:32 PM
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gbelton gbelton is offline
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Now I am Ready...

Hey Guys:

I beleive I am ready now for some Rims! TTCarrera, thanks for the details you've provided on the rim. Your wheels look good, what are your tire size R/F?

GMAN
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Old 12-01-2005, 09:33 PM
INTREPID INTREPID is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
I pulled my ECU and sent it to Upsolute for a remap ....it should be back tomorrow.
Let us know how this works out. I also got a quote from Upsolute. I was told that new software loaded by the dealer might require a new flast by Upsolute (no charge). But, Software version 19.02 is suppose to allow the dealer to flash just changes, not the entire software.
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  #15  
Old 12-01-2005, 10:21 PM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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My Dunlop SP Sport Maxx tires are:

Front: 245/35ZR20

Rear: 285/30YR20
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  #16  
Old 12-02-2005, 07:29 AM
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What Do You Think?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
My Dunlop SP Sport Maxx tires are:

Front: 245/35ZR20

Rear: 285/30YR20
Thanks. Did you happen to see the 21"? Did you consider those?

GMAN
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  #17  
Old 12-02-2005, 07:57 AM
Malibubimmer Malibubimmer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TTCarrera
Next performance upgrade: I pulled my ECU and sent it to Upsolute for a remap ....it should be back tomorrow. I used Upsolute on my 911 Turbo and I was very happy with the increased HP & tourque, plus the remap was smooth and aggressive all the way through the power band. Have had it in for over 2 years with absolutely no problems or issues. Hoping for similar experience with the 6.

I'll let everyone know how I feel about it.
Have you gotten the ECU back yet? If so, how long did it take, where did you send it and how much did it cost? (I ask a lot of questions.) Of course, the big two for me are: (1) do you notice any difference in the performance and, if so, what, and how much is the supposed bump in HP and torque? and (2) are there are BMW new car warranty issues and, if so, how do you deal with them? (That was 5 more questionas. Sorry.)
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Old 12-02-2005, 08:06 AM
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gbelton gbelton is offline
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What R The Real Performace Gains?

Acutal performace results would be great. Mental belief is another...

I do not discount your claims but nothing but the facts man... Malibubimmer, do you concur?

GMAN
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Old 12-02-2005, 09:30 AM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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What are the REAL performance gains??????

First, it's not installed yet. I'm tracking the package this morning, should be delivered within the next 90 minutes. Will take 3 minutes to re-connect the ECU, 12 minutes to put all the cowling and gaskets back in place. Maybe I'll take some photos, if anyone wants to see them or follow it through???

Then I'll drive it, although it's a stormy day here with the possibility of sleet or snow... so probably won't have a chance to really push it. Anyway ..... the only way to tell if there really are significant (or any) gains is to dyno the car, which I won't do. This is simply a GT, 2 or 3 day a week daily driver car for me, not really going to track it or autocross it, maybe just once out of curiosity. It's fun to drive around town or 1-2 hour trip, but it also looks great pulling up to the theatre, symphony or a great restaurant.

I do have a G-Tech performace measurement accelerometer to be able to measure 0-60, 1/4 mile and lateral accelration Gs but since I didn't measure the car with the original ECU map, it won't do me much good to measure it after. But I will, out of curiousity, and let everyone know what I get.

I will be very happy if I simply get "seat-of-the-pants" confirmation that the car is quicker and more aggressive. That's all I'm looking for.

I'm very happy with the work that Upsolute did for my 911 Turbo. Results were aggressive because that re-mapped the boost control .... the boost came on sooner and was allowed to go to 1.1 bar instead of the factory-limited .7 bar. That motor was derived from the Porsche GT-1 motor so out the factory door it was "significantly" detuned .... lots of power left to safely tap in that motor without fear of damage or detonation. Stock motor is 425 HP. After the Upsolute re-map (and the installation of a free-er flowing Europipe exhaust, it tested at 543 Hp and a best 0-60 time on the G-Tech of 3.91 seconds (which, after a time/weight ratio calulation also was within tolerance of the 543).

Upsolute claimed specs for the 645Ci are as follows:

*******>*******>*******>*******>********>********>********>********>
Car typeBMW 6er 645CI
Engine
Transmission
*******>*******>*******>*******>********>********>********>********>
Original















UPsolute















Engine size
4398














4398















Compression
































Power (hp)
333 hp















366 hp















Power (kW)
245 kW















269 kW















Torque (ft/lb)
332 ft/lb















341 ft/lb















Torque (NM)
450 NM















462 NM















Max Speed
156 mph (250 km/h)















159 mph (255 km/h)















Fuel consum. 56 mph (90kmh)
27 mpg (8.6 l/100km)















28 mpg (8.5 l/100km)















Fuel consum. 75mph (120kmh)
20 mpg (11.7 l/100km)















20 mpg (11.6 l/100km)















Fuel consum. city
14 mpg (17.2 l/100km)















14 mpg(17 l/100km)















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Porsche 911 Turbo (Arctic Silver, with Black interiror)
BMW X6 M (Alpine White, with Sakhir Orange interior)
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  #20  
Old 12-02-2005, 09:44 AM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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Where/How Much/Warranty???

www.UPsolute.com

Prices vary, depending upon which shop you take it to (or if you do it yourself like I did and deal directly with their US headquarters in N.C).

If you have major motor problems and BMW (either the dealer or BMWNA) determines that the ECU re-program caused the damage, then of course your warranty is toast. However, that assumes that they go to the trouble to read the ECU and determine that it's been altered. Remember .... most dealers live & die by factory-paid warranty work. Most dealers will fight for you rather than against you on a warranty issue ... they need the factory revenue as much as you need the factory to pay for the repair (although the factory pays a lower hourly rate and provide parts at cost. Dealer makes it up in volume and in getting to keep the franchise. Only in cases where it is obvious .... or where the service writer or service manager hates you because you're arrogant, snotty and/or obnoxious.... will they take the factory's side. (NEVER underestimate the importance of being a good guy in the dealership's eyes).

If you have a fit & finish problem, obviously that would be covered regardless.
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  #21  
Old 12-02-2005, 11:28 AM
Malibubimmer Malibubimmer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbelton
Acutal performace results would be great. Mental belief is another...

I do not discount your claims but nothing but the facts man... Malibubimmer, do you concur?

GMAN
I concur, but I'll take whatever I can get.

I don't mean to be a wet blanket, but it looks like Upsolute will give you 10% more HP but only 2-3% more torque. And since the torque is probably more important on a 0-60 run, I doubt the re-profiling will shave more than a tenth or two.

The question is whether it's going to be worth it in exchange for the possibility it will void your warranty.

Last edited by Malibubimmer; 12-02-2005 at 11:32 AM.
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Old 12-02-2005, 12:54 PM
TTCarrera TTCarrera is offline
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Quote:
it looks like Upsolute will give you 10% more HP but only 2-3% more torque. And since the torque is probably more important on a 0-60 run, I doubt the re-profiling will shave more than a tenth or two.
Agreed. I'm more interested in the impact upon the 60-90 run.
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  #23  
Old 12-02-2005, 03:25 PM
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Tio Tio is offline
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I find it hard to keep it under 50 on the surfact streets and typically run around 80 on the highway. I just don't think I need to run faster. But this is coming from someone that has driven a 525i for the last ten years, so what do I know?
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Old 12-02-2005, 04:02 PM
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gbelton gbelton is offline
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Some Good Info...

TTCarrera,

Good stuff on the specs, let us know how the 0-60 performs. I too do not epect to track the car, just some more torque... Plenty of horse power this baby has!

Malibubimmer,

Do you 0-60 often? Have you tried any backroad runs?

GMAN
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Old 12-02-2005, 04:25 PM
cobradav cobradav is offline
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Mein Auto:
Here is a little bit of info on various tuners' claims and contact info. All these were for the 4.4L engine. Most are already stating they are ready to do the 4.8L engine as well with generally similar increases in HP and torque.

Ooops - posted an older version. Here is the current version
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Last edited by cobradav; 12-02-2005 at 05:09 PM.
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