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E85 / E86 Z4 (2003-2008)
E85 Z4 Roadster, E86 Z4 Coupe, E85 Z4 M Roadster, and E86 Z4 M Coupe talk with our BMW gurus here.

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  #1  
Old 05-11-2015, 06:06 PM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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Possibly trading my BMW for a Porsche... Thoughts?

Hey guys,

You are probably going to stone me for bringing this topic up in here but really want to get some neutral feedback if that is possible in a Bimer forum. Anyways, I love my Z4 but it does have a rebuilt title so if the right deal comes along it will be hard for me to pass it up. With that said, I have an offer for a straight up trade for a 2000 Porsche Boxster S (clean title) with 98k miles in pristine condition. I have a 2003 bmw z4 3.0i with 53k miles in very good shape as well besides the rebuilt title. There is a 25hp jump going to the Boxster and about 11 lb/ft torque. If any of you have a history with Porsche please share your experience. Cost of ownership I would assume is about equal, maybe BMW slightly cheaper for parts/labor? This is where I really want to dig in more as I don't want to have to pay double for parts/labor for the Porsche.

Thanks in advance.
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  #2  
Old 05-11-2015, 06:19 PM
bmwclubracer bmwclubracer is offline
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Look into maintenance costs for Boxster...I know first gen was several hundred for an oil change. You didn't have to drop the engine to do it but it was labor intensive.

If your car had a clean title, it's worth $1000 more than the Porsche. Being it's a rebuilt title, it's worth less and you'll have to wait for the buyer that doesn't mind a rebuilt title. I would consider two things...can you stomach the extra maintenance costs of the Porsche and what is the difference in insurance costs if any. All these things considered, I think you'd love the Porsche.
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  #3  
Old 05-11-2015, 06:33 PM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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Thanks racer, appreciate the feedback. Yes, the BMW with clean title ends up being about $500 more than the Porsche (NADA guides). The Porsche service dept here in town currently has a special for cooling and heating checks, radiator flush and oil change for $150. It isn't the $50 I am currently use to with my truck, but that doesn't seem too outlandish. I haven't had to get an oil change in my z4 yet, so not sure what that costs. Can anyone share what they tend to pay to get their oil changed?
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Last edited by bnreed3; 05-11-2015 at 06:45 PM.
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  #4  
Old 05-11-2015, 07:59 PM
enzed4 enzed4 is offline
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Are you inclined to a 'hands on' approach to maintenance? If things like oil changes, brake pads, brake fluid, air filters, etc are something you feel comfortable doing yourself, you can save $$$ on labour, that you could put towards the higher cost of Porsche parts (if they are indeed more expensive). There are probably plenty of places like Pelican Parts or ECS Tuning that carry Porsche or equivalent parts cheaper than dealers (just like for your Z4).
Do you have access to a good Indy garage that can work on Porsches - this could be a godsend if you need work done.
Good luck with whatever you choose - the Boxster is a very nice car
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Old 05-11-2015, 08:08 PM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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I've done many oil and air filter changes in my life. That is about the extent that I have gone though. With that said, there are so many informative youtube videos or "how to" guides you can purchase that if doing those things myself will save me enough money then I'll learn to do them myself. There is a shop here in town that works on Porsche's that isn't the dealer, so I am sure they are less expensive. I have heard the Boxster eats through rubber and brakes, so looks like I would be learning how to do that part of it myself.
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  #6  
Old 05-11-2015, 09:07 PM
Vladi Vladi is offline
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Apart from the financial aspect, the Boxster S is more fun to drive than the 3.0i. Before I bought my Z4 M I tried many other convertibles with the Boxster among them. It is an amazing car in virtually all aspects but the Z4 M better suits my taste. The Boxster beats the 3.0i hands down, though. To me, however, it still remains the Porsche for women.

There's a little funny comparison between the Boxster and the Z4 M. Couldn't agree more with Hammond...

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Old 05-11-2015, 10:01 PM
chickdr chickdr is offline
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The Boxster S is an awesome car. I had a 2002 Boxster 2.7 for 4 years. The handling is hands down better than the Z4 and the car is lighter. Mid-engine rules in this regard(like the video above shows). I would however be a little concerned as the car you are looking at trading for is 15yrs old. Make sure it has all the maintenance logs.
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Old 05-11-2015, 10:07 PM
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Life is too short to restrict yourself. Go drive the Porsche...if it feels good do it. You can ALWAYS come back to a Z4 (but ///M next time).
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  #9  
Old 05-12-2015, 06:44 AM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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Thanks guys! Much appreciated with the feedback. Trust me, if I had a Z4 M I am sure I would not even think about trading it; however, mine is the 3.0i without the sports package (no sports button!) so if I could jump into a Boxster S it really is quite enticing. The seller is a car buff and has all the records he has done to it, so it has a great maintenance history. As long as he ends up pulling the trigger on his end I think I will end up doing the trade. Maintenance costs are higher but I plan to do all the oil changes and brake work myself.
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  #10  
Old 05-12-2015, 12:25 PM
kenster888 kenster888 is offline
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I don't know if it applies to this particular Boxter, but do a Google search on IMS failure. With that high mileage you may be sitting on a time bomb. Not saying you shouldn't trade, but you need to be informed. And yes, Porsche parts are much more expensive than the Z4. Goodluck!
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  #11  
Old 05-12-2015, 12:57 PM
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Also take it for a test drive when the engine and tranny are cold, like the first drive of the day. If the shift to 2nd gear has any grind or lack of smoothness, it's an indication the 2nd gear syncros are gone or going. It's a common problem on the Boxsters. A friend of mine just got bit by this on the Boxster S he bought. His first "mod" was a tranny rebuild.
With respect to performance comparisons, you're correct that the Porsche will outperform your 3.0i, but the 3.0si is at least it's equal in autocross as is the Z4M. Boxster's and Boxster S's (up through 2004 model year) are in the same SCCA class (B Street) as the Z4. Probably not fair to the 2.5i and 3.0i owners, but the 3.0si and M are very competitive in that class.
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Last edited by dc_wright; 05-12-2015 at 12:58 PM.
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  #12  
Old 05-12-2015, 01:26 PM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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This Boxster S is a automatic tiptronic (unfortunately). I just really don't want to have to have the IMS replaced. The new kit for that is like $3500 installed, which is absolutely insane in my opinion. Plus, there really isn't a great way to check to see if it is going bad. The dealer recommended getting it checked out by a local Bosch service center where they can check for metal shards in the oil as that is a good indicator. I was all pumped for the trade but now I am more nervous after hearing about this IMS issue. Plus, if you don't get the IMS fixed it can end up wrecking the engine. Are you serious?
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  #13  
Old 05-12-2015, 01:50 PM
Z4-2003 Z4-2003 is offline
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A 2000 Boxster S "should" have the dual row IMS bearing which is much better than the single row. Failures are reported on dual row as less than 1%. The problem is there are many other ways the engines blow. I wanted a Boxster S and spent all winter reading about them and nearly pulled the trigger. They are just too fragile, hence I now own a Z4. I was just not comfortable with risking a catastrophic engine failure that costs as much as the car did. I would get one if it was 2009 or newer, when the IMS was eliminated, but those are far out of my price range at this point. The Boxster S sounds great and has amazing handling (I test drove a few), but the interior is not great. The z4 interior is night and day better in materials quality.

Last edited by Z4-2003; 05-12-2015 at 02:02 PM.
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  #14  
Old 05-12-2015, 09:30 PM
impreza276 impreza276 is offline
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Agree with Z4-2003. I looked into the upkeep requirements of early Boxsters and determined they were out of my league.
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Old 05-13-2015, 03:28 AM
bmwclubracer bmwclubracer is offline
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Given this new and disturbing information (tiptronic?) I now have to advise against the Boxster. The upside is that an auto Boxster will be easier to sell to a woman than 6spd.

An auto, besides being no more fun to drive than a Camry, is just another thing to break.
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  #16  
Old 05-13-2015, 03:59 AM
MRCW MRCW is online now
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Really enjoy my 2005 boxster. It's my weekend sunny weather car. Not as quick as my X1 35i m sport but handles so much better...as a DIY, oil changes are easy and under $100 and just recently replaced front brakes and rotors for under $300 in parts.. took about an hour or so.

Been in and out of BMW, Mercedes and Porsche for the past 30 years and Porsches have been my favorite driving car... bear in mind they have not been my daily driver.

AFAIK the IMS / failure issue is "real" but doesn't happen allot. Porsche replaced the engine in my boxster because of it years ago. Currently there are kits to swap out to a better designed system that gets better lubrication, which is the cause of failures...believe it or not, a car with a bit higher mileage may be a better candidate for no failure as it got more use.

The going rate for IMS upgrades are generally in the $1600 range and most folks get the clutch replaced if you have a manual. That adds about another $700

don't have any experience with a tiptronic as I prefer a manual on my Porsches

Best of luck

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Old 05-13-2015, 06:10 AM
Bob Stech Bob Stech is online now
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I'd get a price for the IMS replacement. From what I've seen the IMS is a lot more than $1600. A deal breaker for me; one reason I chose the Z4 over the Boxter and the z4 is just way better looking.
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Old 05-13-2015, 06:34 AM
MRCW MRCW is online now
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Originally Posted by Bob Stech View Post
I'd get a price for the IMS replacement. From what I've seen the IMS is a lot more than $1600. A deal breaker for me; one reason I chose the Z4 over the Boxter and the z4 is just way better looking.
Parts are $850 retail and 6.5 hours labor. Sure of you go to a dealer you'll pay allot more.

IMO, Z4 is just not attractive with such a long hood

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Old 05-13-2015, 07:53 AM
Twixboy Twixboy is online now
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Originally Posted by MRCW View Post
Parts are $850 retail and 6.5 hours labor. Sure of you go to a dealer you'll pay allot more.

IMO, Z4 is just not attractive with such a long hood

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I'm with Bob Stech, I like the long swooping hood of the Z4. The 986 headlights are so ugly and "un-Porsche" that it's a deal-killer for me. Just IMO.
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Old 05-13-2015, 08:05 AM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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I think I am going to pass on the Porsche. The IMS issue really scares me! If I was a mechanic and could do it myself for $900 then I'd probably change my mind and bite the bullet. It is around $3500-3800 to have the dealer do the replacement IMS bearing and flange (with the direct oil feed to keep the bearing lubricated). NO THANK YOU!
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Last edited by bnreed3; 05-13-2015 at 08:08 AM.
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  #21  
Old 05-13-2015, 08:28 AM
Twixboy Twixboy is online now
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Originally Posted by bnreed3 View Post
I think I am going to pass on the Porsche. The IMS issue really scares me! If I was a mechanic and could do it myself for $900 then I'd probably change my mind and bite the bullet. It is around $3500-3800 to have the dealer do the replacement IMS bearing and flange (with the direct oil feed to keep the bearing lubricated). NO THANK YOU!
I was just thinking... you mention the other guy is a car buff. Since he seems to be giving you a great deal on the trade, it's possible he's withholding some information. It's likely he's been getting an oil analysis done at every oil change and doesn't like the trend that he's seeing.
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Old 05-13-2015, 08:33 AM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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It's possible; however, he was the one who mentioned the IMS issues to me and that I might find it beneficial to at least read up on it.
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Old 05-13-2015, 08:35 AM
Twixboy Twixboy is online now
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Originally Posted by bnreed3 View Post
It's possible; however, he was the one who mentioned the IMS issues to me and that I might find it beneficial to at least read up on it.
Ohh, I thought kenster brought it up. Anyhoo, glad you decided to keep the Z! Time for some mods.
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  #24  
Old 05-13-2015, 01:23 PM
bnreed3 bnreed3 is offline
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Well, I have had an add on CL just for fun and have my Z4 way overpriced for it having a rebuilt title. I bought it for $7500 with 53xxx miles and have a guy really wanting to buy next week for my asking price of $11,900. I love the car, but with a rebuilt title you have to take these opportunities. Thinking about getting into a '99-'01 Corvette if the sale goes through.
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Old 05-13-2015, 06:19 PM
enzed4 enzed4 is offline
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Originally Posted by bmwclubracer View Post
An auto, besides being no more fun to drive than a Camry, is just another thing to break.
Yes, I always hand my balls to the wife before driving my auto Z4
Fun is not limited to having a third pedal, it's not always a case of 'if it ain't stick, it ain't driving'
I would have loved mine to be a manual, but they're very hard to come by, so sometimes you have to jump at the opportunity that you get, or risk waiting forever for a 'real' car.
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