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  #351  
Old 04-23-2010, 02:56 PM
arjuno arjuno is offline
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+1 NASA43, completely agree.

Some people seem to confuse the 1.18% mark down on a lease payments with max MSDs as the return on money. The MSD program has been shown on average to return 8-10% back on your money over the term of the lease.

On my lease itself, I'm saving 3100 for an initial cash due at signing of 8500 (7350 of which is in MSDs).
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  #352  
Old 07-07-2010, 07:42 AM
bayarea328xit bayarea328xit is offline
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Anyone use MSDs recently? At BMW of Mountain View (CA)?

If so, when did you complete the transaction?
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  #353  
Old 08-19-2010, 06:47 PM
dha510 dha510 is offline
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BMWFS is the only program allowing MSD on the leased vehicle,correct? You can not do MSD when leasing MB or Audi, or am I wrong?
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  #354  
Old 08-19-2010, 08:19 PM
NewBimmerr NewBimmerr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dha510 View Post
BMWFS is the only program allowing MSD on the leased vehicle,correct? You can not do MSD when leasing MB or Audi, or am I wrong?
Does MINI allow MSD?
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  #355  
Old 08-19-2010, 08:21 PM
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SARAFIL SARAFIL is offline
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Originally Posted by NewBimmerr View Post
Does MINI allow MSD?
yes, same program as BMW
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  #356  
Old 08-19-2010, 08:34 PM
NewBimmerr NewBimmerr is offline
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Originally Posted by SARAFIL View Post
yes, same program as BMW
Thanks. That's what I told my friend who just leased a MINI, but for some reason, all 5 dealers she went to refused to do MSD. Plus, they are still talking MSRP on the 2010 models...I went with her to one of the dealerships to test drive (great car btw), but it's amazing how different they are in dealing with customers compared to BMW. They laughed at her when she mentioned Invoice + and the CA (Motoring Advisor) for MINI was clueless on lease terms and had to ask the finance guy for it.
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  #357  
Old 08-19-2010, 09:09 PM
dha510 dha510 is offline
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Originally Posted by SARAFIL View Post
yes, same program as BMW
I am not surprised MINI allows MSD, financial entity is same as BMW. What about other so-called "luxury car manufacturers" i.e. MB, Audi?
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  #358  
Old 08-21-2010, 09:34 AM
southpaw23 southpaw23 is offline
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Infiniti does as well.
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  #359  
Old 08-22-2010, 08:46 PM
dha510 dha510 is offline
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Went to MB and Audi today and asked about MSD, got a "Are you from Mars" kind of look at both dealerships
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  #360  
Old 08-22-2010, 09:17 PM
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lilskel lilskel is offline
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Originally Posted by dha510 View Post
Went to MB and Audi today and asked about MSD, got a "Are you from Mars" kind of look at both dealerships
Ask them about their residuals and then you will have the same look on your face when they tell you what they are. Oh, and if maintenance is included
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  #361  
Old 09-12-2010, 07:52 AM
MTech8 MTech8 is offline
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Can someone remind me how to calculate the SD value? Is it a set amount or is it based off a percentage of the car?

I read though this thread years ago, but wasn't leasing then. I basically understand that I can put down MSD to buy down the MF. I believe it's up to 7 MSD. Just curious how much each SD would cost.

For example, if I wanted to put down 7 SD, what is the total?

Thanks!
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  #362  
Old 09-12-2010, 08:03 AM
gekisai29 gekisai29 is offline
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mb allows in more limited circumstances ie, standard rates
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  #363  
Old 09-12-2010, 08:05 AM
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SARAFIL SARAFIL is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTech8 View Post
Can someone remind me how to calculate the SD value? Is it a set amount or is it based off a percentage of the car?

I read though this thread years ago, but wasn't leasing then. I basically understand that I can put down MSD to buy down the MF. I believe it's up to 7 MSD. Just curious how much each SD would cost.

For example, if I wanted to put down 7 SD, what is the total?

Thanks!
Each security deposit is your monthly payment rounded up to the next $50. So, $401 is rounded to $450, etc.

Your total is just the number of security deposits * the amount of each security deposit. In the above scenario, it would be 7 * $450
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  #364  
Old 09-23-2010, 11:58 PM
MTech8 MTech8 is offline
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Thanks SARAFIL!
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  #365  
Old 09-28-2010, 02:36 PM
MTech8 MTech8 is offline
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Ok. Need some help.

So I was speaking to a dealer and these are the numbers that he gave me. He didn't give me the money factor (which I'll ask him for later). But something just doesn't seem right. From reading this thread, I was under the impression that my monthly payments would be less + I would get the security deposit amount back.

For a 65K X5 for 36 month lease
$754.87 with 4100 down
$815.00 with 6800 security deposit
$883 with 0 down

(Residual on car is 38,541).

When I asked him why the payment is higher, he said that I am buying down the rate, but since I am getting the 6800 back, the true payment is $626.11.

So he said that:
$754.87 x 36 months = $27,175.32
$815 x 36 months = $29,340
$815 x 36 months = $29,340 - $6800 = 22,540 / 36 = $626

Please help.
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  #366  
Old 09-28-2010, 03:19 PM
erdoran erdoran is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTech8 View Post
Ok. Need some help.

So I was speaking to a dealer and these are the numbers that he gave me. He didn't give me the money factor (which I'll ask him for later). But something just doesn't seem right. From reading this thread, I was under the impression that my monthly payments would be less + I would get the security deposit amount back.

For a 65K X5 for 36 month lease
$754.87 with 4100 down
$815.00 with 6800 security deposit
$883 with 0 down

(Residual on car is 38,541).

When I asked him why the payment is higher, he said that I am buying down the rate, but since I am getting the 6800 back, the true payment is $626.11.

So he said that:
$754.87 x 36 months = $27,175.32
$815 x 36 months = $29,340
$815 x 36 months = $29,340 - $6800 = 22,540 / 36 = $626

Please help.
Somebody is confused.
$754.87 x 36 months = $27,175.32 PLUS the buydown of $4100 gets you $31,275.32 total
The security deposit doesn't figure into your total paid out, it is neutral. Your true payment is $815.

Since you haven't provided any other info like sticker, your negotiated price, or MF no one can comment on the "goodness" of your deal but judging from the misinformation above (be it BS or the CA being clueless about leasing and MSDs) if I were you I'd get myself any of the numerous lease calculating programs, read up on leases until YOU can do the calculations yourself, and keep your eyes peeled for more mistakes or BS....or just shop elsewhere.
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  #367  
Old 09-28-2010, 04:15 PM
MTech8 MTech8 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erdoran View Post
Somebody is confused.
$754.87 x 36 months = $27,175.32 PLUS the buydown of $4100 gets you $31,275.32 total
The security deposit doesn't figure into your total paid out, it is neutral. Your true payment is $815.

Since you haven't provided any other info like sticker, your negotiated price, or MF no one can comment on the "goodness" of your deal but judging from the misinformation above (be it BS or the CA being clueless about leasing and MSDs) if I were you I'd get myself any of the numerous lease calculating programs, read up on leases until YOU can do the calculations yourself, and keep your eyes peeled for more mistakes or BS....or just shop elsewhere.
Thanks. Erdoran. Yeah. I'm pretty confused. New to leasing. I tried calculating figures (hopefully got it right).

So the MSRP = 65325
Cap Cost = 59331 (purchase price) - 4100 (down) = 55231
Residual based on 59% = 38541.75
Term 36 Month
Total Rate = 0.0021 (base rate) + 0.001 (markup) = .0031

Thus
Depreciation = 463.59
Interest = 290.70
Monthly Payment = 754.29


Now how do I calcuate MSD if I didn't want to put down pay and put down max security deposit?

So with MSD in the calculation. I subtract the MSD rate reduction.
What I understand is that the "Total Rate = 0.0021 - markup - MSD rate reduction

But what happens to cap cost? Is it reduced by the security deposit amount? or Does it remain the same?

Thanks!
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  #368  
Old 09-28-2010, 04:25 PM
erdoran erdoran is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTech8 View Post
Thanks. Erdoran. Yeah. I'm pretty confused. New to leasing. I tried calculating figures (hopefully got it right).

So the MSRP = 65325
Cap Cost = 59331 (purchase price) - 4100 (down) = 55231
Residual based on 59% = 38541.75
Term 36 Month
Total Rate = 0.0021 (base rate) + 0.001 (markup) = .0031

Thus
Depreciation = 463.59
Interest = 290.70
Monthly Payment = 754.29


Now how do I calcuate MSD if I didn't want to put down pay and put down max security deposit?

So with MSD in the calculation. I subtract the MSD rate reduction.
What I understand is that the "Total Rate = 0.0021 - markup - MSD rate reduction

But what happens to cap cost? Is it reduced by the security deposit amount? or Does it remain the same?

Thanks!
OK, you should NOT put down any $$, therefore your cap cost is $59,331. Your residual stays the same because it is based on MSRP.

Assuming you are doing 8 MSDs you deduct 8 * .00007 = .00049 from the MF =.00161 for MF (aka total rate) plus whatever markup you aren't able to negotiate down

So find your lease calculator, plug in

cap cost $59339
residual $38542
MF .00161
payments 36

voila! you have your payment. Your security deposit will be 8 * your payment, and you should get back 100% of that. Watch your paperwork like a hawk to be sure your security deposit is properly applied and not somehow converted into a down payment/cap cost reduction instead (I've heard of that type of thing happening)

There is (or was, I'm not really active on the board much) Philippe Kahn in Long Beach who is a board sponsor and has a wonderful reputation, I suggest you look him up and see what he can do for you. From what you've said the first CA told you, I would be very uncomfortable dealing with him.

PS I haven't checked your figures or looked up rebates, residuals, MF, etc for you, it's worth your time to double check them here and look for rebates here, edmunds.com and kbb.com as part of your due diligence.
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  #369  
Old 09-28-2010, 07:54 PM
BMWFanboy BMWFanboy is offline
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You can only do a max of 7 MSDs, not 8.
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  #370  
Old 09-29-2010, 03:16 AM
erdoran erdoran is offline
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Originally Posted by BMWFanboy View Post
You can only do a max of 7 MSDs, not 8.
Oops, I even calculated it right :> just put the wrong number.
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  #371  
Old 09-29-2010, 07:59 AM
MTech8 MTech8 is offline
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Thanks for the help guys! I finally got a firm understanding of MSD and how to calculate them.
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  #372  
Old 09-29-2010, 09:35 AM
E92Carrera E92Carrera is offline
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Originally Posted by BMWFanboy View Post
You can only do a max of 7 MSDs, not 8.
Actually you can do 8* technically. If you are not a returning BMW FS customer, BMW requires a security deposit unless you place an adder to your MF. So thats one 1 SD, then you can now make up to 7 more to reduce your MF. So you can technically do 8
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  #373  
Old 09-30-2010, 10:33 PM
Peregrinus Peregrinus is offline
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So I did the 7 SDs today on my lease. The CA didn't know much about it and the finance guy just kinda-down played it a little ("not a lot of people like to do this"). But man - if you look at the numbers, I'm saving 30 bucks a month on 3500 down. That's a return of 360 dollars a year on 3500 - better than 10% tax-free risk-free - bam. No brainer.

Oh, also, I know it's been posted a few times - but your SD is the monthly payment rounded up to nearest 50 dollars AFTER the MF discount is applied. In my case, it knocked me down to a lower level SD!

Why doesn't BMW advertise this program more? It's excellent value add.
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  #374  
Old 10-03-2010, 10:51 AM
BMWFanboy BMWFanboy is offline
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Originally Posted by E92Carrera View Post
Actually you can do 8* technically. If you are not a returning BMW FS customer, BMW requires a security deposit unless you place an adder to your MF. So thats one 1 SD, then you can now make up to 7 more to reduce your MF. So you can technically do 8
You only get the money factor reduction on 7 and that was the point.
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  #375  
Old 10-14-2010, 10:04 AM
Peripatetic Peripatetic is offline
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First time poster here. Great info on this site and the MSD alone is like finding hundreds (or thousands) in a couch. You guys are all awesome! I'm pretty close to closing a deal with my dealer, but they're telling me that each security deposit lowers the MF by .00004 instead of the .00007 I'm reading here. Is that a new rate or are they just keeping some of the money for themselves? Secondly, can they do this and how can I question the rate without going into full a-hole mode? Thanks for any advice!

Just an update, I called another dealer and they told me it was still .00007 per SD. So now to do battle with the crooks at my dealership.

Last edited by Peripatetic; 10-14-2010 at 10:19 AM.
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