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E63 / E64 6 Series (2003 - 2013)
The E63/E64 BMW 6 Series builds on BMW's sporty heritage with aggressive lines and an incredible motor to back the design up. Available in coupe and convertible trims with a standard 4.8 liter engine producing 360 horsepower and 360 lb-ft of torque, the 6-series is a popular choice that exceeds expectations.

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  #1  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:18 AM
Skylar's Dad Skylar's Dad is offline
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Test Drove the M6--Major Dissapointment!

Unlike MOST of us I actually went down to the dealer and test drove the M6 yesterday. Sterling BMW has a beautiful Interlagos Blue Coupe that was a demo (1K miles) they are selling for $99K.

I brought my good friend who happens to have the new SL 600 (V12/Bi Turbo-more HP and tourque than the M6). We were on his boat right across from the dealership and I told him "From what I hear the M6 is quite a car, lets go give it a go...) I had stopped by the dealership and told my salesman we would be driving that Interlagos Blue model and make sure it has enough GAS!

So I let him go first, the MAJOR difference is that all these cars come with the "infamous" SMG tranny so the Salesman gave us a quick demo on how to use it and I suggested my Buddy go first...

He gave a nice spin, 15 minutes later, Iasked him anticipating an "awesome" response he just said..."you drive it and tell me what YOU think first"....

Hmmm, so I got in and gave it a go...I began to see what my my friend had suggested...

While the "POWER" available was undeniably "THERE" it was getting the transmission to actually getting the wheels to turn when you wanted to go...I mean it was the most herky / jerky experience I have ever had...

I have had PLENTY of manaul Tranny's in my day, so I KNOW how to shift, obviously NOT like a Formula 1 Driver which seems to be the difference here...

Anyway, we BOTH did not care for the car as a result...

BMW cannot offer a Steptronic (Beefed Up Version) in the M6???????

I know they are coming out with a manual and that would be BIG improvement...

My friends SL600, he just leaves it in AUTO pushes down the pedal and the car takes off like a MISSILE

Personally, that is what I am looking for, I do not think one needs to be "paddle shifting" through the 405 Freeway and Pacific Coast Highway... I am not a Boy Racer, just an OLD somewhat successful guy who wants a BIG smile everytime he PUSHES down on the accelerator...Give me that SAME M6 with a Steptronic (great tranny) and I would be thrilled! Now I have to contemplate an SL55 or 600...but I need the back seat...

ps...the Auto feature on the SMG is useless, at least the one the Salesman showed me...

BEAR- for an OLD guy, you must be VERY talented, you boy racer you...

Last edited by Skylar's Dad; 01-15-2007 at 09:25 AM.
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  #2  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:25 AM
Malibubimmer Malibubimmer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylar's Dad View Post
Unlike MOST of us I actually went down to the dealer and test drove the M6 yesterday. Sterling BMW has a beautiful Interlagos Blue Coupe that was a demo (1K miles) they are selling for $99K.

I brought my good friend who happens to have the new SL 600 (V12/Bi Turbo-more HP and tourque than the M6). We were on his boat right across from the dealership and I told him "From what I hear the M6 is quite a car, lets go give it a go...) I had stopped by the dealership and told my salesman we would be driving that Interlagos Blue model and make sure it has enough GAS!

So I let him go first, the MAJOR difference is that all these cars come with the "infamous" SMG tranny so the Salesman gave us a quick demo on how to use it and I suggested my Buddy go first...

He gave a nice spin, 15 minutes later, Iasked him anticipating an "awesome" response he just said..."you drive it and tell me what YOU think first"....

Hmmm, so I got in and gave it a go...I began to see what my my friend had suggested...

While the "POWER" available was undeniably "THERE" it was getting the transmission to actually getting the wheels to turn when you wanted to go...I mean it was the most herky / jerky experience I have ever had...

I have had PLENTY of manaul Tranny's in my day, so I KNOW how to shift, obviously NOT like a Formula 1 Driver which seems to be the difference here...

Anyway, we BOTH did not care for the car as a result...

BMW cannot offer a Steptronic (Beefed Up Version) in the M6???????

I know they are coming out with a manual and that would be BIG improvement...

My friends SL600, he just leaves it in AUTO pushes down the pedal and the car takes off like a MISSILE

Personally, that is what I am looking for, I do not think one needs to be "paddle shifting" through the 405 Freeway and Pacific Coast Highway... I am not a Boy Racer, just an OLD somewhat sucessfyl guy who wants a BIG smile everytime he PUSHES down on the accelerator...Give me that SAME m^ with a Steptronic (great tranny) and I would be thrilled! Now I have to contemplate an SL55 or 600...but I need the back seat...

ps...the Auto feature on the SMG is useless, at least the one the Salesman showed me...

BEAR- for an OLD guy, you must be VERY talented, you boy racer you
...
Did you have the whooopeee button pressed? Also, going from a Steptronic to SMG is going to produce disappointment if you think of the M6 as a slushbox. It is definitely a stick shift experience. BMW just hasn't given us a stick shift yet.

I have driven the SL65 (100 more HP than the SL600) and it is one fast refrigerator!
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  #3  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:30 AM
Skylar's Dad Skylar's Dad is offline
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Originally Posted by Malibubimmer View Post
Did you have the whooopeee button pressed? Also, going from a Steptronic to SMG is going to produce disappointment if you think of the M6 as a slushbox. It is definitely a stick shift experience. BMW just hasn't given us a stick shift yet.

I have driven the SL65 (100 more HP than the SL600) and it is one fast refrigerator!
Mal-

I know you are a couple of years older than me, OK maybe one or two... I invite you to go down to the "WORST dealership on the planet" and test drive the M6...To your point I would have been fine with a manual tranny, wifey could not use it, but that's another story...I am not "Mario Andretti's Son" I am "Skylar's Dad"!!

Cheers-
SD
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  #4  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:35 AM
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Skylar: I have not driven the M6, have driven the M3 SMG, and now own the SMG in the 6. Your comment is correct. You can not drive the SMG like the STEP. I has a clutch, so if you leave your foot planted, it will be jerky as it has to completely disengage the engine from the transmission to shift gears. So if you want a smooth shift, you have to do the same as in a manual, let up on the gas, shift, then mash it. It does not take long to get the technique down, but it does take some practice.
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  #5  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:44 AM
650kid 650kid is offline
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I think that there is definately a large learning curve with the SMG. It definately takes some getting used to and by simply going on a test drive will not give you the feel that you need to get in order to drive it. Having had SMG in my 650 since last march i can tell you that there is no way i would have gone back and gotten the steptronic. I will admit that at first it is definately very jerky, especially with the sport on, but after driving the car everyday you learn to feather the gas for smooth take offs and shifts. I have not driven an m6 yet so i do not know the difference between the SMG II and SMG III but i would imagine they're pretty simalar. In my opinion SMG makes the driving experience that much more exciting

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  #6  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:45 AM
Lanc3r Lanc3r is offline
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Get the Mercedes. Please.
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  #7  
Old 01-15-2007, 10:17 AM
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BHR4CE1 BHR4CE1 is offline
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Well, I must admit that had you asked me on day one if I liked the SMG, I would have yelped out a resounding “NO WAY!” but ask me now and I say yes Yes YES!

This car desires some getting used to; but when given the chance, this thing becomes an extension of you. I have nothing against MB’s, but they weren’t even a consideration when I shopped for the M6. There are just TOO many of them around here. I wanted something a little distinctive, and the M6 vert is just that.

When you acclimatize to the learning curve of this car, you become passionately conscious of the fact that you are really manipulating this machine from point A to point B. You are not merely sitting in it and having it take you where you want to go. If you are fond of the uneventful drive down PCH, I say go for the MB. If you require a little more hands on merriment (which I LOVE) the M6 delivers.

I drive it in auto mode most of the time, and still get a grin on my face when it shifts from gear to gear. I do like shifting from time to time as well, and I have learned to discern where the shift points need to occur. Accordingly, I let up on the throttle a little bit before I shift and bask with the knowledge that I can’t screw up. Yes… it is true…I can shift in the vein of an overweight F1 driver!

I couldn’t BEAR to drive a “regular” auto or manual again.
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  #8  
Old 01-15-2007, 11:14 AM
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Gran Turismo Gran Turismo is offline
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SD - my advice: Go for a 2nd test drive and don't do the following two errors again:

1.) Too much throttle in the 2 lowest gears, as long as you're not used to it Floor it only from 3rd gear upwards.
2.) ALWAYS have the heel of your right foot placed firmly at the bottom end of the gas pedal. So NEVER depress the gas pedal just with the tip of your foot otherwise the jerky behavior is almost guaranteed in low gears...

Never forget that the SMG is technically a manual tranny, so believe it or not: Both will react exactly as jerky while in low gears! There's no torque convertor compensating for such user errors (while turning valuable mechanical engine energy into heat )

It might also help to 'mentally' practice switching gears in advance. Just imagine that by flicking the paddle you give some gremlin the order to switch gears on a MT for you, but YOU are in control of the throttle. When upshifting, the trick is to slightly release the throttle slightly AFTER having flicked the paddle.
After several hours of practice, you won't have to think about it again. That's the famous learning curve every SMG owner is talking about.
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  #9  
Old 01-15-2007, 11:21 AM
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chuck92103 chuck92103 is offline
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Two words..

"Clutch Disengagement"

I drove the SMG in a 650 at the BMW driving school. I think what gets new comers the most is the clutch.

With a typical manual tranny, when you take your your foot off the gas, you depress the clutch and coast to a stop.

With SMG the clutch stays engage giving you the jerks especially if you hit the gas again.

BMW is pulling SMG from all non-M cars (at least in the US). Maybe dealer do not want them off lease because they are harder to move.

The new 5 series will only have a step tranny for the first 6 months, and then they will offer a manual.

I suspect SMG drivers in non M cars have been Guinea pigs for BMW. Overall I would say the acceptance of SMG has been lees than positive. But than again, so has iDrive.
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  #10  
Old 01-15-2007, 12:00 PM
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Gran Turismo Gran Turismo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck92103 View Post
With a typical manual tranny, when you take your your foot off the gas, you depress the clutch and coast to a stop.
Please don't tell me you've learned that from a driving school!? That's not how you would pass a driver's license exam here, where everyone learns to drive on a MT car!
No, you're gradually downshifting (engine braking) until 2nd gear while coasting from higher speeds to a stop - BTW exactly what the SMG is doing too if you don't do anything (excepted braking) in the same situation!

Quote:
With SMG the clutch stays engage giving you the jerks especially if you hit the gas again.
Again, a MT will react the same if doing that in 1st gear with the clutch engaged. If OTOH hitting the gas with the clutch depressed... well, luckily there's a rev limiter!
The little secret is simply to 'hit' the gas appropriately, depending on the selected gear.
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  #11  
Old 01-15-2007, 12:04 PM
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GeneArch GeneArch is offline
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The SMG is the reason I passed on the M6 and had my deposit refunded.

Nothing more I'd love than to simply put it in gear and drive like a normal person. I'd rather not "interact" with the car much in that mode. No thinking about letting off the gas.

Then.. when in "manual" mode I could be boy racer galore and use the paddles like a madman.

I'll wait for a DSG type setup.
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  #12  
Old 01-15-2007, 12:15 PM
BigHat BigHat is offline
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No doubt SMG is an acquired taste and DEFINITELY involves a learning curve. To condemn it on a test drive is everyone's right but really means nothing and is somewhat silly.

Why does someone that doesn't know how to drive a manual blame themselves for a rough driving performance, but someone that doesn't know how to drive an SMG car blames the car?

Had SMG II in an M3, I'd have it in my six if it wasn't a watered down version.

Maybe these will never sell well because people get scared on the test drive, but if you gave it a couple of weeks you'd love it. SMG and it's inevitable upgrades and variants ARE THE FUTURE.

Last edited by BigHat; 01-15-2007 at 12:19 PM.
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  #13  
Old 01-15-2007, 12:35 PM
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chuck92103 chuck92103 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gran Turismo View Post
Please don't tell me you've learned that from a driving school!? That's not how you would pass a driver's license exam here, where everyone learns to drive on a MT car!
No, you're gradually downshifting (engine braking) until 2nd gear while coasting from higher speeds to a stop - BTW exactly what the SMG is doing too if you don't do anything (excepted braking) in the same situation!

Again, a MT will react the same if doing that in 1st gear with the clutch engaged. If OTOH hitting the gas with the clutch depressed... well, luckily there's a rev limiter!
The little secret is simply to 'hit' the gas appropriately, depending on the selected gear.
Brake pads cost less than clutches. Do the math.
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Old 01-15-2007, 01:14 PM
Lanc3r Lanc3r is offline
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Brake pads cost less than clutches. Do the math.
Downshifting does not wear out a clutch. In fact coasting with the clutch in, destroys the throw-out bearing.
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Old 01-15-2007, 01:31 PM
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Gran Turismo Gran Turismo is offline
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Originally Posted by chuck92103 View Post
Brake pads cost less than clutches. Do the math.
Clutch tear and wear is proportional to the involved torque - in other words what's caused by engine braking is negligible compared to what happens when engaging the clutch at WOT. And if you rev-match the downshifts (what the SMG is doing automatically for you ), nothing bad will happen at all.

Just watch / listen to whatever WRC in-car video and pay attention to the shifting technique of those guys while approaching a turn.
Agreeed, their driving style tends to be jerky too!
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  #16  
Old 01-15-2007, 03:11 PM
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The SMGIII shifted effortlessly smooth and quick at the tracks when I attended the Drive Day event. Full 373kW and running at fourth gear or higher, it sure was insanely fast. Then, back to reality when I took it out to town traffic. I knew it was going to be a learning curve. I did my best, knowing this was an automated manual; the clutch was in there somewhere. It didn't quite work for me.

I see a lot of pre-owned M5 cars with less than 20,000km on sale. I think the novelty has worn off by now for many owners who realised the true nature of the SMGIII.

I think SMGIII might be the last instalment. Isn't dual-clutch the next big overhaul?
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Old 01-15-2007, 03:24 PM
Malibubimmer Malibubimmer is offline
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Skylar's Dad - Thanks for the tip, but I have decided that I have an "appointment in Samarra" at Santa Monica BMW. So I plan never to set foot in there again. I will use Bear's M6 rattlebox for a few days instead. Right, Bear?

After reading these comments I am beginning to think we are all a bunch of geezerly farking poseurs. At least those manly BMW owners who think the slush box was an abomination against the Ultimate Driving Experience will think so.

If you remember that the SMG is not a slush box you will do better. Since I have driven sticks all my life -- but not since I let the 3.0CS go -- when I drove BeeWang's 650i SMG I used the "dead pedal" as if it were the clutch to remind me to ease off the accelerator pedal when I shifted gears. (Of course, with no mood lighting down there this was hard to do when it was dark.)

But I would prefer a stick shift to the SMG if I am going to have to shift. The auto in the Mercedes is pretty good and handles the 700+ ft. lbs. of torque pretty easily in the SL65 AMG; it's just too bad the car has all of the soul of a refrigerator.

Back to my question Earl Whitecar: Did you depress the button that gives you the extra 100 HP? The settings in the M5 and M6 make all the difference in the world to performance (and there are a huge number of different settings). This, of course, ignores issues that may exist with SMG, which may be another reason for disappointment.
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Old 01-15-2007, 03:33 PM
Fzara2000 Fzara2000 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gran Turismo View Post

2.) ALWAYS have the heel of your right foot placed firmly at the bottom end of the gas pedal. So NEVER depress the gas pedal just with the tip of your foot otherwise the jerky behavior is almost guaranteed in low gears...

Wow, I never realized I did this in my car. I always drive with my toes on the accelerator to prevent using too much throttle. Good tip!
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Old 01-15-2007, 03:55 PM
CAFleming CAFleming is offline
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As an occasional peruser always looking for my next sports coupe:

1)Isn't part of the point of the SMG that it's supposed to manage the clutch and the clutch throttle interaction for you? Not sure I buy this bit about trying to modulate the gas pedal to make up for the lack of SMG's capability.

2)DSG style transmissions ARE the future for sporty rides

3)I think the original poster would be happier with one of the SL's than an M6. I've driven the SL55/600/ and 65 on the racetrack, and while they're not really awe-inspiring on the twisties, they are really fun "mash the pedal" type cars.

4)If the original poster needs a back seat, but can get by with a small, occasional use only one, he should seriously consider a 997TT. It's actually faster as a Tiptronic than a manual, and performance is simply outstanding in acceleration, handling, and braking. Yet the beast is amazingly civilized in day to day or city driving. I really think that would be the car for you.
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Old 01-15-2007, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Malibubimmer View Post
Since I have driven sticks all my life ...

I would prefer a stick shift to the SMG if I am going to have to shift. ...
I thought each time you needed shifting in the past, you pontificated to Manolo directing him to shift. But as he is no longer in your service now, and there is questionable competency with Reynaldo, are you sure the steptronic isn't right for you?

Last edited by 650iOzBoy; 01-15-2007 at 04:02 PM.
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Old 01-15-2007, 07:11 PM
Malibubimmer Malibubimmer is offline
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I thought each time you needed shifting in the past, you pontificated to Manolo directing him to shift. But as he is no longer in your service now, and there is questionable competency with Reynaldo, are you sure the steptronic isn't right for you?
Lord Insidious, are you off your meds again? Or are you and Chuck92103 simply too much again?

Please note my new location!
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  #22  
Old 01-15-2007, 07:17 PM
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I don't give a shift.
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  #23  
Old 01-15-2007, 07:51 PM
Malibubimmer Malibubimmer is offline
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I don't give a shift.
Shiftless San Diegan.
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  #24  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:19 PM
gotwish gotwish is offline
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Why can't we have a steptronic handling 500+ horses and have those horses ALWAYS ON?
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  #25  
Old 01-15-2007, 09:20 PM
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Why can't we have a steptronic handling 500+ horses and have those horses ALWAYS ON?
If that was the case, I'll be driving the M6 now.
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