Welcome to Bimmerfest -- The #1 Online Community for BMW related information! Please enjoy the discussion forums below and share your experiences with the 200,000 current, new and past BMW owners. The forums are broken out by car model and into other special interest sections such as BMW European Delivery and a special forum to voice your questions to the many BMW dealers on the site to assist our members!

Please follow the links below to help get you started!

Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > Z Series > E85 / E86 Z4 (2003-2008)

E85 / E86 Z4 (2003-2008)
E85 Z4 Roadster, E86 Z4 Coupe, E85 Z4 M Roadster, and E86 Z4 M Coupe talk with our BMW gurus here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #226  
Old 06-23-2007, 01:26 AM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROM3N View Post
Looks really nice Cant wait to see what you think of the sound. BTW whats the latest on your suspension do you still have noise in the front ?
-A little, but as I mentioned before the front shock noise is much quieter than the rear shock noise so I don't notice it. Remember, the rear shocks ARE supposed to make noise, according to TCK. But the noise isn't noticeable over 30mph.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #227  
Old 06-23-2007, 02:22 AM
GP20 GP20 is offline
Banned
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 113
Mein Auto: Z4M
I think the weird thing is I didn't have any rear shock noises at all with my TCk coilivers. I had the single adjustable rears. I'm guessing you have the double-adjustable rears?

How would you describe your front strut noises though? I'm at a crossroad right now. TCK has fixed my front struts but apparently cannot mount them on a Z4M for testing for me anymore (long story). The noises I was experiencing were pretty nasty. Loud - constant - clunking noises when slowly (maybe up to 25~30MPH) going over roads that were not perfectly smooth.
Reply With Quote
  #228  
Old 06-23-2007, 01:29 PM
Ron Stygar's Avatar
Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
19,585 Miles
Location: CT
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 11,143
Mein Auto: Z4 M Coupe 6LL93033
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palantirion View Post
And lastly, for all of you who complain about the rear view in the M Coupe:



By accident I discovered that if you tilt the rearview mirror so that the top of the rear glass bisects the mirror, you can see straight back quite a ways. This ratio will change depending on how tall you are and how you have your seat positioned, but I hope it helps. It IS possible to see out the back
I bisected the head liner half way in the top of the mirror.
Headliner is half on top instead of the interior stuff being half on the bottom.
It really helps.

Thanks for stumbling on this and sharing.
Reply With Quote
  #229  
Old 06-23-2007, 03:25 PM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Quote:
Originally Posted by GP20 View Post
I think the weird thing is I didn't have any rear shock noises at all with my TCk coilivers. I had the single adjustable rears. I'm guessing you have the double-adjustable rears?

How would you describe your front strut noises though? I'm at a crossroad right now. TCK has fixed my front struts but apparently cannot mount them on a Z4M for testing for me anymore (long story). The noises I was experiencing were pretty nasty. Loud - constant - clunking noises when slowly (maybe up to 25~30MPH) going over roads that were not perfectly smooth.
-Yeah, the singles don't make any noise, just the doubles. I think the noises sound like a deep clunk, like what you are describing. Personally, I don't find the noise too abnoxious and I absolutely MUST have the bump adjustment for track days. After tracking with it I can't track without it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Stygar View Post
I bisected the head liner half way in the top of the mirror.
Headliner is half on top instead of the interior stuff being half on the bottom.
It really helps.

Thanks for stumbling on this and sharing.
-Glad it worked for you. I'll pass this on to my wife. It's because she drove the Coupe and left the mirror in the "wrong place" that I discovered the trick, lol.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #230  
Old 06-25-2007, 06:33 AM
Dammmittt's Avatar
Dammmittt Dammmittt is offline
///M
Location: In between locations...
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,371
Mein Auto: 07 M Coupe
Good work on the exhaust. I think the cleaner pipes and less restrictive turns will give you some extra hp that was lost from the step from the M3 to the Z4M. Any word on pricing for the exhaust mod?
__________________


07 ///M Coupe (Premium Package) Black Saphire Ext. Imola Red Int.

Best Website in the History of the Internet!
Reply With Quote
  #231  
Old 06-25-2007, 07:06 AM
Luminor's Avatar
Luminor Luminor is offline
My kine-a town.
Location: Chicago, IL
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 420
Mein Auto: 335i, E350 Estate, F430
Palantirion, you didn't comment on the GruppeM ram air intake...any thoughts from you or the guys at BMS?

http://www.gruppemeurope.com/shippin...m_roadster.htm

The displacement in the description under the image reads 3000cc, but clearly its the S54 in a Z4M.
Reply With Quote
  #232  
Old 06-25-2007, 07:20 AM
Dammmittt's Avatar
Dammmittt Dammmittt is offline
///M
Location: In between locations...
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,371
Mein Auto: 07 M Coupe
What's the suspected performance improvement with the Ramair?
__________________


07 ///M Coupe (Premium Package) Black Saphire Ext. Imola Red Int.

Best Website in the History of the Internet!
Reply With Quote
  #233  
Old 06-25-2007, 07:47 AM
Bammered Bammered is offline
///MTOURAGE
Location: NJ/ Toronto
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 118
Mein Auto: E86 Z4 ///M COUPE
Ron, At 6'4'' the only way I can see through my rear view is having it angled up heavily.... yes u may only get half of the rear window but at least your looking straight back as opposed to glancing back at someones license plate... Extra Nessasary for cop look out!! Good thing i discovered this on my first weekend in the car on the way back from the P-center... never could understand the testers comments about rear view visibility....Would love to see some gruppe M alternatives come out! Any idea on gains? Because its too expensive an intake systme for just improved sound....
__________________
BBS CH- H&R springs - SuperSprint Race and X-Pipe- JVT headers with cat delete- ESS software- CDV delete - R888's for track-Ultimate racing pedals - Dice Ipod intergration- Full option
Reply With Quote
  #234  
Old 06-25-2007, 08:40 AM
Luminor's Avatar
Luminor Luminor is offline
My kine-a town.
Location: Chicago, IL
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 420
Mein Auto: 335i, E350 Estate, F430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dammmittt View Post
What's the suspected performance improvement with the Ramair?
I don't know, that's what I'm hoping someone can tell me...as Bammered indicated, its far too expensive for just a throatier intake note... (maybe its lighter...? )
Reply With Quote
  #235  
Old 06-25-2007, 08:51 AM
Luminor's Avatar
Luminor Luminor is offline
My kine-a town.
Location: Chicago, IL
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 420
Mein Auto: 335i, E350 Estate, F430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dammmittt View Post
What's the suspected performance improvement with the Ramair?
This is what I've been able to find:

Reply With Quote
  #236  
Old 06-25-2007, 09:34 AM
Dammmittt's Avatar
Dammmittt Dammmittt is offline
///M
Location: In between locations...
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,371
Mein Auto: 07 M Coupe
So how much does it cost?
__________________


07 ///M Coupe (Premium Package) Black Saphire Ext. Imola Red Int.

Best Website in the History of the Internet!
Reply With Quote
  #237  
Old 06-25-2007, 11:46 AM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dammmittt View Post
Good work on the exhaust. I think the cleaner pipes and less restrictive turns will give you some extra hp that was lost from the step from the M3 to the Z4M. Any word on pricing for the exhaust mod?
-No idea yet. That'll be on BMS's end once the prototype is finished.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luminor View Post
Palantirion, you didn't comment on the GruppeM ram air intake...any thoughts from you or the guys at BMS?

http://www.gruppemeurope.com/shippin...m_roadster.htm

The displacement in the description under the image reads 3000cc, but clearly its the S54 in a Z4M.
-Currently I'm more interested in this one:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=764754
The dyno results (I've seen the sheet) look very good, and it's locally made which means I will have more input on the product. And it's not expensive.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #238  
Old 06-25-2007, 12:05 PM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Update
-Jose has a bad knee and it acted up this weekend. He still came in Sunday to work on the exhaust but didn't get as much done as he planned. The new estimate is that I'll hear it run tomorrow.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #239  
Old 06-25-2007, 12:43 PM
Dammmittt's Avatar
Dammmittt Dammmittt is offline
///M
Location: In between locations...
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,371
Mein Auto: 07 M Coupe
So, how much do you miss your car right now?
__________________


07 ///M Coupe (Premium Package) Black Saphire Ext. Imola Red Int.

Best Website in the History of the Internet!
Reply With Quote
  #240  
Old 06-25-2007, 05:05 PM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dammmittt View Post
So, how much do you miss your car right now?
-A LOT
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #241  
Old 06-26-2007, 06:44 AM
Luminor's Avatar
Luminor Luminor is offline
My kine-a town.
Location: Chicago, IL
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 420
Mein Auto: 335i, E350 Estate, F430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palantirion View Post
-Currently I'm more interested in this one:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=764754
The dyno results (I've seen the sheet) look very good, and it's locally made which means I will have more input on the product. And it's not expensive.

OK, so standard follow-up questions... When/where available and how much?

(BTW, your boys at BMS never got back to me about the battery mount...just FYI)
Reply With Quote
  #242  
Old 06-26-2007, 07:43 AM
KU Ned's Avatar
KU Ned KU Ned is offline
Jayhawk
Location: Kansas City
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 521
Mein Auto: 330i ZHP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palantirion View Post
Mod 20
3-07-07
I applied the first of what will hopefully become many track maps from www.trackgraphic.com. Jim is a great guy to work with and will also do custom maps (I had him do an autoX course once). In case you are curious about the two Horse Thief Mile stickers, I used two because Scatha ran the track in each direction and HTM is a very different course when reversed.



Mod 21
3-07-07
I am REALLY exited about this one! I read on this forum a while back that you can get more negative camber out of E46s and the Z4 by a simple adjustment to the strut mount bolts:
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...+camber+adjust
In reality, you're just alligning the car outside of factory specs, but what works works! We did a proper allignment after the camber change and found the right side toe had changed too much, so that was fixed. If you do this mod I highly recommend paying for an allignment afterwards - just make sure they don't touch the camber!

Does it work? Hell yes!!! I drove the car immediately before the mod around our local "test track". Then I drove it immediately afterwards. The difference is not extreme, but definately noticeable. With 245/275 tires (slightly less stagger than the stock 225/255) the car finally feels prefectly balanced! By which I mean the car no longer fights with neutral-throttle understeer. To my surprise oversteer wasn't an issue either on the 70-mph S turns I tested on. The car just rotated happily I even ran into a case where I had to brake suddenly (abeit smoothly) while exiting one of the turns due to a Suburban stopping and the ensuing oversteer (IE: potential spin) was not severe and easily corrected by a slight change of steering input.

FYI: Remember that I am running RA-1s. You're experience will differ based on your tires, but I imagine the overall improvement in balance would be similar, even if the total grip was different.

p.s. The camber mod also gets rid of two pin screws that weigh a total of 0.01lbs

p.p.s. The factory understeer IS there for a reason: To keep the average driver from spinning the car as easily. This mod WILL make it potentially easier for you to spin your car. Be careful and progressive - LEARN your car!

Now for pics...
This is the strut tower top after the mod. See the little hole with a smaller threaded hole off-center in it? That's the maximum potential change, which amounts to -1.5 degrees.


Before:


After:

Really, there IS a difference in the angle. 1.5 degrees is difficult to see with the naked eye - especially in an imperfect snapshot. See it in person and it's pretty obvious.

Here is the allignment graph immediately following the mod, but before the allignment. Note the front right toe setting is off:


Some pics of it on the rack:




I didn't take a pic of the grin my face after driving it. Use your imagination.
Good use of "Search"! That is a post from the past. As you represent, the camber adjustment does add to the toe out and may wear your tires prematurely if you do not get an alignment.

I also love trackgraphic. I put all the tracks I have driven on my helmet instead of my car:
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #243  
Old 06-26-2007, 01:53 PM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luminor View Post
OK, so standard follow-up questions... When/where available and how much?

(BTW, your boys at BMS never got back to me about the battery mount...just FYI)
-I have no idea of price or availability until the part is ready for sale. But follow that other thread and you'll probably know as soon as I do. Sorry to hear BMS didn't get back to you. That's unusual for them. I suggest calling them again if you can, maybe the message slipped Chris's mind or the paper got lost.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KU Ned View Post
I also love trackgraphic. I put all the tracks I have driven on my helmet instead of my car:
-I also have them on my otherwise plain-old-white helmet, but in a band around the bottom. I figure it's more accurate that way since the tracks on our cars only reflect where they've been.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #244  
Old 06-28-2007, 04:56 PM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Mod 33
6-28-07
So I got to pick up my Coupe today from Jose (his shop name is withheld at his request, he has too much work) and I LOVE the new exhaust!!! Seriously, I am really surprised how good it looks, how good it sounds, and how driveable it is. I can't wait to get it to the dyno and see how it performs. But for that I'll have to wait for a cooler day to get a closer apples to apples comparison with my baseline run.

As for technical details I should first point out that this is technically a prototype exhaust. I'll have to surrender the Coupe again for about two weeks so that Jose can finalize the design and jig it, and test the jigs with a new assembly. The upside is that the finished product will be even cleaner than the current one! The design is by BMS and all the fabrication was done by Jose. The system is modular in three sections so customers can order just the cans, the x-pipe or the resonator to elliminate the secondary cats - OR any combination thereof. They all bolt on to the corresponding BMW pickup points (part of why the system was so difficult to engineer) and use existing BMW hanger mounts. The cans and resonator are sourced from Magnaflow. Everything else; hangars, pipes, x-pipe, tips, etc. are made by Jose (hence all the jigs that still need to be made).

Jose conservatively estimates the exhaust cuts a minimum of 32lbs from the car, a welcomed benefit that brings my Coupe down to an estimated curb weight of 3230lbs Once the final version is made we'll weigh components and I'll be able to figure out section by section what the exact weight savings is.

The sound is great! I was seriously skeptical that an S54 could be made to sound good short of being dropped in a race car. I like the sound of the S54 stock, but every aftermarket system I'm heard prior to today either sounded tinny, farty or raspy. The BMS system (they really ought to name it!) has a nice bark at startup, and then just hums with a bassy idle. It's fairly loud at idle (almost exactly like my Dinan M5's exhaust) when you are standing right behind the Coupe) until the engine warms up and the idle rpm drops, but it's quiet in the cockpit and in front of the car. There is a surge of bass (again, like my M5) between 1000 and 2000rpm and again between 4000 and 4500rpm. Every where else on the rpm range it's only barely lounder than stock unless you load the throttle. Translation: NO droning , not at freeway cruise (tested 65 to 90mph) or street cruise (4th gear, 2500 to 3500rpm)! The only time the exhaust sounds loud in the cockpit is when you start the car from a stop as the engine passes through 2000rpm. On the throttle the Coupe still sounds like an S54 - just with more tone, richer and with a slight snarl. I'm going to be taking a decibel meter out with me soon and I'll report back on the exact Db numbers from in the cockpit and on the street.

I have no idea what the exhaust will be sold for (or what it will be called), but I will publish the prices as soon as they are finalized by BMS.

Anyway, on with the pics...

Here is some OEM crap. Much of the forward BMW tubes were crimped to one degree or another. This is the stock x-pipe (if you can call it that) to the stock resonator:


This is the BMS resonator section bolted to the BMW x-pipe, for fitment testing:


This is the BMW x-pipe/resonator test fitted to the BMS can assembly:


A view of BMW vs BMS cans (note how much more airflow is blocked by the BMW can!):


BMW can vs. BMS can, profile shots. This is also to show how much better the BMS system is at releasing air from under the car:




The finished prototype:






The BMS cat-delete resonator and x-pipe:


The BMS x-pipe to cans:


A summation of benefits:
-32lbs weight reduction
-Better exhaust flow (HP gain to be determined)
-Better evacuation of underbody air
-Modular system can be purchased one step at a time
-Complete reversability/interchangeability with OEM exhaust
-Great sound
-Great looks
-No droning at cruise or idle
__________________

Last edited by Palantirion; 06-28-2007 at 05:04 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #245  
Old 06-28-2007, 05:31 PM
ROM3N's Avatar
ROM3N ROM3N is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: AZ
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 691
Mein Auto: Z4M coupe
Very nice

They did a good job with the styling .
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #246  
Old 06-29-2007, 05:26 AM
Dammmittt's Avatar
Dammmittt Dammmittt is offline
///M
Location: In between locations...
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,371
Mein Auto: 07 M Coupe
So when can we hear it?
__________________


07 ///M Coupe (Premium Package) Black Saphire Ext. Imola Red Int.

Best Website in the History of the Internet!
Reply With Quote
  #247  
Old 06-29-2007, 06:24 AM
Luminor's Avatar
Luminor Luminor is offline
My kine-a town.
Location: Chicago, IL
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 420
Mein Auto: 335i, E350 Estate, F430
Have you had a chance to Dyno it yet? If it sounds good, increases power (even minimally) and is priced right, I'm in... is that 32lbs weight reduction confirmed?
Reply With Quote
  #248  
Old 06-29-2007, 10:46 AM
Palantirion's Avatar
Palantirion Palantirion is offline
Z4 Mvangelist
Location: Southern CA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,227
Mein Auto: 2003 M5-S2, 2002 540iT-S2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dammmittt View Post
So when can we hear it?
-As soon as I get some video. I would have done it last night, but my wife/camera operator was feeling sick. Hopefully I can get something done today!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luminor View Post
Have you had a chance to Dyno it yet? If it sounds good, increases power (even minimally) and is priced right, I'm in... is that 32lbs weight reduction confirmed?
-The "32lbs" weight reduction is Jose's estimate based on weighing components. It's not exact because he didn't have an additional Magnaflow resonator at the time of weighing, so he rounded down. This means that the weight reduction is at least 32lbs. He thinks it will end up being more like 40lbs when all is said and done, but we figured it was more honest to quote a lower number before we know for sure. And we will know for sure once the Coupe goes back under the knife for jigging. I haven't heard yet from Chris when that will be.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #249  
Old 06-29-2007, 12:54 PM
Luminor's Avatar
Luminor Luminor is offline
My kine-a town.
Location: Chicago, IL
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 420
Mein Auto: 335i, E350 Estate, F430
Will you be checking performance figures on a dyno, or not concerned with that?
Reply With Quote
  #250  
Old 06-29-2007, 02:12 PM
Fast6 Fast6 is offline
matching revs in
Location: west
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 400
Mein Auto: Z4 M Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luminor View Post
Will you be checking performance figures on a dyno, or not concerned with that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palantirion View Post
I can't wait to get it to the dyno and see how it performs. But for that I'll have to wait for a cooler day to get a closer apples to apples comparison with my baseline run.
__________________
'06 M Coupe - Silver Gray/Sepang Brown Dark/Aluminum
E36 M3 - gone
E24 645 - gone
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Forum Navigation
Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > Z Series > E85 / E86 Z4 (2003-2008)
Today's Posts Search
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Z4 M Coupe at NHIS brave1heart E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002) 9 11-11-2006 09:52 AM
335 news release today => 535 next year klu123 E60 (2004 - 2010) 34 04-26-2006 03:35 PM
Z4 coupe wheel styles Don L E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002) 6 03-28-2006 06:55 AM
Z4 Coupe design Axcu E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002) 0 12-10-2005 02:17 PM
NEW BMW Z4 Coupe Video OC-Z4 E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002) 9 10-07-2005 05:13 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:06 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2011 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms