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E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002)
E36/7 Z3 Roadster, Z3 coupe, Z3 M Roadster and Z3 M Coupe talk with our gurus here.

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  #76  
Old 08-22-2007, 07:13 PM
Vinci Vinci is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwm View Post
If you can't tell, I did think about this quite a bit. Your choice, but there was reasoning behind my buying $130 worth of billet mounting parts for a $125 extinguisher.
No doubt! Obviously I haven't played with the mounting in person, so I am just going on how it looked to me. I thought that flipping the tab on the tension clip might be faster than pulling the pin, but I am also thinking about it in the context of the extinguisher being mounted on the driver's seat. Reaching over to the passenger seat, I could see it being cumbersome to have to wiggle the extinguisher out of the tension clasp mounting.

Once I have mine mounted up, I'll probably try the tension clasp mount first, since I already have it here. If I can accidentally unclip the clasp, I'll be ordering up some billet mounts as well. Having that thing come rolling under my pedals is a scary prospect.
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  #77  
Old 08-22-2007, 08:12 PM
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Fred, here's your BB250B in Sable Black (you can't change your mind yet again ). Ignore the lint, that's from my fight with Myles to get him to stop sticking his nose in the picture.

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  #78  
Old 08-22-2007, 08:43 PM
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Looks really nice.

And I'll be sending 2 of the BMF01B's, so you won't feel bad about spending so much on the billet parts (but I did spend less on the red 2.5 lb vs chrome 1 lb extinguisher, by a few $).
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  #79  
Old 08-22-2007, 09:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phrider View Post
Looks really nice.

And I'll be sending 2 of the BMF01B's, so you won't feel bad about spending so much on the billet parts (but I did spend less on the red 2.5 lb vs chrome 1 lb extinguisher, by a few $).
Thay're nice pieces, and because they're brushed I don't have to do much to prep them. I just barely round the edges (powder doesn't like sharp edges), clean them with acetone, and shoot. There was a little Faraday effect near the piece that goes into the BMF01B, but that part isn't visible when installed.

You'll be glad I did the inside... without the powder and the rounding, it's all too easy to scratch the extinguisher installing it. Wish I had thought about that before testing fitment of my BB100B before I put powder on it.

You want both of the BMF01B's in Sable Black, yes?
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  #80  
Old 08-22-2007, 10:40 PM
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Yes, the BMF01B's in Sable Black, please!
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  #81  
Old 08-23-2007, 02:44 PM
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I found another source for billet mounts. The base looks close if not identical to the H3R, though the sleeve is different and they are only available in the 2.5lb (3") style. The price is a good bit lower and they are available in several colors. I would assume they are anodized, but I can't be sure.

http://rude-performance.com/bifiexmobr.html
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  #82  
Old 08-23-2007, 03:00 PM
felonious monk felonious monk is offline
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I just can't make my mind up about this. With full insurance coverage, do I really want to spend a couple hundred dollars on something that needs annual service and refill every 6 years or so... How can I justfiy this?
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  #83  
Old 08-23-2007, 03:44 PM
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That cost is mostly the one-time purchase of the hardware. Hydro-testing is reasonably cheap (I was quoted $30 today by a local shop), and only needs to be done every 6 years. It should only need to be refilled if it has been used or is failing.

You can also save a bit of money by buying an extinguisher second-hand. I picked up a new-condition 2.5lb unit with a current (same month of purchase) hydrostatic certification and vehicle mount for $30 shipped. Granted, that is very uncommon, but I'm sure I'm not the only one that has gotten a deal like that.

There is also the consideration of more than just the vehicle being at risk in a fire. Insurance covers damage, but it won't protect the occupants.

All that said, a fire in a street car is still fairly unlikely.
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  #84  
Old 08-23-2007, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by felonious monk View Post
I just can't make my mind up about this. With full insurance coverage, do I really want to spend a couple hundred dollars on something that needs annual service and refill every 6 years or so... How can I justfiy this?
Derek is right about the one-time cost being most of it. Figure it's fine after 6 years, then will need a refill at 12 years. That's a long amortization in my book.

Fires in modern street cars are rare if the cars are cared for (I know yours is). I definitely don't feel I need an extinguisher in my car on the street. On the other hand, I recently removed my battery safety terminal. When I did that, the importance of the extinguisher went up a little bit for me. The models in the 1 lb range are small enough that it's really not a big deal to carry one other than the initial hardware cost. They don't consume much usable space. My home is insured too, but that doesn't make me think the extinguisher in the pantry is a waste of money.

Of course, Randy reminded me of the coupe that burned up in a parking tower from what looked like the seat belt pyro malfunctioning. As the old saying goes, safety has no quitting time. I've seen more than one car fire, they do happen. Hopefully not to mine.
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Last edited by dwm; 08-23-2007 at 06:39 PM.
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  #85  
Old 08-23-2007, 07:04 PM
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Derek, Terry, Fred... the final CAD for the mounting plate is 2.25" wide to give a little more meat around the BMF01B screws. It'll be 3/16" thick, hopefully 7075. The thickness isn't about strength in my case, it's about threads (Ron is right, it's best to thread the plate so no nuts are sticking into the seat). 7075 is almost twice as strong as 6061, so strength won't be an issue. The bolts included with the BMF01B are #8-32, so a 3/16" piece will give me 6 threads. I realize other folks might not be using the BMF01B, but the plate was designed for my application.

Quote from the laser-cutting shop is too much money for the 7075 (though I'm not sure why, since I have material cost in front of me). So they'll be 3/16" thick 6061. Final price after we get them and I figure out how much work I have to do to powdercoat them. They'll all be Sable Black, I'm not going to reload the gun to do parts no one sees after installation. If anyone other than Fred wants theirs pre-drilled and tapped #8-32 for the H3R BMF01, let me know.
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  #86  
Old 08-23-2007, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by dwm View Post
They'll all be Sable Black, I'm not going to reload the gun to do parts no one sees after installation. If anyone other than Fred wants theirs pre-drilled and tapped #8-32 for the H3R BMF01, let me know.
Black is fine. That is what I would do it in if I had to do it myself anyhow. I won't need the holes drilled though. I haven't settled on a mount yet, and have taps handy for when I make up my mind.
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  #87  
Old 08-24-2007, 01:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinci View Post
I found another source for billet mounts. The base looks close if not identical to the H3R, though the sleeve is different and they are only available in the 2.5lb (3") style. The price is a good bit lower and they are available in several colors. I would assume they are anodized, but I can't be sure.

http://rude-performance.com/bifiexmobr.html
Looks like powdercoating to me (translucent), but it's hard to tell from the tiny picture. The white would definitely not be anodized.
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  #88  
Old 08-25-2007, 11:14 AM
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Might as well pre-drill and tap.
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  #89  
Old 09-06-2007, 12:40 PM
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Daniel, I completely forgot to ask you about the extinguisher mount when I was going over your lighting with you at the Embassy. Did you end up using your temporary mount for Homecoming?
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  #90  
Old 09-06-2007, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinci View Post
Daniel, I completely forgot to ask you about the extinguisher mount when I was going over your lighting with you at the Embassy. Did you end up using your temporary mount for Homecoming?
I used a second-generation temporary for HC, same dimensions as the ones we had laser-cut from aluminum. Works fine. Randy has the laser-cut ones now, I'll be picking them up from him sometime this weekend. I haven't seen the bill yet, but I know it'll be a little more than $25 each (so much for my guesstimating based on the past). We had 15 of them made, I think 9 are spoken for at the moment. Fred and I are each using a pair so the extinguisher can be moved from passenger to driver side easily whenever desired (or you could keep a pair of extinguishers in the car if you're really paranoid about fire ).
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  #91  
Old 09-06-2007, 03:13 PM
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Cool. I haven't pulled the seats to clean under them in a month or two, so this will be a good excuse.
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  #92  
Old 09-08-2007, 10:34 AM
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These are more work than I expected. The laser powderizes the edges of the aluminum, so I had to roloc 36 grit, roloc 100 grit, then roloc yellow scotch-brite the edges. Roloc scotch-brite the faces so the powder will have good mechanical grip. I've prepped 8 for the acetone wash and iron phosphate bath.



I suppose I should measure them to make sure the shop got them right.
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  #93  
Old 09-08-2007, 10:42 AM
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Fred, it appears that H3R ships two different mounting screws for the BMF01B. Mine and one of your have #8-32 screws. Your second one has #10-32 screws. I'll have to pick up a #10-32 tap and #21 drill bit to use the #10-32 screws. Since you have the 2.5lb extinguisher, I'll buy some #10-32 stainless steel screws so I can do both of yours with #10-32 screws.
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  #94  
Old 09-08-2007, 02:24 PM
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Fred, here's one on yours with the BB250 inserted. #10-32 screws here, cut flush on the back before I put powder on the plate (which is coated on both sides). I accidentally nicked this one putting it in the oven, but I'm not redoing it since it takes too long. You can't see the plate when installed anyway unless you crawl in the footwell. All parts in Sable Black. Your second plate is in the oven, I did your second BMF01B the other night.

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  #95  
Old 09-08-2007, 02:32 PM
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Also, if I manage to find time tomorrow to do the remaining plates, I'll take the two worst ones for myself. Otherwise it's just going to be in order of those who asked for them (Fred, Derek, then Terry).

Cost willl be $40 each + shipping, and you're getting a steal if I account for my time and consumables. Needless to say I don't intend to do a second run at these prices.

The result with the BMF01B is really slick, I like it.
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  #96  
Old 09-08-2007, 02:39 PM
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Awesome. That mount turned out pretty amazing! Let me know when you are ready for payment and whatnot.
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  #97  
Old 09-08-2007, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwm View Post
Fred, it appears that H3R ships two different mounting screws for the BMF01B. Mine and one of your have #8-32 screws. Your second one has #10-32 screws. I'll have to pick up a #10-32 tap and #21 drill bit to use the #10-32 screws. Since you have the 2.5lb extinguisher, I'll buy some #10-32 stainless steel screws so I can do both of yours with #10-32 screws.
Thanks for all you work on these. They look great!
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  #98  
Old 09-15-2007, 05:39 PM
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The last of the plates are powdercoated. 5 are unspoken for, send me a PM if you want one ($40 + shipping). None of them are 'perfect' coating-wise, but I've only got so much time to do these kinds of things and they're hidden when installed. The main objective was to round the edges a bit and prevent them from oxidizing. They look nice installed.



Mounting is done with M8 rivet nuts in the sheet metal of the seat. Here's the list of mounting hardware I'm using:

McMaster-Carr 95105A191 knurled steel M8 rivet nuts for material thickness .7mm-3.8mm
McMaster-Carr 92095A286 M8x1.25 25mm long 18-8 stainless steel button-head cap screws
McMaster-Carr 98089A392 18-8 stainless steel 14mm ID 1mm thick precision shim washer
McMaster-Carr 90965A190 M8 316 stainless steel washers

The shim washer goes between the flange of the rivet nut and the seat sheet metal. This makes sure you've got enough thickness for the rivet nut, and also gives you a chance to grind off the flange of the rivet nut and push it into the seat if you bugger it, without damaging the seat sheet metal. Hopefully that doesn't happen, but I buggered one trying to use the plier-style tool that wasn't strong enough for M8 steel rivet nuts.

The M8 washer goes under the head of the button-head screw, obviously.

You could use these rivet nuts if you're using a weaker tool than the big lever-style I use:

McMaster-Carr 94020A391 knurled aluminum M8 rivet nuts for material thickness .7mm-3.8mm

I wouldn't recomment nutserts here... the seat sheet metal is thin, and it's a good idea to have some flange grabbing the seat fabric.

You'll want a stepped or variable diameter drill bit (McMaster-Carr 8910A11 would be good) to make the holes in the seat sheet metal. The rivet nuts want a 13.5mm hole, but 9/16" will work. Position the plate such that the top edge is about 3/16" below the leather/fabric seam. Carefully use the plate to mark the first hole, drill it, install the first rivet nut. Then bolt the plate and start the other hole so you know they're spaced correctly. Going slowly with the stepped bit, you won't need an arch punch for the fabric, it drills pretty cleanly.
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  #99  
Old 09-15-2007, 08:28 PM
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Any thought to buying the hardware in bulk and supplying it? For a fee of course.
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  #100  
Old 09-16-2007, 10:05 AM
Vinci Vinci is offline
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Looks good! I need to get off my butt and order up a mount to put on there. After seeing the H3R mounts, the spring-clip mount for my Amerex looks pretty cheesy.
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