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E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002)
E36/7 Z3 Roadster, Z3 coupe, Z3 M Roadster and Z3 M Coupe talk with our gurus here.

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  #1  
Old 07-12-2003, 08:33 AM
phrider's Avatar
phrider phrider is offline
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Location: LaBrea Tar Pits, LA, CA
 
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Mein Auto: 2001 M Roadster, 1998 M3
No horn

I don't use my horn much, but .... yesterday it didn't work when I needed it. Good thing the brakes and tires did work.

On a 2001 M Roadster, I did replace the original horn with the Griots/Hella louder horn (supposedly the same amps):

1. The two horn related fuses are OK. The original fuses are intact. I switched them out and also tested the old ones. Still no horn.

These are circuits #8 (15 amp) and #43 (5 amp) on my MZ. Circuit #8 is solely used for the horn (I think). Circuit #43 overlaps with the antitheft and central/remote locking system. Does circuit #43 control the relay power for the horn or ????

2. Anyone else have a similar problem?

3. I've had an alarm installed (that I didn't do). Any obvious mechanism for this causing the problem? Perhaps a circuit #43 problem?

4. I haven't dug down to the horn location yet to see if I'm getting power at the horns.

Last edited by phrider; 07-14-2003 at 10:12 AM.
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  #2  
Old 07-14-2003, 10:14 AM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Also, does anyone have the replacement pin part number for the pins in the alarm connector?
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  #3  
Old 07-14-2003, 01:30 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phrider
Also, does anyone have the replacement pin part number for the pins in the alarm connector?
Assuming the BMW end, connect to:

http://www.unofficialbmw.com/all/ele...tact_pins.html

When you order the pins make sure the parts guy doen't let them cede or you will end up with pins with wire attached.
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  #4  
Old 07-14-2003, 01:55 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phrider
Does circuit #43 control the relay power for the horn or ????
Yes. Remove the horn relay. Front most passenger side light green one in the fuse box. Momentarily connect pins 2 and 6 of the relay socket and see if the horn blows.
With the ignition in position one, relay socket pin 8 will have plus 12 volts on it. With the horn pushed, relay pin 4 should go to ground.
Pin 8 and 4 are the relay coil.
Let me know and we can go from there

Last edited by Ron Stygar; 07-14-2003 at 02:04 PM.
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  #5  
Old 07-14-2003, 06:39 PM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Sorry, but I'm colorblind and nobody with regular color vision is handy.... and green/ grey / cream colored are colors that get me into trouble (I'm more cautious since I was nearly run over by a freighter while sailing in a small boat in a storm).

I assume that you mean the circled relay.

Thanks for your help with the relay and the pins.
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Last edited by phrider; 07-14-2003 at 06:41 PM.
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  #6  
Old 07-14-2003, 06:43 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phrider
I assume that you mean the circled relay.
Yes.
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  #7  
Old 07-14-2003, 07:32 PM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Shorting pins 2 and 6 does not sound the horn -- that's the sound of the problem, I assume. Even with the ignition off, pin 6 is 12v+. Pin 2 has continuity with ground (forgot to check resistance from pin 2 to ground, will do that in a minute).

With ignition on position 1, pin 8 is hot at 12v+. I need a helper to hit the horn and check pin 4 -- and Ryan/ M Roadster will be over in a few minutes to help (plus he wants to check out my new Whalen shifter).
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  #8  
Old 07-14-2003, 07:41 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phrider
Shorting pins 2 and 6 does not sound the horn -- that's the sound of the problem, I assume. Even with the ignition off, pin 6 is 12v+. Pin 2 has continuity with ground (forgot to check resistance from pin 2 to ground, will do that in a minute).
.
Pin 6 is a hot at all times line. Shorting pin 6 to 2 puts 12 volts to the horns. So the control side, pin 4 is probably OK. Check your horn install connections.
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  #9  
Old 07-14-2003, 08:13 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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Last edited by Ron Stygar; 11-09-2008 at 10:24 AM.
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  #10  
Old 07-14-2003, 08:33 PM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Yup, control side seems to be OK. Pin 8 is 12V+ with ignition on. Pin 4 goes to ground when horn gets hit.

Horn side seems to be the problem. Pin 6 is the appropriate 12v+, which seems OK.

Pin 2 is 100 ohms from ground. Given that the horns should have a resistance of about 1 ohm if they drawn 12 amps (unless they revoke Ohm's law for horn-type devices), that's the problem. Corrosion or a weak connection or bad horns (both of them???).

I couldn't quite read the bit map for the circuit. A couple questions on the diagram:
1. It looks like the wire color is VIolet/BLack from Pin 2 to all positive horn connection points. Right?
2. What is the routing of this wire in the harness? Does it go back into the cabin or does it stay in the engine area? I just want to be sure my alarm install didn't whack that wire.
3. I couldn't read the # on the connection point prior to the horns. It looks like X18021. Where is that located?
4. I assume X132 / X133 are the horn connections.

Again, thanks for your help.

And thanks to Ryan / M Roadster for honking the horn (and checking out the Whalen).
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  #11  
Old 07-14-2003, 08:42 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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1. It looks like the wire color is VIolet/BLack from Pin 2 to all positive horn connection points. Right?
Wrong. Violet/Blue

http://www.unofficialbmw.com/all/ele...wire_size.html
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  #12  
Old 07-14-2003, 09:06 PM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Location: LaBrea Tar Pits, LA, CA
 
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Mein Auto: 2001 M Roadster, 1998 M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Stygar
1. It looks like the wire color is VIolet/BLack from Pin 2 to all positive horn connection points. Right?
Wrong. Violet/Blue

http://www.unofficialbmw.com/all/ele...wire_size.html
Entschuldigung. Ich habe mein Deutsche fast alles vergessen. (And I've forgotten how to spell in German and all too frequently in English, too). BL = BLau?

Danke!

Last edited by phrider; 07-14-2003 at 09:22 PM.
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  #13  
Old 07-14-2003, 10:36 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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2. What is the routing of this wire in the harness? Does it go back into the cabin or does it stay in the engine area?
>>>Stays in the engine area.
I just want to be sure my alarm install didn't whack that wire.
3. I couldn't read the # on the connection point prior to the horns. It looks like X18021.
>>>X10021.
Where is that located?
>>>In the bottom of the fuse box.
4. I assume X132 / X133 are the horn connections.
>>>Correct.
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  #14  
Old 07-14-2003, 10:44 PM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Thanks again. I'm now on the hunt for the cold connection (I'll bet it's near the horns themselves, right at the split of the two). Although, given the wires split at the fuse box at X10021, it may be a bad ground wire connection coming out of the horns.

Last edited by phrider; 07-14-2003 at 10:47 PM.
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  #15  
Old 07-18-2003, 09:52 PM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Final diagnosis: both of the Griot's / Hella add-on horns were burned out....
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  #16  
Old 07-19-2003, 06:54 AM
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bob lindquist bob lindquist is offline
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Gotta stop!

Quote:
Originally Posted by phrider
Final diagnosis: both of the Griot's / Hella add-on horns were burned out....
You gotta stop Honking every time your happy with your car!
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  #17  
Old 07-19-2003, 08:23 AM
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phrider phrider is offline
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Location: LaBrea Tar Pits, LA, CA
 
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Mein Auto: 2001 M Roadster, 1998 M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob lindquist
You gotta stop Honking every time your happy with your car!
Nah, I hardly ever use the horn, 'cuz I'm having so much fun driving. So when I absolutely needed it.... good thing my foot was already threshold braking.
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