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Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 5 Series > E39 (1997 - 2003)

E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 12-23-2015, 01:42 PM
Dangerzone3 Dangerzone3 is offline
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M62TU Crank Bolt & Harmonic Balancer

Hey guys,
I'm new to this forum but not a forum rookie at all. I'm looking forward to learning a lot and seeing some interesting projects on here.

As my first BMW, I recently picked up a 99 540i that needs new timing chain guides. I'm set for the job but have been wrestling with the crank bolt for the past week. I've heated it red hot and tried the starter method. I've heated it red hot and used an impact gun rated at 950 ftlb of torque and nothing is getting this bolt off. So, I plan on finding a scrap harmonic balancer and welding some pipe or a bar of steel to it and making my own crank hub tool. My question to the experts is, are there any other engines that use the same harmonic balancer as the M62 or that will fit on it? There's a shortage of the M62's where I live so it would be awesome if any other balancers do indeed fit. Also, if anybody has any other tricks to get this God forsaken bolt off, I'm open to ideas. Cheers guys.
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  #2  
Old 12-23-2015, 02:00 PM
acoste acoste is offline
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http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/part...&q=11231741773
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  #3  
Old 12-23-2015, 02:37 PM
MKJS MKJS is offline
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Check out Bobdmac's post, "Around the M62TU in 80 Hours More or Less," he comes up with a real long breaker bar. You can also make one using a 3/4 drive breaker bar and slip a long piece of say, water pipe over it.

Jim
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  #4  
Old 12-23-2015, 04:40 PM
Dangerzone3 Dangerzone3 is offline
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Thanks Acoste, wasn't sure how to do that search on realoem. Really apreciate the help.
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  #5  
Old 12-28-2015, 11:23 AM
Dangerzone3 Dangerzone3 is offline
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OK... I'm still having a really hard time finding a balancer to rig up a tool for this. But I have another question for you folks;

I have lots of experience working on Subarus and the procedure that I've never seen fail is you use a breaker bar to take the crank bolt off while the car is in highest gear and while someone steps on the brakes. I've never had issues with this and never known of anyone who has. So, why can't I do the same on the BMW? Are the transmissions too weak? What is the risk of doing this on the BMW's?

Hope someone can give some good insight on this.
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  #6  
Old 12-28-2015, 11:40 AM
bobdmac bobdmac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKJS View Post
Check out Bobdmac's post, "Around the M62TU in 80 Hours More or Less," he comes up with a real long breaker bar. You can also make one using a 3/4 drive breaker bar and slip a long piece of say, water pipe over it.

Jim
Here's a picture of the 40" breaker bar I used, next to a normal, 14" breaker bar:



I also used this pulley tool from Amazon ($45)



And here's a link to the entire thread: Around the M62TU in 80 Hours, More or Less

In it, I talk about some difficulties I encountered and some newbie mistakes I made.
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  #7  
Old 12-28-2015, 12:06 PM
acoste acoste is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerzone3 View Post
OK... I'm still having a really hard time finding a balancer to rig up a tool for this. But I have another question for you folks;

I have lots of experience working on Subarus and the procedure that I've never seen fail is you use a breaker bar to take the crank bolt off while the car is in highest gear and while someone steps on the brakes. I've never had issues with this and never known of anyone who has. So, why can't I do the same on the BMW? Are the transmissions too weak? What is the risk of doing this on the BMW's?

Hope someone can give some good insight on this.
You mean for a stick shift car, right?
You can avoid all the braking thing if you just lock the flywheel with a lock pin. I wouldn't stress the crankshaft with this torque but it might work with no damage.
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  #8  
Old 12-28-2015, 12:16 PM
bobdmac bobdmac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acoste View Post
You mean for a stick shift car, right?
You can avoid all the braking thing if you just lock the flywheel with a lock pin. I wouldn't stress the crankshaft with this torque but it might work with no damage.
I seem to recall someone damaging his engine (flywheel, I think) using this method. Some have reported using it successfully, but others recommend against it.
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  #9  
Old 12-28-2015, 12:20 PM
Edge540 Edge540 is offline
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do not use the crank lock pin to brake the jesus bolt loose, use the the special tool or make your own or use a chain wrench
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  #10  
Old 12-28-2015, 12:52 PM
mrblahh mrblahh is offline
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there any generics that are not one size fits one engine?

I got my jesus bolt off with heat + 1150 foot pound impact, but installing a new bolt I don't have a good way to hold the motor, brake+gear did not cut it

I hate buying one use tools
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  #11  
Old 12-28-2015, 01:11 PM
MKJS MKJS is offline
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Originally Posted by bobdmac View Post
I seem to recall someone damaging his engine (flywheel, I think) using this method. Some have reported using it successfully, but others recommend against it.
Ya, remember that too Bob. As I recall, the pin did some damage to the flywheel, but don't remember the outcome.

Just ordered the 40" breaker and the crank hold tool for the same job.
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  #12  
Old 12-28-2015, 01:20 PM
Dangerzone3 Dangerzone3 is offline
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Thanks for the input guys.

I have a flywheel lock pin but I'm definitely not going to use it to hold the flywheel. I also don't want to order the tool because I already spent a butt load of money on the timing tool. Really not interested in paying more money for a 1 time use tool and waiting 3 weeks for it to show up.

However, I still haven't got an answer from you guys on the transmission method. It definitely seems more logical to use the transmission method over locking the flywheel with a pin. Does anyone have any experience having the car in gear and applying the brakes while breaking the crank bolt loose?
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  #13  
Old 12-28-2015, 01:26 PM
bobdmac bobdmac is offline
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For what it's worth, I spent a total of about $95 for both tools, and they arrived in one week. With all the other time-consuming issues involved in this work, it was worth it to me to have the right tools and not have to resort to work-arounds.

PS: There's no guarantee that they're "one-time use."
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Last edited by bobdmac; 12-28-2015 at 01:28 PM. Reason: Added PS
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  #14  
Old 12-28-2015, 01:32 PM
Edge540 Edge540 is offline
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ck your local auto zone they loan tools and might have a chain wrench
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  #15  
Old 12-28-2015, 01:39 PM
bobdmac bobdmac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge540 View Post
ck your local auto zone they loan tools and might have a chain wrench
I'd be afraid that a chain wrench would mar the pulley, given the amount of force required, but I'd defer to the opinion of anyone who's used one for this application.
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  #16  
Old 12-28-2015, 02:25 PM
MKJS MKJS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobdmac View Post
For what it's worth, I spent a total of about $95 for both tools, and they arrived in one week. With all the other time-consuming issues involved in this work, it was worth it to me to have the right tools and not have to resort to work-arounds.

PS: There's no guarantee that they're "one-time use."
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  #17  
Old 12-28-2015, 03:09 PM
Dangerzone3 Dangerzone3 is offline
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Bob, I can appreciate that you got them pretty cheap but that tool doesn't ship to Canada. Also with how weak the Canadian dollar is right now, I'd be looking at $120 shipped just for the crank tool. & that's not mentioning how long it takes for things to get to Canada and customs.


I'd just like to know if I can put the car in gear and have someone step on the brakes while I break the bolt loose.
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  #18  
Old 12-28-2015, 03:40 PM
MKJS MKJS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerzone3 View Post
Bob, I can appreciate that you got them pretty cheap but that tool doesn't ship to Canada. Also with how weak the Canadian dollar is right now, I'd be looking at $120 shipped just for the crank tool. & that's not mentioning how long it takes for things to get to Canada and customs.


I'd just like to know if I can put the car in gear and have someone step on the brakes while I break the bolt loose.
He can't tell you that, it's a crap shoot. Might hold, might not.

I'm thinking with some good'ol Canook engeniering you can have one made for 1/4 the price of a "store bought one." Know anyone with a cutting torch? Any welding/machine shop should be able to make you one in an hour or less. There is nothing precision about the tool. As for the breaker bar, get a 3/4 bar and put a long piece of pipe on it. I know for a fact the Aussies could have it done before we got through talking about it, and Canooks are just as capable!!! Please don't tell me the Mounties all wear nail polish up there now days.
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Last edited by MKJS; 12-28-2015 at 03:42 PM.
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  #19  
Old 12-28-2015, 04:07 PM
acoste acoste is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerzone3 View Post
However, I still haven't got an answer from you guys on the transmission method. It definitely seems more logical to use the transmission method over locking the flywheel with a pin.
To me the other way around is more logical.
Torque = force x radius.
Let's say you need 500Nm to loosen the bolt.
When you use the flywheel, the radius is ~0.15m and the force on the lock pin will be 3333N. When you use the transmission the radius of a gear is ~0.05m or less so the force will be at least 3 times larger, 10 000 N on the teeth of the gear.

I personally would buy the proper tool as I did it in the past, even if it's just a one time use.
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  #20  
Old 12-28-2015, 05:52 PM
Edge540 Edge540 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobdmac View Post
I'd be afraid that a chain wrench would mar the pulley, given the amount of force required, but I'd defer to the opinion of anyone who's used one for this application.
no don't put the chain on the pulley, remove the pulley from the hub and put the chain on the hub, and yes I tore mine down this past weekend and used chainwrench and a 36" breaker bar and the jack handle for my floor jack

Last edited by Edge540; 12-28-2015 at 06:03 PM.
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  #21  
Old 12-28-2015, 06:02 PM
mrblahh mrblahh is offline
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chain wrench it is, thank you guys! Something that'll fit on another car
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  #22  
Old 12-28-2015, 06:46 PM
Edge540 Edge540 is offline
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Originally Posted by mrblahh View Post
chain wrench it is, thank you guys! Something that'll fit on another car

let me know if you need any tips using the chain wrench
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  #23  
Old 12-28-2015, 08:09 PM
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Topaz540i Topaz540i is offline
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I wrote a procedure for this with all part numbers and torque values.

Tons of pics too

http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...case%20removal
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  #24  
Old 12-29-2015, 01:38 AM
Burning2nd Burning2nd is offline
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You guys lack the proper tools...

Dont weld anything to the bolt... your asking for trouble and heating it till it was red was a bad idea as well...

I mean it was difficult to get off but its not that hard... it sure as **** aint has hard as the head bolts on a 3vzE motor *120lb, then 90,90, 180 I almost pulled the fricking truck off the lift getting that last 180 turn
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  #25  
Old 12-29-2015, 06:12 PM
Dangerzone3 Dangerzone3 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKJS View Post
He can't tell you that, it's a crap shoot. Might hold, might not.

I'm thinking with some good'ol Canook engeniering you can have one made for 1/4 the price of a "store bought one." Know anyone with a cutting torch? Any welding/machine shop should be able to make you one in an hour or less. There is nothing precision about the tool. As for the breaker bar, get a 3/4 bar and put a long piece of pipe on it. I know for a fact the Aussies could have it done before we got through talking about it, and Canooks are just as capable!!! Please don't tell me the Mounties all wear nail polish up there now days.
I plan on using a scrap harmonic balancer pulley to make a tool for it. I'm just looking for one at the moment. The idea is to use a spare pulley as the "hub" of the tool that gets bolted on and then welding a handle to it. Hopefully I find one soon and can let you guys know if it works.
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