Sayonara

Originally Posted by LoneStar5

Does that mean you are trading in your Porsche for a Prius?

Hey, I'm getting way better mileage in the 911 than in the 550i. I'm doing my part.

Stream's already scratched his Porsche itch, so he's way ahead of me. I'll try to catch up one day.

Originally Posted by stream

After 4.5 great years, I sold my 545i and bought a 2010 Prius. I got the Prius V, which among other features, has 17" wheels and LED headlights.

While I loved the 545i, I decided I wanted to make a difference for our planet, and reduce my carbon footprint. Mabe that's what living in California for 17 years does to people.

I picked up the Prius today, having gone on a few test drives of the new model, and have to say that I'm very happy with it. The new generation is leaps and bounds improved from the previous generation--much more refined--and as one of the car mags said so well--more like a real car, and less like a science experiment, than the previous model.

I got mine at Toyota Sunnyvale (David Coleman, 408-716-1863, is a true professional) and they sell below MSRP!

Here's a few pix (sorry for the terrible late afternoon lighting).

Thanks to this great community for the camaraderie and info sharing over the last 4+ years.

S
Stream this comes as a real surprise to me. You are one of the true BMW people that I and many others on this site could go to and get the right answers to things related to BMWs without any of the B/S. I for one am going to miss you and all the things that you posted to straighten me out. What can I say except GOOD LUCK in your new venture.
Again good luck
cheers
vern

pshht...doing one less transcontinental flight a year more than makes up for the carbon footprint of a 550i. I'll gladly sacrifice that so that I can feel better about driving a BMW.

Not saying you're one of them, but the thing I can't stand are these people who drive Priuses with their noses in their air, while living in big houses with pools and flying all over the place. And believe me, we have a *lot* of those here in California. It's such a joke. Gives the rest of us tree huggers a bad name

Originally Posted by stream

After 4.5 great years, I sold my 545i and bought a 2010 Prius. I got the Prius V, which among other features, has 17" wheels and LED headlights.

While I loved the 545i, I decided I wanted to make a difference for our planet, and reduce my carbon footprint. Mabe that's what living in California for 17 years does to people.

I picked up the Prius today, having gone on a few test drives of the new model, and have to say that I'm very happy with it. The new generation is leaps and bounds improved from the previous generation--much more refined--and as one of the car mags said so well--more like a real car, and less like a science experiment, than the previous model.

I got mine at Toyota Sunnyvale (David Coleman, 408-716-1863, is a true professional) and they sell below MSRP!

Here's a few pix (sorry for the terrible late afternoon lighting).

Thanks to this great community for the camaraderie and info sharing over the last 4+ years.

Wow! A 545 to a Prius. I hope you have a good therapist.

I don't post here much but have enjoyed Bimmerfest for years. I have to throw my hat in the ring as going from an M5 to a 2010 Prius. FWIW, I'm not a tree-hugger, I loves me some bacon, and I think the man-made contribution to global warming is irrelevant compared to the natural warming and cooling cycles of our planet.

But the Prius is an enthusiast car in it's own way. As an engineer it appeals to me that I'm taking kinetic energy that is otherwise converted to heat and turning it into something useful. It's also fun to understand how the hybrid system works, and playing the system to exceed the EPA mileage rating. I've gotten over 80mpg on some nice scenic coastal mountain drives. It takes a lot of concentration to do that, much like hitting the apexes correctly at Laguna Seca in my 911 track car.

Not for everybody, but fun and different. It's a beautiful thing that we have so many choices. I'm sure I'll own another BMW someday. I would LOVE to see BMW create a true hybrid sports sedan that uses hybrid tech first for additional performance and second for mileage.

PS: Battery "fumes", more environmental impact than a Hummer, fatal shocks after accidents, $5K battery replacements every 5 years, etc, 1000lb. battery packs (it's 99lbs actually), are all silly urban legends. A few minutes in Google is all it takes to discredit all of those.

It takes real courage to do what Stream did, especially if he's a car guy. My friend bought a Prius for the same reason that Stream bought his - but he's not a car guy. His wife is the one who went out and bought a bimmer - because she loves cars..... Go figure.

Good luck with the Prius but. . .

If you drive it the way most of us drive a Bimmer, you'll get the same gas mileage as you did in your 545i. When a Prius is driven aggressively you have the inefficiency of two power plants, not just one. It also drives like. . . well. . . a Prius. To get near the claimed gas mileage you have to drive as if there is an egg between your foot and the pedals.

Stream, I will join the others who will miss your insightful posts and knowledge I am a newbie here but I have read a lot of your posts and learned a lot in my journey to acquire a 5er. Wish you well with your Prius I sat in one recently and I was pleasantly surprised by it. I admire a man who is not afraid to act on his convictions

kudos

Sheikfu

I would guess that it's almost genetically impossible to do what Stream has done. It MUST be a California thing. State of Fear brought me back to center on the "green" movement. Just wait till the battery needs replacing - how are you going to dispose of something that large? Expensive... just wait!!
Beware the tyranny of the left!!

Originally Posted by Kevin530

I would guess that it's almost genetically impossible to do what Stream has done. It MUST be a California thing. State of Fear brought me back to center on the "green" movement. Just wait till the battery needs replacing - how are you going to dispose of something that large? Expensive... just wait!!
Beware the tyranny of the left!!

The battery gets recycled. Also, the Prius (in California and the other states (such as NY) that have adopted California's emissions control model) is classified as an AT-PZEV (Advanced Technology Partial Zero Emission Vehicle). AT-PZEVs come with a 10 year/120,000 warranty on the AT-PZEV components, of which the battery is one. So, no expense if the battery fails before the 10 year/120,000 mile point....

Beware the tyranny of the right (wrong)!!

Originally Posted by merlintiaga

Good luck with the Prius but. . .

If you drive it the way most of us drive a Bimmer, you'll get the same gas mileage as you did in your 545i. When a Prius is driven aggressively you have the inefficiency of two power plants, not just one. It also drives like. . . well. . . a Prius. To get near the claimed gas mileage you have to drive as if there is an egg between your foot and the pedals.

If you drive it that way and bump the air pressure in the tires to around 40 psi, you will get around 70 mpg....

Originally Posted by stream

After 4.5 great years, I sold my 545i and bought a 2010 Prius. I got the Prius V, which among other features, has 17" wheels and LED headlights.

While I loved the 545i, I decided I wanted to make a difference for our planet, and reduce my carbon footprint. Mabe that's what living in California for 17 years does to people.

I picked up the Prius today, having gone on a few test drives of the new model, and have to say that I'm very happy with it. The new generation is leaps and bounds improved from the previous generation--much more refined--and as one of the car mags said so well--more like a real car, and less like a science experiment, than the previous model.

I got mine at Toyota Sunnyvale (David Coleman, 408-716-1863, is a true professional) and they sell below MSRP!

Here's a few pix (sorry for the terrible late afternoon lighting).

Thanks to this great community for the camaraderie and info sharing over the last 4+ years.

In about a year, the Japanese aftermarket will have a bunch of suspension bits for the 3G Prius, which will enable it to handle close to what your 5er could.

You will be missed my friend!!

Best of luck Stream! Your patient and detailed postings will be much missed.

Well I just about fell off the couch when I saw this thread.

Stream... Have you lost your mind?

Living in chilly New England (no idea why dad relocated the family here instead of someplace warmer 40 years ago) the global warming thing is a tough sell when I'm freezing my ass off all winter and paying through the nose for heat.

If you using less gas brings my cost down, thanks. However all the raw materials that go into Hybrids (batteries) and the impact of all that mining, usually in third world countries has got to hurt the environment somehow.

Why didn't you go for one of the new high mileage BMW diesels? Most Europeans, who are a pretty green crowd and pay through the nose for fuel, believe the new clean and efficient diesels are the way to go.

Originally Posted by mhs525

Well I just about fell off the couch when I saw this thread.

Stream... Have you lost your mind?

Living in chilly New England (no idea why dad relocated the family here instead of someplace warmer 40 years ago) the global warming thing is a tough sell when I'm freezing my ass off all winter and paying through the nose for heat.

If you using less gas brings my cost down, thanks. However all the raw materials that go into Hybrids (batteries) and the impact of all that mining, usually in third world countries has got to hurt the environment somehow.

Another urban legend. The nickel that goes into the Prius' NiMH battery is primarily sourced from Canada (not exactly a third world country). Also, the percentage of total nickel consumption that goes into the Prius' battery pack doesn't get past rounding error. Lastly, when the battery pack fails, it gets recycled into a new battery pack.

Originally Posted by mhs525

Why didn't you go for one of the new high mileage BMW diesels? Most Europeans, who are a pretty green crowd and pay through the nose for fuel, believe the new clean and efficient diesels are the way to go.

It depends on the driving cycle. Hybrids will out-perform even a diesel in predominantly stop-and-go driving because when the car is stopped, the engine shuts down. Diesels keep on running (and consuming fuel)....

So what is first mod??????

Another urban legend. The nickel that goes into the Prius' NiMH battery is primarily sourced from Canada (not exactly a third world country). Also, the percentage of total nickel consumption that goes into the Prius' battery pack doesn't get past rounding error. Lastly, when the battery pack fails, it gets recycled into a new battery pack.

I'm not a scientist but if you are trying to tell me that the Prius battery has negligable to zero impact on the envirnment I don't believe that for a second. Also if you think every Prius is going to be returned to a Toyota dealer for dismantling and recycling I highly doubt it.

Just like those wonderful mercury filled low energy light bulbs that I spent $50 for to replace all my outside lighting only to find out they don't always work in cold weather. If you think all of them are going to be carefully recycled I highly doubt that too.

It depends on the driving cycle. Hybrids will out-perform even a diesel in predominantly stop-and-go driving because when the car is stopped, the engine shuts down. Diesels keep on running (and consuming fuel)...

BMW has won many awards for being the most fuel efficient car manufacturer. As part of the BMW European models "efficient dynamics" many cars have auto shut off. When the car stops at a light, it shuts off.

Everything I have read in the four or five car magazines I get says the Prius is one of the least involving, drab, driving experiences there is. And according to Consumer Reports many Hybrid owners have been disappointed to find the actual mileage is far below the estimates.

BMW turbo diesels have beaten the Prius in mileage comparison tests.

If you are lucky enough to have a track toy like an M3 or a 911 and your commute is all urban with little to no highway then maybe a Hybrid makes sense but for me my driving thrills come from on ramps and back roads, a few open spaces or fast corners on the way to work. Driving my BMW is my reward for a hard days work.

I couldn't drive a Prius if gas was $8.00/gallon and the average temperature in New England was 90 degrees, in January...

Amen...

Originally Posted by mhs525

I'm not a scientist but if you are trying to tell me that the Prius battery has negligable to zero impact on the envirnment I don't believe that for a second. Also if you think every Prius is going to be returned to a Toyota dealer for dismantling and recycling I highly doubt it.

Just like those wonderful mercury filled low energy light bulbs that I spent $50 for to replace all my outside lighting only to find out they don't always work in cold weather. If you think all of them are going to be carefully recycled I highly doubt that too.



BMW has won many awards for being the most fuel efficient car manufacturer. As part of the BMW European models "efficient dynamics" many cars have auto shut off. When the car stops at a light, it shuts off.

Everything I have read in the four or five car magazines I get says the Prius is one of the least involving, drab, driving experiences there is. And according to Consumer Reports many Hybrid owners have been disappointed to find the actual mileage is far below the estimates.

BMW turbo diesels have beaten the Prius in mileage comparison tests.

If you are lucky enough to have a track toy like an M3 or a 911 and your commute is all urban with little to no highway then maybe a Hybrid makes sense but for me my driving thrills come from on ramps and back roads, a few open spaces or fast corners on the way to work. Driving my BMW is my reward for a hard days work.

I couldn't drive a Prius if gas was $8.00/gallon and the average temperature in New England was 90 degrees, in January...

Originally Posted by mhs525

I'm not a scientist but if you are trying to tell me that the Prius battery has negligable to zero impact on the envirnment I don't believe that for a second. Also if you think every Prius is going to be returned to a Toyota dealer for dismantling and recycling I highly doubt it.

Here is a link you should read: http://priuschat.com/forums/prius-hy...ding-myth.html If you are going to disbelieve the statements made in the link, that is your choice. But please don't spread the falsehoods. If you have contrary 'evidence' please post it. But I would hope you would resort to objective factual evidence, not hearsay repetition of someone else's un-proved assertions.

As far as recycling the battery, if your state follows the California emissions control model, then there will be every incentive to bring the car in for a new battery if the old one fails before 10 years/120,000 miles. If the battery fails after the emission warranty lapses, there is a scrap value for the battery that is somewhere in the range of $500. If you don't want to be bothered to pull the battery and turn it in to a Toyota dealer, I am sure there are others who would have no problem with taking the battery in to a Toyota dealer.

Originally Posted by mhs525

Just like those wonderful mercury filled low energy light bulbs that I spent $50 for to replace all my outside lighting only to find out they don't always work in cold weather. If you think all of them are going to be carefully recycled I highly doubt that too.

That is your choice (to recycle or not). If you choose to recycle, then the impact of the mercury will be reduced and there will be fewer CO2 emission as a result.

Originally Posted by mhs525

BMW has won many awards for being the most fuel efficient car manufacturer. As part of the BMW European models "efficient dynamics" many cars have auto shut off. When the car stops at a light, it shuts off.

There is more to the Prius/ fuel efficiency than auto shut off. How about when coasting or braking, the battery gets re-charged (in addition to the engine shutting off).

Originally Posted by mhs525

Everything I have read in the four or five car magazines I get says the Prius is one of the least involving, drab, driving experiences there is. And according to Consumer Reports many Hybrid owners have been disappointed to find the actual mileage is far below the estimates.

Depending on what you define as least involving, drab driving experience, there may be solutions. I have modified my Prius to handle at approximately 80% of what my R53 MINI can do. True, the Prius can not accelerate anywhere near what my R53 MINI can; but on a downhill grade, it doesn't matter. As far as mileage, if you drive the Prius with its strengths in mind, you will do better than the EPA numbers. If you spend your commute at 75+ mph, the Prius will not make the published highway numbers. In my neck of the woods, commute can (and often does) go from 75 mph to a parking lot in 5 minutes.

Originally Posted by mhs525

BMW turbo diesels have beaten the Prius in mileage comparison tests.

Only when the comparison has favored the diesel's operating model (highway driving). Stop-and-go with coasting to a stop and slow acceleration, the Prius wins.

Originally Posted by mhs525

If you are lucky enough to have a track toy like an M3 or a 911 and your commute is all urban with little to no highway then maybe a Hybrid makes sense but for me my driving thrills come from on ramps and back roads, a few open spaces or fast corners on the way to work. Driving my BMW is my reward for a hard days work.

Good on you. But don't resort to deception/falsehoods to put down the Prius. No one is forcing you to buy one.

Originally Posted by mhs525

I couldn't drive a Prius if gas was $8.00/gallon and the average temperature in New England was 90 degrees, in January...

Would you drive a Prius if gas was $16.00/gallon? $32.00/gallon? Or???? At some point, you would make the switch, it is just a question of how high. When gas was at $4.00/gallon in the S.F. Bay Area, Toyota dealers were selling their Prius inventory at MSRP + $5,000 and had a 3 month waiting list.

When I see this, I said to myself, I have to make some comments.

1st: Hats off to Stream. Giving up a terrific car like the 5 series isn't easy. I think Stream goes where his heart tells.

2nd: Scientific evidence overwhelmingly shows that the current global warming is caused by humans' activities. Historically climate changes on earth may have been due to many different reasons, but the changes brought by the industrial revolution have made the impact that's uniquely not due to nature. Never before in the history of the earth has it been inhabited by so many creatures, making so many changes to the chemistry and biology. Certainly, it's not auto emission alone, but everything makes a difference.

3rd: Although I have mixed feelings about hybrids, I feel that it's one of the nice alternatives, as long as the batteries are properly manufactured and recycled. Some BMW owners seem to think of hybrid as the devil, but don't forget that BMW as well as other European car makers are actively pursuing hybrid technology, in addition to the great diesels that they already have.

4th: It's about how you drive the car. If you drive properly, Prius will return greater fuel economy than advertised. If you drive on the track to follow a M3, you are stupid. Hybrids are best for city traffic. And it's the same thing for other cars - how you drive it makes a huge difference on mileage.

5th: I wish BMW would bring more diesels to the U.S. Cars like the 123d and 120d are great - you get terrific mileage and good handling. Obviously BMW is citing cost reasons, but I believe it's the inaction of the U.S. government in the past that fails to push the automakers to introduce more fuel efficient models in the U.S.

6th: What would I do? Note that one should look at not mpg, but the total gallons of fuel used each year. See this from Duke University, the mileage illusion: http://www.fuqua.duke.edu/news/mpg/mpg.html
If you have a SUV and sedan, should you ditch the sedan for a hybrid or the SUV for a wagon? The answers shows that by ditching the SUVs and V8 gas guzzlers and switching to conventional cars, one can reduce fuel consumption more efficiently. I'd probably switch to a VW Jetta Wagon TDI given my highway extensive commute.

Wow. I'm stunned.

Stream, you always were your own man, glad to see that hasn't changed. I'm amazed you and I took such divergent paths in replacing our E60 V-8's. Hope you enjoy your new ride as much as I enjoy mine (and thanks for doing your part to keep mine fed with dead dinosaurs!)

Interesting to see all the "old-timers" like Steve Pow posting on this thread - shows you had a lot of friends / fans on the forum. I'm sure jspira and mullman will be joining us soon; maybe the admins will even let sleepyca make an appearance?

Observation: I've been spending time on the M3 boards, and the level of discourse is far less thoughtful than it used to be here. (Maturity level, I guess). You were a big part of that. Please don't be a stranger. Stay well, my friend!

As far as recycling the battery, if your state follows the California emissions control model, then there will be every incentive to bring the car in for a new battery if the old one fails before 10 years/120,000 miles. If the battery fails after the emission warranty lapses, there is a scrap value for the battery that is somewhere in the range of $500. If you don't want to be bothered to pull the battery and turn it in to a Toyota dealer, I am sure there are others who would have no problem with taking the battery in to a Toyota dealer.

I sure as hell hope my state doesn't follow anything the state of California does, California is insolvent from all these wonderful programs. The California deficit is larger than my states budget.

That is your choice (to recycle or not). If you choose to recycle, then the impact of the mercury will be reduced and there will be fewer CO2 emission as a result.

Mercury is extremely toxic, if 5% of these light bulbs do not get recycled properly, and I believe that percentage will be MUCH higher, we are going to have a major problem.

I have modified my Prius to handle at approximately 80% of what my R53 MINI can do.

Really, I'm sure there are a MANY car magazines that would love to feature your accomplishments. Please let me know when an independent test proving above has been completed and where I can read about it. Just to be sure you aren't spreading falsehoods.

Only when the comparison has favored the diesel's operating model (highway driving). Stop-and-go with coasting to a stop and slow acceleration, the Prius wins.

Wrong, the comparison was on a combined European cycle including urban stop and go.

Good on you. But don't resort to deception/falsehoods to put down the Prius. No one is forcing you to buy one.

I'm entitled to my opinion and have the right to express it. Falsehoods? Please see above

Would you drive a Prius if gas was $16.00/gallon? $32.00/gallon? Or???? At some point, you would make the switch, it is just a question of how high. When gas was at $4.00/gallon in the S.F. Bay Area, Toyota dealers were selling their Prius inventory at MSRP + $5,000 and had a 3 month waiting list.

No, and they are discounting the Prius here.

Here is my problem with global warming. All these comparisons and statistics quote the earths temperature now compared with say 100 years ago, or 50 years ago. The differences in temperature are in fractions of a degree. If you look at the equipment that was used to measure temperature 50 or 100 years ago there is no way it can be as accurate as today’s technology when you talk about fractions of a degree. My father is retired scientist with a PhD. If he's not worried about it neither am I.

However let’s assume global warming is the threat some people have made it out to be, no one talks about the elephant in the room, population control. As long as the population increases energy will be needed to provide for human needs. Grow and distribute food, keep us warm or cool, provide medicine and health care etc. Driving a Prius may make some small impact on carbon emissions but as long as the population keeps growing we are going to end up in the same place it's just a matter of when.

If we (humanity) want to really address carbon emissions it starts with population control. For example look at what’s happening in China. They are burning so much fossil fuel you can’t even breathe in some of their cities. And it’s increasing, A LOT, every day.

Originally Posted by anE934fun

Depending on what you define as least involving, drab driving experience, there may be solutions. I have modified my Prius to handle at approximately 80% of what my R53 MINI can do. True, the Prius can not accelerate anywhere near what my R53 MINI can; but on a downhill grade, it doesn't matter. As far as mileage, if you drive the Prius with its strengths in mind, you will do better than the EPA numbers. If you spend your commute at 75+ mph, the Prius will not make the published highway numbers. In my neck of the woods, commute can (and often does) go from 75 mph to a parking lot in 5 minutes.

It's not just the lack of acceleration, it that it drives like a boat (imho).

Originally Posted by anE934fun

Only when the comparison has favored the diesel's operating model (highway driving). Stop-and-go with coasting to a stop and slow acceleration, the Prius wins.

The average American has something like a 30 mile round-trip daily commute. If I'm not mistaken, that's going to be mostly highway miles.

Originally Posted by anE934fun

Would you drive a Prius if gas was $16.00/gallon? $32.00/gallon? Or???? At some point, you would make the switch, it is just a question of how high. When gas was at $4.00/gallon in the S.F. Bay Area, Toyota dealers were selling their Prius inventory at MSRP + $5,000 and had a 3 month waiting list.

Yes, it's called irrational buying behavior. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with Priuses, but there wasn't a lot of common sense involved in the run on Priuses when gas prices went up to $4.00. It was just an irrationally driven sheep like buying binge (I know, I live in the Bay Area and it was ridiculous)

Originally Posted by quackbury

maybe the admins will even let sleepyca make an appearance?

May be sleepyca will make another incarnation now since Stream is gone

By the way, stop the bickering guys!