Welcome to Bimmerfest -- The #1 Online Community for BMW related information! Please enjoy the discussion forums below and share your experiences with the 200,000 current, new and past BMW owners. The forums are broken out by car model and into other special interest sections such as BMW European Delivery and a special forum to voice your questions to the many BMW dealers on the site to assist our members!

Please follow the links below to help get you started!

Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > The Best of Bimmerfest! > Ask-A-Dealer

Ask-A-Dealer
Talk to our team of BMW Client Advisors. Get all of your buying/financing/leasing questions answered here!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-24-2009, 01:42 PM
pilotman pilotman is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Rochester
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,380
Mein Auto: e46, X3
BMW Pull Ahead Program Sucks

We have a 2006 X3 on a 39 month lease, three payments of $373 each left (the good old days of inflated residuals, european delivery, $1k over invoice etc).

I am ready to lease a 2009 328xi with $1,500 X3 loyalty cash, $1,000 lease cash, $1,840 option credit and $1,000 over invoice on an in stock vehicle.

I presently have 39,000 miles on the X3, with allowed mileage of 48,750, so I am almost 10,000 miles under. Additionally, X3 is in perfect condition.

BMWFS is telling dealer the X3 is $3,500 underwater, i.e. payoff offered by BMWFS is $3,500 more than market value.

Dealer now wants me to roll in $1,200 in payments which will increase my monthly payment by $30.

Dealer also tells me pull ahead isn't working for me because I'm so far under on miles, this doesn't make any sense and seems backwards, if anything the market value should be closer to payoff, not further.

I know and fully understand how BMW pull ahead works, its discretionary between dealer and BMWFS. But this is BS, don't offer a pull ahead and then leave me to fight with the dealer. This shouldn't be the customer's problem....but it is....now I have wasted a ton of my time researching, locating the perfect car, negotiating a deal, filling out a credit app, etc.

I can't justify eating $1,200 in this market, when there are so many other competitive deals...I can get Nissan/Infiniti employee discount (5% below dealer cost), Mercedes is begging me to get a C-Class and WILL make my last 3 payments....

Sorry, had to vent. This is a bad way to do business, you either qualify for a pull ahead or you don't, BMWFS shouldn't force the customer to fight with the dealer.
Reply With Quote
Advertisement
  #2  
Old 06-24-2009, 02:26 PM
Tucsonbmw Tucsonbmw is offline
Registered User
Location: Tucson
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45
Mein Auto: 135i
I hear ya...if I was you I would tell the dealer the bottomline deal you will accept and if they don't want to take it go to another make. Also, you could just wait 3 months, drop of your X3 and tell the dealer to go f@#$ himself. In this market they need you more than we need them.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-24-2009, 02:29 PM
philippek philippek is offline
Proud S ponsor
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,668
Mein Auto: Z4 M Cpe, Miata, X6 50i
I certainly hope BMW sees your post and uses this feedback. From a dealership's perspective it's equally frustrating to have a customer feel like he was drawn in under false pretenses, and it is a waste of time for all involved. Although BMW may argue that at least getting the opportunity to sell a customer is better than not.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-24-2009, 02:37 PM
Schmed Schmed is offline
Registered User
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 74
Mein Auto: '10 335i ZMP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tucsonbmw View Post
Also, you could just wait 3 months, drop of your X3 and tell the dealer to go f@#$ himself.
I'm about to do that, and it's going to feel DARN good to do just that.

I'm very close to losing interest in the marque given the high prices for options that are standard on a base Acura or Infiniti. Not only that, their lease rates and fees are over the top.

Sorry, BMW. I'm about 3 days away from giving up and moving on. And I'm a "worship at the Roundel altar" type of guy.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-24-2009, 03:30 PM
bmwKbiker bmwKbiker is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: San Jose
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 965
Mein Auto: K1200RS, E93/335i:4cruzin
Quote:
Originally Posted by pilotman View Post
2009 328xi with $1,500 X3 loyalty cash, $1,000 lease cash, $1,840 option credit and $1,000 over invoice on an in stock vehicle.
And they won't eat your last three lease payments what is the world coming to?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-24-2009, 04:37 PM
pilotman pilotman is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Rochester
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,380
Mein Auto: e46, X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwKbiker View Post
And they won't eat your last three lease payments what is the world coming to?
You are missing my point. I'm grateful for all the incentives. I'm not being greedy. The dealer shouldn't have to
eat my last three payments.

BMWFS is the one who extended ME this offer. Lease or buy a new BMW and we will make your last 3 payments. Well I show up and
BMWFS says no way. If I don't qualify being 10000 miles under lease then who does?

BMWFS was begging me to turn in my x3 early and I tried but they wouldn't deal.

Please don't act like BMW is doing me a big favor by offering incentives, they are doing it to compete, plain and simple.

So my dealer is bending over backwards and paying $600 towards my last $1200 of payments and I am paying other $600 so
now it's a $400 over invoice deal.

I'm still pissed because I think my dealer (and my local salesperson, who needs to put food on his table) should be making
$1000 over invoice instead of having to make up what BMWFS should have paid. I wanted my $1,000 over invoice profit to go to the dealer, not be eaten up by BMWFS' misleading pull ahead.

At the end of the day, I'm very happy with my dealer, and not so much with BMWFS. They wound up taking $600 profit from my dealer, and $600 from me.

I give credit to Doug Budai at Bavarian BMW, Shelby Township Michigan (Metro Detroit area) for working with me to close this deal. I highly recommend him, he is prompt, courteous and great to work with.

Last edited by pilotman; 06-24-2009 at 05:04 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-24-2009, 07:56 PM
woolyman woolyman is offline
Registered User
Location: Nebraska
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 43
Mein Auto: X3
I had a similar experience with the pull ahead program last month. I agree that BMWFS should fund this program and not shift part or all the costs onto the dealer.

After several email exchanges with my local dealer, I finally got them to admit that they were unwilling to offer me a deal with full pull ahead credit. While I would have preferred to do business with them, having part of the cost of the pull ahead program buried somewhere in their lease quote was a deal breaker for me. I finally found an out of town dealer willing to honor the program in full and ended up leasing a new 3 series.

PM if you want details.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-24-2009, 08:02 PM
tturedraider's Avatar
tturedraider tturedraider is offline
Freedom isn't free!!
Location: Chicago, north shore (via Tennessee & Texas)
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,324
Mein Auto: '06 Sonora/Beige 330i :-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schmed View Post
I'm about to do that, and it's going to feel DARN good to do just that.

I'm very close to losing interest in the marque given the high prices for options that are standard on a base Acura or Infiniti. Not only that, their lease rates and fees are over the top.

Sorry, BMW. I'm about 3 days away from giving up and moving on. And I'm a "worship at the Roundel altar" type of guy.
The odds are high you'll be back. Maybe a little less high since we're talking about an SUV, but I predict you'll really miss the BMW driving dynamics/experience.
__________________

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- Geo. Orwell

2006 330i Sonora w/ ActiveAutoWerke flash tune :-)
2004 330i ZHP Imola/NB - missed
2000 328i TiAg - gone but not forgotten

** Join the BMW CCA www.bmwcca.org
member #388003 - Use me as a referral & you could win a one day ///M Driving School!! **
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-25-2009, 06:11 AM
Rubber Ducky's Avatar
Rubber Ducky Rubber Ducky is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Cocoa Beach, FL
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 838
Mein Auto: '15 M3 DCT; '14 Stingray
Hey, I thought a pull-ahead option was purely a BMWFS deal, no cost/penalty to dealer. If this is wrong, somebody say so pls.

On the deal that started this thread, sounds to me like dealer was pushing to sweeten the pot for himself and was misrepresenting the pull-ahead numbers - would guess the last-3 payments would have shown in the sale-price column as an add. BMWFS would forgive the last 3 payments, but customer would pay them anyway, in the $1200 rolled into the new contract. Sleazy if true.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-25-2009, 06:37 AM
pilotman pilotman is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Rochester
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,380
Mein Auto: e46, X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Ducky View Post
Hey, I thought a pull-ahead option was purely a BMWFS deal, no cost/penalty to dealer. If this is wrong, somebody say so pls.

On the deal that started this thread, sounds to me like dealer was pushing to sweeten the pot for himself and was misrepresenting the pull-ahead numbers - would guess the last-3 payments would have shown in the sale-price column as an add. BMWFS would forgive the last 3 payments, but customer would pay them anyway, in the $1200 rolled into the new contract. Sleazy if true.
I don't think this is what's happening in my case.

I do know that BMWFS gives the dealer a payoff, and the dealer must purchase the vehicle AT THAT PAYOFF in order for BMWFS to make the last three payments.

Here, my dealer said BMWFS' payoff was $3,500 higher than the market value, and there was no way the dealer could justify buying my car for $3,500 over its "market value".

Problem is, I don't know what the market value is, and I don't know what BMWFS' payoff figure was (didn't ask). Maybe I should, but I'm tired of negotiating, I am happy with $1,500 loyalty cash, $1,000 lease cash, $1,840 option credit...

Does anyone know how I can independently verify the payoff and market value? Is the payoff simply the number they give me when I call, or is there a "special" payoff for the dealer only?

Just be forewarned, you are NOT automatically entitled to take advantage of the pull ahead just because you have a qualifying lease, rather, BMWFS and your dealer must also agree on the value of your existing car.

Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-25-2009, 07:16 AM
ckm1515's Avatar
ckm1515 ckm1515 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: New Jersey
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,133
Mein Auto: 2015 X5 M Sport
Quote:
Originally Posted by pilotman View Post
We have a 2006 X3 on a 39 month lease, three payments of $373 each left (the good old days of inflated residuals, european delivery, $1k over invoice etc).

I am ready to lease a 2009 328xi with $1,500 X3 loyalty cash, $1,000 lease cash, $1,840 option credit and $1,000 over invoice on an in stock vehicle.

I presently have 39,000 miles on the X3, with allowed mileage of 48,750, so I am almost 10,000 miles under. Additionally, X3 is in perfect condition.

BMWFS is telling dealer the X3 is $3,500 underwater, i.e. payoff offered by BMWFS is $3,500 more than market value.

Dealer now wants me to roll in $1,200 in payments which will increase my monthly payment by $30.

Dealer also tells me pull ahead isn't working for me because I'm so far under on miles, this doesn't make any sense and seems backwards, if anything the market value should be closer to payoff, not further.

I know and fully understand how BMW pull ahead works, its discretionary between dealer and BMWFS. But this is BS, don't offer a pull ahead and then leave me to fight with the dealer. This shouldn't be the customer's problem....but it is....now I have wasted a ton of my time researching, locating the perfect car, negotiating a deal, filling out a credit app, etc.

I can't justify eating $1,200 in this market, when there are so many other competitive deals...I can get Nissan/Infiniti employee discount (5% below dealer cost), Mercedes is begging me to get a C-Class and WILL make my last 3 payments....

Sorry, had to vent. This is a bad way to do business, you either qualify for a pull ahead or you don't, BMWFS shouldn't force the customer to fight with the dealer.
Had similar situation when I ended my 2006 E90 330xi lease last July. BMWFS stated that the quoted buyout was not what the market was bearing. I was not aware that that dealer has the OPTION of engaging in the pull ahead program. Advertising materials make it seem like a no brainer. After much back and forth, my dealer purchased the car at the presribed B.O. amount and waived final three payments to get me into the X5. I had originated my two prior leases with them and they gave in on those grounds, or so I was told. My mileage was close to allowance but car was immaculate.
__________________



Current Ride: 2015 X5 3.5 M Sport
Retired: 2014 X3 3.5 M Sport
Retired: 2011 X5 Sport
Retired: 2008 X5 3.0si
Retired: 2006 330 Xi
Retired: 2003 325 'Vert
Retired: 2000 323 Ci
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-25-2009, 07:28 AM
jenX3 jenX3 is offline
Registered User
Location: New York
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: X3
Wow, I had no problem with the pull ahead. I too had an 06 X3, 39 month lease with exactly three payments left. I only had 17,000 miles on the car! ( lease was for 10,000 per year.) It was actually the smoothest deal.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-25-2009, 07:29 AM
ckm1515's Avatar
ckm1515 ckm1515 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: New Jersey
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,133
Mein Auto: 2015 X5 M Sport
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenX3 View Post
Wow, I had no problem with the pull ahead. I too had an 06 X3, 39 month lease with exactly three payments left. I only had 17,000 miles on the car! ( lease was for 10,000 per year.) It was actually the smoothest deal.
Probably because your car was worth more than FMV and dealer knew he could get uplift on resale.
__________________



Current Ride: 2015 X5 3.5 M Sport
Retired: 2014 X3 3.5 M Sport
Retired: 2011 X5 Sport
Retired: 2008 X5 3.0si
Retired: 2006 330 Xi
Retired: 2003 325 'Vert
Retired: 2000 323 Ci
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-25-2009, 09:48 AM
pilotman pilotman is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Rochester
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,380
Mein Auto: e46, X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenX3 View Post
Wow, I had no problem with the pull ahead. I too had an 06 X3, 39 month lease with exactly three payments left. I only had 17,000 miles on the car! ( lease was for 10,000 per year.) It was actually the smoothest deal.
curious as to when you closed your deal? Market conditions can change. My vehicle is 38,900 miles, of 48,750 allowed.

Yours was definitely worth more than mine due to much lower mileage, perhaps this explains the difference.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-25-2009, 10:15 AM
jenX3 jenX3 is offline
Registered User
Location: New York
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by pilotman View Post
curious as to when you closed your deal? Market conditions can change. My vehicle is 38,900 miles, of 48,750 allowed.

Yours was definitely worth more than mine due to much lower mileage, perhaps this explains the difference.
May 29th.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 06-26-2009, 08:40 AM
Alpine300ZHP Alpine300ZHP is offline
East Coast Commuter
Location: South Florida
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,014
Mein Auto: 435/x3 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by pilotman View Post
We have a 2006 X3 on a 39 month lease, three payments of $373 each left (the good old days of inflated residuals, european delivery, $1k over invoice etc).

I am ready to lease a 2009 328xi with $1,500 X3 loyalty cash, $1,000 lease cash, $1,840 option credit and $1,000 over invoice on an in stock vehicle.

I presently have 39,000 miles on the X3, with allowed mileage of 48,750, so I am almost 10,000 miles under. Additionally, X3 is in perfect condition.

BMWFS is telling dealer the X3 is $3,500 underwater, i.e. payoff offered by BMWFS is $3,500 more than market value.

Dealer now wants me to roll in $1,200 in payments which will increase my monthly payment by $30.

Dealer also tells me pull ahead isn't working for me because I'm so far under on miles, this doesn't make any sense and seems backwards, if anything the market value should be closer to payoff, not further.

I know and fully understand how BMW pull ahead works, its discretionary between dealer and BMWFS. But this is BS, don't offer a pull ahead and then leave me to fight with the dealer. This shouldn't be the customer's problem....but it is....now I have wasted a ton of my time researching, locating the perfect car, negotiating a deal, filling out a credit app, etc.

I can't justify eating $1,200 in this market, when there are so many other competitive deals...I can get Nissan/Infiniti employee discount (5% below dealer cost), Mercedes is begging me to get a C-Class and WILL make my last 3 payments....

Sorry, had to vent. This is a bad way to do business, you either qualify for a pull ahead or you don't, BMWFS shouldn't force the customer to fight with the dealer.
Hey Pilot I understand how you feel and agree the program is really not well designed at all. However, I have to tell you this....I thought about getting a C350 myself and I just did not like it. It is an improvement over the old C280, but still subpar with the 3 series IMHO. I am not sure what you are looking for in a car, but maybe, just maybe your best bet would be to lease the 328xi now and just drive the x3 till the lease terminates. You have plenty of mileage left and this way you lock in the great lease deals on the 328 and get the car you really want? So what if you have 3 cars for a while....give your E46 a break for 3 months and use up what is left, mileage-wise, on your x3 and give the wife the 328xi. Seems to me this might be the best way to solve your problem.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 08-10-2009, 06:52 PM
dima123's Avatar
dima123 dima123 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: new york
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 847
Mein Auto: 12 528xi, 12 x5 35d,13ah3
My lease on the x3 is up next month..does anyone know if the pull ahead program is still around??
__________________
Current cars
2013 Activehybrid 3
2012 x5 35d
2012 528xi

Past rides
2011 z4 3.0i
2010 BMW 528i
2009 BMW 328xi
2006 Bmw X3
2004 BMW 325i
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 08-12-2009, 08:06 PM
HG132's Avatar
HG132 HG132 is offline
Go Phillies!
Location: NJ--20 minutes from CBP
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 610
Mein Auto: 2014 X6 35i
Yeah, you are singing my song from my first X3...I only had 22k on my vehicle and lost 23K in lease miles.

It was worth negotiating the last 3 months to get out of my lease and move into a new lease--I got an early itch and the overall deal was just too good.

Be careful when you get a bit too greedy, it can bite you in the "trunk." A BMW is a machine. Are you looking to another car out of spite? I drove the C-class, it's junk compared to the 3...and my father has the CL and S...and they are always in for service. Remember, to look at the big picture.
__________________
2014 X6 White w/Black Leather
2012 535xi Sapphire Black w/Oyster Leather
2013 328xi Black with/Black Faux

Many Thanks:
X6 2011
335cxi M pkg 2008; 2009
335xi 2010
328xi 2007; 2004
X3 M pkg 2007; 2004
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Forum Navigation
Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > The Best of Bimmerfest! > Ask-A-Dealer
Today's Posts Search
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2011 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms