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E46 (1999 - 2006)
The fourth generation 3 Series (E46 chassis) was introduced in 1999 and set the standard for engineering and performance during it's years of production including being named to Car & Driver's 10 best list every one of those years! ! -- View the E46 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 07-14-2009, 12:39 PM
chopin1012 chopin1012 is offline
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Interesting Dealer Experience

Last December, my wife and I purchased a 2001 325i with premium, sport, and cold weather packages. We bought it wholesale. At the time of purchase, we were told the only thing wrong with the vehicle was a leaking power steering hose. I had an indy look at it and we decided it wasn't bad enough to fix yet.

Last week I received a coupon in the mail for a free multi-point summer inspection. I scheduled it and took it in last Friday. They provided me with a print-out of everything they checked. Although many things were visual checks, the inspection was pretty comprehensive. As expected, the only thing that failed inspection was the power steering hose.

Now to the interesting part. First, my service rep explains to me that cars with over 100k usually have far more to repair than mine. Second, they give me a quote for the steering hose repair plus several recommended services. Of course, I declined them all, but was rather shocked and entertained at the list.
  • nitrogen in tires $60
  • wheel balance $60
  • power steering hose fix $330
  • power steering fluid exchange $150
  • brake fluid exchange $180
  • coolant exchange $185
  • 4 wheel alignment $195
  • A/C deodorization $39.95
  • Engine Decarbonization $150
  • Fuel Injector Cleaning $150
The grand total was $1544. I couldn't believe it. First, I have lifetime balance, rotation, inflation, and road hazard for all four tires at a cost of $99. Second, while a nice touch, nitrogen is not a necessity. Third, I can fix the hose for under $100. Fourth, unless they're going to remove the valves (the service rep explained the decarbonization was for the valves) and the injectors and clean them that way, they're probably only going to use a $10 fluid. Fifth, I did the fluid swaps myself: coolant (BMW coolant + distilled water) $21, brake fluid (BMW fluid) $12. Also, when I repair the power steering hose this fall, the Dexron III will probably cost under $10.

The moral to the story, of course, is to do as much repair work yourself as possible. But I still can't believe they wanted $1544 for things that cost me less then $500.
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  #2  
Old 07-14-2009, 12:51 PM
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Looks to me like the service rep is doing what he gets paid to do, recommend.
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  #3  
Old 07-14-2009, 12:57 PM
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I've been running 78% Nitrogen in my tires for over 40 years, and I highly recommend it for everyone.
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  #4  
Old 07-14-2009, 12:58 PM
ventsyv ventsyv is offline
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  #5  
Old 07-14-2009, 01:02 PM
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I think Prestige in NJ quoted my mother $30 or $35 per tire for the Nitrogen fill. Her last 335 was a sport package car, and since she never checked the tire pressure, it would basically show low pressure each change-of season. Her new 335 is an Xdrive car with the 17's, but it's still an issue.

She found a tire shop nearby that did all 4 tires for $60, and thought it was a deal. As she was relating all of this to me I thought the punchline would be "but instead I bought a tire pressure gauge!" No. She paid the $60. I guess many (today it may be most?) bmw drivers do not want to get dirty with a pressure gauge. Your service advisor definitely misjudged you as a client, but they make a LOT of money with those recommendations.

We'll avoid any question of why my 65 year old mother wants/needs a 335. Twice. She has fun with it.
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  #6  
Old 07-14-2009, 01:04 PM
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delirium330 delirium330 is offline
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I'll take a 20% increase in nitrogen any day!!! on a serious note it's horrible to see so many people getting ripped off by this service. even if the pure nitro claims are true to the point where they increase xyz whatever by .0003 %.

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Last edited by delirium330; 07-14-2009 at 01:07 PM.
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  #7  
Old 07-14-2009, 01:16 PM
Nando779 Nando779 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopin1012 View Post
Last December, my wife and I purchased a 2001 325i with premium, sport, and cold weather packages. We bought it wholesale. At the time of purchase, we were told the only thing wrong with the vehicle was a leaking power steering hose. I had an indy look at it and we decided it wasn't bad enough to fix yet.

Last week I received a coupon in the mail for a free multi-point summer inspection. I scheduled it and took it in last Friday. They provided me with a print-out of everything they checked. Although many things were visual checks, the inspection was pretty comprehensive. As expected, the only thing that failed inspection was the power steering hose.

Now to the interesting part. First, my service rep explains to me that cars with over 100k usually have far more to repair than mine. Second, they give me a quote for the steering hose repair plus several recommended services. Of course, I declined them all, but was rather shocked and entertained at the list.
  • nitrogen in tires $60
  • wheel balance $60
  • power steering hose fix $330
  • power steering fluid exchange $150
  • brake fluid exchange $180
  • coolant exchange $185
  • 4 wheel alignment $195
  • A/C deodorization $39.95
  • Engine Decarbonization $150
  • Fuel Injector Cleaning $150
The grand total was $1544. I couldn't believe it. First, I have lifetime balance, rotation, inflation, and road hazard for all four tires at a cost of $99. Second, while a nice touch, nitrogen is not a necessity. Third, I can fix the hose for under $100. Fourth, unless they're going to remove the valves (the service rep explained the decarbonization was for the valves) and the injectors and clean them that way, they're probably only going to use a $10 fluid. Fifth, I did the fluid swaps myself: coolant (BMW coolant + distilled water) $21, brake fluid (BMW fluid) $12. Also, when I repair the power steering hose this fall, the Dexron III will probably cost under $10.

The moral to the story, of course, is to do as much repair work yourself as possible. But I still can't believe they wanted $1544 for things that cost me less then $500.
It still shocks me to hear how much the dealers charge to do a simple coolant or brake flush. Holy crap are they using fluid that has gold chips in it? Or maybe the fluid has endangered Bald Eagle blood in it. Such a rip
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  #8  
Old 07-14-2009, 03:25 PM
chopin1012 chopin1012 is offline
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I think dealers think everything they sell has gold chips.

The comment about it being sad how many people are ripped off is true. That was the first thing I thought when the rep showed me the printout.

As far as people not wanting to get their hands dirty, for luxury car owners, that's probably true, but I have a lot of friends that I tell to call me first for issues because they're simply clueless ass to what to do. In my church, they were going to have me teach brake replacement. The number of people interested in learning was really high. It's had to be postponed, but I won't be surprised if we have a ton of people show up.

One nice thing, I got a free car wash out of it that Max (my 325) really needed. They even cleaned the wheels and reblacked the tires. Perhaps everyone else's service bills paid for my detail.
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  #9  
Old 07-14-2009, 04:53 PM
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Nov99328i Nov99328i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boogety View Post
I've been running 78% Nitrogen in my tires for over 40 years, and I highly recommend it for everyone.
Why? The air you are breathing when you read this is 85% Nitrogen anyway!
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  #10  
Old 07-14-2009, 11:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nov99328i View Post
Why? The air you are breathing when you read this is 85% Nitrogen anyway!
We'll just chock this comment up to oxygen depravation. I'm not sure where you live, but the atmosphere where most of us live consists of 78% Nitrogen, 21% Oxygen and 1% Argon.
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  #11  
Old 07-14-2009, 11:30 PM
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The best dealership experiences I had was a GMC Dealer I used to take my pickup to. They were factory owned, not franchised. The service writers were on salary only. They would tell you up front that they are supposed to recommend the A/C deodorization etc, but that they are a waste of money. I really missed that place when it closed. Auto Nation purchased it and relocated it.
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  #12  
Old 07-14-2009, 11:31 PM
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Not interesting to me at all.

100% typical & expected.
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  #13  
Old 07-15-2009, 04:18 AM
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Nov99328i Nov99328i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmba2002 View Post
We'll just chock this comment up to oxygen depravation. I'm not sure where you live, but the atmosphere where most of us live consists of 78% Nitrogen, 21% Oxygen and 1% Argon.
My head definitely was in the clouds, my bad...
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  #14  
Old 07-15-2009, 06:35 AM
3beemers 3beemers is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nando779 View Post
It still shocks me to hear how much the dealers charge to do a simple coolant or brake flush. Holy crap are they using fluid that has gold chips in it? Or maybe the fluid has endangered Bald Eagle blood in it. Such a rip
This $1544.00 recommendation is not shocking to me ....from a business point of view. First, it is a recommendation. 2nd, no twisting of arm. 3rd, from my experience, the dealership is honest, BUT EXPENSIVE. Expensive because many of us are able to DIY and their facility/techs and customer services are superb. But how many are able to DIY....I believe there are many. This global recession brought that numbers of non-DIY probably a few percent. When I received a free clinic weeks ago, I have proven the honesty of the dealership not only because they took me to the shop to show me what my car need. Because I DIY, I know they are right on the money and I really appreciate that. They did not recommend anything else like the long list you provided here. I have nothing against this dealership where I bought my car from 9 years ago, but I would do my best NOT to buy any part or have my car serviced by them as long as my hands and tools coordination are working.

Just from my point of view...
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  #15  
Old 07-15-2009, 06:47 AM
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delirium330 delirium330 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmba2002 View Post
We'll just chock this comment up to oxygen depravation. I'm not sure where you live, but the atmosphere where most of us live consists of 78% Nitrogen, 21% Oxygen and 1% Argon.
unless you live in los angeles. then you can add in healthy amounts of ozone, particulate matter, carbon monoxide, nitrogen dioxide and sulfur dioxide. enjoy!
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  #16  
Old 07-15-2009, 06:57 AM
Latoilette Latoilette is offline
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I've been going to my dealership for a while.. not to get service.. but to buy parts. I haven't taken my car(s) to any repair shop for the last 12 years (besides cv axle job. I always take that to someone else)
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  #17  
Old 07-15-2009, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boogety View Post
I've been running 78% Nitrogen in my tires for over 40 years, and I highly recommend it for everyone.
+1 me too! works really good!

Quote:
Originally Posted by delirium330 View Post
I'll take a 20% increase in nitrogen any day!!!
Going from %78 N2 to %100 N2 is actually about %28 increase in N2
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  #18  
Old 07-15-2009, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by SeanC View Post
+1 me too! works really good!



Going from %78 N2 to %100 N2 is actually about %28 increase in N2
thanks for trolling through this thread to give me a math lesson... and its actually 28.2% wise ass.
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Old 07-15-2009, 09:20 AM
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thanks for trolling through this thread to give me a math lesson... and its actually 28.2% wise ass.
seriously? what's there to be butt-hurt about?
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  #20  
Old 07-15-2009, 09:43 AM
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seriously? what's there to be butt-hurt about?
serious as cancer
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  #21  
Old 07-15-2009, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopin1012 View Post
Last December, my wife and I purchased a 2001 325i with premium, sport, and cold weather packages. We bought it wholesale. At the time of purchase, we were told the only thing wrong with the vehicle was a leaking power steering hose. I had an indy look at it and we decided it wasn't bad enough to fix yet.

Last week I received a coupon in the mail for a free multi-point summer inspection. I scheduled it and took it in last Friday. They provided me with a print-out of everything they checked. Although many things were visual checks, the inspection was pretty comprehensive. As expected, the only thing that failed inspection was the power steering hose.


Now to the interesting part. First, my service rep explains to me that cars with over 100k usually have far more to repair than mine. Second, they give me a quote for the steering hose repair plus several recommended services. Of course, I declined them all, but was rather shocked and entertained at the list.
  • nitrogen in tires $60
  • wheel balance $60
  • power steering hose fix $330
  • power steering fluid exchange $150
  • brake fluid exchange $180
  • coolant exchange $185
  • 4 wheel alignment $195
  • A/C deodorization $39.95
  • Engine Decarbonization $150
  • Fuel Injector Cleaning $150
The grand total was $1544. I couldn't believe it. First, I have lifetime balance, rotation, inflation, and road hazard for all four tires at a cost of $99. Second, while a nice touch, nitrogen is not a necessity. Third, I can fix the hose for under $100. Fourth, unless they're going to remove the valves (the service rep explained the decarbonization was for the valves) and the injectors and clean them that way, they're probably only going to use a $10 fluid. Fifth, I did the fluid swaps myself: coolant (BMW coolant + distilled water) $21, brake fluid (BMW fluid) $12. Also, when I repair the power steering hose this fall, the Dexron III will probably cost under $10.

The moral to the story, of course, is to do as much repair work yourself as possible. But I still can't believe they wanted $1544 for things that cost me less then $500.
Well, I can beat any BMW dealer on any given day but probably be little fair today.
Now that you went to a BMW dealer to get that free inspection and knew that your only main problem was the leaky PS hose. And that was indeed what they told you and in addition to that they came up with their recommendations. And now you find this interesting.
First off, all let me tell you this: The issue is not a BMW dealer here. Any dealer would produce similar results after a free inspection like that. The purpose of that free inspection is not to give free coffee to vehicle owners. Even if you go to a Mobil service (in gas station), they have their own list to recommend people.
Service rep. did exactly what he was supposed to do in my opinion. And when I look at the list all the quotes look very normal to me (except that maybe coolant change a bit not realistic). So I wonder what you were expecting.
For them to tell you that "We inspected your car sir and everything but the PS hose was okay. We can fix that hose for you. Our list price for this job is $330 but we can give you an indy shop price and get you out the door for $100..."? Ain't going to happen at the dealer.

Please don't take this as I want to start a friction here. Accept my apology if I sounded harsh. But what you experienced at the dealer the other day is definitely not something new to this forum community. They all know how BMW dealers work very well.
If you realize they are more interested in the Nitrogen amount in the air than what the dealer quoted you
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  #22  
Old 07-15-2009, 03:33 PM
chopin1012 chopin1012 is offline
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No offense taken. Not harsh at all. I guess, as I've never had services performed at a dealership (I always DIY or bargain shop it), I was surprised at the large difference in pricing between the dealership and my indy, let alone DIY. The only thing I've ever done at a dealership is buy a steal of a deal.
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  #23  
Old 07-15-2009, 04:02 PM
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BDWREDZ BDWREDZ is offline
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Yeah, I got one of those free inspection invitations, and tossed it in the garbage for this exact reason.
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  #24  
Old 07-15-2009, 04:44 PM
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smolck smolck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopin1012 View Post
  • nitrogen in tires $60 (hey Nascar does it, why not BMW?)
  • wheel balance $60 (only legit charge on here)
  • power steering hose fix $330 (wow, this must be the one lined in 24k gold)
  • power steering fluid exchange $150 (WOW!, bend over sir)
  • brake fluid exchange $180 (and now say ahhhhh)
  • coolant exchange $185 (They do use BMW coolant though, which has magical powers)
  • 4 wheel alignment $195 (REALLY)
  • A/C deodorization $39.95 (WTF does that mean anyway)
  • Engine Decarbonization $150 (Called a can of Techron, $5 at any gas station)
  • Fuel Injector Cleaning $150 (see above)
My comments in ( ) above. Wow! Kudos for not being an idiot and paying them to do it and then come here and complain about why a BMW is so expensive! You win my common sense medal! And by the way, this can all be done for under $300.
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  #25  
Old 07-15-2009, 04:53 PM
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Kamdog Kamdog is offline
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One good reason to put 100% nitrogen in your tires is if the inside of the tire were to try to spontaneously combust, the lack of oxygen would prevent it.

Now, I will be the first to admit that spontaneous combustion inside of a tire is not all that frequent (even thought there have been 0 cases reported, I chalk that up to people being too embarrassed to report it), but, you can't be too careful you know.
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