SMG buyer beware

Originally Posted by rowanm

guys..dont over-stress about the SMG gearbox...i'm driving mine and enjoying the hell outta it...any vehicle will give u ****..u should have money set aside if u dont have warranty?? besides there's nothing like playing with those paddle shift levers?? hooray!!!!!!!!! bet thatz better than engaging your heavy clutch everytime and missing a gear sometimes when drag racing hey????

We like to call it driving with a good wide attention span and skill. SMG is, IMO, not for the raw enthusiast but for the grocery getters.

Long shifts? sounds like you arent winding it up high enough.At high RPMs it shifts really fast.

Originally Posted by RKSS

rowanm, yes but paddles are for boats, no? kind of like bottles are for babies haha....regardless to get back on topic what was the outcome of the original post or did i miss something? hopefully it turned out well. Fill us in please.

Tell that to F1 drivers. A manual with a clutchpedal and lever is cool and romantic but Id take any of the double clutch new designs like the new M3 or Porsche trannys.

Rally driver??? Last time I saw Sebastian Loeb hauling a** down a dirt road the in car shots showed him using a what to shift??? Oh yeah!!! Paddle shifters. Any top line performance car is a paddle shifting manual tranny. Well O.K maybe not vehicles NASCAR LOL......

Originally Posted by ermed

I am a original owner of a 2002 M3 with 60k miles.The car was never pushed hard or taken on the track.Last week the transmission failed to engage.The dealership first said it was a $1600 control module.When that did not work,they said the entire transmission had to be replaced for $12k.I told them that the max trade in value was $18k.The service manager was silent,then said it's up to you.My advice,stay clear of SMG unless the car is still under full warranty.

Was the transmission fluid ever flushed for this vehicle? I'm just curious if you ever changed it, as the dealerships seem to discourage people from ever doing this, when it ironically should be done every 30K miles!

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...331&highlight=

how do i take the gear shift knob off on a smg e46 i need to get it rechromed

Wowzer! Sorry to hear about your horror story with the SMG. I just bought my new 2006 BMW M3 with SMG and it still has about a year left on the warranty. This is giving me serious
thoughts on purchasing an extended warranty to cover this. I like SMG- in LA traffic its good to have the function of automatic and the shifters for track days.

Personally I love the SMG on my E46 M3.

I drive with DSC enabled, so that means leaving the box at speed 5. Changes at medium rpm can be a tad abrubt, but at over 7k they are silky smooth and lightening fast. At lower rpm the harshness of the change can be easily removed by backing off the throttle just as you would in a manual (only to a lesser extent).

The SMG box has to be learnt. Took me about 3 months. Anybody who just goes for a test drive will probably come back with a list of criticisms, but once you learn how to drive round its issues, the benefits are enormous. Being able to keep both hands on the wheel whilst overtaking on narrow bumpy roads is a clear plus, as are the perfect downshifts.

I'll never buy another "old fashioned" manual again!

Steve

I've driven both manual and smg2, manual is great but it feels just like any BMW 3 manual and I can't say it was special IMO, the smg was great and if it was my money that's where it would go, also try a transmission specialist, I'm sure it can be reconditioned or repaired, also all manufactures say the trans oil is for life but all oil degrades with time and also burns, also trans filters do block up and cause problems.

You would never run your engine for 100k without an oil and filter change so why let your gearbox do it, your trans oil should be cherry red, I would check and change if it wasn't

Don't liste to people that give 'advice'about SMG without having owned it!

Sure, it is more complex thatn manula, so is more likely to go wrong, but there are many many SMG owners out there that haven no problems whatsover, they just don't get on the forums and talk about it!

If you're concerned about things going wrong and having expensive repair bills, why get an M car?

OP, i suggest you find another shop who knows what they are doing. sounds like they would just replace the entire tranny rather then find out the root cause of the problem. whether or not its a SMG or Manual.. its still the same tranny/clutch for $12K. either one eventually breaks.

So what's the staus OP??

Originally Posted by Spartikus

Don't liste to people that give 'advice'about SMG without having owned it!

Sure, it is more complex thatn manula, so is more likely to go wrong, but there are many many SMG owners out there that haven no problems whatsover, they just don't get on the forums and talk about it!

This has been a valuable forum for me now that I have a 2002 M3 and a new 535xi with M package.
I like the SMG. I used to ride a lot of motorcycles and it seems somewhat natural. I don't like the clunky jerk it can do, on occasion, when you are almost stopped and it shifts down to first. My impression is that the clutches are hell for stout. They engage in a minor shuddering kind of way that reminds me of racing clutches.
I have no use for the lower settings on the SMG shift programming. One and two seems to lug the engine! I mostly paddle shift it in sport mode; then I seem to have the most control and it seems the most predictable.
I bought this M3 (with 20K miles), because it was a steal and I have never had a BMW. A friend had many M3s and I was impressed with them. I was thinking of getting a Boxster with PDK and still want to see what they are like. In the end I may enjoy the smoother operation of manually shifting it myself, but I sure like shifting with the paddles.
And, yes, you cannot appreciate or use all of what the SMG has to offer without some wheel time. It really shines when you are at speed on windy stuff. Just my opinion as an ex-racer and owner of many high-performance manual cars.

Sorry to hear a fester suffer with this problem. Gotta be help out here.

I generally keep cars for a long time which is why I didn't even consider getting the DCT on my M3.

i have smg and i never had any problems with it.

Originally Posted by ermed

The dealership first said it was a $1600 control module.When that did not work,they said the entire transmission had to be replaced for $12k.I told them that the max trade in value was $18k.The service manager was silent,then said it's up to you

This is why I don't like the idea of owning. I lease, have fun with it, and then walk away.

Sorry to hear about your troubles though.

I always loved the SMG, but if something goes wrong get ready to pay a hefty amount of money to get it fixed and back on the road. Owning is definitely more expensive then leasing, but it really comes down to personal preference.

Originally Posted by e86_Coupe

12 grand? That sounds a little steep personally. I've heard the pump being replaced for 3-5grand though. (Which is insanely expensive but I could see myself biting the bullet in a bad situation...12k is another story) What is included for the $12 000 service?

If you check www.realoem.com you will find that

1. The control module costs $1000 plus core return
2. The SMG tranny is about $7,000
3. The 6 speed tranny is $6k.

To get to $12k, you arer looking at several days labor, programming, testing.

The bottom line is regardless of tranny, they are all expensive, there is no free lunch.

However, with a manual, you more than likely will only need a clutch plate or throw-out bearing.

The best thing to do is run the car up a curb and damage the suspension. Tell you insurance you were in an accident and the tranny will get fixed as well or more than likely the car totalled. (just kidding although I have no doubt folks do this)

Why is this thread mostly about smg vs manual? If the tranny goes its basically the same part for both and to tell you the truth smg is alot easier on the tranny than manual imo.

Originally Posted by gotoschoolhere

This is why I don't like the idea of owning. I lease, have fun with it, and then walk away.

I leased my '93 RX-7, R1. Being a new model and the reintroduction of the rotary engine in a new package, with twin turbos, I opted for a four year, 60K lease. While leasing it I had turbos go out, struts fail and lots of miscellaneous issues; none of which cost me a cent. Then I soloed it three times and drove the piss out of it; even getting it airborne several times and going 170+.
The engine/drivetrain never gave me any problems, fortunately. I have killed many other cars...
Nowadays is there any reason not to lease and race your car (stock solo-autocross)? Can they void the warranty?

Originally Posted by Spartikus

Don't liste to people that give 'advice'about SMG without having owned it!

Sure, it is more complex thatn manula, so is more likely to go wrong, but there are many many SMG owners out there that haven no problems whatsover, they just don't get on the forums and talk about it!

If you're concerned about things going wrong and having expensive repair bills, why get an M car?

I sold my 2002 M3 and bought a 2011 Scooby WRX STI six speed. I couldn't be happier!
I used to race in SCCA. The last manual that was similar to either of these cars was my '93 RX-7 R1. I did not realize how much I missed a manual with a clutch that YOU have infinite control over and choice of any gear... Heel-toe and all that fun stuff.
I really thought I wanted SMG. I was sold on the concept. However, I found it unacceptable between first and second at low speeds. Horrible, unpredictable jerks when going from second to first. Fine on windy roads, but not acceptable when piddling along downtown.

Before I bought the Scooby I drove a '09 Porsche Cayman S with PDK. Really a nice machine and better mannered than the '02 SMG as far as shifts and drivability. Still, so much money for a used car! Once I test drove the STI and started sawing gears again, I was in love. All the memories of being on the track and doing SOLO came back.
One day, when my leg can't press the clutch pedal without cramping, I will get another paddle shift.

Wow, what a concept, pick a high performance car on how it drives "piddling" around town.

I see the smiley face, but...
The M3 would unexpectedly buck when starting off. It would sometimes jerk horribly when coming to a stop. 2002 was the first year for the SMG, if I'm not mistaken. I hope they have improved it for the street.
Sometimes the M3 would do nothing when I tried to start it and I'd have to fiddle with it for a few minutes before it would start. Nobody ever figured that out.

Yes, a semi-high performance car. I've had many HP cars that were more civilized (and predictable), and I enjoyed them more on the street.
OTOH, we are perfectly happy with the 535xi with M package.

BTW, look at my sig. I OWN a 2002 E46 M3 SMG.

There have been software updates for it, but AFAIK the hardware is the same from 2002 - 2007.

The only time mine jerks coming to a stop is if I have a bit and throttle with the brake. I have gotten into the PIO bucking at starting out, lift or step on it fixes that.

You have to learn to drive SMG, it is not a manual and it is not an automatic.

And I leave my in S5 all the time.