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E60 (2004 - 2010)
BMW 5-Series (E60 chassis) was first seen in the Unites States in the fall of 2003 with a 2004 Model Year designation. The E60 is now available as a 528i, 528xi, 535i, 535xi, 550i and a 535xi sports wagon! -- View the E60 Wiki

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  #526  
Old 03-03-2013, 08:08 PM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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CONGRATS!! It is awesome to hear I'm not the only person this has worked for.

I had been checking this thread non stop all day waiting for you to respond, haha.

There's someone else over on 5series.net that was waiting on the results too--his mechanic said that the solenoids wouldn't fix his issue..

Last edited by schpenxel; 03-03-2013 at 08:18 PM.
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  #527  
Old 03-03-2013, 08:21 PM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapiano View Post
Super Success!

Today I replaced the solenoids, sealing sleeve, mechatronic seal adapter, oil pan gasket and drain plug. I decided not to change the pan until I was sure the repair was going to work. The job took 2.5 hours; I used a friend's shop with power tools and a lift, it made all the difference in the world and the task simple.

After completing the job; I let the car run for 5-7 minutes to warm up. I put the car in reverse, removed my foot off the brake and the car immediately started moving backwards. Before the swap there was a significant delay before the car would move. The back and forth cycling between 5th and 6th at 32-40 mph no longer exists, shifting is smooth as butter. The stuttering and jerking when coming to a stop, no longer exists. The car did not go into limp mode during hard acceleration or when manually downshifting as it had before. The shifting was almost unnoticeable.

Anyone having any of the issues below must do this repair; it's not that complicated; just take your time. Total cost for parts and shipping: $527.

After two months of dealing with this; I can say that I am a very happy camper! It's like having a new car all over again. Night and Day!

List of issues with car before repair:
2-3 second delay before the car would move when selecting reverse
Transmission cycling back and forth between 5th and 6th at 32 - 40 mph
The car would stutter/jerk when coming to a complete stop
Car would go into limp mode occasionally under hard acceleration or when manually down shifting (Code on file: 4F85)

Repair Steps
1. Drain transmission oil
2. Reset transmission adaptation via Snap On scan tool
3. Pull Pan, remove gasket and replace with new one
4. Disconnect sealing sleeve power connector
5. Unlock sealing sleeve lock and remove sleeve
6. Remove mechatronic unit
7. Remove solenoid cover and bracket
8. Pull solenoids and replace with new ones
9. Remove and replace mechatronic sealing sleeve
10. Replace mechatronic back in transmission
11. Replace sealing sleeve and lock bracket
12. Reconnect power connector to sealing sleeve
13. Replace oil pan
14. Add 4 quarts of transmission fluid and reconnect filler plug
15. Start car and let it run until the transmission temps get to 84 degrees, used a Snap On scan tool to determine temperature
16. Turn engine off and add more transmission fluid until it started to run out, reconnect filler plug

17. Check for codes
18. Drive to test
19. Replace heat shields and transmission cover
20. Enjoy issue free, smooth shifting; put a smile on your face transmission in your 5 series!
Your filling steps are incorrect. You have to do the final fill with the engine running (yes, seriously), with the transmission temp at whatever the manual said (something around 100*F if I remember correctly).

You pull the fill hole and add fluid until it starts to flow out (while still inside the temperature range given & while engine is running). Then plug the hole of course once you get to that level. I have read that doing this at the lower end up the temp range is preferred.
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  #528  
Old 03-03-2013, 09:31 PM
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My friend (mechanic who let me borrow his shop) who has done this before and monitored the entire process; informed me to measure the fluid we drained out. This gave us a good idea of how much fluid to put back into the transmission. We drained out a little over 5 quarts.

We added 4 quarts of fluid initially, then let the car idle until the transmission temps reached 84 degrees; then we let the car run for about 5 more minutes to allow the pump to pull the fluid into the transmission so we could add the remaining amount. I then pulled the filler plug and put in another 1.75 quarts of transmission oil and sealed her up. Took the car for a nice long test drive; checked for leaks, ran another scan and no codes were present. The sticker on the passenger side of the pan states the temperature range is 84-100 degrees for the fill. I am confident we have enough transmission fluid in the car; the average fill I have read online is 5-6 quarts when you drain the pan. That is exactly in the range I put back in the transmission.

This seems to be the fix everyone has been looking for; it will be great to see the results others are having.

schpenxel, did your car ever go into the limp mode or give you the 4F85 code? Thanks.
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  #529  
Old 03-04-2013, 05:52 AM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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I would have to check the exact code for you--That one looks very familiar though, so it is quite possible I did

Good to hear it worked!
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  #530  
Old 03-05-2013, 07:18 AM
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Thanks for posting your results; this lead me to take on the task. If anyone is on the fence, I highly recommend it. Hard to believe the dealer wanted to swap the tranny; when $500 in parts and 2 hours of labor most likely would cure all issues.
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  #531  
Old 03-06-2013, 12:25 AM
kiwi_chris kiwi_chris is offline
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Hi guys... I'm new to this forum and have been keenly following this particular thread for the last few weeks.

I've posted my problems on a UK forum: http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/...rgggh-t127624/ where there's lots of us experiencing similar issues, and not many of us have found a definite fix.

Basically, I've got the fluctuating revs and a 2-3 second delay in selecting reverse. I've tried almost everything (new trans oil, cleaning sensors etc) and am getting really frustrated. But this thread is really making me think seriously about replacing the solenoids. My question is, do new solenoids somehow need coding to the car? I'm going to get a local independent garage to do the work, but I'm not sure what needs to be done, software-wise, once the new solenoids are in. Do I have to fiddle with the TCU via DIS (or at least INPA)?

I'm capable of resetting the gearbox adaptation values in INPA myself, but not sure about doing much more beyond that...

I've managed to source genuine original ZF parts from a store in China (of all places), and the total for the 7-piece solenoid set, plus mechatronic sealing sleeve, plus seal adapter, is US$444 delivered. Not bad, I think.

http://raymondtech.en.alibaba.com/pr...NOID_PACK.html

So, if I'm to go down this route of replacing the solenoids, what else needs to be done? ie. coding the TCU.

And are there any more parts that I should get replaced while the oil pan's out and the mechatronic unit's exposed?

Thanks in advance for your help! Hopefully this will be another success story! (please god!)...

Chris.
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  #532  
Old 03-06-2013, 05:17 AM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwi_chris View Post
Hi guys... I'm new to this forum and have been keenly following this particular thread for the last few weeks.

I've posted my problems on a UK forum: http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/...rgggh-t127624/ where there's lots of us experiencing similar issues, and not many of us have found a definite fix.

Basically, I've got the fluctuating revs and a 2-3 second delay in selecting reverse. I've tried almost everything (new trans oil, cleaning sensors etc) and am getting really frustrated. But this thread is really making me think seriously about replacing the solenoids. My question is, do new solenoids somehow need coding to the car? I'm going to get a local independent garage to do the work, but I'm not sure what needs to be done, software-wise, once the new solenoids are in. Do I have to fiddle with the TCU via DIS (or at least INPA)?

I'm capable of resetting the gearbox adaptation values in INPA myself, but not sure about doing much more beyond that...

I've managed to source genuine original ZF parts from a store in China (of all places), and the total for the 7-piece solenoid set, plus mechatronic sealing sleeve, plus seal adapter, is US$444 delivered. Not bad, I think.

http://raymondtech.en.alibaba.com/pr...NOID_PACK.html

So, if I'm to go down this route of replacing the solenoids, what else needs to be done? ie. coding the TCU.

And are there any more parts that I should get replaced while the oil pan's out and the mechatronic unit's exposed?

Thanks in advance for your help! Hopefully this will be another success story! (please god!)...

Chris.
New solenoids do not need to be coded to the car. They're just basically dummy solenoids that do what they are told--there's no feedback or serial numbers or anything like that for the car to know they were changed.

No coding required.

Just reset adaptations.

Also change the seal that goes between the mechatronics and transmission oil pump. It looks like this:
. Very important that this seal doesn't leak

The mechatronics "Sleeve" could also stand to be replaced, but if it's not leaking then it's not necessarily needed at the same time.
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  #533  
Old 03-06-2013, 07:16 AM
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Vapiano Vapiano is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schpenxel View Post
New solenoids do not need to be coded to the car. They're just basically dummy solenoids that do what they are told--there's no feedback or serial numbers or anything like that for the car to know they were changed.

No coding required.

Just reset adaptations.

Also change the seal that goes between the mechatronics and transmission oil pump. It looks like this:
. Very important that this seal doesn't leak

The mechatronics "Sleeve" could also stand to be replaced, but if it's not leaking then it's not necessarily needed at the same time.
This basically sums it up; you may as well change the mech sealing sleeve while you are at it. It's a $17 part; it can't hurt.
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  #534  
Old 03-06-2013, 12:45 PM
kiwi_chris kiwi_chris is offline
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Yup, those are what I got quotes for:

ZF 6HP26 7-piece solenoid kit (1068 298 044) US$375
Mechatronic seal adapter (0501 219 952 01) US$15.50
Mechatronic sealing sleeve (0501 216 272 01) US$14.30

You all discuss this issue as a 'surge' at about 37mph under light load. But I also notice it (possibly more so) at 20-25mph under a medium-heavy load. For instance, going to the gym today after work, cruising slowly up a hill in Drive, with 5 adults in the car - the hunting/fluctuations were really noticeable, and bounced between 1000 and 1500rpm.

The problem seems to fade away once I get past about 1800rpm on level ground (perhaps 50mph?).

Think it's all related? Or could this be something associated with turbo vacuum hoses or pressure converters, or a clogged DPF, or faulty MAF sensor, or...

*sigh*
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  #535  
Old 03-06-2013, 01:18 PM
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Vapiano Vapiano is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwi_chris View Post
Yup, those are what I got quotes for:

ZF 6HP26 7-piece solenoid kit (1068 298 044) US$375
Mechatronic seal adapter (0501 219 952 01) US$15.50
Mechatronic sealing sleeve (0501 216 272 01) US$14.30

You all discuss this issue as a 'surge' at about 37mph under light load. But I also notice it (possibly more so) at 20-25mph under a medium-heavy load. For instance, going to the gym today after work, cruising slowly up a hill in Drive, with 5 adults in the car - the hunting/fluctuations were really noticeable, and bounced between 1000 and 1500rpm.

The problem seems to fade away once I get past about 1800rpm on level ground (perhaps 50mph?).

Think it's all related? Or could this be something associated with turbo vacuum hoses or pressure converters, or a clogged DPF, or faulty MAF sensor, or...

*sigh*

Yep, that's it! Swapping out the solenoids, mech adapter and sealing sleeves seems to fix these issues. Has your tranny ever gone into the limp mode as well?

Bellissima Italia! I got married in Positano three years ago! I will be heading back to Italia some time in August. I can't wait.
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  #536  
Old 03-06-2013, 01:42 PM
peachykonan peachykonan is offline
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Hi Vapiano,

Congratulations on your success !

I'm in a similar boat at the moment; I'm trying to resolve a transmission 2-1 downshift jerkiness + 4F8F fault code. My current mechanic recommends a full transmission replacement. Schpenxel made me aware of your thread and I want to try this route. I just need to verify parts before ordering.

I've been trying to msg klaus on thectsc but haven't gotten a response yet. Is there any chance you can help me get in touch?

I have a 2004 525i BMW Automatic and am trying to figure out which solenoid kit to buy from the below list. I'm having my mechanic hopefully obtain the trans serial #, main parts list, and trans type (as stamped on the trans housing) for me.

1. Solenoid Kit - 6HP19/26/32 M-shift
http://www.thectsc.com/index.php?p=p...d=37&parent=45

2. Solenoid Kit - 6H19/26/32 M-shift
http://www.thectsc.com/index.php?p=p...d=36&parent=45

3. Solenoid Kit - 6HP19/26/32 E-shift
http://www.thectsc.com/index.php?p=p...d=35&parent=45


I'm having trouble getting a response from Klaus, what's his normal response time? Can you help me get in touch?

Which of the above kit should I be using?

Thanks,
Mark
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  #537  
Old 03-06-2013, 01:46 PM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peachykonan View Post
Hi Vapiano,

Congratulations on your success !

I'm in a similar boat at the moment; I'm trying to resolve a transmission 2-1 downshift jerkiness + 4F8F fault code. My current mechanic recommends a full transmission replacement. Schpenxel made me aware of your thread and I want to try this route. I just need to verify parts before ordering.

I've been trying to msg klaus on thectsc but haven't gotten a response yet. Is there any chance you can help me get in touch?

I have a 2004 525i BMW Automatic and am trying to figure out which solenoid kit to buy from the below list. I'm having my mechanic hopefully obtain the trans serial #, main parts list, and trans type (as stamped on the trans housing) for me.

1. Solenoid Kit - 6HP19/26/32 M-shift
http://www.thectsc.com/index.php?p=p...d=37&parent=45

2. Solenoid Kit - 6H19/26/32 M-shift
http://www.thectsc.com/index.php?p=p...d=36&parent=45

3. Solenoid Kit - 6HP19/26/32 E-shift
http://www.thectsc.com/index.php?p=p...d=35&parent=45


I'm having trouble getting a response from Klaus, what's his normal response time? Can you help me get in touch?

Which of the above kit should I be using?

Thanks,
Mark
He usually responds in a day or two--He seems to do a lot of email all at once as opposed to a little all the time. How long has it been? may try sending him another email if it's been more than a day

edit: should be one of the first two, but will need serial # to confirm

Last edited by schpenxel; 03-06-2013 at 02:32 PM.
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  #538  
Old 03-06-2013, 01:56 PM
peachykonan peachykonan is offline
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Thanks Schpenxel - my mechanic promised me a photo of the serial / main parts list / etc stamped into the transmission housing tonight.
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  #539  
Old 03-06-2013, 02:30 PM
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Vapiano Vapiano is offline
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Mark,

You are going to need the parts list off the transmission; this will tell you which kit you need. Is your tranny going into the safe mode as well? The code I had was 4F85. I just sent Klaus an email about my results and informed him to ping you. Hopefully he will get back to you very shortly.

Order of Numbers on Driver's Side (LHD) of Tranny:

Serial No. - for identification.
STU No. - this one gives you the parts list.
Model No. - this one determines which tranny type you have.
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Last edited by Vapiano; 03-06-2013 at 02:48 PM.
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  #540  
Old 03-06-2013, 02:39 PM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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Originally Posted by peachykonan View Post
Thanks Schpenxel - my mechanic promised me a photo of the serial / main parts list / etc stamped into the transmission housing tonight.
Good deal!
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  #541  
Old 03-06-2013, 03:08 PM
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Vapiano Vapiano is offline
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Originally Posted by schpenxel View Post
Good deal!
Klaus may want to give you a finder's fee! I have a feeling there will be a mass exodus of solenoids flying off the shelves soon!
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  #542  
Old 03-06-2013, 03:10 PM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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Originally Posted by Vapiano View Post
Klaus may want to give you a finder's fee! I have a feeling there will be a mass exodus of solenoids flying off the shelves soon!
I almost said as much in my reply message but then forgot to, haha. Great minds think alike!
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  #543  
Old 03-06-2013, 03:37 PM
peachykonan peachykonan is offline
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2004 525i 2-1 downshift jerk 4F8F

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapiano View Post
Mark,

You are going to need the parts list off the transmission; this will tell you which kit you need. Is your tranny going into the safe mode as well? The code I had was 4F85. I just sent Klaus an email about my results and informed him to ping you. Hopefully he will get back to you very shortly.

Order of Numbers on Driver's Side (LHD) of Tranny:

Serial No. - for identification.
STU No. - this one gives you the parts list.
Model No. - this one determines which tranny type you have.
I received a tranny safe mode (gear symbol on dash) error 4F8F when I was downshifting from a higher gear down to the lowest while experimenting with the steptronic to see if I can avoid the 2-1 downshift jerkiness. I've stopped using steptronic and the error no longer occurs (OK for both DS and normal). However, this led to my mechanic recommending a full transmission replacement.

I am truly hoping that this works and that I picked the right mechanic. Since this is a requested service, there are no guarantees and that I need to provide the parts. He's not responsible if the parts are incorrect. I had to explicitly ask him for the transmission serial # and parts list number (which he is getting now). He did assure me that he has done this service before however.

I just msged BMW customer relations just in case after seeing Jay25's update in this thread.

Thank you Vapaino + Schpenxel, hoping to get the parts ordered tonight!

Last edited by peachykonan; 03-06-2013 at 03:51 PM.
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  #544  
Old 03-06-2013, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by peachykonan View Post
error 4F8F when I was downshifting from a higher gear down to the lowest while experimenting with the steptronic
This is very interesting; my car would go into the limp mode when downshifting in the auto mode during medium acceleration to force a downshift. The code rendered was 4F85. Your car does the same thing using the steptronic to downshift and your code was 4F8F. I have also noticed that the fluctuations in the DS mode happen between 50-60 mph; basically 20 mph higher than when in the auto mode. There is definitely a correlation between the issues that affects the tranny in both the auto and steptronic modes. It would be nice to know if it's the solenoids, sealing sleeve or mech adapter individually or a combination of each.

Edit: now that I think of it; my car only went into the limp mode during downshifts, never upshifts.

More important, it seems like you may have some doubts about the mechanic you have selected. If there is a strong sense of ambiguity; this maybe a red flag. In the end, they get paid regardless of the outcome. Especially in this situation, when you are going off of information you have found on a forum as opposed to the omnipotent one's recommendations to replace the tranny. I believe based on the report you posted, the solenoids, sealing sleeve and mech adapter will take care of these issues. I don't want to see you become a cash cow for this shop. I am not saying this will happen; but be vigilant.

I have a 5 yr/100,000 mile B2B warranty and the dealer wanted to replace the tranny, warranty company wanted proof it needed to be replaced. They couldn't provide absolute proof, so they said no to replacing it. I took it to a transmission shop, same thing. I took it to an indy shop and they couldn't read the code, so the warranty company wouldn't authorize the fix. After two months and $300 out of pocket for diagnostic fees; I got fed up and decided to do it myself based on schpenxel's video and results. I am so glad I took that plunge.
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Last edited by Vapiano; 03-06-2013 at 06:25 PM.
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  #545  
Old 03-06-2013, 07:02 PM
schpenxel schpenxel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapiano View Post

Edit: now that I think of it; my car only went into the limp mode during downshifts, never upshifts.

More important, it seems like you may have some doubts about the mechanic you have selected. If there is a strong sense of ambiguity; this maybe a red flag. In the end, they get paid regardless of the outcome. Especially in this situation, when you are going off of information you have found on a forum as opposed to the omnipotent one's recommendations to replace the tranny. I believe based on the report you posted, the solenoids, sealing sleeve and mech adapter will take care of these issues. I don't want to see you become a cash cow for this shop. I am not saying this will happen; but be vigilant.

I have a 5 yr/100,000 mile B2B warranty and the dealer wanted to replace the tranny, warranty company wanted proof it needed to be replaced. They couldn't provide absolute proof, so they said no to replacing it. I took it to a transmission shop, same thing. I took it to an indy shop and they couldn't read the code, so the warranty company wouldn't authorize the fix. After two months and $300 out of pocket for diagnostic fees; I got fed up and decided to do it myself based on schpenxel's video and results. I am so glad I took that plunge.
Mine did the same. Not sure about which code it threw, but I remember stepping on the gas as I was about to merge into traffic getting onto the interstate and that being when I saw the transmission warning for the first time. From then on I would see the transmission warning anytime it downshifted if I was accelerating hard through that particular gear change. I eventually figured out changing gears manually it was a particular gear change that caused issues. I can't remember if it was 6 to 5 or 5 to 4 anymore--I'm sure I posted it in the thread at some point though

Regardless, obviously I don't have that problem any more

Last edited by schpenxel; 03-06-2013 at 07:03 PM.
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  #546  
Old 03-06-2013, 07:10 PM
peachykonan peachykonan is offline
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Location: maryland
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 13
Mein Auto: 2004 525i
I think my current mechanic is the best I've had so far. I've been to three shops with ultra-high recommendations on yelp cross-referenced against bimmershops.com, but actual experience was not so good.

#1:Never actually checked transmission fluids or seals and just said mechatronics need to be replaced. After some back and forth, eventually told me that he has no experience with transmissions.
#2: Told me I had the latest transmission software and found a completely separate issue to charge me with.
#3: I contacted HealthServices but he warned me that he doesn't have a lot of experience with the tool used to reset adaptations. If this wasn't the case I'd use him ASAP.
#4: Tim found that the transmission software was dated E060-07-03-525 whereas the newest one is E060-12-11-500, a difference of 8 years. He's updated it for me and also checked fluids and detected a minor sealing sleeve leak (no drip). Sent me the autologic diagnostic report (upon my request). I sent him your solenoid replacement instructions and he replied that they don't differ from the official BMW steps for a trans flush except for 7 and 8 (which involves the solenoids).

If anyone knows of another reliable mechanic out in Los Angeles, please tell me! I've spent a lot just trying to find Tim.

Last edited by peachykonan; 03-06-2013 at 07:33 PM.
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  #547  
Old 03-07-2013, 03:09 AM
kiwi_chris kiwi_chris is offline
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Location: Genoa, Italy
 
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Mein Auto: 2004 BMW 535D
Is it not enough simply to give your VIN number to the supplier, so they can match the solenoids for you?

How much of a job is it to actually inspect the transmission casing for the stamped-on serial numbers?


Update: Actually, I think in my case (an '04 535D) it can only be the GA6HP26Z unit, according to realOEM ( http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.d...55&hg=24&fg=15 ), so no need for me to climb around under the car, thankfully...

Last edited by kiwi_chris; 03-07-2013 at 12:13 PM.
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  #548  
Old 03-07-2013, 12:02 PM
kiwi_chris kiwi_chris is offline
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Location: Genoa, Italy
 
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Mein Auto: 2004 BMW 535D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapiano View Post
Yep, that's it! Swapping out the solenoids, mech adapter and sealing sleeves seems to fix these issues. Has your tranny ever gone into the limp mode as well?

Bellissima Italia! I got married in Positano three years ago! I will be heading back to Italia some time in August. I can't wait.

Nope, fortunately never experienced limp mode. Hope it's not just a matter of time.

I'm based in Genova. It's nowhere near as exotic as places like Positano or Florence or Portofino or Milan etc... wouldn't really recommend a visit here! And boy are the city streets a tight fit for my big car!

Last edited by kiwi_chris; 03-07-2013 at 12:17 PM.
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  #549  
Old 03-07-2013, 12:47 PM
peachykonan peachykonan is offline
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Location: maryland
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 13
Mein Auto: 2004 525i
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwi_chris View Post
Is it not enough simply to give your VIN number to the supplier, so they can match the solenoids for you?

How much of a job is it to actually inspect the transmission casing for the stamped-on serial numbers?


Update: Actually, I think in my case (an '04 535D) it can only be the GA6HP26Z unit, according to realOEM ( http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.d...55&hg=24&fg=15 ), so no need for me to climb around under the car, thankfully...
Both Klaus and Tim got back to me, parts have been ordered and shipped. I'll update with results soon!
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  #550  
Old 03-08-2013, 06:21 AM
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Vapiano Vapiano is offline
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Location: Maryland
 
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Mein Auto: Dinan E60 M5 & 545i
Quote:
Originally Posted by peachykonan View Post
Both Klaus and Tim got back to me, parts have been ordered and shipped. I'll update with results soon!
Sweet! Looking forward to the follow up. I will be changing the tranny pan and oil today. I wanted to make sure that everything went well before moving forward. I might as well change the diff fluid while I am at it.
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