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Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 5 Series > E39 (1997 - 2003)

E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 10-27-2009, 03:57 PM
ccoopere39 ccoopere39 is offline
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Unhappy Why won't my Hartge 20's fit my e39

OK, so I'm a newbe so please don't blast me if this is an obvious answer.

I bought a set of staggered 20" Hartge Nova 7's from my mechanic that came off either an M5 or a 540i (he didn't remember which) I had to order the hub rings and a cap from Hartge, got those in... read as much as I could about the subject and saw a discussion about having to possibly trim the fender liners in the rear or possibly roll the fenders, so I had prepared somewhat for those possibilities. I went to have them put on today and the rears clear fine, but the fronts are too tall. They hit a cast piece of the spring perch that comes out over the tire, even above the stock tire (only about 3/4" clearance above it on stock) Tried both 1/4" and 1/2" spacers with no luck.

Can I buy a different spring perch? or would new shocks have a different style perch that wouldn't have that odd little extra peice. I really don't have the cash to do an expensive suspension upgrade nor do I really need or want it. I just wanted some nice looking wheels, but this has turned into a nightmare. Please tell me there is a simple fix no one has been insightful enough to show me thus far... preferably one that doesn't involve a lot more cash

Here are a couple pics of the perch and the wheels specs (I think). I don't know how well the pics show the perch, it's a pretty tight space.








Last edited by ccoopere39; 10-27-2009 at 04:55 PM. Reason: [B]Couple pics[/B]
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  #2  
Old 10-27-2009, 06:10 PM
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chiefwej chiefwej is offline
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Gee, maybe 20's aren't big enough. Try some 22's.

18's are perfect for an e39. 19's are marginal. Anything bigger is ridiculous and strictly ghetto.
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  #3  
Old 10-27-2009, 06:10 PM
rocae38 rocae38 is offline
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im new here and i have 20' the only problem with them is that they rub on the right side passenger side. i think i need an alignment maybe a new shock too but other than that they fit nice. you need a small tire. try 255/35/20 rear or 245/40/20 front thats what i have.
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  #4  
Old 10-27-2009, 06:22 PM
bowtie bowtie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefwej View Post
Gee, maybe 20's aren't big enough. Try some 22's.

18's are perfect for an e39. 19's are marginal. Anything bigger is ridiculous and strictly ghetto
.

hehehe...
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  #5  
Old 10-27-2009, 07:08 PM
ccoopere39 ccoopere39 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefwej View Post
Gee, maybe 20's aren't big enough. Try some 22's.

18's are perfect for an e39. 19's are marginal. Anything bigger is ridiculous and strictly ghetto.
Nice to see my wheel choice somehow effects and offends you. When I asked for advice, I was planning on something quite that subjective. Thanks for all your help. Anyone with ACTUAL knowledge care to chime in... it would be greatly appreciated.

Bowtie, I can believe someone in the great city of Ft Worth would side with someone from AZ over a fellow Texan ... Go have a Fuzzies Taco for me!

Last edited by ccoopere39; 10-27-2009 at 07:13 PM.
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  #6  
Old 10-27-2009, 07:10 PM
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chivas chivas is offline
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offsets are wong
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  #7  
Old 10-27-2009, 07:24 PM
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bmw_n00b13 bmw_n00b13 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefwej View Post
Gee, maybe 20's aren't big enough. Try some 22's.

18's are perfect for an e39. 19's are marginal. Anything bigger is ridiculous and strictly ghetto.
Absolutely correct analysis.

Go buy a Caddy if you want 20"+
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  #8  
Old 10-27-2009, 08:00 PM
My39 My39 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chivas View Post
offsets are wong


run a spacer, you should be fine. gl
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  #9  
Old 10-27-2009, 08:10 PM
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Wouldn't spacers cure your issue? Or moving to a reasonable sized tire?
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  #10  
Old 10-27-2009, 08:38 PM
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  #11  
Old 10-27-2009, 08:39 PM
My39 My39 is offline
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^^^ sorry, didn't read the entire post. running a lower size aspect ratio tire may or may not solve your problem. the problem you'll be facing is during suspension travel. the lower strut mount will likely rub against the tire.

generally after market suspension tends to be smaller than stock suspension (diameter wise), but you might still be faced with a similar situation. i'm surprised neither 1/4 or half inch spacer didn't push it out more giving you more clearance. maybe go 3/4?

Last edited by My39; 10-27-2009 at 10:02 PM.
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  #12  
Old 10-27-2009, 08:48 PM
Fiziks Fiziks is offline
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Should have done your homework on offsets. Go get a ruler, measure the distance you need to clear by in mm, buy the correct size spacer.
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  #13  
Old 10-27-2009, 09:00 PM
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standard e39 wheels need at least an offset of 20 to clear everything properly.. so as everyone has already said get some spacers, and if that doesnt clear enough smaller tyres.. (no idea what your running)
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  #14  
Old 10-27-2009, 09:26 PM
dvsgene dvsgene is offline
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You need to go to the Chevy forum and ask these guys to set you up properly:
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  #15  
Old 10-27-2009, 09:37 PM
ccoopere39 ccoopere39 is offline
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The offsets are what is recommended by Hartge for either the M5 or the 540i (obviously depending on what they came off of) but definitely an E39. These guys are BMW specialists, so you would think they would know. The tires are as low a profile as you can go 235 I think. Does anyone out there have an M with this type perch? Or for that matter does everyone else's 5's have perches that go over the tire like that? The issue is the height as much as it is the offset/width. I see folks running 20's on here all the time with no mods. I hate to even waiver in the face of all the critics, but 20's weren't my first choice. I found these and got a great deal for genuine Hartge (or what I thought was a good deal). I can't help but think this may be specific to the early E39's and most of us have enough miles to have changed the struts by now. BTW the pics are with my stock 15" wheels on with stock size tires. I don't think even an 18" would fit with low pros with the perch like that.

As far as spacers, if 1/2" won't do it, I'll forget it and move on. There is no point going that far beyond safety and performance to get a wheel to fit. These wheels are over $4 new, I'm sure I can find a buyer.

Does anyone actually know for a fact what the issue is? I guess more importantly, is this perch design something that everyone is dealing with... or is it specific to original parts/ or year?
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  #16  
Old 10-27-2009, 09:40 PM
ccoopere39 ccoopere39 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvsgene View Post
You need to go to the Chevy forum and ask these guys to set you up properly:
NYC huh? Don't you have some rust repair to go do?
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  #17  
Old 10-27-2009, 09:55 PM
dvsgene dvsgene is offline
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NYC huh? Don't you have some rust repair to go do?
Way to go newbie, I'm sure that's the way to get answers from the veterans on the forum
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  #18  
Old 10-27-2009, 09:59 PM
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LaCrosse540i6 LaCrosse540i6 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by My39 View Post
^^^ sorry, didn't read the entire post. running a lower size aspect ratio tire may or may not solve your problem. the problem you'll be facing is during suspension travel. the lower strut mount will likely rub against the tire.

generally after market suspension tends to be smaller than stock suspension (diameter wise), but you might still be faced with a similar situation. i surprised neither 1/4 or half inch spacer didn't push it out more giving you more clearance. maybe go 3/4?
There isn't any suspension travel below where the strut and the spring meet, so I don't get how the tire could rub. Unless you get a force strong enough to where you begin to flex...
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Old 10-27-2009, 10:05 PM
ccoopere39 ccoopere39 is offline
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Originally Posted by LaCrosse540i6 View Post
There isn't any suspension travel below where the strut and the spring meet, so I don't get how the tire could rub. Unless you get a force strong enough to where you begin to flex...
as stated in the post above the pics are with my 15's, not the 20's... I can't get the 20's on because of the perch in the photo. Shown with the stock 15's on.
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  #20  
Old 10-27-2009, 10:09 PM
ccoopere39 ccoopere39 is offline
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Way to go newbie, I'm sure that's the way to get answers from the veterans on the forum
So I'm supposed to get jokes, but it doesn't go both ways? C'mon

If that's the level of "help" your referring to, I can find funny photos on my own... thanks though.
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  #21  
Old 10-27-2009, 10:22 PM
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LaCrosse540i6 LaCrosse540i6 is offline
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Originally Posted by ccoopere39 View Post
as stated in the post above the pics are with my 15's, not the 20's... I can't get the 20's on because of the perch in the photo. Shown with the stock 15's on.

I get that, but the poster made it sound like if you could get them to fit the gap would be too small and it would rub when the suspension gets worked..
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  #22  
Old 10-27-2009, 10:40 PM
frhsfootball80 frhsfootball80 is offline
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what tire size are you running?

Last edited by frhsfootball80; 10-28-2009 at 10:18 AM.
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  #23  
Old 10-27-2009, 10:42 PM
My39 My39 is offline
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Originally Posted by LaCrosse540i6 View Post
There isn't any suspension travel below where the strut and the spring meet, so I don't get how the tire could rub. Unless you get a force strong enough to where you begin to flex...
there is always suspension travel while the car is moving, going over a bump, or making turn. as the springs compress and rebound, the wheel and tire assembly follow the same vertical path.

if the lower portion of his strut assembly is that close to the tire. it will likely rub once it compresses, and with his 20's, they will have a greater chance. i am not sure what to say, but wrong offset usually a common problem when wheel fitting, then tire sizes

run bigger spacer at the front, and they should clear. hub centric ones are good like previous poster replied. gl

Last edited by My39; 10-27-2009 at 10:46 PM.
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  #24  
Old 10-27-2009, 10:56 PM
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LaCrosse540i6 LaCrosse540i6 is offline
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The only travel that takes place is from the bottom of the spring, to the top of the spring. And the wheels are clearly not above the springs.. ALTHOUGH, there may be FLEX which could make the tire rub..I have run tires MMs from the strut and have never had problems, so if the tire would fit initially you should have no problems with the tire hitting the strut in the long run... However this does not help the OP because I doubt the wheels will fit at all without spacers or a rediculous tire size..
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:15 PM
My39 My39 is offline
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Originally Posted by LaCrosse540i6 View Post


The only travel that takes place is from the bottom of the spring, to the top of the spring. And the wheels are clearly not above the springs.. ALTHOUGH, there may be FLEX which could make the tire rub..I have run tires MMs from the strut and have never had problems, so if the tire would fit initially you should have no problems with the tire hitting the strut in the long run... However this does not help the OP because I doubt the wheels will fit at all without spacers or a rediculous tire size..
you are right. thanks for the clarification

don't know what i was thinking, but knuckle is fixed. only spring and shock have travel in terms of strut type suspension, which i believe our e39's have? SLA suspension, however works a little different i believe since it consist of two control arms and the spring sits between the upper and lower
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