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E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002)
E36/7 Z3 Roadster, Z3 coupe, Z3 M Roadster and Z3 M Coupe talk with our gurus here.

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  #1  
Old 11-18-2009, 01:49 AM
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aestheticstorm aestheticstorm is offline
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All about wheels and tires

I'm considering 19" wheels. 3 questions, most certainly n00b:

1) I don't like that the recommended tire size for 19" has a diameter slightly smaller than OEM. One size up on the sidewall of the tires I'm considering (245/40 front, 275/35 rear) is .8" larger in diameter... think that's ok for clearance?

2) Is it possible to hand-torque lugs (with a torque wrench of course) to the appropriate spec? How muscular must one be? Any tips on doing this by hand via jacking the car up one corner at a time? Regarding torque, is the spec universal for any wheel, or is it wheel-specific?

3) Will TPMS complain if I don't get TPMS on the new wheels? Any way to easily disable it?

Thanks!
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Last edited by aestheticstorm; 11-20-2009 at 11:27 AM.
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  #2  
Old 11-18-2009, 08:29 AM
Jermy1304 Jermy1304 is offline
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90nm is easy to get by hand...
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  #3  
Old 11-18-2009, 08:46 AM
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Terry J. Harris Terry J. Harris is offline
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  #4  
Old 11-18-2009, 09:16 AM
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jmillet jmillet is offline
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120 N*m +/- 10 N*m

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jermy1304 View Post
90nm is easy to get by hand...
Per TIS 36 10 1AZ wheel bolt torque for the E85/86 is 120N*m plus or minus 10N*m.
I torque mine to 85 ft/LB.
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  #5  
Old 11-18-2009, 12:14 PM
reidconti reidconti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aestheticstorm View Post
2) Is it possible to hand-torque lugs (with a torque wrench of course) to the appropriate spec? How muscular must one be? Any tips on doing this by hand via jacking the car up one corner at a time? Regarding torque, is the spec universal for any wheel, or is it wheel-specific?
No problem. Most torque wrenches are, what, 1.5 feet long? So 90lb-ft (for arguement's sake) only requires that you put 60lbs of force into that 1.5 foot lever. That's how everyone torques their lugs, as far as I know. Most people don't have torque sticks and air tools handy, and even given that, I think you're supposed to do final torquing by hand.

You won't really be able to torque your lugs while the wheel is in the air, the wheel just turns. You should tighten the lugs down somewhat snugly to make sure the wheel is seated, then lower that corner of the car and torque the lugs while the car is on the ground.
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  #6  
Old 11-18-2009, 01:35 PM
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jmillet jmillet is offline
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Visit your local Harbor Freight Tools store and pick up a 1/2 inch drive torque wrench:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...Itemnumber=239
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=46691
and some impact lug nut sockets:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=40035
and you're good to go.
Come by my place and we'll do a tire changing tutorial; you know where I live
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  #7  
Old 11-18-2009, 01:48 PM
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aestheticstorm aestheticstorm is offline
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Thanks Jim. Might need to make two trips to get all 4 wheels there
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  #8  
Old 11-18-2009, 02:11 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reidconti View Post
You won't really be able to torque your lugs while the wheel is in the air, the wheel just turns. You should tighten the lugs down somewhat snugly to make sure the wheel is seated, then lower that corner of the car and torque the lugs while the car is on the ground.
I use a pedal tool now.



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  #9  
Old 11-18-2009, 02:33 PM
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Rick Hunter Rick Hunter is offline
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Darn... You just missed out on a sale on torque wrenches at Sears.

Anyway, I'm running 245/35 F and 275/30 R tires on my MiRo M6 replicas. As far as torque specs, I'm tightening my bolts at ~88lb.ft. When tightening the front bolts, I first hand tighten, then drop the car just enough so that I can tighten the rest of the way (via torque wrench) without the wheels moving. Then I drop the car the rest of the way.

About 150 to 200 miles later, I'll re-torque them again for good measure.

Good Luck!
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Last edited by Rick Hunter; 11-18-2009 at 07:38 PM.
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  #10  
Old 11-18-2009, 06:13 PM
aba4430 aba4430 is offline
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Thumbs up Torque Wrench

20 to 150 ft-lbs (33.9 to 210.1 N.m) torque wrench for $40 less 10%, $36 at Sears last Sunday. Comes with a case too. I picked one up as the locking collar on my old Craftsman is cracked - still works though, but not sure of the calibraton, being it is 20 years old. Excellent deal though for a Made in USA wrench.

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...keyword=944595

Keep an eye out for it; should be on sale again.

With respect to the lug nuts, what I do is hold the wheel with one hand, and tighten the lugs as much as possible (front wheels can be rotated as well to gain additonal leverage); then lower the car and progressively tighten the lugs to the recommended setting. Then drive the car a few feet to roll and equalize the wheels. Thereafter torque the lugs again to the recommended setting. I think you are supposed to recheck the torque after @500 miles or so at least once thereafter.

Last edited by aba4430; 11-18-2009 at 06:22 PM. Reason: Add more information
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  #11  
Old 11-20-2009, 11:26 AM
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aestheticstorm aestheticstorm is offline
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Does anyone at all have a 245/40, 275/35 19" combination on their M? I'd really love to pull the trigger and order. My calculations say it will work but it would be nice to have piece of mind.
Jermy! Never thought I would say this, but I need your help -- what's the tire diameter of your dubs?

I'm also not planning on getting TPMS as I've had 1 flat in 14 years of driving, and check pressure regularly. I assume I'll need to put electrical tape over the indicator as it will light continuously?
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  #12  
Old 11-22-2009, 09:23 AM
totally_random totally_random is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aestheticstorm View Post
I'm also not planning on getting TPMS as I've had 1 flat in 14 years of driving, and check pressure regularly. I assume I'll need to put electrical tape over the indicator as it will light continuously?
Electrical tape?

One would think that if you can afford the car, new wheels and tires, and the associated maintenance and insurance that springing for TPMS would be within reach. The last thing you want is an upset BMW computer! But, no, I don't know what happens if you don't have TPMS in the wheels.
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  #13  
Old 11-22-2009, 09:55 AM
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Rick Hunter Rick Hunter is offline
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Is there a particular reason why you want to run 245/40 F & 275/35 R? You're looking at 2.9% F and 2.1% R error compared to OEM. That's going to throw off your speedo readings, and more importantly the F error % is getting close to the 3% limit.

Ideally, 245/35 F 265/35 R gets you to as close to OEM, and if you're doing 275/30 R then it's a little closer to OEM than 275/35 R.

Electrical tape works just fine. Keep in mind that TPMS sensors can be had for under $200 for the OEM BMW type. Part numbers are as follows:
36236779490 - Wheel Electronics Module
36146759741 - Valve Stem
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  #14  
Old 11-22-2009, 11:10 AM
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aestheticstorm aestheticstorm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Hunter View Post
Is there a particular reason why you want to run 245/40 F & 275/35 R? You're looking at 2.9% F and 2.1% R error compared to OEM. That's going to throw off your speedo readings, and more importantly the F error % is getting close to the 3% limit.

Ideally, 245/35 F 265/35 R gets you to as close to OEM, and if you're doing 275/30 R then it's a little closer to OEM than 275/35 R.

Electrical tape works just fine. Keep in mind that TPMS sensors can be had for under $200 for the OEM BMW type. Part numbers are as follows:
36236779490 - Wheel Electronics Module
36146759741 - Valve Stem
I just want the wheel-well to be filled out. I've been researching your photos... maybe 35/30 will be ok. I can barely remember what it looks like IRL since you never hang out with us anymore.

Where can TPMS be had for sub-$200? I might consider it for that price. TPMS, in my mind, is an unnecessary expense. Especially when it spazzes out erroneously more often than when I actually have a flat (never).
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  #15  
Old 11-22-2009, 11:40 AM
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jmillet jmillet is offline
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Wink TPMS=Nanny Device

Quote:
Originally Posted by totally_random View Post
Electrical tape?

One would think that if you can afford the car, new wheels and tires, and the associated maintenance and insurance that springing for TPMS would be within reach. The last thing you want is an upset BMW computer! But, no, I don't know what happens if you don't have TPMS in the wheels.
Running sans TPMS causes no harm other than the annoying warning light stays on all the time. The BMW computer could care less.
TPMS is just another nanny device mandated by DOT in a futile attempt to keep stupid people from doing stupid things like never checking their tire pressures. We should have learned a long time ago that good common sense can not be mandated or legislated.
The TPMS simply registers the actual pressure in the tire, not the recommended pressure. It's frightening how many people think the proper tire pressure is the number embossed on the tire sidewall.
As a HPDS instructor I see this frequently amoung novice students, and these are folks who care about their cars and want to be better drivers. Imagine what the general population is like; most don't have a clue as to proper tire pressure, don't know where to look to find it, and could care less as long as the tire isn't flat.
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Last edited by jmillet; 11-22-2009 at 02:40 PM.
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  #16  
Old 11-22-2009, 01:43 PM
KenTenn KenTenn is offline
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As a side note to the torque wrench issue, don't forget to set to back to zero after using each time (each day, not each wheel) as it degrades the accuracy if you don't release it IIRC.
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  #17  
Old 11-22-2009, 02:18 PM
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Ron Stygar Ron Stygar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmillet View Post
It's frightening how many people think the proper tire pressure is the number embossed on the tire sidewall.
Got that from BMWNA a few weeks ago.

A BMW dealer uses 34 PSI all around since it keeps the light from coming on.
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  #18  
Old 11-22-2009, 10:25 PM
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Rick Hunter Rick Hunter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aestheticstorm View Post
I just want the wheel-well to be filled out. I've been researching your photos... maybe 35/30 will be ok. I can barely remember what it looks like IRL since you never hang out with us anymore.

Where can TPMS be had for sub-$200? I might consider it for that price. TPMS, in my mind, is an unnecessary expense. Especially when it spazzes out erroneously more often than when I actually have a flat (never).
I stand corrected... the last time I checked was about 2 years ago. Prices have jumped about $100 since then.

Sorry... I promise to show up to more meets. I do have a family life, y'know.

If you really want to have your wheel wells filled, I'd suggest maybe a conservative lowering of car via springs?

And here... a pic for you to remember by (stock suspension):
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