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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
The E9X is the 4th evolution of the BMW 3 series including a highly tuned twin turbo 335i variant pushing out 300hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque. BMW continues to show that it sets the bar for true driving performance! -- View the E9X Wiki

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  #76  
Old 02-21-2010, 09:23 AM
therajman therajman is offline
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BMW Customer Relations

I called BMW customer relations again. I spoke to one of their supervisors and presented my case to them yet once again - and I told them that I would happily pay for an upgrade from the base stereo to a "better" one - in this case, the Logic7 (with the hope that the Logic7 would be more bearable) even AFTER having taken delivery of the car. All they would have to do would be to replace the head unit and replace/install the speakers. Or they can install a PRO unit and I would pay for it. I was told that BMW cannot do ANYTHING. He told me to go talk to my dealership. I asked him about upgrading the stereo on my own and I was warned that would void the iDrive/electronics warranty. I asked whether I could upgrade the speakers or add an Amp. Again, I am told that adding any "external" electronics will affect or void the warranty. So basically I am SOL.

The supervisor inincerely apologized for the inconvenience and that was it. They registered a complaint on my behalf and told me that it would be sent to BMW Corporate. From the research I have done, it appears that NOTHING will come out of it and that BMW does not care of its customers.

Perhaps I should have coughed up $70K for an M3.

As a contrast, about a year ago, we had an Porsche Cayenne S that we had taken delivery of in 2004. The radio developed problems several month AFTER the warranty ran out. The dealer wanted to charge us. I simply called Porsche customer relations and they replaced the entire unit at NO charge. They stepped forward and took responsibility and they treated us properly and with due respect. That is what I call customer service!

I want to make 1 additional point. The US is one of the largest markets for BMW. Despite the economy, it is imperative that BMW keep its customer base happy and satisfied even if that means taking a hit to their bottom line. Lets face it, by de-contenting the cars, they are saving, a few hundred dollars per car. Hey, one lost sale worth $50K pays for the "content" in 50 cars. At this rate, they stand to lose more than 1 sale. So, for every lost sale, they could "leave" the removed equipment in 50 cars!!!

I know this is a very simplistic viewpoint and that there are many more financial factors involved but why take the risk of aggravating customers in one of your most important markets?
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  #77  
Old 02-21-2010, 09:33 AM
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To be fair, BMW has also been known to okay post-warranty repairs, for goodwill.

But to take a car and completely replace the stereo from a working as-spec'ed system? Not going to happen. Porsche wouldn't do that either.
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  #78  
Old 02-21-2010, 09:38 AM
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Upgrade your speakers---to high-end, high-efficiency speakers. This will make the most of the amp you have.
If that's not good enough, then see what options the base head-unit has for pre-amp outputs. If it has them, go to town on adding (back in) a quality amp(s) and those extra missing speakers, and maybe a small subwoofer.


Oh, and when you're done? If you did a good job, the system will sound even better than a Logic 7.
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  #79  
Old 02-21-2010, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoltrix View Post
Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo..... ....

Not the cooler!!!!!!!!

Never used in almost 4 yr!!!!!

Quote:
I agree that when you see the little things starting to come out of a car we love, it really hurts.
+1!
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  #80  
Old 02-21-2010, 11:41 AM
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Dude,
It is a recession. I can think of alot of things we took for granted just a few years ago that we no longer have today (Like meals on Airplanes and financial aide for college freshmans, even a mega state like New York State can't afford to give us back our tax refunds on time). It's a sad state of the world right now!


Still 50k+ spent on a 2010 335i and you get less standard in-car features that a 1993 318i gave you is a joke!

I just saw a loaded (all options/pkgs except nav and cold) 2009 335i in mint condition with only 3k miles on the clock sell on ebay for $33,000. and according to what you got this car had more features in it.

For now I'm sticking with my E46 until the new fiver comes out in 2011. Hopefully the recession will be over and BMW can start putting standard luxury and BETTER built quality back into these cars


Quote:
Originally Posted by therajman View Post
I Just took delivery of my 2010 335i 2 days ago. This car was ordered in mid-December 2009. The options I got are Premium package, Sport package, Cold Weather package & Navigation System. The car set me back just about $50K.

My previous car with a 2007 335i with the same config but was missing the Nav.

The difference in the 2 cars is significant. The 2007 was a MUCH better car. In terms of quality, solidity and features. I just cannot get over the fact that the new car seems to be cheaper in build.

I am totally appalled at the features that have been yanked!!!

Seatback pockets – gone - where to store stuff in the back - there is NO storage anywhere

Ashtray – gone - I don't smoke but where to store change?

Ashtray power outlet – moved to a very inconvenient location under the glove box!

Rechargeable flashlight – gone!

Ability to use an adapter in the flashlight receptacle to get a 2 power outlets – gone!

Cargo net hooks in the trunk – gone - I regularly used the cargo net, now what do I do with my existing cargo net? Maybe I will send it to BMW as a gift!

Wiper Arms - cheap, flimsy looking spindly arms that do not do a BMW justice - the ones on the 2007 were solid! These ones are pretty sad

Seatbelt height adjusters – gone! How does a short/tall driver adjust the seatbelt position?

Headrests – modified to the point that they don't sit flush with the seat, rather remain at 1st notch. And they don't move forward and backward any more!

Seats - seem to be less padding and generally more uncomfortable!

Sound System - downgraded to a pathetic system that sounds like it is in a cardboard box. Sound clips at high volume. Weak bass. No oomph. Cannot hear the radio at max volume when sunroof and windows are open. The 2007 had the 10-speaker Professional system. This car has what appears to be a 4 (or 6?) speaker system. BMW has to be kidding. How can they justify this pathetic stereo in a $50K car? Of course I was not aware of the downgrade when I ordered the 2010. My sales rep was not either. I found out when I picked up the car and was driving home. Had I known when I placed the order, at least I would have opted for the upgraded sound system. I drive a lot and I like my music. My wife's Cayenne S has a stellar Bose system. The 335i system is like a boom box next to it. Disgusting that BMW can do this and get away with it. It is actually deceitful!

Handling - the 2010 335i does not feel as secure and as confident as the 2007. It seems lighter somehow. Feels more skittish and less poised on curves but that could be because the tires are still new and not broken into. I will report more on the handling after a few thousand miles.

I called customer relations. They promptly threw the dealership/my sales assassociate under the bus stating that these were "sales" issue and not "production or design" issues and they had the audacity to tell me that I should have thoroughly examined a 2010 showroom floor model BEFORE placing my order. They just gave me a bunch of baloney about "we reserve the right to make whatever feature changes we see fit....yada yada yada!" It is obvious that BMW does not really care about customer service/relationship otherwise they would NEVER have done this.

I wish I could give the car back. I cannot replace the stereo without voiding the warranty on the entire iDrive system. I know that BMW wont do anything. They simply don't care. So I am stuck with these missing features. That makes me feel cheated.

Am I the only one that has noticed these items? Is there anyone else out there that has comments on this?
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Last edited by delmarco; 02-21-2010 at 11:51 AM.
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  #81  
Old 02-21-2010, 11:53 AM
steveo90290 steveo90290 is offline
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Two words come to mind: BUYER BEWARE.

Bummer these things slipped through the cracks on you. Was it the same salesman you had when you leased your '07? If it was then I would agree you have a little beef with him. If he was new to selling BMWs then he may not even know himself that there were changes.

The whole euro vs. dollar argument holds water, as for most people the 3 series is an entry level BMW. If the base price creeps above the perception of affordability it knocks BMW out of range for that buyer. BMW has always been a car that has many options available, which in turn drives up the price above base.

At least it is a lease, think how pissed you would be if you bought it.

SteveO

Last edited by steveo90290; 02-21-2010 at 12:00 PM.
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  #82  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo90290 View Post
Two words come to mind: BUYER BEWARE.

Bummer these things slipped through the cracks on you. Was it the same salesman you had when you leased your '07? If it was then I would agree you have a little beef with him. If he was new to selling BMWs then he may not even know himself that there were changes.

The whole euro vs. dollar argument holds water, as for most people the 3 series is an entry level BMW. If the base price creeps above the perception of affordability it knocks BMW out of range for that buyer. BMW has always been a car that has many options available, which in turn drives up the price above sticker.

At least it is a lease, think how pissed you would be if you bought it.

SteveO
Poor BMW USA Customer Service and a complete lack of salesman knowledge and social skills is the reason there is a 2010 C Class in my sig next to my 2001 330i.

We went to a few BMW Dealerships to get a new 3 series outfitted for the missus and poor service and horrible pricing of packages and options (one dealer invoiced us twice for Sirius option and Assist) is what drove us away from BMW New Car Sales and made her decide to get a C Class.

Now I'm very thorough when it comes to spending $40 to $50k on a car and, like what happened to the OP, I can see how I would have ordered a 2010 335i and totally not be told by the salesman that the car would come with less in it. After my experience with BMW New car Sales I KNOW FOR A FACT that the OP mistfortune has NOTHING to do with his lack of homework (especially if he had ordered the car in 2009-before any of us had driven a 2010 model to say what differences it would have)


When you buy a new car, and I can tell many of you may not have done that yet in your lives, the car on the showroom floor AND the car you test drive is NOT the actual car you order and pay for.

Chances are the dealer may tell you "oh this is just the 2009 model, but your 2010 model will be newer and better".

and your response would be "sh!t let me hurry up and order that 2010 one instead"

Same EXACT thing happened when we bought the 2010 C Class last year November-2009. We ordered the specific configuration she wanted, paid for it, even transferred the plates and registration over to the new car and THEN only after all that about a week or two later were we able to see the actual car at pick up.

That is usually how it works and at that time when you get the car the BMW New car Sales is done with you and any complaints you have regarding what you got will get passed on to other departments.

and that is how they RAPE you my friends!
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  #83  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:10 PM
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Like every Brand is doing, cutting cost is all about Efficient Dynamics, i do know bmw works very hard to make the vehicles better the upgraded nav is much easier to learn.....................Did you know in Japan there is no Lexus Badge just the Toyota Badge .........lol There is more Good than Bad.............with BMW
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  #84  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:18 PM
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There are lots on mods on these boards

If you add and amp and speakers it should only effect the warranty on that part the car.
Its kind of lame that they won't do after the sales upgrades, I am sure a lot of people would want them. I am looking at that mobridge da-2000 as a possible way to to upgrade the stereo. There are a lot of examples , on the bmw boards, of people doing after market upgrades with speakers and amps using the speaker outs of the old system to drive a new amp and speakers which doesn't mess with the stock electronics that much .
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  #85  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:23 PM
steveo90290 steveo90290 is offline
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I don't know about anyone else, but I have many new car purchases under my belt. Only once did I not bring home the car I test drove. That was my wife's '07 328xi wagon, as the dealer didn't have an xi in stock.

As far a being tempted to buy a new model year sight unseen.... probably not with out examining the options, and asking a lot of questions. If the car that arrived was not as promised I would not take delivery.

I'm sure you all know what they say about the word "assume."
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  #86  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:34 PM
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Caveat emptor, is Latin for "Let the buyer beware".[1] Generally, caveat emptor is the property law doctrine that controls the sale of real property after the date of closing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caveat_emptor

Every month 1,000's of people take delivery of BMW's and are quite happy with the base audio equipment.

This isn't a conspiracy of BMW NA to screw you......................YOU didn't do your homework to make sure YOU ordered the equipment that was important to YOU

We are currently trying to decide to buy our X3 at lease end next month, or a new 328xi or 335i, so we arranged to borrow a 335i for the weekend to get to know the car.

As for compliants about BMW removing little BS items, you might also want to know that the 328 now comes with a $0 cost "Value Package" that includes leather, heated seats & iPod connection. While this isn't a direct issue with your 335 I think it is a pretty good example of the efforts BMW is going thru to keep their cars affordable with our crappy dollar.
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  #87  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ish View Post
Caveat emptor, pronounced /***716;kæ.vi***720;.***712;***593;***720;t ***716;***603;mp.t***594;r/, is Latin for "Let the buyer beware".[1] Generally, caveat emptor is the property law doctrine that controls the sale of real property after the date of closing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caveat_emptor

Every month 1,000's of people take delivery of BMW's and are quite happy with the base audio equipment.

This isn't a conspiracy of BMW NA to screw you......................YOU didn't do your homework to make sure YOU ordered the equipment that was important to YOU
Caveat emptor................................. Nice
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo90290 View Post
I don't know about anyone else, but I have many new car purchases under my belt. Only once did I not bring home the car I test drove. That was my wife's '07 328xi wagon, as the dealer didn't have an xi in stock.

As far a being tempted to buy a new model year sight unseen.... probably not with out examining the options, and asking a lot of questions. If the car that arrived was not as promised I would not take delivery.

I'm sure you all know what they say about the word "assume."
Yeah it used to be like that but BECAUSE of the recession Mercedes Benz and other luxury dealerships can't afford to just have new cars hanging out on a USA Dealer's lot since it cost money to import cars that may not sell on this side of the pond when they should in a timely fashion to turn a good profit.

Our Benz dealer told us that. He said we could purchase one of the 2010 tester cars (which was usually already dirty and already had like 3k miles on the clock) or choose from 1 of the 20 cars they had in stock (which were ALL black on black cars with either no options or every option).

For the specs she wanted we had to sit down and package it, then order it and lucky enough there was one on a boat heading over from Germany that would've been at the dealership inside a week. So we put a down deposit on it, and transferred the tags/etc... and waited for it to come it.

That is how they do it nowadays. We were lucky to get a week, the norm is two weeks to two months. Her father just ordered his second s55 AMG sports Benz over the holidays to replace his 2008 s55 AMG and has been waiting for it to come of the boat since mid December.

I think before like in 2008 / early 2009 you could've walked into any BMW/Benz dealership and look at rows upon rows of brand new cars on the back lot and pick the exact one you want.

Now they cannot afford to keep inventory like that sitting around. So you most likely gotta tell them what you want, pay first, wait and pick up when it comes of the boat.
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  #89  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:52 PM
steveo90290 steveo90290 is offline
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May be in Kentucky, as for California not true. California is 25% of BMW's market alone, there are plenty of cars here to drive home. Of course you might have to wait on a 760.
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  #90  
Old 02-21-2010, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by 007M3 View Post
Caveat emptor................................. Nice


LMAO!!!! Not nice for all those Floridians that watch they property value and their homes literally and physically melt away because of the cheap toxic Chinese Drywall that was switched in for the standard drywall during the housing rush construction boom.

http://www.nachi.org/chinese-drywall.htm


before


after
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  #91  
Old 02-21-2010, 01:00 PM
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LMAO!!!! Not nice for all those Floridians that watch they property value and their homes literally and physically melt away because of the cheap toxic Chinese Drywall that was switched in for the standard drywall during the housing rush construction boom.


before


after
That sucks about florida ........I was referring to the Term itself.................I am also working with two Clients that want B7's Alpina's, 2 and half Months wait for those babies.......150Gs each but well worth the wait.
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:20 PM
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To the OP, I feel your pain. I'm preparing to order a 2011 335D, and I've got an issue that is similar to your problem. The new upgrade stereo for 2011 is a "Harmon Kardon Surround Sound" system. So what the heck is that? Some say it's the Logic7 by a new name (HK supposedly makes both). Who knows? I've posted up a thread in the "Ask a Dealer" section to see if someone with ties to BMW can tell us (me) exactly what this system is - number of speakers, etc.. I can't find anything on the BMW site that definitively answers this question - to be fair, it might be too soon, since the 2011's have just been announced. Nonetheless, this is similar to what you've described. It will interesting to see what we learn.
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:31 PM
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To the OP, I feel your pain. I'm preparing to order a 2011 335D, and I've got an issue that is similar to your problem. The new upgrade stereo for 2011 is a "Harmon Kardon Surround Sound" system. So what the heck is that? Some say it's the Logic7 by a new name (HK supposedly makes both). Who knows? I've posted up a thread in the "Ask a Dealer" section to see if someone with ties to BMW can tell us (me) exactly what this system is - number of speakers, etc.. I can't find anything on the BMW site that definitively answers this question - to be fair, it might be too soon, since the 2011's have just been announced. Nonetheless, this is similar to what you've described. It will interesting to see what we learn.

To your Benefit your doing a proper due diligence ...........good for you
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph View Post
To the OP, I feel your pain. I'm preparing to order a 2011 335D, and I've got an issue that is similar to your problem. The new upgrade stereo for 2011 is a "Harmon Kardon Surround Sound" system. So what the heck is that? Some say it's the Logic7 by a new name (HK supposedly makes both). Who knows? I've posted up a thread in the "Ask a Dealer" section to see if someone with ties to BMW can tell us (me) exactly what this system is - number of speakers, etc.. I can't find anything on the BMW site that definitively answers this question - to be fair, it might be too soon, since the 2011's have just been announced. Nonetheless, this is similar to what you've described. It will interesting to see what we learn.
lol.

Man they are really stripping it down.

HK!?

On my 2001 330i HK Premium Sound was a free option I wonder how much BMW will charge for this on a 2011 3 series?
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Old 02-21-2010, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ish View Post
Caveat emptor, pronounced /***716;kæ.vi***720;.***712;***593;***720;t ***716;***603;mp.t***594;r/, is Latin for "Let the buyer beware".[1] Generally, caveat emptor is the property law doctrine that controls the sale of real property after the date of closing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caveat_emptor

Every month 1,000's of people take delivery of BMW's and are quite happy with the base audio equipment.

This isn't a conspiracy of BMW NA to screw you......................YOU didn't do your homework to make sure YOU ordered the equipment that was important to YOU
At the very least a quick read through the online owners manual would quickly acquaint a prospective owner with changes. I can't imagine buy a $50K automobile and not reading everything I could about the car.
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Old 02-21-2010, 02:34 PM
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To the OP: If the sound issue bothers you so much and you're ready to pay quit obssessing about BMW's procedures and iDrive warranty and have an aftermarket system and bass installed. How often does iDrive break down? Come on. I have to agree with other members that them refusing of changing your car stereo because of what happened is not exactly bad customer service. One of the first thing I noticed when 2010 MY info was posted was the downgrade of the sound system. You just have to stay informed and do research. I sincerely doubt that build quality, seat padding, drive feel etc has deteriorated. It's a brand new car with brand new tires and unrboken engine. Had you been pleasantly surprised by the stereo (let's they had actually upgraded it) or the addition of features (if they had added instead of deleted) you may have had a different opinion about the overall car quality. Instead of poisoning your car experience with this attitude, get a nice stereo, screw the iDrive warranty (I bet you if something does go wrong your dealer would still fix it if it is unrelated to sound) and enjoy your new car. Or sell the freakin Bimmer and buy a Cayman - if that is what makes you happy that is what you should do.
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Old 02-21-2010, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ish View Post
Caveat emptor, pronounced /***716;kæ.vi***720;.***712;***593;***720;t ***716;***603;mp.t***594;r/, is Latin for "Let the buyer beware
.


That's easy for you to say.

But look what happened when I tried it.



CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 02-21-2010 at 02:51 PM.
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  #98  
Old 02-21-2010, 02:55 PM
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007M3 007M3 is offline
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Location: In a Dimension of Speed, Power and Induction
 
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Mein Auto: XJ8 But an M3 Soon
Mug

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post


That's easy for you to say.

But look what happened when I tried it.





CA
That is one UGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGLYYYYYYYYYYYY Mug........lol
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  #99  
Old 02-21-2010, 03:39 PM
jmsent jmsent is offline
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Location: Chicago
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
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Mein Auto: 07 335i Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarco View Post
lol.

Man they are really stripping it down.

HK!?

On my 2001 330i HK Premium Sound was a free option I wonder how much BMW will charge for this on a 2011 3 series?
Free? no. It was part of the premium package and it was lousy. The L7 is nothing like the old HK from the E46. It is actually a pretty good audio system. It also used to come standard on the 335i, but as others have explained the dollar has lost value and BMW has to adjust.
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  #100  
Old 02-21-2010, 04:37 PM
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captainaudio captainaudio is offline
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Location: Upper East Side Manhattan - Boca Raton Florida
 
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Posts: 14,438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 007M3 View Post
That is one UGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGLYYYYYYYYYYYY Mug........lol
Before I tried to pronounce " /***716;kæ.vi***720;.***712;***593;***720;t ***716;***603;mp.t***594;r/,"

I looked like this.

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