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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
The E9X is the 4th evolution of the BMW 3 series including a highly tuned twin turbo 335i variant pushing out 300hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque. BMW continues to show that it sets the bar for true driving performance! -- View the E9X Wiki

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  #1  
Old 05-19-2010, 08:16 PM
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captainaudio captainaudio is offline
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The Straw that Broke The Captain's Back

Yesterday I was on the Sawmill River Parkway heading to Brewster when the tire pressure warning came on. There was no good place to pull over so I drove to the next exit. I pulled off the highway and onto a side street. The left rear tire was flat. I inflated it with the Conti Comfort kit and it would not hold air. I inflated it again but this time I injected the "Goop". The goop leaked out a large tear in the sidewall. I got back in the car and called BMW assist. BMW assist said they would tow me to BMW Manhattan. I called BMW Manhattan and told them I was on my way and asked if they could order me a tire. I could not get it through the thick head of the idiot at the other end of the phone that I had replaced the RFTs and needed a Pirelli P_Zero Nero M&S. He kept telling me that only the 7 Series came with Pirellis. I finally gave up and decided I would wait till I got there.

Two and a half hours (and 3 more calls) later the tow truck finally arrived. The driver was very pleasant. He put the car on his flatbed and I climbed in the cab for the ride to BMW Manhattan. On the way I told him about my experience trying to get BMW Manhattan to order a tire. He offered to take me to his garage which was on 10th Ave. and 26th Street. His garage said they would order me a tire. They were about $60 more than Tire Rack but I figured it would be the easy way out. I called them about 5 times today and they assured me that the tire had been ordered and was out for delivery. The last time I called was at 8:30 PM and they are still giving me the same story.

At his point I have totally lost patience with this car and can not wait to get rid of it. I realize buying it was a severe lapse in judgment. I can't believe that the morons who designed the thing made no provision for a spare tire. I feel like I am caught between a rock and a hard place. The car was undrivable with the RFTs and without them I have a situation like the one I am in now. Between the assinine ultra low profile tires and the poorly sorted out suspension it is inevitable that this will happen again. I have destroyed 4 tires and 1 rim in less than 3 years (and I only use the car on weekends to get in and out of the city). This is the last straw, I can hardly wait to get rid of this POS and it will not be missed. At this point I hate the car, I hate the dealer and I hate BMW. Driving this car is just not an enjoyable experience. I am in constant fear of hitting a pot hole and experiencing what I experienced yesterday. So much for "The Ultimate Driving Machine".

I really don't understand the whole low profile tire thing. The only justification I hear is that "they look cool". This strikes me as the same logic as someone who is limping along because their shoes hurt their feet and when you ask them why they don't change their shoes they say "because they look good". Shoes are for walking and tires are for driving. If they do not perform those basic functions well it doesn't matter how good they look.

There is no excuse for a car eating tires and wheels when driven on public roads. This is simply bad engineering.

You get what you pay for. I chintzed out when I bought this car. I will not make the same mistake again and will never purchase another BMW product. This is the only new car I ever purchased that I regretted buying.

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 05-19-2010 at 08:26 PM.
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:26 PM
Ryan M Ryan M is offline
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:29 PM
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I understand how you feel and you should definitely get a different car if you hate yours that much. Luckily I have never had problems with my car and its stock RFT tires (which, IMO, are perfectly acceptable even driving over the roads which look like they were just carpet-bombed by a squadron of B-52's), though I also kind of wish I would get rid of my car (but for totally different reasons not related to suspension or tires).
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:36 PM
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captainaudio captainaudio is offline
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Originally Posted by Ryan M View Post
I'm sure BMW will miss you.

They could not possibly miss me less than I will miss them.

BTW the way that is the same reaction I got a number of years ago when I vowed to never buy another Pontiac ( I had a Firebird 400 during the Musclecar era).

Guess what? They miss me (well probably not anymore). Pontiac went out of business by being arrogant, not paying attention to their market and losing one customer at a time. No company (BMW included) is immune to having the same thing happen.



CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 05-19-2010 at 08:52 PM.
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:39 PM
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captainaudio captainaudio is offline
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Originally Posted by AlexK View Post
I understand how you feel and you should definitely get a different car if you hate yours that much. Luckily I have never had problems with my car and its stock RFT tires (which, IMO, are perfectly acceptable even driving over the roads which look like they were just carpet-bombed by a squadron of B-52's), though I also kind of wish I would get rid of my car (but for totally different reasons not related to suspension or tires).
The XI does not have the sport suspension or 18" wheels so it may not be as much of an issue. I have definitely had a love/hate relationship with this car and I will not deny that it has been a very enjoyable car in many respects but I am at the point where the good aspects are not enough to compensate for the bad aspects.

The basic purpose of an automobile is to get you from one place to another. Styling, performance, comfort, fun, handling, etc. are nice but if the car not reliably fulfill its basic purpose those other aspects become meaningless.

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 05-19-2010 at 08:44 PM.
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:43 PM
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Kilgore Trout Kilgore Trout is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
They could not possibly miss me less than I will miss them.

BTW the way that is the same reaction I got a number of years ago when I vowed to never buy another Pontiac.



CA
BMW may not miss you, but most of us would miss having you post on this board.
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:50 PM
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BMW may not miss you, but most of us would miss having you post on this board.
Thanks KT. One of the best things about having this car is the friends I have made here (in cyberspace and in real life). Those relationships will endure.

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 05-19-2010 at 08:52 PM.
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:50 PM
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CA - you are in the right place. This is an Audi forum, so I am sure they have a model to suit your needs!

[sorry about the tire thing]

[oh, and you'll have to hand back your award too]
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
The XI does not have the sport suspension or 18" wheels so it may not be as much of an issue. I have definitely had a love/hate relationship with this car and I will not deny that it has been a very enjoyable car in many respects but I am at the point where the good aspects are not enough to compensate for the bad aspects.

The basic purpose of an automobile is to get you from one place to another. Styling, performance, comfort, fun, handling, etc. are nice but if the car not reliably fulfill its basic purpose those other aspects become meaningless.

CA
I agree. In the 1970's, "car trouble" was a valid excuse for being late for an important meeting.

Not anymore.
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:55 PM
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CA,

I am very sorry to hear how frustrated you are with everything. I know that for a long time you have expressed your dismay with the suspension issues.

Ironically, the very issue you describe is what keeps us from ever taking a long road trip, especially through West Texas with the RFT's. I completely agree with you that the lack of a provision for a spare in these cars is something that just doesn't make sense. It seems very strange to build a car that is seemingly designed for the open road and then make a short sighted provision for the inevitable road hazard.

BTW: I am in agreement with Kilgore. You would be sorely missed if you left this board.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
They could not possibly miss me less than I will miss them.

BTW the way that is the same reaction I got a number of years ago when I vowed to never buy another Pontiac ( I had a Firebird 400 during the Musclecar era).

Guess what? They miss me (well probably not anymore). Pontiac went out of business by being arrogant, not paying attention to their market and losing one customer at a time. No company (BMW included) is immune to having the same thing happen.



CA
Not true. General Motors is closing Pontiac because General Motors mismanaged their company. They did it so badly they now cannot afford to have a division that focuses on sporty cars.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:02 PM
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CA,

I am very sorry to hear how frustrated you are with everything. I know that for a long time you have expressed your dismay with the suspension issues.

Ironically, the very issue you describe is what keeps us from ever taking a long road trip, especially through West Texas with the RFT's. I completely agree with you that the lack of a provision for a spare in these cars is something that just doesn't make sense. It seems very strange to build a car that is seemingly designed for the open road and then make a short sighted provision for the inevitable road hazard.
You can't bag a tire and push it behind the drivers seat in the 'vert -- will it fit? There is ample room in the trunk in sedans, but it is kind of awkward to have to do it.

Any special reason you are worried with RFTs, Kat? I have a plug and patch in the trunk, and even when deflated the tires are rated for 50 miles apparently. It would have to be a pretty impressive road hazard to take out the sidewall in absence of other major damage to the vehicle.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:04 PM
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The XI does not have the sport suspension or 18" wheels so it may not be as much of an issue.
CA
No, it doesn't, and yes, I have a stock small tires. It still feels more "bumpy" than other cars, though - I just try not to drive too fast over known bumpy portions of the road and I usually manage to avoid the deep potholes. It's not possible to do this every time (for example it's very hard for me to spot any road defects during dark time of the day) but overall I manage to keep my ride comfortable enough. I did try to switch to non-RFT tires but I didn't like the overall result and decided to just stick to OEM tires.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:07 PM
anE934fun anE934fun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
Yesterday I was on the Sawmill River Parkway heading to Brewster when the tire pressure warning came on. There was no good place to pull over so I drove to the next exit. I pulled off the highway and onto a side street. The left rear tire was flat. I inflated it with the Conti Comfort kit and it would not hold air. I inflated it again but this time I injected the "Goop". The goop leaked out a large tear in the sidewall. I got back in the car and called BMW assist. BMW assist said they would tow me to BMW Manhattan. I called BMW Manhattan and told them I was on my way and asked if they could order me a tire. I could not get it through the thick head of the idiot at the other end of the phone that I had replaced the RFTs and needed a Pirelli P_Zero Nero M&S. He kept telling me that only the 7 Series came with Pirellis. I finally gave up and decided I would wait till I got there.

Two and a half hours (and 3 more calls) later the tow truck finally arrived. The driver was very pleasant. He put the car on his flatbed and I climbed in the cab for the ride to BMW Manhattan. On the way I told him about my experience trying to get BMW Manhattan to order a tire. He offered to take me to his garage which was on 10th Ave. and 26th Street. His garage said they would order me a tire. They were about $60 more than Tire Rack but I figured it would be the easy way out. I called them about 5 times today and they assured me that the tire had been ordered and was out for delivery. The last time I called was at 8:30 PM and they are still giving me the same story.

At his point I have totally lost patience with this car and can not wait to get rid of it. I realize buying it was a severe lapse in judgment. I can't believe that the morons who designed the thing made no provision for a spare tire. I feel like I am caught between a rock and a hard place. The car was undrivable with the RFTs and without them I have a situation like the one I am in now. Between the assinine ultra low profile tires and the poorly sorted out suspension it is inevitable that this will happen again. I have destroyed 4 tires and 1 rim in less than 3 years (and I only use the car on weekends to get in and out of the city). This is the last straw, I can hardly wait to get rid of this POS and it will not be missed. At this point I hate the car, I hate the dealer and I hate BMW. Driving this car is just not an enjoyable experience. I am in constant fear of hitting a pot hole and experiencing what I experienced yesterday. So much for "The Ultimate Driving Machine".

I really don't understand the whole low profile tire thing. The only justification I hear is that "they look cool". This strikes me as the same logic as someone who is limping along because their shoes hurt their feet and when you ask them why they don't change their shoes they say "because they look good". Shoes are for walking and tires are for driving. If they do not perform those basic functions well it doesn't matter how good they look.

There is no excuse for a car eating tires and wheels when driven on public roads. This is simply bad engineering.

You get what you pay for. I chintzed out when I bought this car. I will not make the same mistake again and will never purchase another BMW product. This is the only new car I ever purchased that I regretted buying.

CA
It never ceases to amaze me how many women intentionally mangle their feet so that they can wear shoes that 'look good'....

Back on topic; what alternative car are you going to replace the BMW with? Porch? Aston Martian? Or???? They all seem enamored with 18+ inch wheels and tires, which means you will likely have similar experiences to what you are having with your E93. Personally, I went with HRE C70 wheels in 17 inch with non-RFT Michelin PS2s. When I owned the E93, I rolled the dice on flats, but managed to dodge that particular bullet. With the d, I have a 17x8 inch full size wheel (O.Z. HLTs) with a non-RFT Michelin Pilot PS2 in 225/45-17 as my spare. Yes, I lose trunk space, but I have peace of mind.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by ///M-ratedE90 View Post
CA - you are in the right place. This is an Audi forum, so I am sure they have a model to suit your needs!

[sorry about the tire thing]

[oh, and you'll have to hand back your award too]
I live in NYC. When I want the opinion of a Taxi Driver I can stand right in front of my building and hail one.

But seriously XR (or whoever the hell you are this week) if I lived where you do it would probably be less of an issue but face it you are in the same boat I am. Sport suspension, low profile tires and no spare. If you blow out a tire you are as screwed as I was yesterday.

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 05-19-2010 at 09:11 PM.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:15 PM
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tturedraider tturedraider is offline
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CA, I'm sure you're a pretty nice guy, but it sounds to me like your blaming everyone but yourself for your decision to buy a car that doesn't suit you.

BMW is doing anything less than they've always done and, in fact, their cars only get better and better. BMW has been using the same types of wheels and tires for at least a decade. You had the opportunity to test drive the car and decide whether to buy it. If the streets are so bad in NYC you knew that going it.

It was entirely your personal choice to replace the RFTs and go with inadequate flat tire protection. You could have made the wise decision to buy an actual spare tire and jack set that many who have ditched their RFTs. CA, I think you have to bear the responsibility in which you found yourself. And it sounds an awful lot like you're trying to blame BMW because the indy shop you chose to let order a tire for you has fallen down on the job.

And I agree with ///M-ratedE90 that you need to give back your award.

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post

The basic purpose of an automobile is to get you from one place to another. Styling, performance, comfort, fun, handling, etc. are nice but if the car not reliably fulfill its basic purpose those other aspects become meaningless.

CA
If what you wanted was an automobile to get you from point A to point B, you should have bought a Toyota Solara.

Don't go buy a Corvette next. You'll have the same problems - RFTs and a car design without accommodation for a spare tire. I think you'll find the same with most Porsches.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:17 PM
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captainaudio captainaudio is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neapolitan View Post
You can't bag a tire and push it behind the drivers seat in the 'vert -- will it fit? There is ample room in the trunk in sedans, but it is kind of awkward to have to do it.

Any special reason you are worried with RFTs, Kat? I have a plug and patch in the trunk, and even when deflated the tires are rated for 50 miles apparently. It would have to be a pretty impressive road hazard to take out the sidewall in absence of other major damage to the vehicle.
Obviously RFTs would have put me in a completely different situation yesterday. In principal RFTs are a great idea. In reality they have a lot of issuesl

CA
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:29 PM
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I felt about the same as you last weekend. I also have non-RFTs and I hit a pothole last Friday. The next day I have a giant bulge in my $300 tire with <5K miles on it. Fortunately the warranty covered the replacement but it was still a big hastle and I don't have spare yet either. When I asked the guys at discount tire they said that they couldn't mount the donut that Tischer sells. How many places will I have to call to find someone who can?

I agree with you...BMW has left us with no GOOD solution by not having even a place to put a spare.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:31 PM
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Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neapolitan View Post
You can't bag a tire and push it behind the drivers seat in the 'vert -- will it fit? There is ample room in the trunk in sedans, but it is kind of awkward to have to do it.

Any special reason you are worried with RFTs, Kat? I have a plug and patch in the trunk, and even when deflated the tires are rated for 50 miles apparently. It would have to be a pretty impressive road hazard to take out the sidewall in absence of other major damage to the vehicle.
Here is the BF's logic (Mind you, he is the practical engineer - I am the optimistic one).
"West Texas is huge with just little wide spots in the road that masquerade as towns. Sometimes these little burgs are nearly a hundred miles apart. Okay, the teen-einsy ones aren't but from San Antonio west the next appreciable sized town that would have a tire store that had performance RFT's in stock could literally be 250 miles down the road. Now, imagine hitting the "x" road hazard at 8 am on Sunday morning and after finally getting roadside assistance to haul you into wherever no-name town only to find out that the soonest they can get another RFT is Tuesday afternoon."

Mind you, this is a "worst case scenario", but it exemplifies why RFT's are practical for city driving but not so much for less densely populated road trips. As far as bagging a tire and stashing it behind the driver seat in the 'vert? I'm 5'5" and to put my Kate Spade tote on the floor board behind the driver's seat I have to move the seat forward. BF is 6'2". Nothing fits behind the driver's seat when he is behind the wheel.

Sorry for the long answer to the question.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:34 PM
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tturedraider tturedraider is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gEEkChris View Post
I felt about the same as you last weekend. I also have non-RFTs and I hit a pothole last Friday. The next day I have a giant bulge in my $300 tire with <5K miles on it. Fortunately the warranty covered the replacement but it was still a big hastle and I don't have spare yet either. When I asked the guys at discount tire they said that they couldn't mount the donut that Tischer sells. How many places will I have to call to find someone who can?

I agree with you...BMW has left us with no GOOD solution by not having even a place to put a spare.
Couldn't mount the donut tire on the donut rim? I'd love to hear their explanation for that.


I'm not aware of any car manufacturer that designs their RFT designed cars with provision for a spare.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:35 PM
anE934fun anE934fun is offline
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Originally Posted by Nordic_Kat View Post
Here is the BF's logic (Mind you, he is the practical engineer - I am the optimistic one).
"West Texas is huge with just little wide spots in the road that masquerade as towns. Sometimes these little burgs are nearly a hundred miles apart. Okay, the teen-einsy ones aren't but from San Antonio west the next appreciable sized town that would have a tire store that had performance RFT's in stock could literally be 250 miles down the road. Now, imagine hitting the "x" road hazard at 8 am on Sunday morning and after finally getting roadside assistance to haul you into wherever no-name town only to find out that the soonest they can get another RFT is Tuesday afternoon."

Mind you, this is a "worst case scenario", but it exemplifies why RFT's are practical for city driving but not so much for less densely populated road trips. As far as bagging a tire and stashing it behind the driver seat in the 'vert? I'm 5'5" and to put my Kate Spade tote on the floor board behind the driver's seat I have to move the seat forward. BF is 6'2". Nothing fits behind the driver's seat when he is behind the wheel.

Sorry for the long answer to the question.
When I owned my E93, the rear passenger seat back would fold down and made for a nice auxiliary storage area. If memory serves, the E93 was equipped with the Cold Weather package, so that might be a requirement. But with the right package, there is/was ample storage space in back of the front seats.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:40 PM
gEEkChris gEEkChris is offline
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Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
Couldn't mount the donut tire on the donut rim? I'd love to hear their explanation for that.


I'm not aware of any car manufacturer that designs their RFT designed cars with provision for a spare.
I am not the only one. There was someone in a thread a while back having the same problem finding someone to mount it. I don't why...they just said they don't have the equipment for a donut.

The reason I switched to non-RFT was that I got a screw in the side of my RFT...not fixable...5 days to get replacement RFTs. WTF am I supposed to do for 5 days? An RFT is safer and in general a good idea...but is does NOT eliminate the need for a spare.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:41 PM
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angler angler is offline
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Originally Posted by gEEkChris View Post
I felt about the same as you last weekend. I also have non-RFTs and I hit a pothole last Friday. The next day I have a giant bulge in my $300 tire with <5K miles on it. Fortunately the warranty covered the replacement but it was still a big hastle and I don't have spare yet either. When I asked the guys at discount tire they said that they couldn't mount the donut that Tischer sells. How many places will I have to call to find someone who can?

I agree with you...BMW has left us with no GOOD solution by not having even a place to put a spare.
i have had two flats with my non-rft's and never had an issue getting the tischer spare mounted.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:41 PM
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Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anE934fun View Post
When I owned my E93, the rear passenger seat back would fold down and made for a nice auxiliary storage area. If memory serves, the E93 was equipped with the Cold Weather package, so that might be a requirement. But with the right package, there is/was ample storage space in back of the front seats.
Technically you are correct. I was referring to behind the driver's seat and in the foot well of the back seat.

However, for the sake of argument, let's imagine a road trip in the E93 where you have two roll-aboard suitcases and two sets of golfclubs taking up that rear seat storage area. Now what?
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:42 PM
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captainaudio captainaudio is offline
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Fortunately during my incident yesterday it was during the day, I was in a populated area, although it was raining lighly the weather was not bad and I was not in a dangerous neighborhood.

I had a few alternatives.

1. Use the Conti Comfort Kit (didn't solve the probelm)

2. Call AAA who would have towed me to a nearby station, but then I would have to figure out how to get home from Yonkers. I am sure I could have taken public transportation but what if this had occured in Rural Vermont (where I spend a fair amount of time). I then would have had to return to Yonkers to pick up the car after a new tire was ordered and mounted.

3. Call BMW assist who will tow you to the nearest BMW Center. Once again, what if this happened in Rural Vermont or even worse what if it happened in Rural Vermont in the middle of a Winter night. I have had flat tires in that situation and although it was not fun I was able to mount the spare and move on.


One more item: What if I could fit a donut spare in the trunk? What do I do with the full size tire I took off the car. Leave it by the side of the road attached to the $400 rim?

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