Harmon Kardon Speaker System

Can you still do everything with the Harmon Kardon stereo without the idrive interface?

So far I have enjoyed the Harmon Kardon sound system, although I haven't had much to compare it to. I know my Dad had an early 2000s BMW 335i and at the time they had just updated the sound system and I remember the sales person saying that the car had perfect integrated speakers and when you had the car off it was supposed to be perfectly tuned...yada...yada...yada.

Harmon Kardon Speaker System described by BMW:

"It's a sound experience as remarkable as the BMW driving experience. Unlike traditional stereo systems, the Harman Kardon surround sound Audio System uses vehicle-specific equalizing, and a powerful 300W amplifier, to deliver powerful, high-current, ultrawide-bandwidth. The result: a scintillating audio performance that pumps the highest definition soundtrack to the open road. The 10-speaker system also includes four tweeters, four midrange speakers and two bass speakers located under the front seats."

I can imagine the stock doesn't contain the two subs under the seats or tweeters?

Overall I enjoy it, I say if you do get it, as mentioned above, you should get the Navigation to mess with the settings of the system. I haven't got it to sound perfect yet but it's close. Plus if you're a Warranty junky, then you can't get a aftermarket without voiding at least the stereo warranty and possibly your electrical warranty. I say go for it if you love music!

Originally Posted by BeemerMeUp

So far I have enjoyed the Harmon Kardon sound system, although I haven't had much to compare it to. I know my Dad had an early 2000s BMW 335i and at the time they had just updated the sound system and I remember the sales person saying that the car had perfect integrated speakers and when you had the car off it was supposed to be perfectly tuned...yada...yada...yada.

Harmon Kardon Speaker System described by BMW:

"It's a sound experience as remarkable as the BMW driving experience. Unlike traditional stereo systems, the Harman Kardon surround sound Audio System uses vehicle-specific equalizing, and a powerful 300W amplifier, to deliver powerful, high-current, ultrawide-bandwidth. The result: a scintillating audio performance that pumps the highest definition soundtrack to the open road. The 10-speaker system also includes four tweeters, four midrange speakers and two bass speakers located under the front seats."

I can imagine the stock doesn't contain the two subs under the seats or tweeters?

Overall I enjoy it, I say if you do get it, as mentioned above, you should get the Navigation to mess with the settings of the system. I haven't got it to sound perfect yet but it's close. Plus if you're a Warranty junky, then you can't get a aftermarket without voiding at least the stereo warranty and possibly your electrical warranty. I say go for it if you love music!

If you have an '08 the stock system includes the subs.

Harmon Kardon....Yes.

Originally Posted by Calskanska

Is the Harman Kardon speaker upgrade actually worth the $875 cost?

Not in my book vs the 2012 base system. The "base" system has changed over time since the 1er was introduced, and I've seen some prior years were markedly different. The current version is actually very decent. It will not produce bone rattling sound, but it is more than loud enough, has decent clarity, decent bass and the spatial imaging is good with speaker placement similar to the HK (tweeters in the front lower window triangles, mids on the doors and subs under the seats).

I enjoy high end equipment (at home I have a tube preamp, separate power amp, Thiel speakers, various headphone amps and about $4K in headphones ranging from Electrostats to AKG's, Sennheisers, Grados and Dr Dre's.). I made a point of checking out the base and HK systems before ticking my order form boxes and I have no regrets with the base system. Listen to each and decide for yourself.

For the MY 2010 and 2011 the Harmon Kardon upgrade was a must. This was because BMW did away with the HIFI system which used upgraded Phillips speakers plus a 200 watt amp. In 2012 the HIFI is back as the base system for the US market. I have a MY 2009 with the HIFI that I am quite pleased with. I unfortunately did not know about this BMW downgrade when I ordered my 2010 X5. The six speaker base system simply sucks. To upgrade it in a 1 or 3 series is not that difficult. BMW has an alpine upgrade that expands to 10 speakers and adds a 200 watt amp. The other nice thing is the 1 and 3 have direct wiring unlike the X5 which uses the fiber optic loop and diplexers to send a specific signal to each speaker. Because they left several of the diplexers out when they reduced the speakers in the X5 it is almost impossible to upgrade by adding the right components. I personally prefer the HIFI over the premium system because I am not a big DSP fan.

Nathan_h & Others, I have learned how to find out how many miles I have left until I need gas, how many mpg I am going when driving, how many mpg on the highway on the average I am getting and how many mpg on the city I am getting without having the idrive system. I also now leave my Garmin locked up in my car. Now I know longer am upset that I did not add the idrive navigation system but I will be sure to test a few cars with it before my lease is up and cars with the Harmon Kardon Upgrade to see if it is worth adding these two upgrades. For now, I am enjoying how much better this car is than my prior car. I do wish they would have covered the back seats to match the rest of the seat.

Glad to hear it. I am getting used to the idea of no iDrive in my car, and am tempted to suffer through a few months of using a dash mounted blackberry or ipad as a nav solution -- and see if I want to have yet a third device in the car (ie, would I really want dedicated nav, too).

Nathan_h, let us know how it is! I bought a small padded zippered case that just fits the Garmin and I put that inside another small zippered case that is slightly bigger to hold the cord, mount and the beanbag mount in the side pocket. It then fits perfectly in my car unnoticed and locked up. I am getting good at setting it up and putting it away quickly only when I need it. I still wish I could have had a chance to try out the idrive system to see if I would have liked it but no cars had it on the lot and I was not sure if having it in the middle of the dashboard would bother me since I am so petite but the Garmin sits in my middle of my dashboard also and somehow I see fine.

If you're comparing the H/K system with the Business loudspeaker and/or base system, then yes it is (unfortunately) worth it.

I say unfortunately, because it's not a £1k sound system in the slightest - very muddy, not much separation/detail - but, because the other 2 sound systems BMW offers in the 1 Series Coupe (facelift) are just terrible, the H/K upgrade was a necessity for me. But, this is how the base, or at least upgraded "Business" system should have sounded - for the extra £1k, and the name, it should be so much better than it is!

I remember having the H/K system in my MINI Cooper S, and that sounded fantastic, so much better. The system in the BMW should definitely be a lot better, for the extra money.

Any pictures of the HK system?

Returning to the original poster's question, can HK be added to a car that has the base system? I UNDERSTAND that it is better to order it with HK but some of us are stuck with the base and can't go do the "order it" path now. I got my car slightly used as it was a way better deal for me and the MSRP was $57k as equipped. The only thing it was lackcing is HK. This "D" is so sweet with the Msport.

Most people say that for the price of the hk system, you can do better with an aftermarket stealth (ie looks oem) system.

Originally Posted by nathan_h

Most people say that for the price of the hk system, you can do better with an aftermarket stealth (ie looks oem) system.

+1. The cost of the components would probably be prohibitive... even from a junkyard. I thought about doing a CCC-CIC upgrade in my 2004 545i before I realized that even getting parts from a junkyard was going to cost upwards of $2000. Seriously? My phone is faster, better and more capable... oh and cost a fraction as much. And I buy retail... not subsidized!

While I still think the HK is worth it if you're ordering a new car, there's no doubt in my mind that if you're going to tear into the car and replace components anyway you're far better off going after-market.

thanks to nathan and thumper. Yes, i've done aftermarket installs on other makes. I have a rockford fosgate amp and 4 way system from another car along with a decent head unit. I guess i'm wondering if i can use the i drive to select sat radio station, etc. and it port in as a an input into the head unit of mine. I would locate the amp under the passenger front seat just like it is in the Honda that the system now resides in.

I would rather not hack into my car's factory setup and do the HK though. My system is worth about $900 if purchased new.

It's the better amp that you get with the HK system that justifies the upgrade. The largest deficiency with the stock BMW audio systems is underpowering.

The speakers are somewhat better too, and in these cars there is no way to upgrade aftermarket any more cheaply than just springing for the upgraded system.

If you care at all about audio quality in the car, I recommend the upgrade.

I will carefully direct you guys back to my point of interest. I understand that it will likely cost more to upgrade than the original $875 order option. What i'm asking is does the fact that my car was made as a base stystem make it impossible to install the HK system. For instance will my door panels be different than an HK equipped vehicle to where i can't install the extra speakers? I've looked at the speakers in the rear deck and they don't have much vertical depth. There is no lower access (from the trunk side) to them either. Where is the factory HK amp located at?

I would love to do an aftermarket but only if it is properly integrated with the D-drive. My Alpine 6x9 speakers will likely be too deep to fit in the rear deck. there would also be the need of an adapter plate for the dash.

I'm pretty good at making a nice wire harness using proper wire/connectors/ soldering where necessary. I would consider my install into the Accord as professional quality. The amp is 127 watts per channel RMS from its "birthing sheet" delivered with actual amp. I have component "separates" with a cross over for the front 2 channels and the afore mentioned 6x9s in the back. An extra channel or 2 could be added on for some hidden subs. I believe the factory HK has an 8" sub under each seat.

Originally Posted by BB_cuda

I will carefully direct you guys back to my point of interest. I understand that it will likely cost more to upgrade than the original $875 order option. What i'm asking is does the fact that my car was made as a base stystem make it impossible to install the HK system. For instance will my door panels be different than an HK equipped vehicle to where i can't install the extra speakers? I've looked at the speakers in the rear deck and they don't have much vertical depth. There is no lower access (from the trunk side) to them either. Where is the factory HK amp located at?

I would love to do an aftermarket but only if it is properly integrated with the D-drive. My Alpine 6x9 speakers will likely be too deep to fit in the rear deck. there would also be the need of an adapter plate for the dash.

I'm pretty good at making a nice wire harness using proper wire/connectors/ soldering where necessary. I would consider my install into the Accord as professional quality. The amp is 127 watts per channel RMS from its "birthing sheet" delivered with actual amp. I have component "separates" with a cross over for the front 2 channels and the afore mentioned 6x9s in the back. An extra channel or 2 could be added on for some hidden subs. I believe the factory HK has an 8" sub under each seat.

Got it.

The HK system involves different speakers, amplifiers, and different electronics in the head unit. I'm not sure about the speaker count in the 1 Series; there are actually more speakers in the E60 Logic7 system than in the standard audio system (the rear doors).

The HK system has different equalizer and preamp electronics. I am not sure it would be possible to upgrade via software or firmware - there may be some computer hardware in there to be changed as well.

In my opinion, if you don't purchase the HK upgrade with the car, it is not effectively possible to upgrade to it later. There is simply too much fundamental stuff to be changed. At that point you are better off going aftermarket.

Originally Posted by nathan_h

Can you still do everything with the Harmon Kardon stereo without the idrive interface?

What is included in "everything"?

Absolutely! The H-K sounds fantastic and is a must if you have the convertible.

I have a 2011 135i with navigation and HK audio but it does not look like I have bluetooth... Is that even possible??

Originally Posted by WJGreer

Got it.

The HK system involves different speakers, amplifiers, and different electronics in the head unit. I'm not sure about the speaker count in the 1 Series; there are actually more speakers in the E60 Logic7 system than in the standard audio system (the rear doors).

The HK system has different equalizer and preamp electronics. I am not sure it would be possible to upgrade via software or firmware - there may be some computer hardware in there to be changed as well.

In my opinion, if you don't purchase the HK upgrade with the car, it is not effectively possible to upgrade to it later. There is simply too much fundamental stuff to be changed. At that point you are better off going aftermarket.

+1!

Originally Posted by BB_cuda

I will carefully direct you guys back to my point of interest. I understand that it will likely cost more to upgrade than the original $875 order option. What i'm asking is does the fact that my car was made as a base stystem make it impossible to install the HK system. For instance will my door panels be different than an HK equipped vehicle to where i can't install the extra speakers? I've looked at the speakers in the rear deck and they don't have much vertical depth. There is no lower access (from the trunk side) to them either. Where is the factory HK amp located at?

I would love to do an aftermarket but only if it is properly integrated with the D-drive. My Alpine 6x9 speakers will likely be too deep to fit in the rear deck. there would also be the need of an adapter plate for the dash.

I'm pretty good at making a nice wire harness using proper wire/connectors/ soldering where necessary. I would consider my install into the Accord as professional quality. The amp is 127 watts per channel RMS from its "birthing sheet" delivered with actual amp. I have component "separates" with a cross over for the front 2 channels and the afore mentioned 6x9s in the back. An extra channel or 2 could be added on for some hidden subs. I believe the factory HK has an 8" sub under each seat.

Just seeing this post now. You have probably already got your new car by now! But for others that stumble across it, a few points.

The HK sound system is clearly better than the "hifi" sound system (which is the base version in the US currently, there have been lower end versions offered as the base version in prior model years, and that persists outside the US in some markets).

The price in the US is closer to $1600 because while the HK option is circa $850 it requires that you get the BMW assist/bluetooth/emergency monitoring system -- which is circa an additional $700.

At that point, it's a toss up: A good pro shop can take your $1600 and give you a significant upgrade. And if you want to, you can easily get much better sound than the HK system, though at a higher price.

Note that if you think you want to upgrade down the road, it's easier to do so if you DIDN'T get the HK option, since the HK option is less upgrade friendly. There's some excellent documentation on the musicarnw web site, as well as on 1addicts.com with complete system breakdowns, etc.

That said, if you're wrapping the cost of the HK system into the cost of the car, and you like the way it sounds, and you don't want to someone to remove panels etc in order to do an aftermarket system, the HK option is not a bad way to go.

---

To your specific question: Can you upgrade from base to HK after the fact? Yeah, but it requires recoding the head unit (the HK system uses digital to send the audio to the amp in the trunk whereas the hifi system uses analog), and pulling all the panels etc. If you are going to do that, and are going to buy all the HK parts (amp, speakers, pay to record the head unit), you should just do a stealth install of aftermarket gear, imo.

Originally Posted by Rainmanrey

I have a 2011 135i with navigation and HK audio but it does not look like I have bluetooth... Is that even possible??

If you have a US spec car, I do not think that is possible. If you get those options you automatically get BMW Assist and Bluetooth stuff thrown in for free. They are available separately at additional cost if you are not getting HK or the nav system.

I wonder what I am doing wrong, my 135i is a US spec. The menu screen does not even list a phone option. I tried putting my iPhone (3GS) into search mode and seeing if anything pops up in the BMW's menu or on my phone when I first turn on the car. Since I can find bluetooth options in the menu of the car, how do I proceed?

I agree with the aftermarket option being a better choice if your car did not come with the HK system. The only concern I do not like about the aftermarket system is the head unit. I will have a different finish/dimensions, etc. and will stick out like a sore thumb not to mention that maybe the steering wheel controls might not even work. Everything else in the system is hidden or can be placed out of sight. Just my 0.02 cents