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X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

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  #51  
Old 11-20-2010, 02:45 AM
Armand Armand is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gogatorsx5 View Post
I'm jumping from '08 Cayenne S to 2011 X5 xDrive 50i (ordered today)..............Loved the Cayenne and everything about it. It's my 3rd Porsche and I still own 2002 C4 Cabriolet. The X5 interior is superior to the Cayenne and a similarly equiped 2011 Cayenne S is about $7,000 more than the X5 I have on order. Also needed to take delivery by 12/31 to take advantage of IRS section 179 and Porsche Dealer could not locate a vehicle to my specs and ordering one would take 90 to 120 days for delivery. I'll miss that Porsche mistique and mostly that unmistakeable Porsche "growl". That said, the BMW will be my first Bimmer. Two friends have X5's and love them. I'll give it a whirl!
Enjoy that deduction! Be sure though to check on the status of accelerated deductions. It was set to expire on 1/1/10. Congress is about to take on tax cuts and it looks likely they may get their way to renew some of the expired benefits for the next couple of years. Well worth the research.
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  #52  
Old 11-20-2010, 11:14 AM
gogatorsx5 gogatorsx5 is offline
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I'll use the deduction this year.................and worry about next year next year. My #1 worry is will the X5 50i dissapoint me? That '08 Cayenne S is one fine car!
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  #53  
Old 11-20-2010, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by gogatorsx5 View Post
I'll use the deduction this year.................and worry about next year next year. My #1 worry is will the X5 50i dissapoint me? That '08 Cayenne S is one fine car!
No one has a crystal ball. You obviously wanted something different than your '08 Pepper and the next closest thing is the X5. I suspect you can bear to live with it in nearly any case for three years and then get another Pepper.

After your test drive, how could you be so worried about being disappointed?
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  #54  
Old 11-20-2010, 12:09 PM
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I prefer the X5 over the Porsche C. for looks and option costs.
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  #55  
Old 11-20-2010, 03:16 PM
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i owned a 2004 Cayenne S and was contemplating trading in my 997 on the new s, but could not get over how much more expensive the Cayenne was vs the X5, nearly 15k!!!! The Cayenne interior is just gorgeous, but the outside looks like most of the Japanese offerings out there. The turbo looked the meanest, but the X5 looks good all the way around in amy trim level. Porsche cut allocations and production in order to get the most bang for your buck! I think that is going to hurt them since the Cayenne is one of their best sellers.
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  #56  
Old 11-21-2010, 12:29 AM
binobenzo2466 binobenzo2466 is offline
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I have to say that my fiancee drives a 2011 x5 diesel and i drive a range rover sport supercharged and I wanted to get a Cayenne when i get rid of the rover but after driving the bmw I am a big fan. I did like the gts cayenne and am waiting to see the new one which will prob look like the turbo...the only problem with porsche is they have such a big difference in looks between an S model and turbo or gts. I want to have the option to get the best looks and still be able to something that doesn't cost 150k. The BMW with sport package and 20 inch rims looks agressive and mean and a cayenne S looks like crap for 90k.

That and the Cayenne does look like a Hyundai from certain angles and that alone is enough to walk away.....just my opinion.

Jason

Last edited by binobenzo2466; 11-21-2010 at 12:29 AM. Reason: misquoted the year of bmw
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  #57  
Old 11-21-2010, 04:43 AM
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couldn't agree more! A friend had ordered a new CTT and after looking at it, he decided to cancel the order and get an X6! He had an X5 and wanted a change. The turbo and if they make the gts have the best looks. I had built my Cayenne s out to 93k to look good and that was a stretch. I am a Porsche fan and have owned 5 of them, but this time, I just couldn't get past the looks! Besides, I love how the X5 drives and the option prices are not that bad. Example:Porsche charges 1300 for roof rails! enough said!
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  #58  
Old 11-21-2010, 05:59 AM
alex md alex md is online now
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Agree with your opinion

I own x5 2007 4.8 and was looking for change. Test drove 2011 Cayenne twice/S version/
loaded to 80-82 K level,which is def not fully loaded by any means
Although i enjoyed the ride it was NOT better than x5 5.0 with sport package
Inside x5 is much roomier and cleaner look
Obviously interior design is a matter of opinion but I think that Cayenne overdid with all the button gadgets and their navigation screen is not as clear and nice as X5. Torque vectoring feature on Cayenne was nice and I wish they would adopt this for X5. Therefore, my clear choice will be X5 even if 20K is not a dramatic difference.

Thanks,
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  #59  
Old 11-21-2010, 07:36 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
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My problem with the X5 is they all look the same. Unless you look carefully you might be seeing a 3.0. diesel, 50 or M. The Cayenne at least has a different look between the Turbos and the rest. I do like the looks of the new '11 Cayenne a lot though. The back of all of them X5 and Cayenne still look like a '52 Chev panel truck to me. Everyone has their own opinion,
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  #60  
Old 11-21-2010, 07:54 AM
alex md alex md is online now
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agree with your opinion

Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleJ View Post
My problem with the X5 is they all look the same. Unless you look carefully you might be seeing a 3.0. diesel, 50 or M. The Cayenne at least has a different look between the Turbos and the rest. I do like the looks of the new '11 Cayenne a lot though. The back of all of them X5 and Cayenne still look like a '52 Chev panel truck to me. Everyone has their own opinion,
people that need to know know the difference between 3.5 vs 5.0
Cayenne Turbo has very cool look particularly in black with red brakes and turbo wheels but we are talking 120K when all said and done.back is a big improvement but stillnot as good as X5 or even X3/F-25/
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  #61  
Old 11-21-2010, 07:58 AM
swajames swajames is offline
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The new Cayenne has just won Motor Trend's SUV of the year award.

http://www.motortrend.com/oftheyear/...nne/index.html

It's a significantly better car than the prior model, itself an already capable SUV that could take you places you couldn't get to in an X5 or an X6. The key factor in the 2011 is weight. As BMW needlessly loads the pounds, entirely down to cost cutting in the manufacturing process and lazy design, the Cayenne has shed a lot of weight, around 400lbs in some cases. I'm fairly sure the cars some here claim to have driven weren't 2011 models based on the dates on the posts, the cars weren't in the showrooms until recently. Either way, the new Cayenne is a very good SUV. It is more expensive than the equivalent BMW, but then a house in the Hamptons costs more than the same size house in Iowa. If you can handle the price of entry, the Cayenne is a better SUV than the X5. Nothing from BMW can hit 60 in 4.3 seconds, pull .95g on the skidpad, tow 7700 pounds and take you truly off road. When it comes to capabilities and credentials, the Cayenne is in a class of one.

Michael Harley (Emission here on Bimmerfest) posted a review of the pre-production Turbo on Autoblog which makes some similar points.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/05/28/2...o-first-drive/
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Last edited by swajames; 11-21-2010 at 09:05 AM.
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  #62  
Old 11-21-2010, 12:33 PM
alex md alex md is online now
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respectfully disagree

Quote:
Originally Posted by swajames View Post
The new Cayenne has just won Motor Trend's SUV of the year award.

http://www.motortrend.com/oftheyear/...nne/index.html

It's a significantly better car than the prior model, itself an already capable SUV that could take you places you couldn't get to in an X5 or an X6. The key factor in the 2011 is weight. As BMW needlessly loads the pounds, entirely down to cost cutting in the manufacturing process and lazy design, the Cayenne has shed a lot of weight, around 400lbs in some cases. I'm fairly sure the cars some here claim to have driven weren't 2011 models based on the dates on the posts, the cars weren't in the showrooms until recently. Either way, the new Cayenne is a very good SUV. It is more expensive than the equivalent BMW, but then a house in the Hamptons costs more than the same size house in Iowa. If you can handle the price of entry, the Cayenne is a better SUV than the X5. Nothing from BMW can hit 60 in 4.3 seconds, pull .95g on the skidpad, tow 7700 pounds and take you truly off road. When it comes to capabilities and credentials, the Cayenne is in a class of one.

Michael Harley (Emission here on Bimmerfest) posted a review of the pre-production Turbo on Autoblog which makes some similar points.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/05/28/2...o-first-drive/
All-wheel drive system in PC IS NOT better than x-drive in X5
PC indeed is superb SUV but so is X5
i test drove 2011 PC S version and compare with X5 5.0, not PC Turbo vs X5M
if PC is house in Hamptons, then X5 is a house in Montauk, but not in Iowa/ not to offend people in Iowa
thanx Alex
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  #63  
Old 11-21-2010, 01:54 PM
swajames swajames is offline
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Originally Posted by alex md View Post
All-wheel drive system in PC IS NOT better than x-drive in X5
PC indeed is superb SUV but so is X5
i test drove 2011 PC S version and compare with X5 5.0, not PC Turbo vs X5M
if PC is house in Hamptons, then X5 is a house in Montauk, but not in Iowa/ not to offend people in Iowa
thanx Alex
Well, you simply can't take an X5 off road to the extent you can in a Cayenne. Don't get me wrong, the X5 is a very capable SUV, but it doesn't quite have the breadth or depth of a Cayenne, and that extends to xDrive. You see a lot of gimmicks like that recent video with the X3 purporting to show that xDrive is better than the competition but in my judgment that isn't always the case. It's very good, but it's built more for pavement and soft-roading. Not to say the X5 isn't a tremendous vehicle, it is, but this thread was lacking a little perspective which was the only reason I posted.
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Last edited by swajames; 11-21-2010 at 01:59 PM.
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  #64  
Old 11-21-2010, 02:02 PM
pfbz pfbz is offline
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The BMW is definitely better deal on the low end, especially with the $2,500 holiday credit, as well as notably quicker than the V6 Porsche.


I wanted a lower price point gas engine. I thought the BMW 35i Turbo is was much more satisfying and fun to drive than the Porsche 3.6L normally aspirated engine, especially at altitude.

Even thought the power specs are extremely similar (Porsche: 300HP/295LB-FT with 8-sp, BMW: 300HP/300LB-FT with 8-sp), the driving experience is not. The 35i felt extremely peppy, easily as quick as my Touareg 4.2 V8, while the Cayenne six felt like a definite step down in power.

I know manufacturers specs and 0-60 times can be misleading, but they show the same result. BMW is almost 500 pounds heavier at 4960 lbs, and still hits 0-60 in 6.4, while the lighter Cayenne (4475 lbs) takes a full second longer at 7.4. This definitely meshes with my sense of acceleration. For reference, my 2004 Touareg V8 6-speed has a quoted 0-60 of 6.9 seconds, exactly half way in between with a whopping 5,300 pounds.

BMW X5 35i: 300HP/300LB-FT/4960 Pounds/6.4 0-60
Cayenne V6:   300HP/295LB-FT/4475 Pounds/7.4 0-60
I think comparing the twin turbo BMW 50i to the Cayenne S yields similar results. The BMW is quicker and less expensive.

BMW 50i:   400HP/450LB-FT/5370 Pounds/5.3 0-60
Cayenne S: 400HP/369LB-FT/4553 Pounds/5.6 0-60
I'm not as familiar with the BMW X5M vs. the Cayenne Turbo, but am a bit disappointed they didn't put the new 8-speed in the M. At the $100K+ price point, I'd probably start looking at lot more closely at the Cayenne. Well, actually, not really. At the $100,000+ price point, I'd buy a $55K X5 and a $55K Cayman/Boxster/Z4 instead of dumping money into a 5,000 pound SUV trying to make it perform like a proper sports car.

Last edited by pfbz; 11-21-2010 at 02:08 PM.
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  #65  
Old 11-21-2010, 03:19 PM
swajames swajames is offline
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pfbz, you're putting a lot of weight on the 0-60 time, and probably unduly so - it's something that's of much lesser importance as you're assessing the capabilities of an SUV. That said, Porsche is notoriously conservative in its official times, much more so than BMW tends to be. Either way, it's not that hard to build an SUV which can go fast in a straight line. What separates the men from the boys, and where for me the 2011 Cayenne S has the measure of the X5 xDrive50i, is in the other performance attributes - the ability to take corners, the ability to tow a heavy payload, the ability to go truly off-road. Simply put, a 2011 Cayenne could tow the X5 to the track then beat it around that track - and it wouldn't miss a beat if it had to go off-road or through water to get there. The converse isn't necessarily true. The X5 is well down on towing capacity, is less capable in the corners (assuming both cars have the benefit of the right handling-oriented options), is more impacted by excess weight and is comparatively lukewarm off-road. BMW just set the bar a bit lower with the X5 then Porsche did with the 2011 Cayenne, hardly surprising as it is cheaper. While some of the price difference with the Porsche is due to the badge, much of it is due to the better engineering that went into the Cayenne. "Adding lightness", to paraphrase Colin Chapman, isn't easy or cheap. The X5 is good, but to my mind it's simply not as good or as rounded an SUV - on pavement or off - as the Cayenne. All these are, of course, just opinions. Would I be happy with an X5? You bet, it's a very, very solid SUV. But if you look at the bigger picture, the 2011 Cayenne checks more of the more material boxes. Whether it is worth the premium is, of course, the real question and there's no one-size-fits-all answer there.
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Last edited by swajames; 11-21-2010 at 03:59 PM.
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  #66  
Old 11-21-2010, 06:56 PM
pfbz pfbz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swajames View Post
pfbz, you're putting a lot of weight on the 0-60 time, and probably unduly so - it's something that's of much lesser importance as you're assessing the capabilities of an SUV. That said, Porsche is notoriously conservative in its official times, much more so than BMW tends to be. Either way, it's not that hard to build an SUV which can go fast in a straight line. What separates the men from the boys, and where for me the 2011 Cayenne S has the measure of the X5 xDrive50i, is in the other performance attributes - the ability to take corners, the ability to tow a heavy payload, the ability to go truly off-road. Simply put, a 2011 Cayenne could tow the X5 to the track then beat it around that track - and it wouldn't miss a beat if it had to go off-road or through water to get there. The converse isn't necessarily true. The X5 is well down on towing capacity, is less capable in the corners (assuming both cars have the benefit of the right handling-oriented options), is more impacted by excess weight and is comparatively lukewarm off-road. BMW just set the bar a bit lower with the X5 then Porsche did with the 2011 Cayenne, hardly surprising as it is cheaper. While some of the price difference with the Porsche is due to the badge, much of it is due to the better engineering that went into the Cayenne. "Adding lightness", to paraphrase Colin Chapman, isn't easy or cheap. The X5 is good, but to my mind it's simply not as good or as rounded an SUV - on pavement or off - as the Cayenne. All these are, of course, just opinions. Would I be happy with an X5? You bet, it's a very, very solid SUV. But if you look at the bigger picture, the 2011 Cayenne checks more of the more material boxes. Whether it is worth the premium is, of course, the real question and there's no one-size-fits-all answer there.
Much of what you say has factual basis, but it isn't really completely accurate IMHO. The 0-60 times of course are only one metric, and I mentioned their limited value right up front... But the numbers exactly matched my perception of the performance during extended test drives. I also felt the handling of the base 35i was easily the equal of the base 2011 Cayenne.

A couple of points:
  • Off-Road: The Cayenne (and Touareg) used to have great off-road ability. The jury is still out on the 2011 versions off-road ability, but it appears they moved quite a bit farther into the "on road" camp then they used to be. If the 2011 Touareg hadn't been eviscerated of it's off road ability and also lost both the V8 Gas and V10 diesel motors, I'd likely be buying another one. The Porsche maintains the powerful gas motors, but at a huge price premium and still by most accounts has lost most of its off road ability.
  • Add Lightness: He actually said, "Simplify, then add lightness..." Colin definitely didn't have the X5 or Cayenne in mind when he uttered that phrase, and would roll over in his grave if he knew it was being applied to 2 ton plus behemoth SUV's with more computers, gadgets, and driving aids than the aircraft and spacecraft of his era and three times the weight of the cars he loved.
  • I really wanted to love the new Cayenne. I drove both multiple times. For what I was looking for (on road fun, comfort,reasonable price point, good mountain passing power, ability to handle simple off road tasks, room for my dogs, etc) the BMW was the clear choice by a fairly large margin.

Last edited by pfbz; 11-21-2010 at 07:53 PM.
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  #67  
Old 11-21-2010, 07:24 PM
Armand Armand is offline
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Just curious why some folks claim the Cayenne is smaller than the X5? According to the official websites, they are very close all around. Something I missed?

What I like about BMW is that they really get the importance of efficiency. The X5 35i, 35D and 40D are all based on 3.0 L technology. Cayenne now has the hybrid option which comes with a 3.0 L gas engine. Not a bad start but way behind BMW in terms of investment in higher mpg, lower and cleaner emissions.

Shedding weight is good. E70 is a mid-cycle model. I can't wait until we get more details on the next gen X5. I bet we'll see some brilliant moves. They are already experimenting with promising technologies in the Megacity project. Hopefully the new X5 will inherit a few cool features from that investment.
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  #68  
Old 11-22-2010, 07:44 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
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Both the Cayenne and the T-egg can be optioned with the more aggressive off road specs. This was made optional because of the need to shed weight, cost, and the fact that most owners/buyers did not want or need such capable off road hardware, according to what I have read. Thus, if you really need your Cayenne Turbo S to go over the Rubicon Trail with the Jeep's and Range Rovers you can still get the stuff to make that happen.

Last edited by UncleJ; 11-22-2010 at 07:45 AM.
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  #69  
Old 11-22-2010, 08:50 AM
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  #70  
Old 11-22-2010, 09:01 AM
pfbz pfbz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleJ View Post
Both the Cayenne and the T-egg can be optioned with the more aggressive off road specs. This was made optional because of the need to shed weight, cost, and the fact that most owners/buyers did not want or need such capable off road hardware, according to what I have read. Thus, if you really need your Cayenne Turbo S to go over the Rubicon Trail with the Jeep's and Range Rovers you can still get the stuff to make that happen.
Not correct.

The 2011 Touareg CAN NOT be ordered in the US with any of the off road options. Air suspension, not available. Locking center or rear diffs, not available. Underbody protection, not available. 4Xmotion, not available. Low range transfer case, not available.

On the Cayenne, you can still opt for air suspension, and a few protection plates, but still no locking diffs or low range.
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  #71  
Old 11-22-2010, 05:34 PM
swajames swajames is offline
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Not correct.

The 2011 Touareg CAN NOT be ordered in the US with any of the off road options. Air suspension, not available. Locking center or rear diffs, not available. Underbody protection, not available. 4Xmotion, not available. Low range transfer case, not available.

On the Cayenne, you can still opt for air suspension, and a few protection plates, but still no locking diffs or low range.
I've yet to see anyone demonstrate that the 2011 model is less capable off-road than the prior generation. Porsche isn't particularly prone to hyperbole, and they believe that the new model is better than the old one.

The 2011 does actually have locking diffs.

Offroad Mode 1 turns on the basics (systems such as Porsche Hill Control and the offroad programs for the air suspension, uses PTV Plus for torque vectoring etc).

Offroad Mode 2 locks the center differential and electronically controls the rear diff and PTV Plus.

Offroad Mode 3 also locks the rear differential.

You can indeed add a lot of other optional off-road hardware as other posters have noted.
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Last edited by swajames; 11-22-2010 at 05:43 PM.
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  #72  
Old 11-23-2010, 08:17 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
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Sorry about the mis-info on the T-egg. The Edmunds site review for the '11 indicated the off road stuff was optional. The Cayenne still seems to have the "off road chops" though.

Last edited by UncleJ; 11-23-2010 at 08:27 AM.
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  #73  
Old 11-28-2010, 04:43 PM
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This was exactly my question when thinking of trading in our 03 X5. I love the look of the redesigned 2008 Cayenne. We already have a 911 and it should be noted that the stereo on the 2008 (which was the model in my price range) is so crappy. GPS sucks - scrolling to type an address is ridiculous and the speakers are horrible. We spent $5k to upgrade the stereo to something that is touchscreen and is much more user friendly. They did change this stereo in the 09 model, but for now that was simply too much to spend. We ended up buying an 07 4.8 X5 and could not be happier.

The Cayenne is a great looking car, but it just doesn't have the masculine lines that the BMW has and the intelligence of the X is really impressive. Of course this is all my humble opinion.
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  #74  
Old 11-28-2010, 04:47 PM
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Why would one want to take these cars off road? and scratch the paint god forbid!


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  #75  
Old 12-02-2010, 08:46 PM
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Go away

uncle j and rome, if you guys are so anti bmw WHY ARE YOU ON THE BIMMERFEST?!
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