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X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

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  #51  
Old 11-08-2010, 09:24 AM
adgrant adgrant is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguin View Post
Perhaps BMW has improved things over the 2010 version, but the database in mine is vastly inferior to the Garmin database. I would say that 10-15% of the time the BMW Nav gets the city wrong with addresses when I am on a trip. Several times on a trip it has told me to turn onto a cowtrail off a main highway while traveling in Utah and Idaho.

The database does not have any of the Wisconsin state parks in it, but it has the city parks.

Etc.
You might be able to change the cowtrail behavior by changing the route preferences. My Garmin has tried to take me down some "interesting" roads too. As for the POI database, the Garmin's is much better but that's not my primary criteria for judging a NAV unit.

I prefer the BMW unit for the following reasons:

1) I never have to wait for a sat lock.

2) It's instructions are generally clearer than the Garmin's. The lane indications for highways are a huge help.

3) If I ignore a turn instruction (either accidentally or deliberately), the BMW unit recalculates very quickly, the Garmin does not.

4) I can send destinations from Google Maps.

5) The screen is much bigger

6) It doesn't fall off the windshield.

I use my Garmin in rental cars and its better than nothing but I find it quite annoying.
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  #52  
Old 11-08-2010, 10:11 AM
Havelcek Havelcek is offline
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And it won't get stolen out of your car.
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  #53  
Old 11-08-2010, 02:02 PM
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bobamoo bobamoo is offline
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Originally Posted by Havelcek View Post
And it won't get stolen out of your car.
Great point
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  #54  
Old 11-08-2010, 03:46 PM
Penguin Penguin is offline
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Originally Posted by adgrant View Post
You might be able to change the cowtrail behavior by changing the route preferences. My Garmin has tried to take me down some "interesting" roads too. As for the POI database, the Garmin's is much better but that's not my primary criteria for judging a NAV unit.

I prefer the BMW unit for the following reasons:

1) I never have to wait for a sat lock.

2) It's instructions are generally clearer than the Garmin's. The lane indications for highways are a huge help.

3) If I ignore a turn instruction (either accidentally or deliberately), the BMW unit recalculates very quickly, the Garmin does not.

4) I can send destinations from Google Maps.

5) The screen is much bigger

6) It doesn't fall off the windshield.

I use my Garmin in rental cars and its better than nothing but I find it quite annoying.

My problem with the BMW is simply that you can not trust it, since the database has so many errors and is very incomplete, as compared to Garmin.

Here's an example. The BMW Nav routes me on a 250 mile (roughly) route in Utah over excellent paved state highways going through barren landscape with hardly a town. The BMW Nav estimates that it will take me more than TEN hours, or an average speed of less than 25 MPH. It has done this many times and only seems to compute accurate times if the route is on interstate highways, or short trips in urban areas.

This is just ridiculous, and means the estimated arrival data of the BMW nav is worthless, since you cannot trust it. My Garmin, OTOH, is extremely accurate with estimating arrival times.

I could go on and on about all the errors, such as the nav voice saying "turn left" while the route on the map shows straight ahead, but the fact is the 2010 Nav on the X5 is full of bugs and inaccurate information.
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  #55  
Old 11-08-2010, 04:15 PM
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bobamoo bobamoo is offline
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Have to agree. I've only taken 1 trip in my X5 so far, but I know the route. Direct route does not use interstates. X5 nav routed me down all interstates. I have changed to all 3 route preferences, still says all interstates. Next time I take this trip (probably in a few weeks, I'll just head down the roads I know and then after about an hour or so, turn on the nav and see what it says. If it still tries to get me on interstates, then I know it's time to keep using the Garmin, because that would take me way out of the way to back track.
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  #56  
Old 11-08-2010, 06:19 PM
adgrant adgrant is offline
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Originally Posted by bobamoo View Post
Have to agree. I've only taken 1 trip in my X5 so far, but I know the route. Direct route does not use interstates. X5 nav routed me down all interstates. I have changed to all 3 route preferences, still says all interstates. Next time I take this trip (probably in a few weeks, I'll just head down the roads I know and then after about an hour or so, turn on the nav and see what it says. If it still tries to get me on interstates, then I know it's time to keep using the Garmin, because that would take me way out of the way to back track.
If you know the route why are you using the Nav.
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  #57  
Old 11-08-2010, 06:30 PM
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bobamoo bobamoo is offline
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Let's me know how accurate it is for the times I don't know the route.
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  #58  
Old 11-08-2010, 07:11 PM
adgrant adgrant is offline
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Originally Posted by bobamoo View Post
Let's me know how accurate it is for the times I don't know the route.
I have tried the same thing. Problem is every route is different. It's as much about the data as the routing algorithm. My Garmin unit has taken me on some very strange journeys in various places. It's always best to study your route on google maps first but the larger display and easy zooming make it much easier to sanity check the BMW system vs the Garmin. The BMW unit also seems to re-route much faster when you ignore its original suggestion.
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  #59  
Old 11-08-2010, 07:16 PM
z2g z2g is offline
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Originally Posted by Marlbro View Post
WOW !! so for you 3 grand Nav option on your 60 grand car the zoom mode is it !!!!!!
10 x the price for the flick of the wrist
Did I ever say I purchased the Navigation solely because of that feature which I mentioned I liked?!?!?? I just said that was one feature I really liked.

By the way, I still don't understand your original statement. It makes no sense to me.
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  #60  
Old 11-08-2010, 07:48 PM
adgrant adgrant is offline
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Originally Posted by Marlbro View Post
WOW !! so for you 3 grand Nav option on your 60 grand car the zoom mode is it !!!!!!
10 x the price for the flick of the wrist
The built in Nav is more like 2k. I would say the quick zoom is a big deal. Some of us like to see a map. Zooming on a Garmin is a most unusable.
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  #61  
Old 11-08-2010, 08:52 PM
ANZAC_1915 ANZAC_1915 is offline
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Originally Posted by adgrant View Post
The built in Nav is more like 2k. I would say the quick zoom is a big deal. Some of us like to see a map. Zooming on a Garmin is a most unusable.
Integration with the HUD is nice too.
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  #62  
Old 11-08-2010, 10:15 PM
z2g z2g is offline
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Originally Posted by Penguin View Post
My problem with the BMW is simply that you can not trust it, since the database has so many errors and is very incomplete, as compared to Garmin.

Here's an example. The BMW Nav routes me on a 250 mile (roughly) route in Utah over excellent paved state highways going through barren landscape with hardly a town. The BMW Nav estimates that it will take me more than TEN hours, or an average speed of less than 25 MPH. It has done this many times and only seems to compute accurate times if the route is on interstate highways, or short trips in urban areas.

This is just ridiculous, and means the estimated arrival data of the BMW nav is worthless, since you cannot trust it. My Garmin, OTOH, is extremely accurate with estimating arrival times.

I could go on and on about all the errors, such as the nav voice saying "turn left" while the route on the map shows straight ahead, but the fact is the 2010 Nav on the X5 is full of bugs and inaccurate information.
I guess it depends on the area. In my area (CA), it's pretty accurate. I've driven all over Northern CA and Southern CA with the X5 and using the X5 navigation. And, it was fine. Yes, I think the Garmin is better in routing and accuracy. However, I don't think the X5's navigation system is any worse than other factory navigation systems I've used and other low-moderately-priced GPS units on the market.

I think it comes down to which map the X5 uses and its routing software. There are two maps that most GPS use.....one by Navteq, the other by Tele Atlas. Garmin and Magellan use Navteq, which is the better of the two. Many factory systems and low-moderate end GPS units use the Tele Atlas map.

I've read that BMW uses Navteq. So, it's the best out there. However, I guess the routing software isn't the best. But, from what I've seen, it gets me to point A to point B. And, the estimated time of arrival was pretty accurate for me.
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  #63  
Old 11-09-2010, 04:10 AM
Kengineer Kengineer is offline
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We have the problem, in NM, of the nav system sending us on off-highway routes. We've only had the car a few days, but we tested it on our drive home. Not only did it keep telling me to turn around, but it didn't recalculate the route for 30 miles! The worry, in the NM and CO area in the winter is that the system could send people on routes where they get stuck and stranded on a mountain pass. We're driving to CO this weekend, so we'll see where it sends us. Thankfully, we can check gmaps on our phones. Unfortunately, you can tell the system fo avoid highways, but not the inverse!
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  #64  
Old 11-09-2010, 05:32 AM
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Originally Posted by z2g View Post
I've read that BMW uses Navteq. So, it's the best out there. However, I guess the routing software isn't the best. But, from what I've seen, it gets me to point A to point B. And, the estimated time of arrival was pretty accurate for me.

No, and that is the problem. BMW used NavTeq in the prior generation of their Nav system, but with the introduction of the "new and improved" nav system in 2010, they switched to the European-based TeleAtlas.
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  #65  
Old 11-09-2010, 06:13 AM
adgrant adgrant is offline
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Originally Posted by Penguin View Post
No, and that is the problem. BMW used NavTeq in the prior generation of their Nav system, but with the introduction of the "new and improved" nav system in 2010, they switched to the European-based TeleAtlas.
The new Nav/iDrive system was introduced in the 2009 model year on several models. Did they change the map provider since then?
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  #66  
Old 11-09-2010, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by adgrant View Post
The new Nav/iDrive system was introduced in the 2009 model year on several models. Did they change the map provider since then?
I can only speak to the X5, in which the nav data base was switched from NavTeq to TeleAtlas with the 2010 model year.

I do not know the timing of the switch for other models, but I beleive it happened at the same time the new generation i-drive was introduced.

The Teleatlas data is, quite simply, abysmal.
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  #67  
Old 11-09-2010, 09:18 AM
Havelcek Havelcek is offline
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You can find versions of this topic on message boards for every car maker in the world. The bottom line is that if you want the absolute best driving directions then buy a hand-held unit with updating capabilities. If you want decent nav integrated with your car, then get it from the factory. Simple as that.
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  #68  
Old 11-09-2010, 11:22 AM
Penguin Penguin is offline
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Originally Posted by Havelcek View Post
The bottom line is that if you want the absolute best driving directions then buy a hand-held unit with updating capabilities. If you want decent nav integrated with your car, then get it from the factory. Simple as that.
Sorry, but I would not classify the BMW Nav system as "decent."

When the voice of the nave system says "Turn Right" and the route on the map display shows "go straight," "decent" is not the word that comes to mind.

When the system estimates I will average 23 MPH on paved state highways for the next 250 miles, it isn't "decent."

When I find a motel in city "X" using the nav, then tell it to go there, and it changes to city "Y," 38 miles away (but using the same street name and address), that's not "decent."

I would be OK if the BMW system was decent; however, it is so poor I have stopped using it and gone back to a windshield mount Garmin when I go on trips.

The prior BMW nav system did have a decent database; however, with the changeover to tele Atlas, it left the relm of "decent."

Last edited by Penguin; 11-09-2010 at 11:25 AM.
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  #69  
Old 11-09-2010, 12:09 PM
Havelcek Havelcek is offline
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I'm sorry to hear about your challenges with the system. Maybe its that I live in the tri-state area, but I've never had a problem like what you describe.
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  #70  
Old 11-09-2010, 01:23 PM
adgrant adgrant is offline
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Originally Posted by Havelcek View Post
I'm sorry to hear about your challenges with the system. Maybe its that I live in the tri-state area, but I've never had a problem like what you describe.
I too live in the tri-state but have used the Nav from Maine to the Carolinas without any major issues (I don't always agree with its routing but more out of personal preference and knowledge of local traffic patterns).

Also used it in Germany, France and England where it worked flawlessly.

Last edited by adgrant; 11-09-2010 at 01:25 PM.
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  #71  
Old 11-09-2010, 01:48 PM
Penguin Penguin is offline
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It os good that you are happy with the BMW Tele Atlas nav, but many people have problems:

http://www.walletpop.com/blog/2010/0...drivers-wrong/
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  #72  
Old 11-09-2010, 02:18 PM
adgrant adgrant is offline
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It os good that you are happy with the BMW Tele Atlas nav, but many people have problems:

http://www.walletpop.com/blog/2010/0...drivers-wrong/
One work around for the problems those people were having is to use google maps to enter addresses. You have to know where you are going before you leave the house, but most people do. Google maps is also useful for trip planning (time and distance etc) and for familiarizing yourself with the route in advance.
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  #73  
Old 11-09-2010, 03:39 PM
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bobamoo bobamoo is offline
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Originally Posted by adgrant View Post
One work around for the problems those people were having is to use google maps to enter addresses. You have to know where you are going before you leave the house, but most people do. Google maps is also useful for trip planning (time and distance etc) and for familiarizing yourself with the route in advance.
I set all of my favorites using Google Maps. That works great!
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  #74  
Old 11-09-2010, 04:19 PM
Penguin Penguin is offline
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Originally Posted by adgrant View Post
One work around for the problems those people were having is to use google maps to enter addresses. You have to know where you are going before you leave the house, but most people do. Google maps is also useful for trip planning (time and distance etc) and for familiarizing yourself with the route in advance.

When I am on a several week vacation, as I did a couple of times this Summer, one of the functions of the GPS is to find motels and restaurants at the end of the day. While I appreciate your Google suggestion, just taking-out my Garmin GPS is faster and more convenient than getting a computer connection to google and sending POI to the vehicle. On my vacations, I do not set each night's destination in advance, but alter them based on weather, road conditions, and if I want to stop and walk a trail or spend more time at someplace interesting.

The easiest answer for me is to just use the Garmin.

Google probably works fine for day trips from and back to home, and people who use the BMW nav for that probably have no complaints.

Last edited by Penguin; 11-09-2010 at 04:22 PM.
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  #75  
Old 11-09-2010, 05:53 PM
MRV99 MRV99 is offline
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Originally Posted by Marlbro View Post
BAD points
1. Squeaking Door Seals
2. Squeaking Glove box & rattles
3. wheel hubs rusting
4. Brake calipers rusting
5. poor ride Quality on 20 inch with sport suspension (non Adaptive)
6. M Sport pack prone to "Stone Pecking" no Warranty cover on paint damage. (not on mine thankfully)
7. Electrical system weak, prone to flat batteries, poor design for Software driven cut outs
8. Sat Nav does not allow for Several stops on route, only allows for A to B programming.
9. No cup holders in the Rear as Standard
10. Roller Blind deleted, from Standard
11. No Option to delete RFTs and go with non RFT tires (include spare)
12. Fuel consumption (can not get to Manuf claimed figures) even if I push it
13. Front Fender indicator repeater lamp on RHS fell out whilst driving home
dangled on the wire, chattered against the paint, and chipped the paint.
Dealer said, "sorry about that, will replace both of them, it's not the first time" WTF
I finally am going to respond.
1) Welcome to globalization. I have never had a sqeqky door seal. I have had them fail but were replaced under warranty.

2) My past and current X glovebox has not rattled. Maybe you have a mouse pet mouse and marbles inthere?

3) Every car that I have had which had a hub centric setup rusts. Nothing a little wire brush and antiseize can't fix. Never had a stuck wheel since plus you never see the hubs.

4) Welcome to breaks but not uncommon. I can see aesthetically it looks bad no comment.

5) Your X5 was not optimized for 20" wheels. I am sure that BMW has stats on the number of each size wheel it sells on the car from the factory and I am pretty sure that 75% are 18's/19's. Yes you may argue differently but In Chicago we have a few(100's) X's driving around and I would have to say most are 18's/19's with very few 20+ If BMW had to tune the suspension for every wheel size the car would cost 5K more. Simple statistics, build the car for the masses.

6) If BMW developed the M-sport package to prevent the stone pecking then I am sure everyone would complain on the look. You want wide tires, you will get stone pecking.

7) If people didn't want every electrical dodad on their cars then this would not be an issue. 12volt systems have been around for ever and were fine when you only had radio and lights but now your talking power everything. Just think about the amount of electricity the car needs now. The reality is auto manufactures need to move to a 48 volt system but not manufacture wants to go through the cost of certifying a 48volt system. Every wire, connector and devise will need stringent testing by the government and would cost ungodly amounts of money. This issue surfaced many years ago and once one company starts all will have to follow but cash strapped manufactures will not take that risk yet until it is tooooo late. You can also blame the Gov for the MPG requirements. BMW needs to gain MPG everywhere it can and that includes the alternator draw. Para-static drag on an engine kills HP and MPG. You could bolt a 100hp supercharger on a car and only get net 60 because it takes 40hp just to run the supercharger. That is why turbos are the popular item. The newer Hybrid charging systems are make there way into cars but that also adds complexity/reliability issues which the std alternator does not have. Yes they fail but they are simple. Besides the hybrid charging systems will be one more complaint for people to scream about on the boards because of issues..

8) I have had Nav's in my cars since my 2002 and I have never once thought of entering in multiple destinations. I guess I am just a simple person but I guess you would have to do some planning to layout multiple destinations. Wonder how complex it would be if you changed the order of and went from A -> C -> B -> D I guess more complexity would be better in your eyes.

9) I don't know what the Standard means but every X5 that I have owned had the fold down arm rest with cup holders. I never knew that it was an option.

10) Not sure but I wish they would have knocked 100 off the price and keep the cover. Mine sits in the attic collecting dust. So no comment

11) Arguing this is like arguing the dipstick issue. I am sure only a very small few are that passionate about the runflat issue. Statistics plus the extra cost involved of having another option for 2% of all people who don't want them are not worth it to BMW. Simple sell the RFT's and by non-RFT's

12) That is funny! If the car actually got the MPG that the sticker said then you would be complaining about how the car is underpowered or was a dog to drive. If BMW actually had real MPG on the sticker then you would be paying more for your car. Gas guzzler tax and BMW would be taxed up the wazzu for having a fleet that does not meet min MPG requirements. Either way you pay more. If the 2-4mpg difference is going to kill your pocket book then BMW's should not be your car of choice. I hear lexus gets good MPG. Side note. took a 400 mile round trip with only 500mile on the new car. I reset the trip computer and i got 15.9. That was 85mph average with many 100+mph runs plus 15 miles of college town driving so it was slow driving. My 4.8 on the same trip was getting 16 and that was at 25k miles and 50hp less. No complaints.

13) no comment
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