Welcome to Bimmerfest -- The #1 Online Community for BMW related information! Please enjoy the discussion forums below and share your experiences with the 200,000 current, new and past BMW owners. The forums are broken out by car model and into other special interest sections such as BMW European Delivery and a special forum to voice your questions to the many BMW dealers on the site to assist our members!

Please follow the links below to help get you started!

Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > X Series > X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)

X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-23-2010, 03:04 AM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
diesel pooched?

Help! Need suggestions for dealing with X5 engine disaster. Friday, wife drives 100 yds from home and engine stalls. Difficult to restart but after several tries comes to life. Now knocks badly. Actually sounds like a very sharp, hollow, metallic clanking. coming from inside engine. Like a totally collapsed lifter in a chev v8. Towed to BMW. That afternoon they called and said "something definitely wrong with engine". Really? Today say 'still diagnosing it according to what BMW is telling them to do'. Has 24000 miles. Any thoughts? Especially on what the dealer and BMW should do vs will try to get away with?
Reply With Quote
Advertisement
  #2  
Old 11-23-2010, 05:23 AM
XXX555 XXX555 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: S. Florida
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 270
Mein Auto: 2012 M3 cab
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzojournalist View Post
Help! Need suggestions for dealing with X5 engine disaster. Friday, wife drives 100 yds from home and engine stalls. Difficult to restart but after several tries comes to life. Now knocks badly. Actually sounds like a very sharp, hollow, metallic clanking. coming from inside engine. Like a totally collapsed lifter in a chev v8. Towed to BMW. That afternoon they called and said "something definitely wrong with engine". Really? Today say 'still diagnosing it according to what BMW is telling them to do'. Has 24000 miles. Any thoughts? Especially on what the dealer and BMW should do vs will try to get away with?
NO mechanical clue with information available. While I am all for "hope for the best and prepare for the worst".....As long as they keep you up to date, give them a chance. Good luck.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-23-2010, 06:41 AM
boatpi boatpi is offline
Registered User
Location: ca
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 60
Mein Auto: 530
Just wait, it is dificult. Years ago I had an Audi 5000 diesel. it sounded even worse, and turned out to be a failed injector.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-23-2010, 07:19 AM
Funf Dreisig Funf Dreisig is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 404
Mein Auto: 77 530i & 09 35d
Quote:
Originally Posted by XXX555 View Post
NO mechanical clue with information available. While I am all for "hope for the best and prepare for the worst".....As long as they keep you up to date, give them a chance. Good luck.
I agree.


FWIW here are pics of every 35d owner's worst engine nightmare In this case it appears to have been an assembly error -- one of the rod bolts was probably never installed

Let's hope the OP's engine problem is much less serious.

Funf Dreisig
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-23-2010, 07:52 AM
quackbury's Avatar
quackbury quackbury is offline
///Monkeyazz Duck
Location: Not In Kansas Any More
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,462
Mein Auto: 535i M Sport; 328i Wagon
So what grade gasoline did your wife fill the tank with?

It's well worth reading through the entire thread Funf posted. The nightmare isn't just the engine damage, it's the fact the shop left the brand new crate motor sitting on the floor, and other apparent bouts of sloppiness. If the engine does have to replaced, keep your fingers crossed your BMW Center does a better job than those yokels did.
__________________


Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-23-2010, 07:53 AM
0428's Avatar
0428 0428 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: East Coast
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,567
Mein Auto: X5 35i Sport Sapphire
Don't worry about it, you car is still under warranty.
__________________


Retired

1999 Prelude SH / Pearl White /
2007 X3 Sport / Jet Black /
2010 X5 Sport / Sapphire Black /

Current
2013 X5 M-Sport / M-Power / Alpine White /
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-23-2010, 08:08 AM
roadkillrob roadkillrob is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Boston
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,438
Mein Auto: 325CIC, 335CIC
Why is leaving the new engine sitting on the floor sloppy? That is pretty much how every show works on them to move accessories and all the other parts the crate engine doesn't include and to move over the transmission - a lot of things cannot be done on an engine stand and it isn't going to hurt the engine sitting on the floor.
__________________
2008 335i Vert Montego/Saddle/Grey Poplar
2014 X3 35i Space Grey/Chestnut/Fineline Wave
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-23-2010, 08:59 AM
ard ard is online now
Resident Curmudgeon
Location: Sierra foothills
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,103
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
OP- You're in Canada, right? Just checking.

So you are going to be doing a bit of a 'dance' with this issue for a bit. Here's why: The dealer is just doing the work on the car, they don't make the decisions and they may not know exactly WHAT to do. So you'll need to let them know your expectations, and keep pressure on them, but also acknowledge that BMWNA is calling the shots on technical issues and $$$ decisions. You want the dealership/SA on your side. Any opportunity to co-opt him- show him that you'll be understanding and cooperative with his schedule if he goes to bat for you with BMWNA would help.

My approach is usually pretty transparent- "You guys need to be 100% honest with me- I understand you cannot control BMWNA, but anything under this roof I expect you to do what you say you'll do. Yes, I understand that schedules may shift, but I expect to get communications about it. I expect you to go to bat with BMWNA for me, and if you do I will support you personally 100%." Fortunately, I work to establish a working relationship at every dealership I've used (various cars) as early as the first visit.

With you car, they will likely need to do a tear down, then submit to BMWNA for guidance/recommendation/approval. Verbally walk through what is being done to your car. Recognize the SA will NOT want to give you much...they are much more comfortable with "we're waiting for BMW"... even though they may actually KNOW what is broken, what caused it, etc. What you want it to know WHEN it reaches a point where a decision on WHAT repair is being considered...THEN you want to lobb the SA and BMWNAy. Easier to influence a decision rather than change one! If worst comes to worst, you want a new motor not a dealer/field rebuild. I have no issues with a new/remanned engine, btw.

Good luck

A
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-23-2010, 09:13 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Silicon Valley
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 6,575
Mein Auto: '06 X3
Good advice, let us know what it turned out to be and how it was resolved.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-23-2010, 09:20 AM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
will keep you informed

Thanks for all your help. The possibility that someone put gasoline into it will be looked into. Normailly we use RR co-op fuel which is very popular around here. Fortunately, I am a journeyman automotive technician (canadaian mechanics go through a 4 year apprenticeship process) and am somewhat aware of the dealership/regional office warranty dance. But this is our first BMW and only worked on one before in my carreer to this point.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 11-23-2010, 10:15 AM
Funf Dreisig Funf Dreisig is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 404
Mein Auto: 77 530i & 09 35d
Quote:
Originally Posted by roadkillrob View Post
Why is leaving the new engine sitting on the floor sloppy? That is pretty much how every show works on them to move accessories and all the other parts the crate engine doesn't include and to move over the transmission - a lot of things cannot be done on an engine stand and it isn't going to hurt the engine sitting on the floor.
As I've posted before. I've dropped a 911 engine onto the lid of the crate it was shipped in after I installed casters to make it into a dolly. And I installed the replacement engine using the same technique. I've dropped the tranny of a 530i onto a home made rolling pallet. But I would NOT lay a new engine on the shop floor propped up with greasy 2x4s and try to work on it.

Keep in mind that in the thread I linked, a fair number of parts were being transferred from the old engine to the new one. A good stand will hold an engine securely and allow you to rotate the engine to reach and properly install/torque various parts/fittings etc. Sure at some point the engine needs to come off the stand and be attached to the tranny, etc. And I would use a shop crane to lift the engine off the stand and gently mate it with the tranny sitting on some rolling platform. Even if that rolling platform were the top of a crate with casters But that's just me. I have an engine stand and a shop crane, maybe that shop didn't

Funf Dreisig
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 11-23-2010, 11:03 AM
ard ard is online now
Resident Curmudgeon
Location: Sierra foothills
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,103
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzojournalist View Post
Thanks for all your help. The possibility that someone put gasoline into it will be looked into. Normailly we use RR co-op fuel which is very popular around here. Fortunately, I am a journeyman automotive technician (canadaian mechanics go through a 4 year apprenticeship process) and am somewhat aware of the dealership/regional office warranty dance.
Ahh, good...you should be fine. Try and get the SA on your side.


Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzojournalist View Post
But this is our first BMW and only worked on one before in my carreer to this point.
Eh... as they say, turn em over and they're all the same....

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 11-26-2010, 10:13 AM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
Well its one week later and this is what they will tell me: #6 cyl the problem. swapping injectors didnt help. there are metal filings in the oil filter(!!!). waiting for BMW to authorize removing oil pan and heads to check for further damage. I have ruled out misfueling. So..... after 7 days all thats happened is theyve swapped injectors and looked in the oil filter.....We've had some heavy winter weather this last week so I know my vehicle is at the bottom of the list. But holy christmas, just diagnose the thing, PLEASE! ....SA says if a new engine or short block is necessary, will come from Germany. "several weeks" wait. It almsot like we are doing a good cop/bad cop thing. My wife wants to rip' em a new...(and pretty much told them so). I try to be more understanding and keep the SA on our side....Did I mention the night before this all happened I put brand new winter tires on?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 11-26-2010, 10:21 AM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
Something else I'm curious about. The dealership its at now is not the one we bought it from. They would not budge on price and had a very eliteist attitude. Fine. We buy it 300 miles away at Delwari BMW who would deal and had a completely different and pleasant attitude. And we are not repeat customers. Like I said this is our first bmw. I wonder if this factors into things any? or not.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 11-26-2010, 10:41 AM
ard ard is online now
Resident Curmudgeon
Location: Sierra foothills
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,103
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
What are the lemon laws in Canada? I'd reach out to BMWNA and start being "concerned" that "we may have a lemon situation developing due to how the dealer and BMW is handling this issue". Do you have a loaner car or is that a USA thing?? You want BMW really engaged on this issue.



Since you are in canada, I am at a loss as to what your rights are... many states in the US they have 30 days, then they buy the car back...they have, what, 25 left for yours?

Dealer attitude can vary a lot, and even between new car sales and service within the same dealer! Even between SAs at one dealer.... Call Delwari and talk to you salesperson, see what they recommend. Hard to imagine a way that they would transport it 300 miles, but having some additional input might help.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 11-26-2010, 12:02 PM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
No lemon laws here but there is a non-profit Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan that makes binding decisions (****back a possiblity). It seems fairly legit, with some arguing its more or less effective than your lemon laws. However, it only gets involved when the manufacturers own complaints resolution porcess has been exhausted. So I will get BMWNA involved. All i want at this point is a timely diagnosis and installation of a new engline unless someone can convince me otherwise (and it would take alot of convincing). We have been provided a demonstator as a loaner, a nice little '11 328 that would be sweet except its too small for our family and activites (hockey etc.) and local roads (deeper snow). So today they have arranged a rental SUV which will probably be an Escape or some kind of Jeep.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 11-26-2010, 12:52 PM
ard ard is online now
Resident Curmudgeon
Location: Sierra foothills
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,103
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzojournalist View Post
No lemon laws here but there is a non-profit Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan that makes binding decisions (****back a possiblity). It seems fairly legit, with some arguing its more or less effective than your lemon laws. However, it only gets involved when the manufacturers own complaints resolution porcess has been exhausted. So I will get BMWNA involved. All i want at this point is a timely diagnosis and installation of a new engline unless someone can convince me otherwise (and it would take alot of convincing). We have been provided a demonstator as a loaner, a nice little '11 328 that would be sweet except its too small for our family and activites (hockey etc.) and local roads (deeper snow). So today they have arranged a rental SUV which will probably be an Escape or some kind of Jeep.
Don't take the SUV yet...push for an X5 off their lot, used if they have. Once you take a 4x4suv you'll have less leverage (if driving a X5 is important to you.)
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 11-26-2010, 12:58 PM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
We insisted on an X5 (and my wife wanted our new tires transferred to it!). Not possible. "x5'
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 11-26-2010, 09:00 PM
ard ard is online now
Resident Curmudgeon
Location: Sierra foothills
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,103
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzojournalist View Post
We insisted on an X5 (and my wife wanted our new tires transferred to it!). Not possible. "x5'
Wait until BMW Canada gets involved... sure the dealer will resist.

You know you have two separate entities you are dealing with: the sloths at the dealership and BMW Canada/NA/whomever (Say, who is it in canada??) The dealer either needs to be your prompt and strong advocate, or get out of the way...let BMW know that the dealer isn't prosecuting this repair quickly and could lead to a costly issue...

Remember, it is still your car, it is yours now- you can take your tires off, you can yank the car out and move it to another dealer.

2 cents

A
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 11-26-2010, 09:57 PM
Funf Dreisig Funf Dreisig is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 404
Mein Auto: 77 530i & 09 35d
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzojournalist View Post
Well its one week later and this is what they will tell me: #6 cyl the problem. swapping injectors didnt help. there are metal filings in the oil filter(!!!). waiting for BMW to authorize removing oil pan and heads to check for further damage....
I hesitate to even mention this but...

At 24k miles your oil filter should have been changed at least twice. So there should be NO metal filings left to pick up (e.g. machining debris, etc.). Metal fur yes; fillings no. So where exactly did these metal filings come from?

The busted rod that holed the engine (in the thread that I previously linked) was #6. What you have posted so far is consistent with the sounds/damage that would occur with a similar missing/failed rod bolt BUT with shutting the engine down before the rod busted a hole in the case and froze the engine

Let's hope they drop the pan and find the culprit(s) soon.

Funf Dreisig

p.s. What has the modern mechanics life come too -- having to wait for permission to drop an oil pan to diagnose a problem?

Last edited by Funf Dreisig; 11-26-2010 at 10:00 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 11-27-2010, 12:06 AM
ard ard is online now
Resident Curmudgeon
Location: Sierra foothills
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,103
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf Dreisig View Post

p.s. What has the modern mechanics life come too -- having to wait for permission to drop an oil pan to diagnose a problem?
Could be, but how often does a dealership who wants to push off repairs to when THEY want to do it, use the old "we're waiting on BMW" excuse....
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 11-27-2010, 08:33 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Silicon Valley
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 6,575
Mein Auto: '06 X3
Gonz. Sounds like time for a "come to Jesus" sitdown with the Service Mgr, the General Mgr, the Area BMW rep and you to discuss what is going to be done and how quick that is going to happen. If you get no satisfaction (sounds like an old 'stones song) then it is time for the Barristers/Solicitors or whatever you call them up there to get involved on your behalf.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 11-28-2010, 03:53 AM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
A friday visit found them pulling the engine. They claim no authorization to replace or further diagnosis but tell me since you have to pull it anyway to drop the pan, they are trying to be a little proactive. Lots of soothing words and concern. "We are trying to do the best we can..." Its a small dealership so maybe one or two x5 in stock at any time (ie: refusal to give up as a loaner) and being a Canadian business, customer service is inherently a low priority anyway. They have provided a new Yukon (with a white stain on the seat) which will do for now. The time for a "come to Jesus" sitdown will be ASAP if nothing heard monday. Actually talked to technician for a few minutes. Decent chap. If he had to guess, he thinks maybe a leaking injector took out the rod bearing. just guessing though...
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 11-28-2010, 08:38 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Silicon Valley
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 6,575
Mein Auto: '06 X3
Sounds like a start. With luck a brand new engine is on the way up to you from S'burg by truck right now since you do not want a repaired engine. Keep us informed please.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 12-01-2010, 12:18 PM
gonzojournalist gonzojournalist is offline
Registered User
Location: winnipeg MB Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: '10 X5 35d
Had "come to Jesus" monday but only with Service Manager (S/M). Showed us old engine. Bent #6 rod. Wiped out crank. Our position: new engine. He agrees as much but decision in hands of Regional and technical people in Toronto (1000mi away). Whatever, we will sue if necessary. Called BMW Canada and ranted to them. S/M leaves msg today that they OKed new motor. Will take 10 working days to get here from the Fatherland. Problem now is they only want to warranty it for balance of original warranty (4 year/80,000 km). Vehicle has 38,000k at this point. I want something alot better. S/M says cannot do anything about that. Against dealer agreement. Our fight is with BMW Canada alone. Will keep up the pressure but at least car will be on road.
Will try and download crappy cell phone pics of engine. Everyone agrees cylender hydro'ed from bad injector but is it the injector or the software????
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Forum Navigation
Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > X Series > X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
Today's Posts Search
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:18 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2011 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms