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3 Series / 4 Series
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  #1  
Old 04-12-2002, 02:34 PM
31st330i 31st330i is offline
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dealer won't fix the parking brake squeek

this is pretty damned far fetched but they call the parking brake squeek "normal" and they went so far as to say that it's the shoe rubbing on the drum versus what I think it really is. I think it's really the edges of the parking brake shoe rubbing against the backing plate "tables" without lube.

has this fix been rejected by your dealers as well?
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  #2  
Old 04-12-2002, 02:39 PM
geomax geomax is offline
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Yes. They told me the same thing - that the squeek is "normal". But knowing them, if the engine blew up, they'd say that was "normal" well. It's shocking how unskilled most BMW dealer mechanics are. I'm not saying all, but I've met a few already that just pissed me off no end.
  #3  
Old 04-12-2002, 02:48 PM
31st330i 31st330i is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by geomax
Yes. They told me the same thing - that the squeek is "normal". But knowing them, if the engine blew up, they'd say that was "normal" well. It's shocking how unskilled most BMW dealer mechanics are. I'm not saying all, but I've met a few already that just pissed me off no end.
as a former dealership tech (who knows what questions to ask), I hate to say this but I agree. BMW seems to have taken all diagnostic decisions away from the tech, making them little more than parts changers. there apparently isn't even a wiring diagram published. if there's a problem, the tech has to plug the car into the diagnostic computer and then answer questions. the computer what makes the decision as to what is bad. supposedly if they answer the questions in a certain way, they can force a sub page of the schematic to show up.

I spoke briefly with the shop foreman at the automall dealer (fremont california) and felt that he was rather junior. I only wonder what the other techs are like.
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  #4  
Old 04-12-2002, 02:59 PM
jm8571 jm8571 is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by 31st330i


as a former dealership tech (who knows what questions to ask), I hate to say this but I agree. BMW seems to have taken all diagnostic decisions away from the tech, making them little more than parts changers.
Not just BMW all auto makers are there, or are going there. GM actually confused the techs so much, they had so scale back their strategy. This is really about dealerships hiring guys with no troubleshooting or vehicle repair experience, so cars aren't fixed, so owners complain, so the auto companies make better diagnostic systems, so the dealers higher even less qualified personel, so...and on and on.

When it comes right down to it, you can't substitute process or product for good people.
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  #5  
Old 04-12-2002, 03:15 PM
31st330i 31st330i is offline
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I'm a computer weenie now but I find that the diagnostic skills I picked up as a tech serve me to this day!

but even back in the late 80's when I was still a tech, there were only a few who could really make an accurate diagnosis. the rest of the monkies couldn't diagnose their way out of a paper bag. but THOSE are the guys that end up making more money anyway. the good guys end up doing big transmission, engine or electrical jobs usually under warranty (pays less - techs that do mostly this kind of work were measured at 95%-125% efficiency). the diagnostically challenged types that couldn't diagnose their way out of a paper bag would do things like routine services or brake changes or installation of accessories where they could run 150%-200% efficiency (earn more paid hours in a day then they actually worked).

in fact, at my last job as a tech I as at a lexus dealer. the cars were too new at the time to require any serious problem diagnosis. the top guys (brown nosers) in that shop were making betwen $65K to over $80K a year from doing mostly service work. this was in 1991.
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  #6  
Old 04-12-2002, 03:51 PM
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That's frustrating, but just as aggravating, if not moreso, are the service advisors who have never heard of any problem ever. When was the last time you took any car to any dealer and the service advisor (not a tech) actually telling you that they'e heard of this problem before?

Even during the aux fan recall, I spoke to at least 2 service advisors who had "never heard of this before" well into the recall period.

Next time I hear this, and then they ask me to hand them the keys or sign something or whatever, I'll just answer, "Oh, I'm sorry, I've never heard of that before."
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  #7  
Old 04-12-2002, 03:59 PM
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I'm having LOADS of fun trying to get VOB to do the bloody fix for the differential whine. Thankfully, their quality control guy (who is actually very nice, I've always liked HIM a lot) has heard the noise and agrees that it's a problem. Now, I have to take the car BACK next week so that the shop foreman can come on a ride with me so that he can hear it. (Assuming that all those power tools haven't blasted his hearing.) I'm still quite pissed at my service advisor, he is SUCH an asshole.
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  #8  
Old 04-12-2002, 04:48 PM
DJ DJ is offline
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I have a y2k e46 with 51k+ miles. I first had the annoying parking brake squeak when the car was at 4k miles and about 2 months old. The dealership would not fix it, saying "that's normal". I said "Gee, when I climb in and out of a new $36K car, the rear e-brake shoe shouldn't sqeak. It is not normal. My 11 year old Toyota doesn't do that". So they humored me I guess and sprayed some sort of lubricant to the e-brake cable connection.

That fixed it for a while but then it came back in all its ugliness at about 6k. So I learned to keep the e-brake off and just leave the car in gear most of the time when parked on level surfaces (like in the garage at home, parking lot a work, etc.) using it only when I really needed to.

The problem then seemed to just disappear at about 33k miles (sure, with the warranty about to expire) but it has not returned.
  #9  
Old 04-17-2002, 12:16 AM
DevHead DevHead is offline
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I wonder if my squeaks now are related to this. It squeaks when I'm braking (driving the car). Hopefully mine is just your normal squeak.

Can you elaborate more on this squeak that you speak of? TIA.
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  #10  
Old 04-17-2002, 12:46 AM
chewyb chewyb is offline
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Did you follow the owners manual

In the owners manual there are intructions for breaking in the emergency brake. I was wondering if you followed these steps and are still having the problem.
  #11  
Old 04-17-2002, 12:56 AM
31st330i 31st330i is offline
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yes, I have read the manual and am familiar with the steps. and yes, I often do that. the brake squeek sounds like its the brake shoes rubbing on un lubricated backing plate tables (assuming there are mini drum brakes inside of the disk brakes.
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  #12  
Old 04-17-2002, 07:05 AM
webguy330i webguy330i is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by DevHead
I wonder if my squeaks now are related to this. It squeaks when I'm braking (driving the car). Hopefully mine is just your normal squeak.

Can you elaborate more on this squeak that you speak of? TIA.
The ebrake is actually a drum brake on the inside of the brake caliper, which is what gets used when you press the brake pedal. So the squeaking you're hearing (more like squealing I imagine) is not related to the ebrake.

On a side note, my rear squeak has returned as well. You may recall a thread back in Feb. describing how they lubed the rear suspension and honestly, I didn't have the squeak for probably another month or so (unless I psycologically blocked it or something). I have noticed that if I don't engage the ebrake though, it will not squeak.

I've just learned to live with it. =/
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  #13  
Old 04-17-2002, 08:30 AM
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same here. "We have no knowledge of this problem"
  #14  
Old 04-17-2002, 04:01 PM
ESS ESS is offline
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I have the annoying parking brake squeak also. My car will be due for its first scheduled oil change in about a week. I will post my dealers response to the squeak.

The squeak can be pretty embarassing. I park next to a Porche Boxter at work every morning and the driver has heard my Bimmer squeak several times when I'm exiting.
  #15  
Old 04-17-2002, 06:00 PM
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DrBimmer DrBimmer is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by jm8571
When it comes right down to it, you can't substitute process or product for good people.
Why don't they get "good" people? Well, they can't afford them. Everyone here is quick to bash the dealer's service prices for anything from an oil change to a brake job, yet you have to see what that is paying for. It pays for BMW parts, BMW trained techs and a full warranty on the repairs. If everyone is going to keep complaining that dealers charge too much (Anyone notice how much their lawyer charges by the hour??) then the dealer won't hire the best techs as they can't afford to pay them well, and then the quality of the diagnoses from the poor techs will be meager at best, which is what requires BMW to create software to troubleshoot the car. And after seeing the computer at work, it is in everyone's interest. That thing will trace a problem in a car faster than almost any BMW tech I know. Problem is that even with the computer, some techs can't get it straight.
  #16  
Old 04-17-2002, 06:56 PM
Nat Brown Nat Brown is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by DrBimmer


Why don't they get "good" people? Well, they can't afford them. Everyone here is quick to bash the dealer's service prices for anything from an oil change to a brake job, yet you have to see what that is paying for. It pays for BMW parts, BMW trained techs and a full warranty on the repairs. If everyone is going to keep complaining that dealers charge too much (Anyone notice how much their lawyer charges by the hour??) then the dealer won't hire the best techs as they can't afford to pay them well, and then the quality of the diagnoses from the poor techs will be meager at best, which is what requires BMW to create software to troubleshoot the car. And after seeing the computer at work, it is in everyone's interest. That thing will trace a problem in a car faster than almost any BMW tech I know. Problem is that even with the computer, some techs can't get it straight.
I can't say I agree with that. My local dealers charge $125/hour for labor, compared to better quality non-dealership techs across town that charge $90/hour. BMW, which has the highest profit margins in the auto industry, at 9%, should invest some of their monstrous profits into better training and diagnostics.

Meanwhile, they'll see my car for service and warranty repairs, but if it falls out of those two categories, the non-certified techs will get my business. They do a better job and don't give me excuses.

--gary
  #17  
Old 04-18-2002, 06:36 PM
DevHead DevHead is offline
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Hmmm, I hope this issue doesn't bite me (ebrake squeak). Regular brake squeaks are enough to handle. Aaack!
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