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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
The new chapter in the highly successful story of the BMW 5 Series Sedan (F10) and wagon (F11)

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  #26  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:24 PM
Rafa Rafa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nosnoop View Post
No, it is not bad at all.
And you can pretty much ignore whatever sambb posted here or in any other threads.
+1. sambb's mission in life seems to be badmouthing all things BMW. Read as many posts as you can in as many threads as are of interest to you, and judge for yourself.
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  #27  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:43 PM
sambb sambb is offline
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here is the link to jd power quality, but it isnt 2011...
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ings-by-brand/
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  #28  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:55 PM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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Samba, will you PLEASE shut up and stop posting. You are no expert to give any advise, just a fool.
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  #29  
Old 12-05-2010, 08:01 PM
sambb sambb is offline
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for the op: again, we haven't had reliability problems with the one I have driven, but consider the jD power report closely - they are the experts, not us. There are a group of posters here, however, who have had several issues. It is tough without BMW admitting the actual problems... we have been down that road with the HPFP before. nevertheless, 3 stars on the JD power quality ranking isn't bad, just not at the level that we would want. Heck, we want BMW to be 5 stars. It is unfortunate that the 2010 initial quality is below ford, mercedes, lexus,etc. Maybe 2011 models fare better, time will tell. I have owned 7 BMWs over he last ~25 years, the only bad one was the 335i, although i have had several little things in all of them. The f10 in my family has been ok, but JD ppower are the experts.

Last edited by sambb; 12-05-2010 at 08:06 PM.
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  #30  
Old 12-05-2010, 08:01 PM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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What a gool

Please stop posting. You know nothing since you don't even own a BMW. Take your opinions and comments to another forum. Btw, why are you on this anyway and posting so much. Don't you have better things in life.
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  #31  
Old 12-05-2010, 08:07 PM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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What a goof

Please stop posting. You know nothing since you don't even own a BMW. Take your opinions and comments to another forum. Btw, why are you on this anyway and posting so much. Don't you have better things in life.
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  #32  
Old 12-05-2010, 08:17 PM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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Please stop your postings.
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  #33  
Old 12-06-2010, 05:08 AM
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Needsdecaf Needsdecaf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sambb View Post
here is the link to jd power quality, but it isnt 2011...
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ings-by-brand/
From Consumer Reports December 2010 Issue, BMW is not in good shape quality wise.

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  #34  
Old 12-06-2010, 05:12 AM
sambb sambb is offline
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Originally Posted by Needsdecaf View Post
From Consumer Reports December 2010 Issue, BMW is not in good shape quality wise.

Not just BMW! Mercedes and Audi as well! WOW this is really eye opening! Makes sense however, between the HPFP issue and the new model year issues. Hopefully things will improve in 2012!
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  #35  
Old 12-06-2010, 05:46 AM
pharding pharding is offline
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Thanks for posting the chart. Today I am going to trade my 2011 550i for a Scion. Also what is Scion?

Seriously, what matters to me is my experience with BMW over the last 10 years. 4 5ers for me, 1 3er for my son, and 1 3er that my company leased for an employee. 6 BMW's in 10 years. The experience has been great. Problems were very rare and promptly taken care of. BMW build quality has been great along with their customer commitment.
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Last edited by pharding; 12-06-2010 at 05:57 AM.
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  #36  
Old 12-06-2010, 06:27 AM
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Needsdecaf Needsdecaf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pharding View Post
Thanks for posting the chart. Today I am going to trade my 2011 550i for a Scion. Also what is Scion?

Seriously, what matters to me is my experience with BMW over the last 10 years. 4 5ers for me, 1 3er for my son, and 1 3er that my company leased for an employee. 6 BMW's in 10 years. The experience has been great. Problems were very rare and promptly taken care of. BMW build quality has been great along with their customer commitment.
Consumer Reports is what it is. I take it with a large grain of salt, as they tend to paint with a broad brush. Note the variability of the reports...some have very large ranges of good to bad.

As you said, what matters to YOU is YOUR track record. Also, what also matters is how the company handles said problems as well, something that is NOT tracked in this report.
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  #37  
Old 12-06-2010, 07:44 AM
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I find BMW UK, take much better care of there customers than an other main dealership We have delt with.
Out of interest new cars we have bought are from; Lexus,Audi,Ford,Jaguar,Nissan, and BMW.
Ooops forgot "HONDA" and that was the second best.
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  #38  
Old 12-06-2010, 10:04 AM
sambb sambb is offline
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What is amazing about the graph is the broad range of BMW. Some are way above average, some are way below, and the overall reliability is pretty low - but other german marques are nearby in this rating. I hope that all can have reliable cars, having dealt with one unreliable BMW, it is a nightmare. An absolute nightmare.
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  #39  
Old 12-06-2010, 10:54 AM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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What car did you have

What year and MAKE of BMW are did you have your NIGHTMARES with-- I think everyone would like to know since you seem not to be able to stop complaining about your nightmare BMW.
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  #40  
Old 12-06-2010, 11:15 AM
sambb sambb is offline
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i have stated several times that my most unreliable BMW has been a 335i coupe. I have had several reliable ones as well. Some in between. Dating back to the early 80s. I have had 7 different, and in my family we have had 9 BMWs. I usually would not recommend keeping out of warranty generally.
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  #41  
Old 12-06-2010, 11:17 AM
tdepetra tdepetra is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sambb View Post
What is amazing about the graph is the broad range of BMW. Some are way above average, some are way below, and the overall reliability is pretty low - but other german marques are nearby in this rating. I hope that all can have reliable cars, having dealt with one unreliable BMW, it is a nightmare. An absolute nightmare.
I'll show you a nightmare: Audi A8 Quattro. From 8,000 - 82,000 miles - head gasket replacements on both sides, bad steering rack, Quattro and transmission leaks, alternator replacement, two sets of brake rotors due to service mistakes, six flatbed rides to the dealer (all leaving me stranded, as opposed to being "garage" events), and $9,200 in repairs in the last six months of ownership. That doesn't include about a $11,000 hit above and beyond normal depreciation, or the fact that the dealer service department continuously lied to me about their own mistakes.

I love my defect-free F10 after almost 5,000 miles.
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  #42  
Old 12-06-2010, 11:19 AM
sambb sambb is offline
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Originally Posted by tdepetra View Post
I'll show you a nightmare: Audi A8 Quattro. From 8,000 - 82,000 miles - head gasket replacements on both sides, bad steering rack, Quattro and transmission leaks, alternator replacement, two sets of brake rotors due to service mistakes, six flatbed rides to the dealer (all leaving me stranded, as opposed to being "garage" events), and $9,200 in repairs in the last six months of ownership. That doesn't include about a $11,000 hit above and beyond normal depreciation, or the fact that the dealer service department continuously lied to me about their own mistakes.

I love my defect-free F10 after almost 5,000 miles.
yep that is terrible as well, seems like a warranty would have made it easier on you. best of luck with your new car.
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  #43  
Old 12-06-2010, 01:06 PM
anthony@empireleasing anthony@empireleasing is offline
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I have delivered three mercedes in the past most all with problems from the start...keys not working, steering columns not moving, power dorr locks not functioning....all annoying as if nobody checks mercedes on the way out of the factory. I do not see this when i deliver BMWs thats why I drive only BMW ( although we have a subaru for the winter months) The quality is great. I wish they would stop doing stupid stuff like cancelling options when you upgrade IE no side bolster adjustment when you order the more expensive seats and the changing for parts like the combox if they had it for sept the should have had it to begin with. asides from that I think they take pride in their quality and try to continually improve.
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  #44  
Old 12-06-2010, 02:36 PM
sambb sambb is offline
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It will be interesting to see what the f10 reliability is over the next few years, given the degree of tech in it, and accounting for first year hiccups. Clearly BMW has some room to move up on the reliability scale. I bet they will, as repairs get expensive over time and the 5 series is a hiuge cash cow for them.
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  #45  
Old 12-06-2010, 05:14 PM
pharding pharding is offline
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sambb Why do you spend so much of your precious time here spewing your boundless negativity about BMW? You are amazing. You should find something that you feel positive about in life and pursue that.
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04 Successfully lobbied BMW NA and BMW FS to prohibit dealers from using residual values based upon Euro Delivery MSRP and to use US MSRP saving BMW Enthusiasts several thousand dollars on each lease

14 550i Euro Del
14 X3 2.8i
11 550i Euro Del, Retired
08 550i Euro Del, Retired
06 330i Euro Del, Retired
04 545i Euro Del, Retired
01 530i Euro Del, Retired

Last edited by pharding; 12-06-2010 at 05:15 PM.
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  #46  
Old 12-06-2010, 05:56 PM
Stanesq Stanesq is offline
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You say you don't like the car and bash it, but what about your boyfriend? Does he like driving the car?



Quote:
Originally Posted by sambb View Post
Well, I dont know for sure, only BMW knows. But there are lots of issues in cars (generally) in the first year. Dont know if it applies to the f10.
I also would anticipate that BMW will respond to the sports sedan issue, based on reviews by car and driver and consumer reports of the f10.
Based on these 2 things, one may want to reconsider the car. On the other hand, if you really like the car, then you may be the ideal target and you should buy (provided you dont get scared off by first year model year issues).
One could also consider a short term lease, so one is not committed to the car. There are options.

I have driven the f10 about 700 miles, the longest stretch was a 350 mile highway drive. Haven;t had reliability issues in my family member's car, except some steering grind, which we haven't really gone to the dealer for.
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  #47  
Old 12-06-2010, 06:33 PM
sambb sambb is offline
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Originally Posted by pharding View Post
sambb Why do you spend so much of your precious time here spewing your boundless negativity about BMW? You are amazing. You should find something that you feel positive about in life and pursue that.
i don't believe being hopeful about BMWs future is negative, thanks for your comment however.
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  #48  
Old 12-07-2010, 03:48 PM
lawbuz lawbuz is offline
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Someone above said that the steering issues were definitely addressed in the post-September builds. What exactly does that mean? Does that mean that the alignment/car drifting to the right matter was addressed or that the steering was made tighter and more sporty?

From my conversation with the BMW service and sales guys, nothing can be done about steering feel. BMW can adjust it so that you have to work harder to steer (less steering assist) but that adjustment does NOT make the car more communicative. Therefore, I don't see any change in the sportiness of the car in the 2012 model. This is not necessarily a bad thing, however. I'm getting accustomed to the easier steering and actually kinda find it comfortable, even if it's a bit boring and disengaged at times. Personal preferences.
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  #49  
Old 12-08-2010, 12:02 AM
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K-A K-A is offline
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Originally Posted by sambb View Post
Well, we dont have any data on how bad it is actually, but we do know that BMW quality ha slipped. I am not sure that there are stats on the f10 reliability, but there certainly have been problems reported here from steering, to pulling right, to grinding, and of course the handling issues as well. Those have been reported by others, not me.
Are you implying that the F10 is launching with more hiccups than the E60 did?

I didn't follow BMW much during the "Bangle Years", but I know that the early 2000's were a horrible quality period from most Euro Automakers . M-B in particular, had a hugely problematic launch of the W211 E-Class, and from what I understand, the early E60's were works in progresses in some respects themselves.

I know, as one company gets much better, others in competition must follow. M-B's newest offerings have improved dramatically, and the new E-Class has been virtually perfect, relative to what a German automakers tech-savvy first MY Luxo car would normally be, before. Even Jaguar has been making large strides towards improving (thanks to Ford, we'll see what Tata does).

On the flip side, as these tech features keep dominating cars, and cars get more complex, there are more things that can break, and that will cost more to fix.
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Last edited by K-A; 12-08-2010 at 12:04 AM.
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  #50  
Old 12-08-2010, 03:21 AM
sambb sambb is offline
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Originally Posted by K-A View Post
Are you implying that the F10 is launching with more hiccups than the E60 did?

I didn't follow BMW much during the "Bangle Years", but I know that the early 2000's were a horrible quality period from most Euro Automakers . M-B in particular, had a hugely problematic launch of the W211 E-Class, and from what I understand, the early E60's were works in progresses in some respects themselves.

I know, as one company gets much better, others in competition must follow. M-B's newest offerings have improved dramatically, and the new E-Class has been virtually perfect, relative to what a German automakers tech-savvy first MY Luxo car would normally be, before. Even Jaguar has been making large strides towards improving (thanks to Ford, we'll see what Tata does).

On the flip side, as these tech features keep dominating cars, and cars get more complex, there are more things that can break, and that will cost more to fix.
I dont recall a time that BMW has been this low in quality rankings that are objective. However, maybe one can dig up old jd power reports. NEvertheless, we all should be concerned about new releases given the low initial quality reported by jd power and consumer reports. It is a cautionary note. Then, when i see the steering issues and handling issues, concern is inevitable for the enthusiast.
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