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X3 F25 (2011 - current)
The latest X3 brings some added style and some new features to the BMW SUV family. Talk about the new F25 now!

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  #1  
Old 02-01-2011, 11:52 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
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3.5td in the US 2012 X3?

I read over on the X5 board that in 2012 BMW will be moving the X5 to a 4.0 diesel and the current 35d will be available in the X3. Don't know how valid that is, but it would make a lot of sense especially since future gas prices will almost certainly rise and the CAFE would be helped by the higher mileage diesels. I suspect that if BMW is considering that then we can expect VW/Audi, Volvo, and MB (GLK) to be thinking of doing that too. Personally I can't believe that the Tiguan already does not have the excellent 2.0tdi here. We could be seeing some really interesting oil burners in the next couple of years.

Last edited by UncleJ; 02-02-2011 at 07:04 AM.
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  #2  
Old 02-01-2011, 01:12 PM
06BMWX3 06BMWX3 is offline
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That would be soooo much win, I would get one in a flash!! If the Tiguan would of been available with the TDI back then, that's what I would be driving.
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  #3  
Old 02-02-2011, 08:54 AM
enamoured enamoured is offline
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My excitement about VW TDI waned after reading their HPFP issues. Just google vw tdi hpfp issue. It seems even worse than BMW 335i/535i HPFP issue. VW doesn't acknowledge it as a part problem either.

At least 335d and X5 3.5d owners are not reporting any issues so far. Even Mercedes has low pressure fuel pump issue with their TDI on R-class and GL.
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Last edited by enamoured; 02-02-2011 at 08:56 AM.
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Old 02-02-2011, 09:05 AM
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LMC LMC is offline
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The 40d and 35d are more-powerful variations of the inline 3.0 Turbodiesel. Basically there are two BMW Diesel engines: a 4 cyl 2-liter and a 6 cyl 3-liter, which are produced in a wide variety of outputs.

Perhaps it has been long enough since the intro of the US-spec Diesel that BMW is ready to broaden the line in the USA.
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  #5  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:08 AM
06BMWX3 06BMWX3 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enamoured View Post
My excitement about VW TDI waned after reading their HPFP issues. Just google vw tdi hpfp issue. It seems even worse than BMW 335i/535i HPFP issue. VW doesn't acknowledge it as a part problem either.

Very odd, cause i'm on my 4th TDI (my current second car is a Golf TDi) and never had issues with HPFP. I know it was a problem on '06-'07, 2.0T, but never on the TDi!!

So far, in all honesty, my TDI's were VERY reliable cars. Just to bad the dealers doesn't reflect that.....lol
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Old 02-02-2011, 09:45 AM
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If the X3 did come in a big turbo-six variant, it would be substantially more expensive than the xDrive35i, raising complaints about BMW's pricing strategy and potentially suffering a similar fate to the unpopular 335d. I can imagine a "moderately" optioned X3 xDrive35d (let's say premium paket, Tech paket, Satellite Radio) coming close to $55k, running into X5 diesel territory.

There is a X3 xDrive30d that's orderable in Europe now, but I doubt that will make it over here due to certification and modification requirements.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:18 AM
DarienJim DarienJim is offline
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Are you not concerned that when gas prices push up, there is a shortage of diesel fuel and its prices actually exceed gas prices?
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:35 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
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Yes, that can be a problem however the higher mileage from the diesel negates the increased fuel cost to a great degree. Most of the time in my memory diesel has been about the same price as "regular" gas, however it does fluctuate and right now is right around the "premium" gas price (around here). The dropping into the X3 of the current X5 diesel would pose no problem, it is already certified in the US and would fit nicely in the engine bay.
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Old 02-03-2011, 10:05 AM
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Using the M57 diesel engine would necessitate using the older ZF 6-speed AT, which would be more engineering work since none of the X3s use that gearbox. The last time BMW tried to slot in a new drivetrain, we all know how that went with the 2007 X3.
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Old 02-03-2011, 10:22 AM
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Which might mean that we get the dream drivetrain -- 3.5 TD with a 6MT. SCHWIIING!!!
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Old 02-03-2011, 10:58 AM
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Which might mean that we get the dream drivetrain -- 3.5 TD with a 6MT. SCHWIIING!!!
The reason the M57 was never offered anywhere with the MT was because no MT could handle the torque. There's ever-decreasing demand for MT especially in the truck segment. That's why only the xDrive20d is offered with it.
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Old 02-03-2011, 11:01 AM
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killjoy
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Old 02-03-2011, 11:45 AM
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killjoy
I think it would be possible. Just treat the 6-sp manual tranny with special molybdenum-unobtainium stuff before assembly! Done!
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  #14  
Old 02-03-2011, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by UncleJ View Post
Yes, that can be a problem however the higher mileage from the diesel negates the increased fuel cost to a great degree. Most of the time in my memory diesel has been about the same price as "regular" gas, however it does fluctuate and right now is right around the "premium" gas price (around here). The dropping into the X3 of the current X5 diesel would pose no problem, it is already certified in the US and would fit nicely in the engine bay.
Diesel is already higher priced than premium gas in NH!


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Old 02-03-2011, 03:47 PM
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I test drove the 335d and it drove like a dream with devastating torque! Mating that drivetrain into the X3 would be wonderful, however I remember reading the recent consumer report on the X5 tdi the reliability was much worse than avg. Besides, you'll need to fill urea every 10K or so; that's extra cost and inconvenience, you might be better off getting the 35i turbo engine.
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Old 02-03-2011, 04:48 PM
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Jeez the rest of the world seems to have this figuredd out. Seriously guys why the frick is it so hard for us to get a good diesel engine with our choice of tranny?
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Old 02-03-2011, 06:36 PM
e90diesel e90diesel is offline
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Originally Posted by AzNMpower32 View Post
Using the M57 diesel engine would necessitate using the older ZF 6-speed AT, which would be more engineering work since none of the X3s use that gearbox. The last time BMW tried to slot in a new drivetrain, we all know how that went with the 2007 X3.
Why wouldn't the new 8 speed work? Are you saying that it would be cost prohibitive for BMW to certify the m57/ zf 8 speed for our USA emissions ? If so I'm very curious, do you know approximately what that cost is? Thanks.

Last edited by e90diesel; 02-03-2011 at 06:58 PM.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:41 PM
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Why wouldn't the new 8 speed work? Are you saying that it would be cost prohibitive for BMW to certify the m57/ zf 8 speed for our USA emissions ? If so I'm very curious, do you know approximately what that cost is? Thanks.
Generally, a motor is paired with a transmission, at least with BMW. The N57 turbodiesel (currently in the X5 and X6 xDrive40d sold since late 2010) uses the 8-speed transmission. However, that engine is not certified for the US and doesn't have the urea injection system needed to pass California emission standards.
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:30 PM
e90diesel e90diesel is offline
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The N52 found in the x3 28i had been around for some time with various transmissions prior to being placed into service with an 8 speed for the first time.

My point is that the same thing could happen with the M57/ 8 speed.

It is an awesome engine, BMW went to a lot of trouble to modify the M57 for the US market ( off set wrist pins, structural stiffening to reduce noise) The N57 came out about the same time BMW released the first 335d/ 35d to the US. They went with the M57 because it is a proven design. I do think we will see the N57 in the future.


The parts used in the DEF (urea) system are not engine components. They are part of the exhaust system here in the USA. The system would work fine with the N57, if anything it would use less DEF because the N57 runs a little cleaner than the M57.
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Old 02-05-2011, 12:53 AM
vase330 vase330 is offline
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Mercedes is bringing the 3.0d GLK they have in Europe stateside next year. BMW will abviously not want to be left behind and will want to one up Merc, you can bet on it. The GLK has 7-speed, you will get your diesel with an 8-speed; That you can be sure of. I just renewed my RAV4 registration for another 2yrs and waiting on the diesel patiently.
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Old 02-05-2011, 12:58 AM
vase330 vase330 is offline
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Originally Posted by AzNMpower32 View Post
Generally, a motor is paired with a transmission, at least with BMW. The N57 turbodiesel (currently in the X5 and X6 xDrive40d sold since late 2010) uses the 8-speed transmission. However, that engine is not certified for the US and doesn't have the urea injection system needed to pass California emission standards.
You do realize that the 40d is just a more highly tuned 35d which is just more highly tuned 30d no? In fact the only difference is the ECU just like the 328i vs 330ci were same exact engine save foe ECU and more aggressive cams on the 330. Nothing new here, BMW does this a lot. Its all marketing. Cost of making the 40d is probably exactly same as 35d, but that extra 5d creates a perception gap, and for that they charge a lot more for the car.
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Old 02-05-2011, 07:00 AM
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Originally Posted by vase330 View Post
You do realize that the 40d is just a more highly tuned 35d which is just more highly tuned 30d no? In fact the only difference is the ECU just like the 328i vs 330ci were same exact engine save foe ECU and more aggressive cams on the 330. Nothing new here, BMW does this a lot. Its all marketing. Cost of making the 40d is probably exactly same as 35d, but that extra 5d creates a perception gap, and for that they charge a lot more for the car.
The 40d is a new engine, the N57. The 35d (or known as the 3.0sd) was a 10-year old M57 engine.
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Old 02-05-2011, 07:44 AM
e90diesel e90diesel is offline
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Originally Posted by vase330 View Post
Mercedes is bringing the 3.0d GLK they have in Europe stateside next year. BMW will abviously not want to be left behind and will want to one up Merc, you can bet on it. The GLK has 7-speed, you will get your diesel with an 8-speed; That you can be sure of. I just renewed my RAV4 registration for another 2yrs and waiting on the diesel patiently.
I recently read that Mercedes will offer the GLK diesel in the USA later this year. It sounds like it will be there 2.15 L version that puts out 369 lb ft of torque!!! The looks are questionable, but the thing is built like a tank. The IIHS roof crush test results are extremely impressive! If BMW doesn't get it in gear I might jump ship for the GLK.
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Old 02-05-2011, 08:01 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
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The looks may be questionable but they are growing on me. I see more and more of the GLK's around and they are looking really good. I also have been seeing lots of Q5's which IMHO look so much better than the Q7, which seems out of proportion somehow, like the R class. Must be that Teutonic "art deco" rear end treatment. The EX35 is rumored to get the uprated 335 hp V6 too and that will be an interesting car. Not a diesel unfortunately but a runner for sure.
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Old 02-05-2011, 09:59 AM
e90diesel e90diesel is offline
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[QUOTE=UncleJ;5826624]The looks may be questionable but they are growing on me.

I agree!
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