Consumer Report Rates X5 as Worst of the WORST

"You are not driving it enough!" "They all do that" "We have never seen that problem before" Are all topics in the Service Advisor Course offered by BMW U.

My bulletproof Honda died.

Need a tow to the dealer. It is fairly new car (50Kmiles), sounded like the timing chain broke.

I sure hope that now my X5 (4Kmiles) doesn't do the same.

no.

Wow...after reading all of this, I am seriously tempted to call my husband up right now and tell him to go ahead and get a 3rd car! That way, if my X5d is in the shop, I have a spare to drive! Not too worried about it though, I am a stay at home mom and would much prefer to be without a car a day or two, but have TONS of fun driving....then have a boring, car. We traded an 05 H2 & Challenger SRT8 for my x5D, and all I can say is it is the perfect combination of both. I have enough room for the family, but it is a total BLAST to drive. It's my mini-vacation of the day!

The Consumer Report is just one of many tools to assist your decision making; its anything but accurate. Do most people watch movies based on critics' reviews...I don't. Its whatever appeals to my 6 senses and bank account. The accuracy of this survey is dependent on a multitude of extrinsic and intrinsic variables: sample size, demographic, social-economic, traits of drivers, etc. Some drivers are more spirited than others on asphalt--> thus more attrition to the parts--> more time and money spent with the Service Center. Others will intentionally or unintentionally neglect the recommended maintenance schedule---> more time and $$ for repairs. If the "happy meter" survey is based on time and money spent by these drivers, the survey results will not be favorable.

Originally Posted by caden

Do most people watch movies based on critics' reviews...I don't.

Actually, most people react to reviews, news, facts, whatever, in the same way. They have a lot of confidence in that which agrees with their preconceived notions of the truth, and find some reasoning that allows them to completely ignore anything that doesn't agree with them. For most people, buying a luxury car is about emotion as much as anything. If one really wants a BMW (or wants to validate a previous purchase), that person will rationalize reports from JD Power, Consumer Reports, etc., as being biased in some way and not reflective of reality. But people have a hard time admitting that they do this, because it makes them sound less rational.

Originally Posted by caden

The accuracy of this survey is dependent on a multitude of extrinsic and intrinsic variables: sample size, demographic, social-economic, traits of drivers, etc.

It's a report based on owners of new BMWs. I'm going out on a limb and say the demographic is mostly educated people with a pretty substantial income who get free maintenance for four years and who like cars a lot.

The E70 has not been as reliable as others in its class (whatever that is). Give it up. Admit that you wanted it because of the blue and white badge on the hood and the way it drives, and nothing anyone said about reliability was going to change your mind. You will feel better.

Full disclosure: I bought mine because of the blue and white badge on the hood and the way it drives. Oh, and because BMW Welt in Munich was really cool.

[QUOTE=weasel_atty;5943684
Admit that you wanted it because of the blue and white badge on the hood and the way it drives, and nothing anyone said about reliability was going to change your mind. /QUOTE]

+++1

I'm in the market to either get a used 2007-2010 x5 or a new x3. Current car is an 2002 RX300. Decided it was time to go for something a bit sportier.

While I don't take CR as complete gospel, I do trust their reliability testing. Even though they give x5 a low reliability rating, it doesn't mean the vehicle is totally unreliable. Resale value is pretty good which suggests to me that reliability, while lower, isn't as bad as say Range Rover Sport. RR Sport would be my first pick but reliability is so bad, I won't go there.

It's a matter of tolerance. Just like with movies, if both critics and users reviews are bad, I won't bother. But if users review are pretty good while critics are lukewarm, I might give the movie a shot. Right now, I'm trying to see if the 2010 is more reliable than 2007. That appears to be the case, according to JD Powers. Even moreso, the x3 appear to score better than x5. So it's looking right now like the new bigger x3 fully loaded with extended warranty might be my best bet.

Yep, had the new X3 been avail when I signed the papers for the X5, I would have gotten it instead. Way too many X5s running around where I live. But no regrets what so ever, it has been running like a dream. All the posts where people report multiple problems one after another, unfortunate you've got a dud. But when you get one that's made right, what a pleasure it is to be the owner.

PotOdd, remember the X3 moved from Austria to S'burg for assembly with this year's model. There will be teething problems so the reliability for the first year or so may be suspect. A new model, a new plant, an unfamiliar (with the platform) workforce all is going to require some "working in" to get things right. While the new X3 by all accounts is a vast improvement over the old one (the 35 has the same 0-60 time as the X5 50) it is still a newby and I for one would wait until it gets sorted out a bit more.

True, but I don't know if I want to wait for 2012. Also the engine isn't new so that's the main concern. One thing about the Lexus, is that the interior is top notch, need to make sure x3 is as good as x5. Don't want to go back to plastic

Originally Posted by UncleJ

PotOdd, remember the X3 moved from Austria to S'burg for assembly with this year's model. There will be teething problems so the reliability for the first year or so may be suspect. A new model, a new plant, an unfamiliar (with the platform) workforce all is going to require some "working in" to get things right. While the new X3 by all accounts is a vast improvement over the old one (the 35 has the same 0-60 time as the X5 50) it is still a newby and I for one would wait until it gets sorted out a bit more.

Originally Posted by PotOdds

One thing about the Lexus, is that the interior is top notch, need to make sure x3 is as good as x5. Don't want to go back to plastic

I'm sure the X3 interior will be able to hold its own against the X5. Meaning, it will probably peel. http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...terior+peeling

Originally Posted by weasel_atty

actually, most people react to reviews, news, facts, whatever, in the same way. They have a lot of confidence in that which agrees with their preconceived notions of the truth, and find some reasoning that allows them to completely ignore anything that doesn't agree with them. For most people, buying a luxury car is about emotion as much as anything. If one really wants a bmw (or wants to validate a previous purchase), that person will rationalize reports from jd power, consumer reports, etc., as being biased in some way and not reflective of reality. But people have a hard time admitting that they do this, because it makes them sound less rational.



It's a report based on owners of new bmws. I'm going out on a limb and say the demographic is mostly educated people with a pretty substantial income who get free maintenance for four years and who like cars a lot.

The e70 has not been as reliable as others in its class (whatever that is). Give it up. Admit that you wanted it because of the blue and white badge on the hood and the way it drives, and nothing anyone said about reliability was going to change your mind. You will feel better.

Full disclosure: I bought mine because of the blue and white badge on the hood and the way it drives. Oh, and because bmw welt in munich was really cool.

+1000

Originally Posted by caden

The Consumer Report is just one of many tools to assist your decision making; its anything but accurate. Do most people watch movies based on critics' reviews...I don't. Its whatever appeals to my 6 senses and bank account. The accuracy of this survey is dependent on a multitude of extrinsic and intrinsic variables: sample size, demographic, social-economic, traits of drivers, etc. Some drivers are more spirited than others on asphalt--> thus more attrition to the parts--> more time and money spent with the Service Center. Others will intentionally or unintentionally neglect the recommended maintenance schedule---> more time and $$ for repairs. If the "happy meter" survey is based on time and money spent by these drivers, the survey results will not be favorable.

Originally Posted by weasel_atty

Actually, most people react to reviews, news, facts, whatever, in the same way. They have a lot of confidence in that which agrees with their preconceived notions of the truth, and find some reasoning that allows them to completely ignore anything that doesn't agree with them. For most people, buying a luxury car is about emotion as much as anything.

It's a report based on owners of new BMWs. I'm going out on a limb and say the demographic is mostly educated people with a pretty substantial income who get free maintenance for four years and who like cars a lot.

All of above are good points. The data is what it is -- survey results of reported complaints. The weaknesses are that each car category has a different set of cohorts of owners. A case in point would be that a typical BMW owner would be one to point out and notice every single squeak and rattle. As opposed to the Toyota driver, who knows nothing, or cares to know about cars, not tell the difference between the gas and the brake (bad joke, sorry).

Without a doubt, it still tells us though that X5s are 80% more likely to be in the shop than the average car (I have a copy of the actual magazine and data) -- and the majority of reasons are due to audio system problems. I think overall it is a good car depending on the perspective, but I think too that BMW needs to fix this perception. Of note, cars have been more reliable than they have ever been in the history of cars.

Cars are sometimes chosen based on how they resonate emotionally, another good point. Like someone buying a house based on how good the interiors were designed and how cute the drapes matched the colors in the living room, but without knowledge as to how rusted out the plumbing was.

Learning points: (1) People have to make a well-informed choice when buying the car, and consumer reports is one such source of information. (2) know what you want in a car and judge whether pros like sportiness and image outweigh risks of this so-called low reliability. (3) don't bitch about making the trip to the shop when the unreliable car turns out to be, well, unreliable.

Originally Posted by weasel_atty;5958911 it will probably peel. [url

What's with the steering wheel paint peeling? All my bimmers have had this issue...maybe the high torque is to blame for the separation....

Originally Posted by Inline Sixer

don't bitch about making the trip to the shop when the unreliable car turns out to be, well, unreliable.

I'm an attorney. I spent years in school learning to bitch, followed by years in big law firms gaining bitching expertise. And I live in California, where we pass voter propositions that are nothing more than bitching which becomes an amendment to the state constitution. Don't think I'm going to sit idly by while you try to take bitching away from me.

Originally Posted by caden

What's with the steering wheel paint peeling? All my bimmers have had this issue...maybe the high torque is to blame for the separation....

It's your fault. It is either the pH of your skin or your hand cream. You need to buy a pair of BMW cotton gloves.

Originally Posted by weasel_atty

I'm an attorney. I spent years in school learning to bitch, followed by years in big law firms gaining bitching expertise. And I live in California, where we pass voter propositions that are nothing more than bitching which becomes an amendment to the state constitution. Don't think I'm going to sit idly by while you try to take bitching away from me.



It's your fault. It is either the pH of your skin or your hand cream. You need to buy a pair of BMW cotton gloves.

i sometimes forget bitching is a national pastime, and you sir, are an expert!

Originally Posted by rattmann

My bulletproof Honda died.

Need a tow to the dealer. It is fairly new car (50Kmiles), sounded like the timing chain broke.

I sure hope that now my X5 (4Kmiles) doesn't do the same.

NO Sweat

HONDA gave me a Brand NEW engine under warranty.

Well the iPhone does kinda suck, can u blame CR for not recommending it. Get an Evo4G on Sprint ull be much happier in life!

Sent from my PC36100 using Bimmer App

Weasle, and the courts overturn the state constitution amendments (and the expressed will of the people at the polls) with regularity! Oh yes, it is the Ph of your skin and it is your fault -- also you are not driving it enough, they all do that, and we have never seen this before. The '11 Cayenne S may be an acceptable alternative however.