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E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #26  
Old 03-18-2011, 08:20 AM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Also this E46 Oil Pan Gasket DIY shows you how to use the engine hoist:
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=665810

This picture tells it all, the oil pump and pickup tube are in the way, otherwise, you can simply slide the gasket in (w/o removing the subframe). This goes back to my post above about cutting the gasket in half.


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  #27  
Old 03-18-2011, 09:20 AM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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So that it won't get lost and the effort expended by cn90 and any followups are not wasted, over time, I added the following pointer to the bestlinks containing cn90's astute suggestions!

- How to fix broken or stripped oil drain pan plug bolt threads (0) (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) (11) (12) (13) (14) (15) (16) (17) (18) & replacing the oil pan & BMW E39 oil pan gasket DIY (1) (2) without removing the I6 subframe (3) & how to isolate & fix OFH oil filter housing leaks (1) (2) (3) (4) & how to make your own engine hoist and engine support (1) when removing the subframe or I6 oil pan
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  #28  
Old 03-18-2011, 09:42 AM
franka franka is offline
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The factory, robotic applied, liquid gaskets, are an epoxy like substance with 2 or 3 part components mixed in the application nozzle. You will not find those quality of 'sealants' at your local hardware store.

Also, they are typically used between two casting so that when mated there is no scalloping of either part like you would get with a sheet metal part. Plus many have grooves in the casting so the two castings can tighten face to face.

I like the idea expressed in the above posts to save time, but its not as simple as squeezing out a tube of sealant in place of the gasket. Plus I'm not saying it will not work. I'm just posting what is done at some factories.
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  #29  
Old 03-18-2011, 10:15 AM
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nyclad nyclad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 559eddie559 View Post
I have personally changed my oil pan gasket about two weeks ago.

It was from the oil filter flange gasket which is on the driver side.
Is the oil filter flange gasket the same as the oil filter housing gasket?

And just to confirm, then you changed both the OFH gasket and the oil pan gasket too?
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  #30  
Old 03-18-2011, 10:55 AM
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energizedmortal energizedmortal is offline
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had to replace my radiator, cracked oil filter housing + gasket and oil pan gasket at 110,000 miles. Former bmw tech indy in the Bronx did it all for $1200 (he gave me a used oil filter housing with the freeze plugs that don't leak). I dropped the car off Tuesday morning got it back Wednesday night.

R V Auto Repair Inc
2195 Jerome Avenue, NY 10453-1818 (718) 933-2230 ***8206;

The radiator leaked again in two months but the ofh gasket and oil pan gasket are holding up fine at 145,000 miles now even though my oil pan drain plug threads are stripped and have been welded with JB. I suck the oil from the top now. Once in a blue i may drain from the oil level sensor to see if the filter missed something.

Last edited by energizedmortal; 03-18-2011 at 10:58 AM.
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  #31  
Old 03-18-2011, 12:23 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cn90 View Post
Another trick to do this job without removing the subframe.
I have not tried this, so this is just a thought!

The main reason you need to remove the subframe:
- The oil sump gasket is stiff (it has metal in it) and you cannot work it (in other words, "snake it") from under the oil pump/pickup pipe ---> therefore you need to remove the subframe (itself is a pain in the butt). Admittedly some people have been able to "snake it" under the crankshaft.

So for those of you who don't want to remove the subframe, I propose that you cut the new gasket ($28 experiment!) at the front and rear parts of the gasket (See pic below):
- Do the above-mentioned post (drain oil, loosen sump bolts, remove old gaskets, let the sump rest against the subframe).
- Now slide in the 2 halves of the new gaskets (that you just cut in half).
- Gently bolt it up, leaving a 1/2 inch gap.
- Apply Volvo chemical seal at the 2 locations where you cut it.
- Bolt it up.
- Add oil.

What you do think?
Who wants to be the guinea pig LOL? Worst case scenario, you lose $28 bucks, but I think this should work great.
All I can tell you is that: if and whenever my oil sump gasket goes bad, I will try it this way (cut it in half + Volvo chemical seal): 1h job is better than 10h job!
Conceptually, this is no different to using RTV for the "half-moon" areas when doing the VCG or Vanos jobs!

Good idea or instead of cutting it the gasket.
You can try to bend the gasket under the "oil pick up"
I did that to my gasket because there was no way around it. I was kinda nervous after i had done that because i thought i might of ripped it but, it is holding on pretty good plus its metal and the rubber on the gasket is new so it would be hard to rip the rubber.

This is just another way of risking it without taking out the whole oil pan off.

Great idea though!!!
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  #32  
Old 03-18-2011, 12:27 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyclad View Post
Is the oil filter flange gasket the same as the oil filter housing gasket?

And just to confirm, then you changed both the OFH gasket and the oil pan gasket too?
Yes its the same gasket OFH.
I did the oil pan gasket about 2 weeks but after the job was done i still seen drips of oil and i went on to discover that it was the OFH so im going to tackle the OFH today
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  #33  
Old 03-18-2011, 12:36 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyclad View Post
Is the oil filter flange gasket the same as the oil filter housing gasket?

And just to confirm, then you changed both the OFH gasket and the oil pan gasket too?
Yes its the same gasket OFH.
I did the oil pan gasket about 2 weeks but after the job was done i still seen drips of oil and i went on to discover that it was the OFH so im going to tackle the OFH today
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  #34  
Old 03-18-2011, 01:23 PM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 559eddie559 View Post
Good idea or instead of cutting it the gasket.
You can try to bend the gasket under the "oil pick up"
I did that to my gasket because there was no way around it...
Wow,

You "snaked" the gasket under the pickup tube?
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  #35  
Old 03-18-2011, 01:25 PM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 559eddie559 View Post
Yes its the same gasket OFH.
I did the oil pan gasket about 2 weeks but after the job was done i still seen drips of oil and i went on to discover that it was the OFH so im going to tackle the OFH today
I am confused, you did the OFH gasket and it leaked again.
Please clarify the sequence of events.
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  #36  
Old 03-18-2011, 01:32 PM
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energizedmortal energizedmortal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 559eddie559 View Post
Good idea or instead of cutting it the gasket.
You can try to bend the gasket under the "oil pick up"
I did that to my gasket because there was no way around it. I was kinda nervous after i had done that because i thought i might of ripped it but, it is holding on pretty good plus its metal and the rubber on the gasket is new so it would be hard to rip the rubber.

This is just another way of risking it without taking out the whole oil pan off.

Great idea though!!!
CN90,

Bending the oil pan gasket won't ruin it? i know its only a matter of time before i have all types of oil leaks so i'm bookmarking this
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  #37  
Old 03-18-2011, 06:13 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by energizedmortal View Post
so i'm bookmarking this
I just now re-modified the bestlinks so that this discussion can be easily found contextually in the future with our without us being involved:

How to identify & fix an oil filter housing (OFH) leak (1) (2) (3) (4) & how to identify an oil pan gasket leak (1) & how to remove & replace the E39 V8 oil pan gasket (1) (2) or the E39 I6 oil pan gasket (1) & hints how to replace the rigid metalized I6 oil pan gasket without removing the subframe (1) & if you do remove the subframe, how to build your own hoist & engine-support tools (1) & how to fix broken or stripped oil drain pan plug bolt threads (0) (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) (11) (12) (13) (14) (15) (16) (17) (18)

Interestingly, I noticed the bestlinks thread has had over 130,000 visitors (which is more than any other sticky thread) so people must be availing themselves of the information inside (which is a good thing).

This ingenious idea of cn90's is wonderful and deserves someone to test it out! If/when I have an oil-pan leak, I'll avail myself of his excellent ideas!
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  #38  
Old 03-18-2011, 06:48 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by energizedmortal View Post
CN90,

Bending the oil pan gasket won't ruin it? i know its only a matter of time before i have all types of oil leaks so i'm bookmarking this
Well im not 100% positive it wont ruin it but i took the chance and so far so good... The gasket itself will be a little bent but it will straighten itself out once you tigthen it down.

I could not actually see the gasket but i stuck my hand around the area i bent it and i felt no rips or anything.
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  #39  
Old 03-18-2011, 06:52 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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Originally Posted by cn90 View Post
Wow,

You "snaked" the gasket under the pickup tube?
Yea i know i risked the gasket but when you have put around 6 hrs of work on it and being down there just to find out that the pick up tube is in the way man it sucks.

I "snaked" it and so far so good.

When i snaked it i could feel the part that i bent.. i couldnt see it but i could feel that the rubber was not ripped.

After you bolt it down it will straighten out itself
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  #40  
Old 03-18-2011, 06:55 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cn90 View Post
I am confused, you did the OFH gasket and it leaked again.
Please clarify the sequence of events.
Sorry about the confusion.

I changed my oil pan gasket because i thought it was leaking from there but i figured out that my OFH was leaking not my oil pan gasket. I started my OFH today. I have never replaced my OFH.

In the long run the oil pan gasket was going out the door already so it wasnt a bad investment.
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  #41  
Old 03-18-2011, 06:57 PM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Originally Posted by 559eddie559 View Post
...I "snaked" it and so far so good...
Very interesting.
Sometimes "cutting corner" is not a bad thing LOL.
Thanks for sharing your experience.
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  #42  
Old 03-18-2011, 07:02 PM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Originally Posted by 559eddie559 View Post
...I "snaked" it and so far so good...
Very interesting.
Sometimes "cutting corner" is not a bad thing LOL.
Thanks for sharing your experience.

Maybe if and whenever I replace the oil pan gasket, I can "Snake" it under. This way I will save 6h removing/re-installing the subframe!

If I understand correctly, then the gasket's INNER part is rubber (or something like it) and the OUTER edge is metal. Correct?

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  #43  
Old 03-18-2011, 11:16 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cn90 View Post
Very interesting.
Sometimes "cutting corner" is not a bad thing LOL.
Thanks for sharing your experience.

Maybe if and whenever I replace the oil pan gasket, I can "Snake" it under. This way I will save 6h removing/re-installing the subframe!

If I understand correctly, then the gasket's INNER part is rubber (or something like it) and the OUTER edge is metal. Correct?

Yup your correct about the gasket.

If you have trouble getting it around the oil pump try taking the rack and pinion off or loosen it up to get some room. I had to replace mine so i had to take it out anyways. I only had to bend it where the oil pickup was at which was the back part. I took the rack and pinion and took the motor mount nuts off and lifted the engine up with a jack and i did it without removing anything from the front of the engine.
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  #44  
Old 03-19-2011, 04:28 AM
franka franka is offline
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Many years ago I ran a stamping plant that made the internal metal spine with the screw limiters automatically installed. Its later rubber coated. This was for all of the GM V6s that had production runs for many years. My method of automatically installing the limiters was very profitable for us.

The metal spines are stamped from a full hard grade of steel for stiffness and ease of production line installation. They will bend once or twice, but too much bending in one place will easily crack the hard and perferated steel core. Plain old carbon steel comes in basically four hardness grades and full hard is the hardest. Thus the easiest to crack. I'm assuming all gaskets made with a steel core are made basically this way.

If it didn't leak in the first 100 miles its likely that it will not leak for many years. Good luck.
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Last edited by franka; 03-19-2011 at 04:29 AM.
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  #45  
Old 03-28-2011, 06:50 AM
Mudbone Mudbone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 559eddie559 View Post
Yup your correct about the gasket.

If you have trouble getting it around the oil pump try taking the rack and pinion off or loosen it up to get some room. I had to replace mine so i had to take it out anyways. I only had to bend it where the oil pickup was at which was the back part. I took the rack and pinion and took the motor mount nuts off and lifted the engine up with a jack and i did it without removing anything from the front of the engine.
Did you have any trouble cleaning the old gasket material off the oil pan or the engine block?
I'm concerned about large and small pieces of the gasket falling into the oil pan and not being able to remove them.
How much room is there between the block and the pan when the pan is unbolted?
Will it "rock" from side to side in order to clean/inspect the gasket surfaces?
What type of gasket sealant did you use?

Thanks!
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  #46  
Old 03-28-2011, 11:24 AM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Mudbone,

Now I think about this issue further, I think you can safely remove any pieces that fall down the oil sump by removing the "Oil Level Sensor" and fish them out. However, if you are careful, then I don't think anything will fall inside the sump because the rubber seal is bonded to the gasket's metal frame.

On another note: I am thinking about cutting the gasket in different places than I mentioned above.
If you make the cuts on the "high side" (remember the motor is titled toward the passenger side, then the oil pan junction's driver side sits higher than the pass side), it makes sense because this "high side" sits above oil level.

Plus you only apply sealant at where the cuts are. Basically about 1 cm in length of sealant in 2 locations.

Anyway, it is your call and worth a $28 experiment (the oil pan gasket is $28)!

Here is what I think where the cuts should be:

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  #47  
Old 03-28-2011, 12:58 PM
Mudbone Mudbone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cn90 View Post
Mudbone,

Now I think about this issue further, I think you can safely remove any pieces that fall down the oil sump by removing the "Oil Level Sensor" and fish them out. However, if you are careful, then I don't think anything will fall inside the sump because the rubber seal is bonded to the gasket's metal frame.

On another note: I am thinking about cutting the gasket in different places than I mentioned above.
If you make the cuts on the "high side" (remember the motor is titled toward the passenger side, then the oil pan junction's driver side sits higher than the pass side), it makes sense because this "high side" sits above oil level.

Plus you only apply sealant at where the cuts are. Basically about 1 cm in length of sealant in 2 locations.

Anyway, it is your call and worth a $28 experiment (the oil pan gasket is $28)!

Here is what I think where the cuts should be:

I believe you idea has great merit. I am still concernered about pieces of the old gasket falling into the pan and not being able to retrieve them. If the gasket was not compromised, the bond your referring to, we would not be having this discussion.

I have sent a PM to 559eddie559. I want his input. He has done this without dropping the subframe. Specifically, I want to know how much room is there between the mating surfaces when the pan is unbolted and can/will the pan "rock" side to side to access the gasket surfaces in order to clean it.
One way or the other, I'm going to dive in this weekend.

Thanks again for the GREAT idea about cutting the gasket.
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  #48  
Old 03-28-2011, 04:38 PM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudbone View Post
I believe you idea has great merit. I am still concernered about pieces of the old gasket falling into the pan and not being able to retrieve them. If the gasket was not compromised, the bond your referring to, we would not be having this discussion.
If you look at Thread #26 above, the gasket comes off in one piece, so no worry about bits and pieces falling inside.
This is because the rubber is bonded to the metal frame.
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  #49  
Old 03-28-2011, 09:43 PM
559eddie559 559eddie559 is offline
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I have sent a PM to 559eddie559. I want his input. He has done this without dropping the subframe. Specifically, I want to know how much room is there between the mating surfaces when the pan is unbolted and can/will the pan "rock" side to side to access the gasket surfaces in order to clean it.
One way or the other, I'm going to dive in this weekend.

Thanks again for the GREAT idea about cutting the gasket.[/QUOTE]

There is about 5 to 6 inches between the mating surfaces... the best side to "snake" the gasket and where you will have a visual of how the gasket is going in is by getting on the passenger side and snaking it....The pan will rock just enough so you could see the oil pick up but thats only if your on the passenger side... Just pressure wash your car because when your working down there its not easy being careful to not drop any oil gunk in the pan or dirt, i didnt do that but i recommend you do so you wont be stressing about all that junk going in there.


Trust me your not even thinking about the little pieces of gasket falling in there when your under there for several hours... the only concern you will run into is snaking that son of a gun(gasket).
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  #50  
Old 04-05-2011, 03:59 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cn90 View Post
Volvo use "Chemical Gasket" (Anaerobic gasket)to seal the cam head and the oil sump.
Volvo PN 1161059: $30 for Volvo OEM or $7 for Victor Reinz brand
Hi Cam,
I realize the OP, Mudbone, following your astute advice, successfully replaced his I6 gasket by cutting it in two locations and using "Permatex Ultra Copper" sealant as described in this thread today:
- E39 (1997 - 2003) > Replaced oil pan gasket

But, I'm still wondering about the best "sealant" to use.
- BMW_Oils_Lubricants_Sealants_and_Thread_Lockers.pd f

Is the Volvo PN 1161059 similar to the BMW PN 81-22-9-400-339 Hylomar 'stuff' presumably prescribed for the oil pan gasket?


Last edited by bluebee; 04-05-2011 at 04:12 PM.
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