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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
The E9X is the 4th evolution of the BMW 3 series including a highly tuned twin turbo 335i variant pushing out 300hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque. BMW continues to show that it sets the bar for true driving performance! -- View the E9X Wiki

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  #1  
Old 04-12-2011, 05:09 AM
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tturedraider tturedraider is offline
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Arrow A little perspective - Average annual price increase since MY 2005

I did this once before, but I thought it might be interesting to revisit it.

Based on August 2004 prices a 2005 330i with ZHP, ZPP, heated front seats, fold down rear seat backs, xenons, PDC/rear, HK (standard), steptronic transmission and non-metallic paint had an MSRP of $45,795. An equivalently equipped ZMP 335i today has an MSRP of $50,300. That is a difference of $4,505. An average annual increase in price of 1.41% over seven model years.

The 2005 E46 330i ZHP made 235hp @ 5,900 rpm and 222 lb-ft tq @ 3,500 rpm. Its automatic transmission had only five gears and it was rated at 17 mpg city & 25 highway. It did not have side curtain airbags. It had a tubular airbag to protect the driver's head. Its DSC was less sophisticated than today's. The ZHP was prone to VANOS rattle. The premium package did not include the garage door opener. The side bolsters on the sport seats were not adjustable. It did not have brake drying. E46s have various weaknesses in their engine cooling systems. It did not have Corona Rings. I'm sure there are some other things I'm missing, but, of course, one really big thing it did not have was a 300hp engine that made 300 lb-ft tq @ 1250 rpm, which is rated at 19 mpg city & 28 highway, and, as great as the ZHP is, it did not push you back in your seat when you mashed the gas pedal like the 335i does.

All in all, I'd say the current E90 335i ZMP is at least as good a value as the 2005 E46 330i ZHP.

What say y'all?
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  #2  
Old 04-12-2011, 05:12 AM
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The flaw in your argument is you didn't take inflation into account over the past 7 years.

Keep in mind the value of the US dollar over the past 7 years has been dramatically down.

Equivalently equipped is one thing. Equivalent US dollar comparisons over 7 years is quite another.

Using the CPI as a measure of yearly inflation, a $45,795 vehicle from 2004 would be equivalent to $52,900, give or take a few hundred, in today's dollars. Not even close to $50,300.

So, the "equivalent" 335i you speak of today, is selling at a very nice discount today to the 2005 330i.

The 335i you speak of today is a much better value than its 2005 cousin selling way back in 2004.
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Old 04-12-2011, 05:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hpowders View Post
The flaw in your argument is you didn't take inflation into account over the past 7 years.

Keep in mind the value of the US dollar over the past 7 years has been dramatically down.

Equivalently equipped is one thing. Equivalent US dollar comparisons over 7 years is quite another.

Using the CPI as a measure of yearly inflation, a $45,795 vehicle from 2004 would be equivalent to $52,900 in today's dollars. Not even close to $50,300.

So, the "equivalent" 335i you speak of today, is selling at a very nice discount today to the 2004 330i.

The 335i you speak of today is a much better value than its 2004 cousin.
Yeah, I just looked up that myself. And that was kinda my point. Maybe people will feel a little better about what they're paying for. It's not that the cost of the car has gone up so much, it's that there are so many options available today that weren't in MY 2005.
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Old 04-12-2011, 05:44 AM
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Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
Yeah, I just looked up that myself. And that was kinda my point. Maybe people will feel a little better about what they're paying for. It's not that the cost of the car has gone up so much, it's that there are so many options available today that weren't in MY 2005.
And of course, the depressing fact that we have all become quite a bit poorer as the US dollar's value has seriously eroded since 2004.
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Old 04-12-2011, 11:41 PM
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BerfsBimmer BerfsBimmer is offline
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I agree with the OPís observation. I think it shows how competition is good for the consumer. Sooooo Mr. Red Raider, does this mean youíre on the prowl for a new bimmer?
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Old 04-13-2011, 12:03 AM
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I agree with the OPís observation. I think it shows how competition is good for the consumer. Sooooo Mr. Red Raider, does this mean youíre on the prowl for a new bimmer?
Nope. I like my '06 E90 330i. I'll probably keep it until fairly late in the F30's production run.

However, just for fun I was configuring what I would get on a new 335i if I was in the market. That got me thinking about how much the prices had actually changed as opposed to how the availability of addition features/options has raised the price of the car. I would love to have the ZMP on my car, but I really like the E90 330i, so I don't have to get a new 335 just to have the ZMP. Now, if you'd like to buy me a new 335i, who am I to look a gift horse in the mouth?
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Old 04-13-2011, 08:34 AM
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So all the whining about de-contenting and rising prices is truly just that: whining? Finally someone put some numbers on it!

Of course we are forgetting that the E9X 335i ZMP is not as true a BMW as the E46 ZHP.
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Old 04-13-2011, 08:47 AM
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Why not compare the 330i to today's 328i and feel truly blessed:
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Old 04-13-2011, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by cwinter View Post
So all the whining about de-contenting and rising prices is truly just that: whining? Finally someone put some numbers on it!
No, there has been some de-contenting. The difference between my 07 328 and 11 335i is very evident. Cheaper materials all around, ashtray delete, cheap switchgear, etc
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Old 04-13-2011, 11:36 AM
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No, there has been some de-contenting. The difference between my 07 328 and 11 335i is very evident. Cheaper materials all around, ashtray delete, cheap switchgear, etc
Cheaper materials - that is your imagination. I have spent A LOT of time with the 2011 3er and there is not one iota of difference between the materials used in it and my '06 330i.

Decontenting - no more flashlight, vinyl sun visors (cheap), ashtray (not as bad as it first seemed), tie-downs in the trunk (stupid), fewer tools in the tool "box" (deleting the manual crank tool for the moonroof is very stupid), no more insulation pad under the hood (doesn't really matter), no more nets on the backs of the front seats, no longer pre-wiring for alarm. Re: the last two - even though some miss the nets I would say overall most owners rarely used them and the pre-wiring is one cost saving measure that made very good sense; the number of people who ever utilized the pre-wiring was infinitesimally small (my assessment).
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Old 04-13-2011, 11:42 AM
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Why not compare the 330i to today's 328i and feel truly blessed:
That's the first comparison I made some time ago. However, one can make an argument that the performance difference in automatic transmissions between the two cars is significant, being in favor of the E46. I do wish they hadn't dropped the ZF tranny that was in the '06 E90 325i. It is a better performer than the current GM unit. Having said that, the GM unit's performance is not significantly less than the ZF. It's just different. The E46 automatic can be somewhat prone to premature failure. All the guys and gals over in the E46 forum who have an automatic are constantly wringing their hands wondering when their transmission will fail. The early 323i's and 325i's seem to be the most susceptible.
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Old 04-13-2011, 11:48 AM
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No, there has been some de-contenting. The difference between my 07 328 and 11 335i is very evident. Cheaper materials all around, ashtray delete, cheap switchgear, etc
I guess I wasn't clear. I meant that the usual blatant comment is that prices are rising while decontenting is taking place. The truth is, prices are actually stable or falling and content is CHANGING. We humans are masters as focusing on the bad (what has been taken out of the car) and forget that other parts may now be included in the base price that previously were not.
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Old 04-13-2011, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
Decontenting - no more flashlight, vinyl sun visors (cheap), ashtray (not as bad as it first seemed), tie-downs in the trunk (stupid), fewer tools in the tool "box" (deleting the manual crank tool for the moonroof is very stupid), no more insulation pad under the hood (doesn't really matter), no more nets on the backs of the front seats, no longer pre-wiring for alarm. Re: the last two - even though some miss the nets I would say overall most owners rarely used them and the pre-wiring is one cost saving measure that made very good sense; the number of people who ever utilized the pre-wiring was infinitesimally small (my assessment).
My car has an insulation pad (albeit smallish) under the hood, nets on the backs of the seats, and came with a flashlight in the glove box. Step back from 2011 and it looks even better, I think.
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Old 04-13-2011, 12:25 PM
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My car has an insulation pad (albeit smallish) under the hood, nets on the backs of the seats, and came with a flashlight in the glove box. Step back from 2011 and it looks even better, I think.
Those of us that installed the insulation pad manually seem to all have the same comments. It does not change the noise level in the cabin and there is no empirical data that suggests it reduces heat transfer to the hood.

The nets I give you but my guess is BMW came to the same conclusion as myself -- few people use them. In 2 yrs I have used the back seat nets a total of 0 times.

I have a small LED flashlight in my trunk that cost me next to nothing.

I guess in short, I see potential savings to BMW while only upsetting the pickiest of nit pickers. I WOULD very much miss the cargo hooks in the trunk though, which I thankfully still have. My guess too though is that few BMW owners use these regularly.
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Old 04-13-2011, 06:49 PM
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I can count on one hand how many times I've used the flashlight, is it's really a piece of crap anyway. The $2 LED flashlight I got for Christmas works far better. The hood pad is something I am utterly neutral about; I wouldn't be upset without it, but I am glad to have it (simply for having it). I keep a small notepad in the seat-back pockets, though. That is useful.
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Old 04-13-2011, 07:02 PM
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I can count on one hand how many times I've used the flashlight, is it's really a piece of crap anyway. The $2 LED flashlight I got for Christmas works far better. The hood pad is something I am utterly neutral about; I wouldn't be upset without it, but I am glad to have it (simply for having it). I keep a small notepad in the seat-back pockets, though. That is useful.
But, if they weren't there you could keep it in the cubby on the driver's door, true?
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Old 04-13-2011, 07:16 PM
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To me the biggest item of decontenting is making a premium sound system an option on the 335i. Mine came with it but would cost quite a bit if building a car now.
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Old 04-13-2011, 07:24 PM
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To me the biggest item of decontenting is making a premium sound system an option on the 335i. Mine came with it but would cost quite a bit if building a car now.
Well, that depends on your perspective. When it was standard on the 330/335 it was a $1,200 option on the 325/328. When they made it optional on the 335 they dropped the price to $875, so from a 328 buyer's perspective it was a good thing. And since 328 buyers out number 335 buyers by at least 3:1 it probably increased BMW's profits, because more of those buyers would now opt to get Logic7/HK and a very high percentage of 335 buyers would opt for it.
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Old 04-13-2011, 08:22 PM
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But, if they weren't there you could keep it in the cubby on the driver's door, true?
That's the in-car temporary waste holding unit.
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Old 04-13-2011, 09:32 PM
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Perhaps the price increases are smaller because the 3 Series is overpriced to begin with... Almost everything is an option ($$$ adds up quickly) and I'm sure their margins are at a "premium" compared to other makes, so if they raise just a tad (or less than CPI) and de-content just a tad, they are at least still even and probably ahead of the game. Hey, they can get away with it at this point, so... I love my 3, but I'm not sure it is $8-10k better than a comparable G or TL, etc, BASED STRICTLY ON materials, quality, workmanship.

I know... Ha
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Old 04-13-2011, 10:10 PM
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Perhaps the price increases are smaller because the 3 Series is overpriced to begin with... Almost everything is an option ($$$ adds up quickly) and I'm sure their margins are at a "premium" compared to other makes, so if they raise just a tad (or less than CPI) and de-content just a tad, they are at least still even and probably ahead of the game. Hey, they can get away with it at this point, so... I love my 3, but I'm not sure it is $8-10k better than a comparable G or TL, etc, BASED STRICTLY ON materials, quality, workmanship.

I know... Ha
It is. Based on the inline six motor you can't get anywhere else and the handling no one else can master.
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Old 04-14-2011, 05:12 AM
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Yeah. I'm sure glad "someone" finally put some equivalent numbers on it and placed the comparison in proper perspective. BMW has admirably kept US prices under control given the tremendous hit to the US greenback since 2004.

Let's stop dumping on BMW, eh?
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Old 04-14-2011, 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by hpowders View Post
Yeah. I'm sure glad "someone" finally put some equivalent numbers on it and placed the comparison in proper perspective. BMW has admirably kept US prices under control given the tremendous hit to the US greenback since 2004.

Let's stop dumping on BMW, eh?
What is with the "since 2004" bit? Inflation didn't begin in 2004; measured as CPI it didn't take off all that much, relative to historical spikes, beginning in 2004 either.

Any $$$ number today can be inflation/CPI-adjusted to a much smaller $ number back in time, whether it's 2004, 1994, 1984, 1974 or much further back.
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Old 04-14-2011, 08:03 AM
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What is with the "since 2004" bit? Inflation didn't begin in 2004; measured as CPI it didn't take off all that much, relative to historical spikes, beginning in 2004 either.

Any $$$ number today can be inflation/CPI-adjusted to a much smaller $ number back in time, whether it's 2004, 1994, 1984, 1974 or much further back.
Just for clarity, hp and I both took the price of MY 2005 and adjusted it forward to what those dollars would be today.
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Old 04-14-2011, 08:12 AM
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Just for clarity, hp and I both took the price of MY 2005 and adjusted it forward to what those dollars would be today.
Uhhhhh..... yes.
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Porsche: Accept no substitute, unless you're poor!

The E90 sedan is the last in the line of great 4 door 3 Series BMW's. Too bad.

"The VW GTI remains and will likely continue to be one of the finest compact sports cars in the world." Christian Seabaugh, Motortrend, March 27, 2012.

06/02/2005-12/02/2014: 9.50 great years on Bimmerfest!!!
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