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X3 F25 (2011 - current)
The latest X3 brings some added style and some new features to the BMW SUV family. Talk about the new F25 now!

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  #1  
Old 04-26-2011, 05:43 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Logic 7 or Dirac in X3???

Hey everyone -
Quick question....is the "premium audio" in the 2011 X3 the Logic 7 setup or that Dirac setup in other models like the M5 and 5 GT?

I've read a bit about each and opted out of the premium audio b/c I thought it was logic 7 (due to crappy marketing of the audio not really explaining what is there) Now I heard that the X3 models in the UK with premium audio are dirac and that it's light years ahead of the logic 7...and now I'm kinda getting buyers remorse for not getting the upgraded system if it really is Dirac. I had always planned to live with the "standard" 12 speaker 205 watt setup for like a year and then upgrade to something aftermarket that was much nicer...however...now I'm thinking the dirac would have been a better approach..

So...anyone know what the real deal here is on what is included, L7 vs Dirac, and is an upgraded aftermarket system on par (or better) than Dirac?
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  #2  
Old 04-26-2011, 06:23 PM
Want the Thrill Want the Thrill is offline
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Here is the info from another forum that says it is definitly Dirac:

I emailed Dirac to get information on the upgraded stereo option in the X3. At first they said they didn't know anything about it being in the new X3 and then he did some research and sent me the following information:


yesterday, I got a confirmation that the new X3 (F25) features the optional sound system with Dirac Live technology. The system should then be identical with Hifi Professional System:
http://www.bmw.com/com/en/insights/t...fessional.html

However, it doesn't say it has 16 speakers, 9 amplifier channels, 825 Watts (I think), and uses Dirac Live technology for the calibration.

You can read about Dirac Live at: http://www.dirac.se/dirac_live.asp
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  #3  
Old 04-26-2011, 06:28 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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sh*t...now I'm pissed b/c that really wasn't clear in the X3 brochure and the dealer just said "yea you get the bigger amp and the tweeters"... Seems like this system is a total different setup.... man that sucks... I can't add it b/c my X3 is already in production....seems like it woudl have been worth the 800..oh well.

Do you know if the dealer can add this on after (like if I purchased it ad hoc) or if at that point it would just be better to go with an aftermarket that is better than dirac?
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  #4  
Old 04-26-2011, 07:22 PM
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Evlengr Evlengr is offline
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Originally Posted by mole7374 View Post
sh*t...now I'm pissed b/c that really wasn't clear in the X3 brochure and the dealer just said "yea you get the bigger amp and the tweeters"... Seems like this system is a total different setup.... man that sucks... I can't add it b/c my X3 is already in production....seems like it woudl have been worth the 800..oh well.

Do you know if the dealer can add this on after (like if I purchased it ad hoc) or if at that point it would just be better to go with an aftermarket that is better than dirac?
You can add on audio correction systems for about $200 aftermarket.

Alpine makes one (I have it) and so do many others. Will do time correction, alignment, delay, attack, tone, etc... and all from a laptop and condenser mic.

I am sure by now you know my feelings on BMW's sound systems .
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  #5  
Old 04-26-2011, 07:44 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Originally Posted by Evlengr View Post
You can add on audio correction systems for about $200 aftermarket.

Alpine makes one (I have it) and so do many others. Will do time correction, alignment, delay, attack, tone, etc... and all from a laptop and condenser mic.

I am sure by now you know my feelings on BMW's sound systems .
Evlengr -
Funny every post I research on audio has you attached (for what seems to be obvious reasons) and I was getting ready to PM you on some advice...too funny.

At any rate....I take it then from your reply that I should NOT have buyers remorse for skipping the "premium hifi" in the new X3 and I should instead take the money I saved and invest it in an aftermarket that will ultimately sound better? The struggle I'm having is that nobody seems to have a conclusive opinion on whether the top/highest end "premium" BMW system (ie hifi premium) is better than or on part with a decent aftermarket, or if investing in an aftermarket will get me a higher quality better sounding system. Since you seems to be the resident expert on this is your an indicator that I will be better off in the end with a decent aftermarket? I don't know a whole lot about Dirac but it seems to me that it's either a) an amazing system or b) an completely marketing hoax like Bose. Thoughts?
Also...what is your opinion on Bavarian Sound Works stuff...worth it or not worth an upgrade for aftermarket?
I'm probably going to wait at least 6 months until the F25 gets more systems identified for it b/c it seems like there really isn't a lot out there right now for the new model....I'm sure by the end of the year crutchfield and other places will have systems identified that will work...and then I'll need some recommendations. I'd like to keep the "stock" head unit unless it just doesn't make sense for a decent upgrade...and obviously I'd want it to integrate into the idrive properly.

Sorry for the long reply but I'd really like to do the audio "right"...I'm not looking to drop tons of money, but my thoughts are that BMW chrages 875 and for probably 1500 I can get something much nicer overall...
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  #6  
Old 04-26-2011, 07:46 PM
Non_head Non_head is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mole7374 View Post
sh*t...now I'm pissed b/c that really wasn't clear in the X3 brochure and the dealer just said "yea you get the bigger amp and the tweeters"... Seems like this system is a total different setup.... man that sucks... I can't add it b/c my X3 is already in production....seems like it woudl have been worth the 800..oh well.

Do you know if the dealer can add this on after (like if I purchased it ad hoc) or if at that point it would just be better to go with an aftermarket that is better than dirac?
I had the same issue with xenon lights, didn't order them and had to get them afterwards because I saw them on a demo car (reordered and have to wait 2 more months!)
So reorder if you really want it. But just to shed some light on the logic7/dirac issue, while I was tracking my car through mybmw portal the premium Hi-Fi was listed as logic7 surround sound on ! Not dirac ! I am sure other people who signed up on BMW website and tracked their car can confirm this. This might have something to do with the fact that which country is the car being shipped to( US in my case!)
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  #7  
Old 04-26-2011, 07:51 PM
jasonskitchen jasonskitchen is offline
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I can confirm it is listed as Logic 7 - I picked up mine yesterday, still setting up all the audio which is only minorly tricky at the moment...btw, before i go searching for it, anyone know where the radio ID # is listed for when I call to activate the sat. radio? yes, i'm lazy...
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Old 04-26-2011, 08:02 PM
Non_head Non_head is offline
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Originally Posted by jasonskitchen View Post
I can confirm it is listed as Logic 7 - I picked up mine yesterday, still setting up all the audio which is only minorly tricky at the moment...btw, before i go searching for it, anyone know where the radio ID # is listed for when I call to activate the sat. radio? yes, i'm lazy...
Congrats! How do you like the sound system? I tried it in the dealership but just for 20 secs !! Was it worth the extra 875?
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  #9  
Old 04-26-2011, 08:03 PM
Want the Thrill Want the Thrill is offline
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Jasonskitchen please post some pics of your new ride
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  #10  
Old 04-26-2011, 08:11 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Originally Posted by Non_head View Post
I had the same issue with xenon lights, didn't order them and had to get them afterwards because I saw them on a demo car (reordered and have to wait 2 more months!)
So reorder if you really want it. But just to shed some light on the logic7/dirac issue, while I was tracking my car through mybmw portal the premium Hi-Fi was listed as logic7 surround sound on ! Not dirac ! I am sure other people who signed up on BMW website and tracked their car can confirm this. This might have something to do with the fact that which country is the car being shipped to( US in my case!)
Hey...yea I totally remember your xeon post...in fact I remember being one of the people telling you to reorder! (ironic now with my post huh?) The difference with me is that for the most part the audio part of the X3 is much easier to upgrade than the xeons and unlike stock xeons which are better than anything aftermarket, aftermarket audio (if done correctly) will generally be a definite upgrade. ...and from the start I went into it thinking that I'd see how the 12 speaker setup was, and if need be upgrade later...so definitely different mindset.

The remore I started to have was when I saw posts that said the X3 had dirac which most people claim to be amazing...I passed on the premium b/c I originally read it was logic 7 and I read mixed reviews on it....dirac gets pretty much great reviews overall...so that is why I got a little upset...but if you are telling me 100% for sure that this is logic 7 I'll probably rest easier...
My X3 finished production today so definitely not going to reorder, especially with the pending production delays I've been reading about! Thanks for the advice though...
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  #11  
Old 04-26-2011, 08:20 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Originally Posted by jasonskitchen View Post
I can confirm it is listed as Logic 7 - I picked up mine yesterday, still setting up all the audio which is only minorly tricky at the moment...btw, before i go searching for it, anyone know where the radio ID # is listed for when I call to activate the sat. radio? yes, i'm lazy...

jasonskitchen -

Hey thanks! So you can confirm this 100% right? I gotta say that BMW's info on their audio is really crappy because the UK website DEFINITELY lists their "hifi professional" 16 speaker setup at Dirac...that was part of what got me thinking that the USA models had Dirac has well...however our upgrade is called "premium" and not "professional" but the description is similar...hence my confusion. (and I'm sure others confusions as well) Ok so basically to net this out...it looks like the UK versions of the X3 have a much lesser "base" setup than we do in the US, however the top "premium" upgrade gets your Dirac...however our "premium" upgrade stops at L7. So different countries are getting different upgrades I assume right?

And you are 100% on this being L7 with no Dirac?
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Old 04-26-2011, 08:27 PM
Non_head Non_head is offline
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Originally Posted by mole7374 View Post
Hey...yea I totally remember your xeon post...in fact I remember being one of the people telling you to reorder! (ironic now with my post huh?) The difference with me is that for the most part the audio part of the X3 is much easier to upgrade than the xeons and unlike stock xeons which are better than anything aftermarket, aftermarket audio (if done correctly) will generally be a definite upgrade. ...and from the start I went into it thinking that I'd see how the 12 speaker setup was, and if need be upgrade later...so definitely different mindset.

The remore I started to have was when I saw posts that said the X3 had dirac which most people claim to be amazing...I passed on the premium b/c I originally read it was logic 7 and I read mixed reviews on it....dirac gets pretty much great reviews overall...so that is why I got a little upset...but if you are telling me 100% for sure that this is logic 7 I'll probably rest easier...
My X3 finished production today so definitely not going to reorder, especially with the pending production delays I've been reading about! Thanks for the advice though...
Wow! Now i remember! Like you said your case is totally different and I have to agree with you on this! But just to sleep easier at night, on the website it is listed as logic 7 (I just double checked!) but if they write logic 7 and ship with Dirac (which doesn't make sense to me) that's a different story. Just found out that mine went into production !today 3 weeks ahead of schedule ! I guess I don't have to w8 much longer
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Old 04-26-2011, 08:41 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Wow! Now i remember! Like you said your case is totally different and I have to agree with you on this! But just to sleep easier at night, on the website it is listed as logic 7 (I just double checked!) but if they write logic 7 and ship with Dirac (which doesn't make sense to me) that's a different story. Just found out that mine went into production !today 3 weeks ahead of schedule ! I guess I don't have to w8 much longer
LOL... so many posts here I'm amazed we all even remember what threads we jump into!! Congrats on the production side...mine is wrapping up either today or tomorrow. I'm glad you went back and got the xeons...for real...you will be very happy. I've had 2 cars with xeons and it really does add a lot to driving at night...and they look GREAT!! And glad to hear you have no production delays...I've started to hear about some issues with power tailgate etc...I skipped that.

Ok.... so I'm guessing that if the site says L7 and not Dirac it's going to be that...I dont' see BMW shipping Dirac just to be nice! I'm guessing that the UK folks get the Dirac upgrade b/c their base system is not nearly as nice as ours...their "business upgrade" is our stock system. Can you actually post the link for me that says the X3 uses L7 and not Dirac? Also...I was on the Dirac website and it does not show the X3
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Old 04-26-2011, 09:10 PM
Non_head Non_head is offline
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LOL... so many posts here I'm amazed we all even remember what threads we jump into!! Congrats on the production side...mine is wrapping up either today or tomorrow. I'm glad you went back and got the xeons...for real...you will be very happy. I've had 2 cars with xeons and it really does add a lot to driving at night...and they look GREAT!! And glad to hear you have no production delays...I've started to hear about some issues with power tailgate etc...I skipped that.

Ok.... so I'm guessing that if the site says L7 and not Dirac it's going to be that...I dont' see BMW shipping Dirac just to be nice! I'm guessing that the UK folks get the Dirac upgrade b/c their base system is not nearly as nice as ours...their "business upgrade" is our stock system. Can you actually post the link for me that says the X3 uses L7 and not Dirac? Also...I was on the Dirac website and it does not show the X3
Well I did some more research... I checked out the German site ( I know German) as well as he uk website, I saw the Dirac reference In uk and did not see it on German Konfigurator! here is the thing though, the code for this option is 677 in Germany, UK and USA. I checked my build sheet and it refers to it as 677 for premium Hi-Fi . I don't know what to conclude!!! It makes sense if folks in UK have better options than us but not from folks in Germany!!! And on the other hand I am looking at logic 7 surround sound in myBMW portal!! I wish I could send you the link but it is in my account ( you can sign up yourself and take a look! You only need VIN or production number
At the end the price for this option is 1180
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Old 04-26-2011, 09:29 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Well I did some more research... I checked out the German site ( I know German) as well as he uk website, I saw the Dirac reference In uk and did not see it on German Konfigurator! here is the thing though, the code for this option is 677 in Germany, UK and USA. I checked my build sheet and it refers to it as 677 for premium Hi-Fi . I don't know what to conclude!!! It makes sense if folks in UK have better options than us but not from folks in Germany!!! And on the other hand I am looking at logic 7 surround sound in myBMW portal!! I wish I could send you the link but it is in my account ( you can sign up yourself and take a look! You only need VIN or production number
At the end the price for this option is 1180
Wow how bad is BMW at explaining their options...it just seems VERY odd to me that the UK site spells things out so clearly whereas the USA site is a mystery...it's very strange. I know what you mean by the portal too...you mean where it shows your options etc right? I have that setup but since I did the standard system is just shows that and no detail around it. The reason why I'm questioning the L7 is b/c if you look at the BMW site (below is only link I found) it shows that the "professional" system is used by the X3 (under models used) and if you click on L7 it does not show X3. Now maybe this has not been updated for the 2011 model year but it's still strange. I'd say that your portal is probably more accurate than me and the other users on here also posted as L7. I did see the 677 come up as the build number too...it's just crazy that it takes this much effort to actually find out what audio we have in our cars!

http://www.bmw.com/com/en/insights/t...fessional.html
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Old 04-26-2011, 09:35 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Originally Posted by Non_head View Post
Well I did some more research... I checked out the German site ( I know German) as well as he uk website, I saw the Dirac reference In uk and did not see it on German Konfigurator! here is the thing though, the code for this option is 677 in Germany, UK and USA. I checked my build sheet and it refers to it as 677 for premium Hi-Fi . I don't know what to conclude!!! It makes sense if folks in UK have better options than us but not from folks in Germany!!! And on the other hand I am looking at logic 7 surround sound in myBMW portal!! I wish I could send you the link but it is in my account ( you can sign up yourself and take a look! You only need VIN or production number
At the end the price for this option is 1180
hey....the more posts I go and read the more I think you are right and this is L7 and not Dirac...I think Dirac is pretty exclusive and only in very specific models...
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Old 04-26-2011, 11:33 PM
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Evlengr Evlengr is offline
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ok, imo opinion (and I can back it up with specs) there isnt a BMW audio system that can compete with a mid-level aftermarket system. Let alone a real hi end one. And Bav Motor Works stuff is good but waaaaaaaaaaaay over priced for what they deliver. And don't let people tell you it will butcher your current set up. You can interface a really nice sound processor, amps and speakers and never change the appearance of the whole system. I have NEVER had anyone (including BMW employess) tell me that my sound system isn't better than the installed ones. It is NOT loud thump thump thump. It was designed to be clear and reproduce the true audio quality of the music.

So no don't second guess your self on the sound system. Unlike the xenon's, it can easily be upgraded and you can do it little by little or all at once. I suggest little by little until you achieve the quality you like.
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Old 04-27-2011, 03:48 AM
stgreen stgreen is offline
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Whether its Logic 7 or Dirac, it sounds incredible. It has volume and clarity as well.

It's difficult to determine if the US $875 is a 'good' deal compared to aftermarket, but personally, I don't want to do anything like this aftermarket - I just want to order the car and turn on the stereo and listen to my music.

So I am sure one could go the aftermarket route like any car, but from my test drives and comparisons to other car stereos this option was well worth it.
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Old 04-27-2011, 04:14 AM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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ok, imo opinion (and I can back it up with specs) there isnt a BMW audio system that can compete with a mid-level aftermarket system. Let alone a real hi end one. And Bav Motor Works stuff is good but waaaaaaaaaaaay over priced for what they deliver. And don't let people tell you it will butcher your current set up. You can interface a really nice sound processor, amps and speakers and never change the appearance of the whole system. I have NEVER had anyone (including BMW employess) tell me that my sound system isn't better than the installed ones. It is NOT loud thump thump thump. It was designed to be clear and reproduce the true audio quality of the music.

So no don't second guess your self on the sound system. Unlike the xenon's, it can easily be upgraded and you can do it little by little or all at once. I suggest little by little until you achieve the quality you like.
Thanks Evlengr -
I was pretty much leaning my feelings in that way as well so I'm not really guessing...it is however confusing b/c there's ultimately TOO MUCH info and opinions out there and it's hard to gather facts.
I don't mind (and in fact prefer) aftermarket b/c I plan on paying a professional to do the job right...so it's like dropping your car off for a service call...I'll wait, they upgrade!

So that benig said...and if could ask you for another opinion/post, can you recommend some component options? If you have an older post on this sorry I just didnt' find...and with the 2011 being new I'm guessing it may be a different answer anyway.

Ultimately I'd like to keep the stock head unit (unless that's really just a bad "technical" reason), but on the rest I'm open to wahtever. I know you like alpine (me too) so I'm guessing the PXE-H660 is what you'd do for the sound correction (that's a sound processor right?)....however what about the speaker setup & amp etc. I'm not looking for crazy booming sound either...not all all...more interested in clarity and crisp sound that can be turned up a bit if I so choose.

So what I'm wondering...is if by adding the Alpine PXE-H660 and some better speakers to the stock head unit and amp, would I get a nice upgrade? Or is the amp a weak link too? What speakers (other than BSW overpriced but nice) would you recommend? And last question on the speaker side.....I know the system I have comes with 12 speakers vs 16 in the "premium"...I don't know exactly where the extra 4 speakers are but I think they are small tweaters need the door handles (front doors) and maybe 2 speakrs in each d-pilar in the back...I think the d-pilar ones are not on the 12 setup but not sure...my question is, even though I don't have those 4 speakes in the car, is the wiring still there for them and is it easy to drop the speakers in those places too...and is it even needed?

Thanks for all the help...I definitely want to do this right and the help is appreciated.
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Old 04-27-2011, 04:28 AM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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last last last question

And sorry last question...I may start a new thread on this...

can anyone recommend a good and professional (no hack) installer in the northern NJ area? I'm in Bergen county but will drive a bit (NJ only) if the installer is good.
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Old 04-27-2011, 04:55 AM
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Evlengr Evlengr is offline
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Sound

Here is a start for you:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=451804

First stage and second stage are in the same thread.

The alpine 4 inch are now sps-410 but the same idea.

Yup on the pxe and if you read through the thread I even provided a rough diagram of my layout.

My experience is with installation on a 07 and 08.

If I were to buy the new 11 I would not touch the H/U and integrate everything down stream prior to BMW's amp. That is where the processor comes in. Since the battery is in the rear compartment and they have now gotten smart and opened up the whole area underneath in the back it will be a snap for any installer to do this work. PS always make sure the installer is fully insured (even the best make mistakes) and have them show you their portfolio. If they don't have one then they don't take pride in their work and are not worth the effort.
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  #22  
Old 04-27-2011, 05:40 AM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Originally Posted by Evlengr View Post
Here is a start for you:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=451804

First stage and second stage are in the same thread.

The alpine 4 inch are now sps-410 but the same idea.

Yup on the pxe and if you read through the thread I even provided a rough diagram of my layout.

My experience is with installation on a 07 and 08.

If I were to buy the new 11 I would not touch the H/U and integrate everything down stream prior to BMW's amp. That is where the processor comes in. Since the battery is in the rear compartment and they have now gotten smart and opened up the whole area underneath in the back it will be a snap for any installer to do this work. PS always make sure the installer is fully insured (even the best make mistakes) and have them show you their portfolio. If they don't have one then they don't take pride in their work and are not worth the effort.

NICE!!!...that's awesome EV thanks so much!! So netting it out...
Stock H/U---> Sound processor ----> amp -----> speakers. That's the correct flow from what I'm gathering...and whether or not I get a new amp really depends on 1) if I need it with upgraded speakers needing more power, and 2) if I just want more power (which I probably don't so #1 is more applicable. Ideally I'd like to keep stock H/U and amp and just do the sound processor and speakers...looks like with your other post that should not be too difficult at all with the right professional doing the work...awesome stuff!!

I'll be looking for a good installer to help with this...awesome info.
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  #23  
Old 04-27-2011, 02:54 PM
jasonskitchen jasonskitchen is offline
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Location: New York
 
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Mein Auto: 2011 BMW X3 28i
MOLE, the only info i see anywhere is listed as LOGIC 7
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  #24  
Old 04-27-2011, 03:05 PM
mole7374 mole7374 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonskitchen View Post
MOLE, the only info i see anywhere is listed as LOGIC 7
ok thanks...appreciate the help! Is this physicall on the radio/speakers somewhere or in documentation?
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  #25  
Old 04-28-2011, 10:05 AM
jasonskitchen jasonskitchen is offline
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Mein Auto: 2011 BMW X3 28i
just in documentation... i havent examined the standard audio but seems as though the extra speakers w/ the logic 7 are just tweeters that only appear in small "vents" -- a few above the driver and passenger side, and I see 2 more below the rear seats... I can't really hear that much out of them, per se... but overall its pretty rich sounding system....no complaints
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