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BMW Diesel Owners / Enthusiasts
Do you own a diesel powered BMW? Maybe a 335d or a BMW x35d? Come and talk about what makes your car great!

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  #26  
Old 02-18-2013, 10:55 AM
Penguin Penguin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gulfcoastbeemer View Post
Everyone of my diesel vehicles has regularly exceeded the EPA mileage estimates published for them. Darn if I know why. I'm going to attribute it to the power of positive thinking
Or good driving habits.
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  #27  
Old 02-18-2013, 02:00 PM
Pierre Louis Pierre Louis is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gulfcoastbeemer View Post
I'm not a genius with additives, like Clark Griswold or yourself, but empirical data of my own, collected in the form of 10-years of fuel receipts for five different diesel engine vehicles, suggests fuel economy does vary with fuel source / "quality". Everyone of my diesel vehicles has regularly exceeded the EPA mileage estimates published for them. Darn if I know why.

I'm going to attribute it to the power of positive thinking -- we know it can't be a fuel additive.
I agree, but without additives. The same car as you too - a Mercedes E320 CDI that exceeded the EPA estimates. I would get 43 mpg at 65 mph on flat land for a car rated at 37 highway in the more optimistic era before they made the "correction" on the newer models.

PL
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Last edited by Pierre Louis; 02-18-2013 at 02:01 PM.
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  #28  
Old 02-18-2013, 02:50 PM
BMWTurboDzl BMWTurboDzl is offline
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I always wondered if our vehicle programming could take advantage of higher Cetane fuel (~50 ish)

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  #29  
Old 02-18-2013, 03:01 PM
Snipe656 Snipe656 is offline
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Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl View Post
I always wondered if our vehicle programming could take advantage of higher Cetane fuel (~50 ish)

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I know it is supposed to change for lower cetane. I remember reading about it within the BMW provided information back when I was researching fuels and cetane. That was 3ish years ago so I do not remember where I read that but I do know it was from BMW.
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  #30  
Old 02-18-2013, 05:02 PM
gulfcoastbeemer gulfcoastbeemer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre Louis View Post
I agree, but without additives. The same car as you too - a Mercedes E320 CDI that exceeded the EPA estimates. I would get 43 mpg at 65 mph on flat land for a car rated at 37 highway in the more optimistic era before they made the "correction" on the newer models.

PL
Pierre, does the attached photo look familiar?

That photo of the MPG display was taken during a trip last summer in my '06 M-B E320 CDI. See, I am an over-achiever.
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  #31  
Old 02-18-2013, 06:02 PM
Pierre Louis Pierre Louis is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gulfcoastbeemer View Post
Pierre, does the attached photo look familiar?

That photo of the MPG display was taken during a trip last summer in my '06 M-B E320 CDI. See, I am an over-achiever.
Whoa, that is good! May be that cetane improver working!?!

PL
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  #32  
Old 02-18-2013, 06:07 PM
gulfcoastbeemer gulfcoastbeemer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre Louis View Post
Whoa, that is good! May be that cetane improver working!?!

PL
Stanadyne Performance Formula 4 oz / 15 gal. -- that or, I was driving downhill for the last 135 miles.
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  #33  
Old 02-18-2013, 07:47 PM
Pierre Louis Pierre Louis is offline
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Originally Posted by gulfcoastbeemer View Post
Stanadyne Performance Formula 4 oz / 15 gal. -- that or, I was driving downhill for the last 135 miles.
Stanadyne may be one of the few good additives, but you may have had a tail wind!

PL
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  #34  
Old 06-30-2014, 08:41 PM
TactilE70 TactilE70 is offline
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Stanadyne diesel additive is safe to use for my 2011 x5 35D?
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  #35  
Old 07-01-2014, 06:51 AM
d geek d geek is offline
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Originally Posted by TactilE70 View Post
Stanadyne diesel additive is safe to use for my 2011 x5 35D?
All Stanadyne products are good to go with ULSD (Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel)
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  #36  
Old 07-01-2014, 06:59 AM
BMWTurboDzl BMWTurboDzl is offline
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Originally Posted by TactilE70 View Post
Stanadyne diesel additive is safe to use for my 2011 x5 35D?
Just about any well known diesel additive will probably not do any harm. I only say that based off the sheer numbers of people who use these well known products.

If a product was causing problems in significant numbers i'd like to think we would have heard about it.
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  #37  
Old 07-01-2014, 11:36 AM
TactilE70 TactilE70 is offline
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Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl View Post
Just about any well known diesel additive will probably not do any harm. I only say that based off the sheer numbers of people who use these well known products.

If a product was causing problems in significant numbers i'd like to think we would have heard about it.
Great thanks to all for insight.
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  #38  
Old 07-01-2014, 11:37 AM
TactilE70 TactilE70 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl View Post
Just about any well known diesel additive will probably not do any harm. I only say that based off the sheer numbers of people who use these well known products.

If a product was causing problems in significant numbers i'd like to think we would have heard about it.
Great thanks to all for the insight.
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  #39  
Old 07-01-2014, 05:50 PM
Pierre Louis Pierre Louis is offline
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Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl View Post
Just about any well known diesel additive will probably not do any harm. I only say that based off the sheer numbers of people who use these well known products.

If a product was causing problems in significant numbers i'd like to think we would have heard about it.
This isn't really true is it. We never see if any of the people with real problems used preventive additives. Perhaps they didn't but I don't know if they would readily admit it.

There really is no data on their use, positive or negative, just anecdotes. The companies that sell them for a profit certainly don't publish field data that would show a significant advantage.

The best users can say, from my experience, is that the ingredients are the "same" as what is in the diesel additive package used already (plus 99% plain diesel fuel, BTW).

PL
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Last edited by Pierre Louis; 07-01-2014 at 05:53 PM.
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  #40  
Old 07-02-2014, 07:05 AM
d geek d geek is offline
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I would recommend a name brand diesel additive if I had a 328d. The reason being is that this same HPFP has been in use since 2009 in Audi/VW diesels sold here in N Am and there have been a number of HPFP failures in that time. The root cause for these failures is unknown to the public. Bosch has revised the pump over that time, but VW has been mute on the subject so it is unknown what changes were made.

When the first modern BMW diesels were introduced to this market in 2009, the pump that was used had special internal coatings to deal with the lower quality diesel found over here. I have not heard of any HPFP failures in these 6 cyl diesels to date. Perhaps BMW spec'd this same coating on the Bosch pump used on the 4 cyl diesel used in the 328d and X3. One thing to note is that the pump used on these engines and the Passat tdi are slightly lower pressure than the ones used on Audi/VW- I think because these use solenoid injectors instead of piezo-electric injectors. There have been very few Passat HPFP failures reported on tdiclub.com compared to the Jetta and Golf that use the higher pressure pump.

A quality additive like Power Service or Stanadyne will improve fuel lubricity. This can only help the pump if it is a marginal design.
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  #41  
Old 07-02-2014, 08:37 AM
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floydarogers floydarogers is offline
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Originally Posted by d geek View Post
I would recommend a name brand diesel additive if I had a 328d. The reason being is that this same HPFP has been in use since 2009 in Audi/VW diesels sold here in N Am and there have been a number of HPFP failures in that time. The root cause for these failures is unknown to the public. Bosch has revised the pump over that time, but VW has been mute on the subject so it is unknown what changes were made.
....
A quality additive like Power Service or Stanadyne will improve fuel lubricity. This can only help the pump if it is a marginal design.
Since virtually all diesel here has bio-diesel in it, which improves lubricity, I question that additives to increase it are really needed. IIRC, many if not most VW failures are related to mis-fueling with gasoline.
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  #42  
Old 07-02-2014, 08:51 AM
d geek d geek is offline
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Originally Posted by floydarogers View Post
Since virtually all diesel here has bio-diesel in it, which improves lubricity, I question that additives to increase it are really needed. IIRC, many if not most VW failures are related to mis-fueling with gasoline.
I agree that biodiesel is an effective lubricity additive. Biodiesel also increases the chances of free water in diesel, and most name brand additives address that too.

Where is here? Certainly not the whole US. Although standard diesel (D2) may have up to 5% biodiesel content per the ASTM spec, it is by no means universally true that all D2 has biodiesel content. Most states have their own labeling laws. Here in Texas the diesel pumps are required to be labeled if there is any biodiesel content. I can tell you that not all pumps are labeled such. So I know at least here not all diesel has biodiesel content. I know that biodiesel is difficult to find in MI as well.

While it is true that some tdi HPFP failures are due to mis-fueling, then you would expect random HPFP failures on all diesels. How many have you seen reported on this forum? There have been hundreds of HPFP failures reported at tdiclub- many by long time diesel owners who are extremely unlikely to have misfueled with gasoline.
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  #43  
Old 07-02-2014, 09:07 AM
Pierre Louis Pierre Louis is offline
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Brushing aside skeptics and evangelists, here is some data from VW on HPFP failures and lubricity.

BMW has had a better handle on fuel system components when looking at fuel pump reliability, but no-one is perfect. The recommendation NOT to use additives continues per BMW.

PL
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  #44  
Old 07-02-2014, 12:03 PM
d geek d geek is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre Louis View Post
...
BMW has had a better handle on fuel system components when looking at fuel pump reliability, but no-one is perfect. The recommendation NOT to use additives continues per BMW.

PL
You make a good point. If your car is in warranty, and the manual specifically says "no additives", then you are advised to play it safe in order to not give them any reason to deny warranty. In this case the 5% biodiesel as suggested by floydarogers is a good idea, if you have access to it.
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  #45  
Old 07-02-2014, 12:40 PM
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I hate to bust everyone's bubble but I've been using additives since I bought the car so far sogood and that was 3 yrs ago and 44k

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  #46  
Old 07-02-2014, 01:28 PM
Pierre Louis Pierre Louis is offline
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I hate to bust everyone's bubble but I've been using additives since I bought the car so far sogood and that was 3 yrs ago and 44k

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You're OK. Amsoil is considered a reputable company as to the products it makes.

PL
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  #47  
Old 07-05-2014, 03:52 PM
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floydarogers floydarogers is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d geek View Post
...
Where is here? Certainly not the whole US...
Almost the entire US has incentives or mandates in place for ethanol & biodiesel - looks like 44 of 60 states. http://www.c2es.org/us-states-region...-maps/biofuels
Number of biodiesel mandates appears to be about 1/2 that: http://www.sae.org/events/gim/presen...oebkenberg.pdf (see the map p.7; also note the date 2005...)
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  #48  
Old 07-05-2014, 08:37 PM
d geek d geek is offline
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Originally Posted by floydarogers View Post
Almost the entire US has incentives or mandates in place for ethanol & biodiesel - looks like 44 of 60 states. http://www.c2es.org/us-states-region...-maps/biofuels
Number of biodiesel mandates appears to be about 1/2 that: http://www.sae.org/events/gim/presen...oebkenberg.pdf (see the map p.7; also note the date 2005...)
That graphic shows that there are mandates in 11 states. Just because there is a financial incentive does not mean that

Quote:
Originally Posted by floydarogers View Post
...virtually all diesel here has bio-diesel in it...

Last edited by d geek; 07-05-2014 at 09:35 PM.
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  #49  
Old 07-11-2014, 06:24 PM
totitan totitan is offline
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Optilube is the best for increasing lubricity and it only takes 1/4 oz/gal. Its widely used by members over at TDI Club. I know its circumstantial but there has been no HPFP falures in members cars that use it regularly. BTW.... d geek and Pierre Louis Im well aware of your positions on this issue.
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  #50  
Old 07-11-2014, 08:30 PM
sirbikes sirbikes is offline
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Per the directions, I only use 1 to 2 oz per tankful ~ 20 gal. Should I be using more? I bought 5 gal of it when it was on sale over a year ago and it still feels full -- lasts a long time. A few pennies per gal.

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Optilube is the best for increasing lubricity and it only takes 1/4 oz/gal. Its widely used by members over at TDI Club. I know its circumstantial but there has been no HPFP falures in members cars that use it regularly. BTW.... d geek and Pierre Louis Im well aware of your positions on this issue.
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