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  #1  
Old 01-11-2004, 10:58 PM
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"ZHP" vs. Stock 330i - Acceleration Numbers

After some interesting acceleration results with the ’01 E46 330i (owned by Tanin) when we took the modifications off (there's another long thread on that)… we decided to test his new ’04 E46 330i with the “ZHP” Performance Package for acceleration times. The car is new, so we’ve had to wait for the miles to accumulate before we did any legitimate testing. When the odometer rolled to 1400 miles, we hooked up the instruments. Some (myself included) will argue we didn’t wait long enough.

Testing was done by a Passport G-Timer GT2, at our “secret” test location (flat, level, and no traffic). Ambient temp was about 58 F, elevation about 10 feet above sea level.

In any case, I have attached the spreadsheet with the three different variations of E46 we tested (Stock, ZHP, Mod).

You’ll notice the “ZHP” was slower than the stock 330i to 60 mph, and in the quarter mile. We were surprised, but not shocked. The “ZHP” accelerated faster in some gears, while the stock 330i took others. At the end of the quarter, the “ZHP” was only .12 seconds behind (a blink). These numbers may reflect the “newness” of the engine, or the “newness” of the vehicle/transmission to the driver!

The ZHP is still very new. It is common knowledge that German engines (BMW in particular) tend to “loosen-up” and get faster as they age. The “Stock” 330i had nearly 50,000 on the clock, and was a very quick production example (it would beat my ’01 330i in every drag race ). I firmly believe the “ZHP” will shave some time as it ages… and, of course, we’ll test it!

BTW - The “ZHP” is now at Borla getting a new exhaust which we will follow with a CAI.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Overview - E46.pdf (31.6 KB, 1181 views)
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  #2  
Old 01-11-2004, 11:35 PM
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mquetel mquetel is offline
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Perhaps the ZHP was a tad slower b/c of all the extra baggage the option carries with it?
  #3  
Old 01-12-2004, 12:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emission
BTW - The “ZHP” is now at Borla getting a new exhaust which we will follow with a CAI.
The car will be put on a dyno "stock" and after the Borla has been installed. I promise to post the #'s when available. In theory I should have the car back next Friday
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  #4  
Old 01-12-2004, 05:34 AM
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  #5  
Old 01-12-2004, 06:02 AM
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Those times for the ZHP are pretty impressive . . . Tanin's regular 330i was a faster then usual 330 so the fact that a ZHP with only 1400 miles on it turned in such low times is impressive.

I would bet when that ZHP has about 7000 miles on it, you'll get even better times . . .
  #6  
Old 01-12-2004, 06:32 AM
DaveH DaveH is offline
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I would like to see the results with the ZHP wheels swapped with the 2001 330i (I assume they are the 17" sport model standard). It has been my iimpression that the ZHP 18" wheels with Bridgestone tires are heavier than most think and that the ZHP bump in torque/Hp is negated by the extra wheel weight.
  #7  
Old 01-12-2004, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveH
I would like to see the results with the ZHP wheels swapped with the 2001 330i (I assume they are the 17" sport model standard). It has been my iimpression that the ZHP 18" wheels with Bridgestone tires are heavier than most think and that the ZHP bump in torque/Hp is negated by the extra wheel weight.
My thoughts as well.
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  #8  
Old 01-12-2004, 06:46 AM
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Thanks Emission.

I agree with Alan and DaveH. That 330i is one of the fastest we've seen, so the ZHP's times aren't too bad given that it has only 1400 miles on it. That said, this thread will be great ammuniition for ZHP bashers.

It would be REALLY interesting to repeat the tests when the ZHP has 20K miles and run with stock ZHP wheels and also a set of M68's.
  #9  
Old 01-12-2004, 07:17 AM
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Though I would say the ZHP would definitely get better times with the M68's wrapped in Pilot's or Contisports . . . it wouldn't make much difference in the real world because 99% of the ZHP's have the heavier 18's.

Rumatt & I have faster cars then the ZHP owners, that's all that matters



BTW I bet this thread will be up to 4 pages by the end of the day . . .
  #10  
Old 01-12-2004, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AF330i

BTW I bet this thread will be up to 4 pages by the end of the day . . .




Wait til I get new pulleys and a set of these.....



Then we will talk
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  #11  
Old 01-12-2004, 08:08 AM
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Emission Emission is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AF330i
Though I would say the ZHP would definitely get better times with the M68's wrapped in Pilot's or Contisports . . . it wouldn't make much difference in the real world because 99% of the ZHP's have the heavier 18's.
I think you answered your own question. We wanted to test a stock ZHP, and those were the numbers - objective.

I may add that we did three good runs (we actually did more, but with missed shifts or too much wheelspin at launch) - all were within .1 of each other. Two actually had the identical 1/4 mile times (in different directions).

I am adding two columns to the spreadsheet - my X5 3.0 and my dad's 540i 6-speed (new attachement below). My X5 seems a bit quicker than most (not as slow as you all thought!), while the 540i seems right on the money. Remember, every car is slightly different (ever wonder why a car magazine doesn't ever test five identical cars? Yeah, the numbers would be all over the board!).
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Overview - All BMW.pdf (32.6 KB, 438 views)
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  #12  
Old 01-12-2004, 08:38 AM
DaveH DaveH is offline
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Personally, I think your testing is a great addition to the information on this site and please take my humble suggestion as an addenda to the already fine work you have done. I do not wish to see this on all of your tests-only the ZHP vs 330i test..

The reason I would like to see the test of the 17" & 18" wheel swap is to place a pseudo-control on the experiment for those like myself who feel the added unsprung wheel weight is very costly to the ZHP. I also believe that the small ZHP engine modifications were needed in order to keep up with the stock 330i set up. Although the outcome is predictable, I would like to verify the severity of the wheel weights on acceleration. All I have read on the subject has been in theory only. No one has ever put numbers on an actual test before.

Since some on this site are always looking to increase the performance of their vehicles, what modification that you know of could improve overall handling and acceleration in one package other than rims/tires? CAI? Exhaust? Sway bars? Chips? Without voiding the BMW warranty, none of these do in my mind. The potential for ZHP owners to see that wheel size and weight has reached it's apex as far as return of investment on performance (theoretically, of course). They should actually be looking to downsize back to 17" rim which I feel is the optimum size for the E46 chassis size and curb weight
  #13  
Old 01-12-2004, 08:41 AM
jeffinohio jeffinohio is offline
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If possible I would love to see the numbers a 330 coupe can put up and see how they compare to the zhp and 330 sedan!
  #14  
Old 01-12-2004, 09:06 AM
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Emission Emission is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveH
The reason I would like to see the test of the 17" & 18" wheel swap is to place a pseudo-control on the experiment for those like myself who feel the added unsprung wheel weight is very costly to the ZHP. I also believe that the small ZHP engine modifications were needed in order to keep up with the stock 330i set up. Although the outcome is predictable, I would like to verify the severity of the wheel weights on acceleration. All I have read on the subject has been in theory only. No one has ever put numbers on an actual test before.
The stock rear width is 245 while the "ZHP" option bumps it to 255. This should give more grip at launch and (maybe) offset the added weight. I know the issue with heavy wheels is the increased resistance to breaking inertia - for some reason (maybe that added width) the 0-10 mph time of the "ZHP" was quicker (.34 vs .36) for the "ZHP" making me question that inertia issue - and wondering if it is really a non-issue when offset with wider tires.

I don't think my testing equipment (or anyone's for that matter) can accurately differentiate between the two wheels - short of a drag strip with lights. For that matter, what about the increased aerodynamic drag from the wider wheels? Shouldn't they slow the car?

There are so many things that affect acceleration, not just vehicle-related. The atmospheric pressure, temperature, humidity, altitude, road surface, road condition, etc... Frustrating, really. We try to eliminate these variables by testing on the identical road...
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I am fortunate to have unique press cars delivered weekly, but I own:

'13 Audi Q5 2.0T Quattro 8AT
'15 Volkswagen Golf TDI 6MT
'86 Porsche 911 Turbo 4MT


Gone, but never forgotten... my E70 X5 35d, E90 335i, E46 330i, E36 328i, E70 X5 3.0si, E53 X5 3.0i.
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  #15  
Old 01-12-2004, 09:06 AM
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Emission, thanks for posting your test results. I look forward to seeing some more test results once she's a little more broken in.

I can't help but wonder how Car & Driver got a 0 to 60 time of 5.6 seconds out of a 330i ZHP.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Car & Driver's Test Results
Displacement: 182 cu in, 2979cc
Power (SAE net): 235 bhp @ 5900 rpm
Torque (SAE net): 222 lb-ft @ 3500 rpm
Transmission: 6-speed manual
Wheelbase: 107.3 in
Length/width/height: 176.0/68.5/55.1 in
Curb weight: 3370 lb
Zero to 60 mph: 5.6 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 15.3 sec
Street start, 5-60 mph: 6.4 sec
Standing 1/4-mile: 14.3 sec @ 97 mph
Top speed (drag limited): 152 mph
Braking, 70-0 mph: 158 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad: 0.86 g
EPA fuel economy, city driving: 21 mpg
C/D-observed fuel economy: 20 mpg
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Last edited by Andy; 01-12-2004 at 09:11 AM.
  #16  
Old 01-12-2004, 09:07 AM
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Emission Emission is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffinohio
If possible I would love to see the numbers a 330 coupe can put up and see how they compare to the zhp and 330 sedan!
We plan on testing those too. We just need to get our hands on some.
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I am fortunate to have unique press cars delivered weekly, but I own:

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Gone, but never forgotten... my E70 X5 35d, E90 335i, E46 330i, E36 328i, E70 X5 3.0si, E53 X5 3.0i.
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  #17  
Old 01-12-2004, 09:20 AM
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Emission Emission is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy
Emission, thanks for posting your test results. I look forward to seeing some more test results once she's a little more broken in.

I can't help but wonder how Car & Driver got a 0 to 60 time of 5.6 seconds out of a 330i ZHP.
Press vehicles are all very scientifically broken-in (at least the Nissan/Infinitis are!), and most have miles on them. They may be hand-selected by the manufacturer too. Other than that...
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I am fortunate to have unique press cars delivered weekly, but I own:

'13 Audi Q5 2.0T Quattro 8AT
'15 Volkswagen Golf TDI 6MT
'86 Porsche 911 Turbo 4MT


Gone, but never forgotten... my E70 X5 35d, E90 335i, E46 330i, E36 328i, E70 X5 3.0si, E53 X5 3.0i.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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  #18  
Old 01-12-2004, 09:45 AM
DaveH DaveH is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emission
The stock rear width is 245 while the "ZHP" option bumps it to 255. This should give more grip at launch and (maybe) offset the added weight. I know the issue with heavy wheels is the increased resistance to breaking inertia - for some reason (maybe that added width) the 0-10 mph time of the "ZHP" was quicker (.34 vs .36) for the "ZHP" making me question that inertia issue - and wondering if it is really a non-issue when offset with wider tires.

I don't think my testing equipment (or anyone's for that matter) can accurately differentiate between the two wheels - short of a drag strip with lights. For that matter, what about the increased aerodynamic drag from the wider wheels? Shouldn't they slow the car?

There are so many things that affect acceleration, not just vehicle-related. The atmospheric pressure, temperature, humidity, altitude, road surface, road condition, etc... Frustrating, really. We try to eliminate these variables by testing on the identical road...

The added tire width from 245 to 255 equates to about a 4% increase in tire contact patch. This may affect launch since you were experimenting with wheel spin for optimum times. The aerodynamic drag is negligible based upon the percent increase versus total frontal area. The speeds are also too low for the forces of drag to have any real consequences on these differences as well. The fact that you measure all the environmental conditions as a basis for your report shows that you and your colleagues understand how they affect the testing data and performance variations. That is why I find your posts very informative and valid.
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Last edited by DaveH; 01-12-2004 at 09:48 AM.
  #19  
Old 01-12-2004, 10:25 AM
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So she's a little slow, but she still looks good doin' it.
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  #20  
Old 01-12-2004, 10:44 AM
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What's the launch rpm for all three cars? 3000rpm-ish? do you do power shifts?



Excellent info.
  #21  
Old 01-12-2004, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ezsce46
What's the launch rpm for all three cars? 3000rpm-ish? do you do power shifts?
Good question.

First of all, these cars are privately owned, so nothing nasty or abusive.

Launches are generally 2000-3000 rpm and with a dumped clutch (no slipping as it is abusive in my book). Shifts are hard, but we do use the clutch!

"Tanin" can better describe the launches, as all the BMW times are his (except for the X5 which I did).
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  #22  
Old 01-12-2004, 11:01 AM
binaryfarms binaryfarms is offline
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I've got a 330coupe that would love to see the "secret testing facility".

Completely stock, manual, and I'm in the area. Thanks for the numbers, very interesting to see. Lemme know if you'd like a willing lab rat to continue your tests on.
  #23  
Old 01-12-2004, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emission
There are so many things that affect acceleration, not just vehicle-related. The atmospheric pressure, temperature, humidity, altitude, road surface, road condition, etc... Frustrating, really. We try to eliminate these variables by testing on the identical road...
So you do as much as you can to eliminate as many variables as possible. If all of the weather conditions are recorded, they, along with the day's results, can be calibrated against a known standard (such as ISA) so that multiple testing sessions can be meaningfully compared (and even different runs in the same testing sessions)

You're off to a good start by using the same location (so long as the surface condition doesn't change). Are you recording and monitoring the other conditions throughout your sessions?

Also, are you trying to get the best possible times out of each vehicle or are you using constant launch and shift techniques? Also, are you keeping track of tire pressures during your tests?
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  #24  
Old 01-12-2004, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ·clyde·
So you do as much as you can to eliminate as many variables as possible. If all of the weather conditions are recorded, they, along with the day's results, can be calibrated against a known standard (such as ISA) so that multiple testing sessions can be meaningfully compared (and even different runs in the same testing sessions)

You're off to a good start by using the same location (so long as the surface condition doesn't change). Are you recording and monitoring the other conditions throughout your sessions?

Also, are you trying to get the best possible times out of each vehicle or are you using constant launch and shift techniques? Also, are you keeping track of tire pressures during your tests?
Or, instead of doing that, have a "control" vehicle that you run, like one of the cars that you're always going to have at these tests, and run a couple of runs each time and compare the sessions and see how much pressure, temperature and humidity affect the actual runs themselves.

Maybe we can all pitch in to buy you some proper test equipment or new clutches for the 930 Turbo.
  #25  
Old 01-12-2004, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK
Or, instead of doing that, have a "control" vehicle that you run, like one of the cars that you're always going to have at these tests, and run a couple of runs each time and compare the sessions and see how much pressure, temperature and humidity affect the actual runs themselves.

Maybe we can all pitch in to buy you some proper test equipment or new clutches for the 930 Turbo.
Using a single car as a control device wouldn't do a whole lot to provide a reliable baseline over time as parts age, wear and get replaced. Different cars and/or parts will respond differently to different atmospheric conditions as well. Converting to ISA isn't foolproof, but the standard is fixed while another mechanical object is not.
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