Welcome to Bimmerfest -- The #1 Online Community for BMW related information! Please enjoy the discussion forums below and share your experiences with the 200,000 current, new and past BMW owners. The forums are broken out by car model and into other special interest sections such as BMW European Delivery and a special forum to voice your questions to the many BMW dealers on the site to assist our members!

Please follow the links below to help get you started!

Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 5 Series > E39 (1997 - 2003)

E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #26  
Old 02-02-2013, 05:58 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Quote:
Originally Posted by Microflight View Post
how does the code P0500 translate to English.
It's in the picture below from my bogus smog failure from the referenced thread.
- P0500 Vehicle Speed Sensor Malfunction
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 02-22-2013, 06:19 PM
Microflight Microflight is offline
Registered User
Location: Goleta CA
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 7
Mein Auto: 2005 E46
Trifecta - Brake Pressure Sensor 81 error code - not Sensor but Module

2003 E 39 After a previous post I made starting with an 81 error code which would have been the brake pressure sensor, I back probed the sensor and saw that it was giving credible values. I then concluded ( guessed) that it was the module.

A BMW tech friend identified a rebuilder that he used and liked - Module Master in of all places Moscow Idaho (actually near Spokane Washington) phone 888-892-0764 and on the web.

They quoted 300 for the Bosch 5.7 module. Their terms are 5 day turn. If the Module has no error on the inbound check, there is only the shipping charge. If the module is unrepairable, for $75 additional they will send you a good unit - remembering that you will have to reprogram the VIN into it so there would be that additional charge when you got it back. Module Master provides a 5 year warranty.

I sent the module, they repaired and returned it to me. I installed it and the ABS, DSC and Brake warning lights went out on start - normal. One day later aver a number of short trips the service engine soon light also went out. NERVANA

The report from Module Master is as follows: "Repaired damage to power return circuit and 8 line sensor driver section to restore proper module operation. Installed high current shunt to protect power return circuit from future failure. Unit now powers up and executes self test and functions perfectly on test fixture without any error codes."

I conclude that this module was unerdesigned and while surviving for a number of years was bound to fail. Given the number of failures and the common knowledge among the Indy's I know that they immediately are aware and have experienced the problem with the module

As for error codes, one has to be careful in assessing a fault code that is based upon a network communication like the ABS module. I am certain from the DME and ABS module prospective, the error is that it is not receiving the communication from the Brake Pressur Sensor, but once you verify the brake pressure sensor is sending signal, the culprit are the wires or the module as was the case here in the module.

While I could have opened the module and attempted the repair, I sense that it would be sublect to failure again without the shunt. $300 is a lot - peace of mind is priceless
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-17-2013, 09:40 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Quote:
Originally Posted by Microflight View Post
81 error code ... I back probed the sensor and saw that it was giving credible values
The anecdotal evidence is overwhelming that the 81 code is bogus (most of the time). In fact, I can't remember a single incidence of the 81 being real (but I am no expert and not everyone is on the forums). Point is that the 81 error code 'should' be further tested before believing it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Microflight View Post
A BMW tech friend identified a rebuilder that he used and liked
See also:
- What are all known options when your ABS control module is bad (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Microflight View Post
As for error codes, one has to be careful in assessing a fault code that is based upon a network communication like the ABS module.
Bill (540iman) would be proud of you! You're one of the few who realize the inability to get isolation readings without actually isolating the components under test.
- Explanations by 540iman as to why the fancy diagnostic tools very often (extremely often, like almost all the time) fail to properly diagnose the trifecta or bifecta (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Microflight View Post
I sent the module, they repaired and returned it to me.
Thanks for the update. I will append it to the canonical ABS trifecta thread:
- How to diagnose the BMW amber ABS BRAKE DSC/ASC trifecta or bifecta (1)
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	bps.png
Views:	2905
Size:	128.9 KB
ID:	366974  
Attached Files
File Type: pdf BMW_30-PAGE_DSC_COMPONENTS.PDF (1.69 MB, 119 views)
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need

Last edited by bluebee; 03-18-2013 at 12:28 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 03-18-2013, 12:27 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
See also this thread today, by Poolman, which discusses how to properly REMOVE the brake pressure sensor:
- Brake pressure sensor
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 10-14-2013, 12:09 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
This post by poolman in a thread today shows why we can't trust the mechanics when they tell us the Brake Pressure Sensor is bad, simply because they're sometimes reading what the broken computer is telling the diagnostic port:
-> E39 (1997 - 2003) > ABS sensor
Quote:
Originally Posted by poolman View Post
My indy told me all of my sensors were OK and that my problem was brake pressure issues,,which became the rebuild of my ABS unit
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 12-29-2013, 01:11 PM
jkeysatx jkeysatx is offline
Registered User
Location: texas
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 1
Mein Auto: 2002 5301
e39 error 105?

My ABS/DSC warning lights came on, had the code read and replaced the right front wheel sensor. While I was at it I replaced the front brake pads. Drove the car and the waring lights came back on...the original code for the wheel sensor now is clear...and I have the brake presure error code 105..so now I'm not sure if the original problem was real and could use some advice...
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 12-29-2013, 03:23 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkeysatx View Post
My ABS/DSC warning lights came on, had the code read and replaced the right front wheel sensor. While I was at it I replaced the front brake pads. Drove the car and the waring lights came back on...the original code for the wheel sensor now is clear...and I have the brake presure error code 105..so now I'm not sure if the original problem was real and could use some advice...
Other than the cooling system, and FSU, the trifecta is probably the next-most common problem on the E39.

In almost all of the trifecta/bifecta threads, the problem was either one of the sensors or the ABS control module.

So, the team here developed a test of the wheel speed sensors, and it's all documented in this huge thread. Just sit down, grab a cup of coffee, and read it and you'll solve your problem.

NOBODY to my knowledge has not solved this problem (well, there was the one guy who just wanted the error to go away so he could sell the car to some unsuspecting sap, and he wasn't able to do that without actually fixing the car - which he complained about - so he didn't) but everyone else has solved the problem with the information in this one thread....

- How to diagnose the BMW amber ABS BRAKE DSC/ASC trifecta or bifecta (1) & what are all known options when your ABS control module is bad (1)
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 05-09-2014, 04:28 PM
upallnight upallnight is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Crook County
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 525
Mein Auto: BMW, Lotus, Porsche
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
It's in the picture below from my bogus smog failure from the referenced thread.
- P0500 Vehicle Speed Sensor Malfunction
The failure is for the MIL or Check Engine light. If you reset the check engine light or MIL prior to taking the car in for testing and didn't have enough drive cycles (150 plus miles, plus several start and stop cycles) you fail the test. This is to prevent people from resetting the CEL or MIL about a block away from the testing site to extinguish the lights.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 05-09-2014, 10:57 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Quote:
Originally Posted by upallnight View Post
The failure is for the MIL or Check Engine light. If you reset the check engine light or MIL prior to taking the car in for testing and didn't have enough drive cycles (150 plus miles, plus several start and stop cycles) you fail the test. This is to prevent people from resetting the CEL or MIL about a block away from the testing site to extinguish the lights.
What happened, to me, was that I failed inspection due to this bogus P0500 which did NOT set the check engine light.

The bogus P0500 occurred because the ABS control module was removed for repair (I'm assuming that's what caused the P0500 since that's when it happened and it never happened again, and I didn't change anything in the interim).

The problem was that it did NOT set a fault, but, it set a PENDING fault, which caused me to fail inspection (it takes three pending faults to set the CEL).

So, my warning to others, is to check your monitors with a scanner BEFORE going for smog inspection after having removed the ABS control module.

See also:
- What's this about the P0500 setting the SES (1) & why you want to wait a week before getting a smog test after removing your ABS control module (1)
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 05-10-2014, 04:31 AM
upallnight upallnight is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Crook County
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 525
Mein Auto: BMW, Lotus, Porsche
ABS fault will not set off a CEL or MIL fault. It will set of the ABS light or brake light. Why should they even be concern with an ABS fault since it is not smog related. I can see if you were in a European country or England where cars are brought in for a MOT.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 05-10-2014, 09:22 AM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Quote:
Originally Posted by upallnight View Post
ABS fault will not set off a CEL or MIL fault. It will set of the ABS light or brake light. Why should they even be concern with an ABS fault since it is not smog related. I can see if you were in a European country or England where cars are brought in for a MOT.
I fully understand what you're saying, and, don't disagree that the ABS won't, in and of itself, set the CEL, but, a P0500 will set the CEL, if the pending code is seen on three successive FTC drive cycles.

However, when I inquired at the time why I was being failed for a seemingly non-emission-related pending fault code, I was told that MANY things affect emissions, including the AC, evap leaks, and, yes, speed sensors.

Now, you and I know this P0500 was a bogus pending code, and, since I hadn't checked for pending codes before paying for my smog check, I was plumb out of luck (i.e., completely out of luck).

I did call the smog check referee at the time, but, he told me the same thing.

Anyway, the fact is clear that I failed due to a pending P0500, and, that I passed without changing anything, two weeks later, simply by driving the vehicle.
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need

Last edited by bluebee; 05-12-2014 at 02:21 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 10-05-2014, 09:05 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Here's another case of a false reading today:
> E39 (1997 - 2003) > DSC, Brakes, an ABS
Quote:
Originally Posted by fortunateson View Post
We'll I have been having the "trifecta" issue for the last month. I an indie read the codes and came up with "line pressure sensor". I was going to send the ABS sensor to BBA for a repair but held off because of the code reading. To be sure I went to another indie and they confirmed it was the sensor. Got the part and installed it. The three lights went off.... For about twenty seconds! Goodbye to about $200. I can't really complain to either indie since they read the codes for free. I guess I'll have to send the ABS off now anyway. Pissed off to say the least!
See also:
- How to physically test & repair the Bosch ABS control module (1) & how to diagnose the BMW amber ABS BRAKE DSC/ASC trifecta or bifecta (1) & what are all known options when your ABS control module is bad (1) & why you want to only buy oem wheel speed sensors (1) & how to remove and replace the four BMW E39 ABS related WSS wheel speed sensors (1) & which wss innervates the speedometer (1) & explanations by 540iman as to why the fancy diagnostic tools always fail to properly diagnose the trifecta or bifecta (1) & where to get the fancy schmancy diagnostic tools for free once you're aware of their limitations (1) & why it's probably not the ABS hydraulic pump failing (1) & how to properly test the BPS brake pressure sensor (1) & how to properly test and replace the steering angle sensor (1) & Quick99Si's explanation of why the 10-minute wheel speed sensor diode-action quick test doesn't always work, especially on non-OEM wheel speed sensors (1) & what's this about the P0500 setting the SES (1) & why you want to wait a week before getting a smog test after removing your ABS control module (1) &, if you really want to try, how to attempt to disable the ABS/DSC but keep the speedometer and mpg cluster readouts (1)
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 10-20-2014, 11:24 PM
Walopower Walopower is offline
Registered User
Location: Finland
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 74
Mein Auto: 525iAT
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
In post #522 of the canonical ABS trifecta thread, I've added more detailed pictures of the connectors and I've improved the pinout annotation at the ABS harness connector with respect to the diagram above.

I have e39 525iA 2001.
Got codes:
88 Vorlade Pumpe.
92 Druck Sensor (Plausibilitaet Vorlade Pumpe).
First was DSC+ABS light, then only DSC light.
INPA logs wheel sensors data correct.
Preload pump runs smootly with manually 12V, but activation from INPA I got it run once when I try about 10 times.
I measured Preload pump wires, 12+ on Black (groud), if I activate preload pump from INPA, it goes to GND.
Nothing in Red. I have find it from WDS where it should come.
I tested pressure sensor, but, when I measure Blue (center) wire without connected, it show 5V like violet wire, In connected it show varying voltage between 0.46V-3.0XV and grey wire (should be varying voltage) shows ground, not like in above example!
Before yesterday it works fine.
Where is problem, in ABS control box maybe?
Update: I ordered new DSC box, I can code it myself. In Europe ECU repair services cost more than USA. Let's see in next week that if it was the problem.
Then I will try to fix old box if it is reason of the problem.

(Already soldered).

Whole story:

I bought a new ABS/DSC box /Bosch 5.7 "1265950002" (same code than old one).
Then I tried to code it with NCS Expert following this help:
http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...e-w-NCS-Expert
I can read vehicle data (ZCS/FA f) from all ECUS. But then it not show DSC ECU, only ASC5 ECU (witch should not be there), but I have DSC!

Modules appears:
ABG,ASC5,EWS,GM3,IHKR,KMB,LCM;RAD,SM

I tried with old ABS box and it make same.
Then I tried code ASC5 module, it was wrong and got I got ASC5 codierindex=h10 error.
New ABS identified in INPA and I already calibrated steering wheel senser.
Old daten files or where is problem?
But I can't find newer than v.41.
I tried INPA version 4.4.7/5.0.2/6.5.2.
Do I have to install EasyDIS?

First one is old ECU and second new one.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Unit BMWTNR HW SW-FSW CI DI BI/VI Date Odometer VIN ADFG Algorithm
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ABS -> 6.757.595 55 03 10 16 3C 06/01 - - - DSC5.7
ABS -> 6.769.537 55 03 10 16 3C 07/14 - - - DSC5.7

I used BMW decoder, decoded old FA/SA, activated DSC option, encoded, one number changed. Started NCS expert, readed ZCS, then entered ZCS manually, and changed one 0->9 to FA/SA number and after that, DSC module was in coding list! Then I coded it and warning lights and ABS error code was gone!
Only strange thing when I opened INPA ans DSC page, ABS+DSC light starts illuminating, no error codes, I need to read errors from other modules too.
Maybe I have to code all modules, but I am little scary to do that, because everything works now.

Edit:
I found ZCS label from trunk, it was in Nokia HIFI Bass unit. But in that is also number 03.01.06 (europe format 2006?), but there is also correct VIN, so SA should also be right
When I bought this car, there was same miscodings, I think somebody is coded it wrong in early days.
That SA code in the labes is same than was in ZCS. Very strange, no DSC, Xenons, Automatic climate, what are original equipments for sure.
I added DCS, Xenons, board computer (0550, assumed that this is low as should?), automatic climate to SA code with BMW decoder. Changed that SA to those three modules with FA_write job.
OLD modules in coding list:
ABG,ASC5,EWS,GM3,IHKR,KMB,LCM;RAD,SM
NOW:
ABG,DSC,EWS,GM3,IHKA,KMB,LCM,LWR,LWS,RAD,SM
Should LWS be here? it is controlled by DSC? (I checked also steering wheel sensor to SA code).
Then I code whole car.
Got LWR job-not-found error (maybe lights should on when prosessing), coded it independet, was ok.
Airbag light starts illuminate, it was passanger belt switch. I started BMWscanner, coded passanger belt switch current monitoring ON, airbag light goes off.
Then I use BMW Scanner to clear errors and code lights, Alarm etc. behavior to my preference.
Now there is no errors, everything works!

So it was brake pressure sensor and pump error codes, but it was a module...
I have read that sensor or pump failures are uncommon reason to errors.

Last edited by Walopower; 10-30-2014 at 12:26 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 10-21-2014, 07:45 AM
Crutzy Crutzy is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: New Jersey
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 150
Mein Auto: BMW 5-series E39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walopower View Post
in ABS control box maybe?
You asked the same question in the tirfecta thread.
Forget about the codes.
When the computer is bad, the computer spits out bad codes.
Everyone gets them. They are meaningless (probably).

Your problem is almost certainly the computer, so just open it up, remove the goop around the big wire, and reattach the big wire with conductive epoxy. Or just pay someone $100 to do that for you.

First double check your wheel speed sensors with a digital multimeter, but after that, reattach that wire and you're good to go.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 10-23-2014, 09:52 PM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Yet another brake pressure sensor was replaced, to no avail ...
> E39 (1997 - 2003) > 2002 E39 ASC BRAKE ABS lights on => Diagnostic Procedure & Parts Location
Quote:
Originally Posted by fortunateson View Post
Well the sensors were not tested. The initial code was brake line pressure sensor, done by two independent mechanics, so that sensor was replaced ($200). Read up on the issue and sent ABS unit to BBA , re-installed, trifecta gone! Cleared the SAS code and trifecta back as I stated. Can someone lead me to the promised land?
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 01-24-2015, 07:18 AM
stuartjohn24 stuartjohn24 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Chippenham, Wiltshire, UK
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 682
Mein Auto: BMW E65 745i
Hello!

I currently have a brake pressure sensor fault on my DSC module, its intermittent at the moment so I purchased a spare DSC module so I could investigate further. The replacement module was fault too but these were simple blown MOSFET issues (Faults with return pump and pre-charge pump) I have fixed this now and documented what I found on a new thread in the E65 section.

However while I was in there I documented the wire bond connections, and which pins they go to to see if any of the common failures can be contributed by the stiffer aluminium bond wires.

I numbered the gold bond pads 1 to 45, please excuse my repair at the left!



I did not manage to identify all of the connections entirely but I think 90% is there, here is the list:



I believe this is the same unit as used in the E39 but uses a slightly different pinout? i.e. the direct diagnostic interface is not used on the E65/66 pin 11 of the main connector but is on the E39.

Interesting that the DSC pressure sensor has an alluminium bond wire for its GND, I bet this is whats up with mine and other posted before. I wonder if grounding the sensor elsewhere will fix the issue? I may give that a go!

I will cut mine open and see if I can confirm a poor connection on the bond pad I have numbered 37.

Stuart
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 01-24-2015, 09:48 AM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartjohn24 View Post
I will cut mine open and see if I can confirm a poor connection on the bond pad I have numbered 37
Thank you very much for reporting this helpful information!

You take fantastic pictures!


Probably it's best to put this excellent bondpad-pinout information in the canonical thread for repairing the ABS control module:
- How to physically test & repair the Bosch ABS control module (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartjohn24 View Post
I believe this is the same unit as used in the E39 but uses a slightly different pinout? i.e. the direct diagnostic interface is not used on the E65/66 pin 11 of the main connector but is on the E39.
As for whether your vehicle uses the same Bosch ABS control module as ours, this thread has a chart which only goes to 2003, but which shows that the 2002/2003 E65 does use the same lousy ABS control module that we have on the newer E39s.
- How to diagnose the BMW amber ABS BRAKE DSC/ASC trifecta or bifecta (1)

Your bondpad pinout chart is an excellent addition, because I don't think we've characterized the pinout on the line of bondpads inside the ABS control module yet; we've only characterized the pinout on the harness connector:
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	chart.jpg
Views:	648
Size:	196.8 KB
ID:	488343   Click image for larger version

Name:	bmw_abs_conrol_module_small.jpg
Views:	514
Size:	96.0 KB
ID:	488344   Click image for larger version

Name:	bmw_abs_conrol_module.jpg
Views:	33
Size:	184.7 KB
ID:	488345   Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch1.jpg
Views:	582
Size:	36.1 KB
ID:	488347   Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch2.png
Views:	632
Size:	313.1 KB
ID:	488348  

Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch3.jpg
Views:	1003
Size:	94.4 KB
ID:	488349   Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch4.png
Views:	1064
Size:	435.2 KB
ID:	488350   Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch5.jpg
Views:	1960
Size:	91.4 KB
ID:	488351   Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch6.jpg
Views:	1057
Size:	76.1 KB
ID:	488352   Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch7.jpg
Views:	998
Size:	112.0 KB
ID:	488356  

Click image for larger version

Name:	bosch8.jpg
Views:	1007
Size:	87.2 KB
ID:	488357  
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need

Last edited by bluebee; 01-24-2015 at 10:34 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 01-24-2015, 10:01 AM
stuartjohn24 stuartjohn24 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Chippenham, Wiltshire, UK
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 682
Mein Auto: BMW E65 745i
Hello bluebee,

Thanks for the reply, not a problem, I came across this thread when I was researching so figured I would try and contribute some information to help you guys out.

I understand the later E39 used the same Bosch 5.7 unit as used in my E65, however I believe they are wired slightly differently and will almost definitely have different software.

I have compared the pinouts using the BMW WDS to see the differences, the E39 had a diagnostic interface at pin 11 of the connector, that's not used in the E65 as all communication takes place over the PT-CAN. Also the E65 does not have a hard wired DSC button input, this again is controlled via PT-CAN because the option is selectable in the idrive menu.

Interesting that it's a particular bond that comes off, this gives you wheel sensor errors reading through the post. That wire you mention is indeed one of the 8 connections that connect to the four speed sensors.

I hope to update later in the week with findings of my DSC module and the brake pressure sensor fault.

Stuart
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 01-24-2015, 10:58 AM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartjohn24 View Post
figured I would try and contribute some information to help you guys out.
I love your attitude!
We NEED help, as we've never had a pinout before, for the 45 pins of the ABS control module, for example.

Personally, I believe that we can fix the bad epoxy connection at pin 7 ourselves, for almost nothing, which is why all the information you can provide is great.

I especially LOVE your pictures. Very clear. Very focused. Very nice!

I think what happens is that the particular bond intermittently fails, due to heat/vibration/whatever, and, since it's a duplicate, the voltage drop across the failed bond changes, which screws with the head of the abs computer, which is why all sorts of odd results come out of it, such as an indication of a failed BPS, which often, if not always, turns out to be false (ask me how I know).

So that others benefit, here, for the record, is your post on the 7-series forum, for the folks here to benefit from, now, and long after we're gone.

[/QUOTE]
> 7 Series - E65 / E66 (2002 - 2008) > Bosch DSC 5.7 ABS Module Diagnosis and Repair
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartjohn24 View Post
Well, I have been having a bit of fun with my faulty ABS/DSC module over the last couple of weeks.

I thought I would share my expereineces with you so you can have a go at fault finding and repairing some of the common faults yourself before sending it off for re-manufacture.

If your lucky, you can repair these units pretty easily for under $20!

If you have some patients, and a very steady hand! its possible to repair some of the internals if you are very careful!

There are a couple of common faults with these units that I will detail and show how to repair, you will need some basic electrical understanding, some idea of how the DSC system works and of course a code scanner, INPA is my favourite!

Error Code 5E9B - Return Pump

Symptom - The pump fitted to the rear of the DSC hydraulic unit runs continuously, even with the ignition off, this causes a flat battery.

Cause - The MOSFET drivers for the return pump are damaged and one or both of them are short circuit.

Error Code 5EE4 - Pre-charging Pump

Cause - The DSC unit has detected a fault with one or both of the internal MOSFET drivers and will no longer drive the pre-charge pump.

Both of these faults will cause all three of the ABS, DSC and Traction Control lamps to illuminate.

The return pump is driven by two MOSFETS located on one of the heatsinks shown below:

The devices in the image below, on the right hand side, are responsible for driving the return pump, they work in parallel, you can clearly see the discolouration to the screws on the right heatsink, this indicated the heatsink got VERY hot!

One or both of these devices will be short circuit, this is what causes the return pump to run continuously.

The devices on the left have a different function, the other MOSFET on the left side actually switches the DSC module on and off, this is done by the T15 wake up signal that is required for modules on the PT-CAN.

The schottky diode package, next to the MOSFET, basically connects the two separate power supplies to the DSC module from two different fuses (for safety) i.e. if a fuse blows the DSC module can still have limited functionality using the second supply to report faults to the driver. Simply check the device with a multimeter using the diode function, or change it if unsure, its unlikely that it will be damaged. Again if the DSC module communicates and powers up then the MOSFET can be considered good too.

The legs of the devices are formed at 90 degrees and then spot welded to the support assembly that carries the conductors. These can be carefully snipped off and replacements soldered in place.

The devices fitted to my DSC module were STP60NS04ZB, they are no longer available, the general spec is as follows:

60A N-Channel MOSFET, the voltage is clamped.

I used 50V 100A N-Channel MOSFETS, try and get something with a low on resistance and somewhere around 50-100V 70-100A, this will be sufficient, cost of components is under $20.

Re-assemble the DSC module and try it in your car, this should now fix the constant running of the return pump. :thumb up:

Right....

The pre-charge pump is a little more tricky! The MOSFETS for this pump are inside the cover of the electronics module, this has to be carefully cut open

This is the delicate part of the unit, it has a ceramic substrate circuit that has wire bonds and is sealed under a transparent silicone type goo!

I don't have a photo before I started and I don't want to rip-off other peoples photos so I will dive straight in!

Once the lid is removed, the two MOSFET devices are located to the side of the main circuit on a separate ceramic substrate.

You can see clearly that the device on the right is damaged, and you can see the damaged/melted silicon. this is effectively whats inside the black devices used for the return pump, why on earth they thought putting them inside like this in bare die form is anyones guess

Anyway, you will notice the wires are silver coloured, they are in fact aluminium and welded to the gold bond pads and die.

Unfortunately we cannot solder to aluminium, but we can solder to the gold pads and the edges of the components on the main circuit.

Here is a rough hand drawn schematic of how the two MOSFETS drive the pump:

As you can see, the die on the left switches the pump to ground/0V and the device on the right switches 12V to the pump. You will also notice two feedback inputs, this is how the DSC monitors the MOSFETS to determine if they are open or short circuit.

The damaged die measured 41 ohms, the DSC can see that the feedback input is at 12V even when its not switching the MOSFET on so reports the fault.

I managed to repair the module by fitting another N-Channel MOSFET inside the DSC module itself, its not pretty, but it works!

The green wire connects to the GATE of the MOSFET, this is the signal from the DSC to switch it on, the black wire is the feedback to the circuit for diagnosis. This has to be carefully soldered to the side of the capacitor.

Note: it takes a fair amount of heat to solder the gate wire to the gold bond pad, this is because its thermally connected to aluminium heatsink under the ceramic substrates. Its a bit fiddly but its possible to repair if your patient!

BE CAREFUL NOT TO DISTURB THE GOLD WIRE BONDS, THEY ARE THINNER THAN A HUMAN HAIR AND INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT TO REPAIR WITH SOLDER!

Hope this helps someone else!!!

Feel free to ask questions, I will list the wire bond pinouts for reference as some come loose internally through temperature cycling and cause all sorts of faults, the aluminium bonds are the most common to break, and can be soldered with wire with patients! thats another post though!

Stuart
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 01-24-2015, 11:47 AM
stuartjohn24 stuartjohn24 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Chippenham, Wiltshire, UK
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 682
Mein Auto: BMW E65 745i
No problem bluebee, I'm glad to help. I enjoy reverse engineering things like this out of curiosity, it's nice to pass the information on to others that are interested.

Yes your exactly right, the environment I.e. Temperature cycling, vibration etc... Are the major factors here.

The 42 pins of the main connector don't all connect to the ceramic substrate inside, some connect to the discreet components in the rear of the module.

Please bear in mind where I have stated 'not used' that means it's not used in the E65, the E39 will be different.

I will take some better pics of my old DSC unit next week under a high power microscope, hopefully I may be able to identify a dodgy bond wire visually.

Stuart
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 01-27-2015, 01:51 PM
stuartjohn24 stuartjohn24 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Chippenham, Wiltshire, UK
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 682
Mein Auto: BMW E65 745i
Quick Update:

I cut open my old DSC module today to inspect the wire bonds in an attempt to trace the cause of the pressure sensor fault.

I have started inspecting areas around the wire bonds, I'm convinced some appear to show cracking around the edges. Problem is, the silicone type sealing "goo" has a very uneven surface and its making it difficult to focus in some areas.

Before I go poking around, I will measure the resistance of the wire bonds from the substrate to the housing bond pad, I will do this at ambient temperature, and at around -10 degrees celsius.

I had been experiencing the fault regularly in the colder weather here in the UK, -10 should just about do it I hope!

Anyway, if anyone is a little geeky like me I have taken a few photos of some of the devices inside the unit.

One of the two main processor dies:


Closeup of 'Die' markings:


Markings on the 'Die' show the processors are in fact Intel 88C196EC automotive grade 16 bit micro controllers.

Siemens propitiatory semiconductor device, mask dated 1994:



ST Microelectronics branded device, mask dated 1992?:



What looks like a 'Good' wire bond:



This one looks to have shadowing around the weld area, it's hard to determine wether this is a crack or not, the image isn't great. This wire bond is the voltage supply for the pressure sensor.



I will update again when I complete some of the resistance measurements and temperature tests.

Stuart
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 01-29-2015, 01:12 AM
pudl pudl is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Wien, Österreich, EU
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 592
Mein Auto: BMW E39 530dAT 2001/04
I appreciate the detail.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 02-18-2015, 05:27 AM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
Based on this post in the canonical trifecta thread, I may have gotten the BPS pinout wrong in the descriptions of this thread ...
> E39 (1997 - 2003) > 2002 E39 ASC BRAKE ABS lights on => Diagnostic Procedure & Parts Location

Quote:
Originally Posted by mckazok View Post
Just wanted to share a video I recorded today. Long story short, I recently purchased a 740i with brake light trifecta and started diagnosing using inpa, found pressure sensor error.
Tested pressure sensor today and realized connector pins were actually 1:Ground 2:Signal 3:+5
Mine was not getting ground, it was getting +5 and I was able to trick ABS unit by grounding signal pin.
Used a cable to supply ground to the sensor then voila! It worked.
I was reading full pressure on INPA now it was at 0 and responding linearly to system pressure.
I was lucky, apparently broken jumper in the unit was for ground only.
I drove it home after this, and no more lights, no more codes in INPA either.

Below is the link to the video.
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 02-18-2015, 05:46 AM
bluebee's Avatar
bluebee bluebee is offline
Seek to understand,^Value
Location: San Jose, California
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 24,872
Mein Auto: 02 BMW 525i M54 auto 130K
BTW, it bears repeating, just as we saw in the video above ... I have never seen, anecdotally anyway, in this forum, any bad brake pressure sensors, yet, we constantly see the ABS control module code 81 implicating a bad BPS when the ABS control module's 7th aluminum (duplicate) wire partially lifts off its gold bondpad (causing resistance and subsequent voltage changes to occur in the ABS control module).

As it even happened to me, I say this from my own experience also.
__________________
Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Forum Navigation
Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 5 Series > E39 (1997 - 2003)
Today's Posts Search
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2015 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms