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7 Series - E65 / E66 (2002 - 2008)
Discussion of BMW's 4th generation E65/E66 7 Series flagship. The E65 generated much controversy, due to its radical styling and iDrive user difficulties. Nonetheless, the E65 broke records to become the best-selling 7-series iteration ever, especially after its 2005 facelift.

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  #1  
Old 07-13-2010, 11:01 AM
Ghibli Ghibli is offline
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Location: South Africa
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 9
Mein Auto: 2002 745i (E65)
High vacuum, rough idle

Upon (cold) startup I have a rough idle on my 745i (V8 N62, 2002), but when fully warmed up it doesn't go away. Driving is ok, but with transmission in D and slowly starting to run (but keeping brakes slightly applied), you can feel the car shudder / bucking. When there's enough speed, no problems whatsoever.

I first thought this was related to the only error present in the fault memory regarding Vanos. But it's not, I can now fully reproduce the situation every time I want:

I discovered that if I start the engine when cold, and I pull the dipstick or remove the oil cap there is a REALLY high vacuum present (if I cover the oil cap opening with my hand there's a huge amount of suction). You can also hear (howling) noises in the manifold. The engine almost dies but just keeps on going,

Funny thing though is later (with the engine warmed up, be it 10km or 100km, the rough idle and high vacuum are still present) if I then stop the engine and start it again right away, the idle is 100% smooth and ok. Now if I pull the dipstick or remove the oil cap there is a REALLY low vacuum present (much less suction). And no noises in the manifold (just a little change in rpm).

So: what actual changes the vacuum pressure (from high upon startup to low when warm) and refuses to "switch" to the low setting?

I have thought of the following:
- CCV -> checked them, they are not broke, and they are mechanical and therfor not influenced by starting/stopping the engine?
- Vacuum pump -> but it's mechanical and therefor not influenced by starting/stopping the engine (and not connected to the manifold, only to the brake booster)?
- Throttebody -> but should through a code when in failure, plus would put the valvetronic in limp-home mode (how to check though???). I can hear the valvetronic motors kick in after 1 minute, so I guess no limp-home???
- Differential pressure sensor in the manifold?
- Tank ventilation valve?
- or??

Any thoughts are deeply appreciated. Although the car drives without a problem, this is driving me nuts!

Last edited by Ghibli; 07-14-2010 at 01:22 AM.
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  #2  
Old 07-13-2010, 02:34 PM
t_clealy t_clealy is offline
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Mein Auto: 05 BMW 745Li
Sounds like you have a vacuum leaks somewhere there. Assuming vacuum means some sort of a hissing noise or something.
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  #3  
Old 07-14-2010, 01:23 AM
Ghibli Ghibli is offline
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Location: South Africa
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
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Mein Auto: 2002 745i (E65)
Quote:
Originally Posted by t_clealy View Post
Sounds like you have a vacuum leaks somewhere there. Assuming vacuum means some sort of a hissing noise or something.
Ah see what you mean, no with vacuum I mean underpressure which is apperent when I cover the oil opening with my hand.
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  #4  
Old 07-21-2010, 01:42 AM
Ghibli Ghibli is offline
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Location: South Africa
 
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Mein Auto: 2002 745i (E65)
Symptom, not cause

Ok, getting there slowly.

The GT1 tells me the valvetronic is operating in failsafe mode (see picture attached).

In that case the throttle takes over from the valvetronic to deliver air to the engine.

This causes the high(er) vacuum. Therefor the high vacuum is not the cause, but "just" a symptom.

So the (restated) problem is the following: If I start the engine when cold the engine starts and stays in failsafe mode (not just during the warm up period which is normal, but always) with rough idle.

Later (be it 10km or 200km) the rough idle and failsafe program are still present. If I then stop the engine and start it again right away, the idle is 100% smooth and ok. So no more failsafe but normal valvetronic operation.

So basically: what causes the failsafe program in the valvetronic? And (since cold startup with throttle is normal) what causes the valvetronic NOT to switch over to valvetronic operation when warmed up?
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  #5  
Old 07-21-2010, 09:34 AM
Keif Keif is online now
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Mein Auto: 2007 Alpina B7
Are there no errors logged in any of the areas mentioned by DIS? (in the lower-right of your screenshot)
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  #6  
Old 07-22-2010, 03:06 AM
Ghibli Ghibli is offline
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Location: South Africa
 
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Mein Auto: 2002 745i (E65)
Keif, yes, only 1: 10034 (which corresponds with Peake 2732 and P0021): over advanced intake cam, bank2 (drivers side).

I have swapped the following:
- intake CPS (from Bank 2 to Bank 1)
- intake solenoid (from intake to exhaust)
- 4 coil packs (from Bank 2 to Bank 1, and while in there 8 new OEM spark plugs)

Unfortunately, the 10034 error remains on Bank 2 (and does not move to Bank 1 (or exhaust) which could have indicated faulty CPS, coil pack a/o solenoid).

The only thing remains I think is the intake VANOS unit itself, but I thought they hardly ever fail????? The VANOS resting position is retarded so I think if it's over advanced at least there is (enough) oil pressure right? Could there be something "sticking", preventing the cam to retard back??? I have also added the GT1 readout of the VANOS positions and adaptations.

Could this error force the valvetronic in failsafe mode? Could be offcourse, but why then directly back to normal operation after stopping and starting the engine again (when warmed up)?
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Last edited by Ghibli; 07-22-2010 at 03:08 AM.
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  #7  
Old 12-10-2013, 09:20 AM
whalepirot whalepirot is offline
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Location: SoCal - OC
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 67
Mein Auto: 745Li/735iL/Vette/R1100RS
Any fix? None, anywhere that I've found, outside of selling the car.

Realizing this is an old thread, it must be more common as this generation of engines ages; like mine. I am faced with dumping the car or finding a reasonably priced fix. Other searches yield a variety of possible trouble areas, like plastic hoses.

Might this, seemingly heat-related problem be a sticky actuator or cracked vacuum hose to one?

All the computer troubleshooting is nice and helps isolate problems, but it still is an engine requiring proper delivery systems for fuel, spark and vacuum.
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  #8  
Old 05-19-2014, 11:05 PM
cerber717 cerber717 is offline
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Location: Bay Area NorCal
 
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Mein Auto: BMW E36 328
was there any solution to this problem , my n62 has the same issues
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  #9  
Old 06-11-2014, 01:00 PM
carl0s carl0s is offline
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Location: Manchester, England, UK
 
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Mein Auto: E46 330i, LS2 RX7
Check the "cs-adaption"

(camshaft adaptation), in INPA. It should be close to the middle (71 for exhaust, 127 for intake). Expect it is out for intake cam, according to your GT1/DIS diagnostic.

Then swap both the cam position sensor, and VANOS solenoid, for the relevant cam (intake you said?) with the other bank, see if problem stays where it is, i.e. sensors are OK.

Next, perform ram_backup in tool32 (tool32 -> open prg -> ME9_N62.prg), find highlight ram_backup -> run (f5). This will reset camshaft adaptation values. They will revert to the middle (71 for exhaust, 127 for intake). Start engine and see if cs-adaption values revert back to bad values (I read that the adaptation values can get stuck incorrectly after bad VANOS solenoid is cleaned/replaced/moved to other bank - so the ram_backup reset is the first thing to try).

If the cam shaft adaptation goes back to bad values, then probably your VANOS adjuster unit is defective, or it has slipped like mine did (http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...3#post27687353 ).

Re-time the cam, ensuring the vanos adjuster is set properly as part of the timing procedure, and make sure the vanos adjuster unit is bolted up tight to the cam, and see how things look then (cs-adaption).

Yes this will disable valvetronic and cause the engine to operate off the throttle, and feel lazy.
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Last edited by carl0s; 06-11-2014 at 01:06 PM.
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  #10  
Old 07-29-2014, 12:52 AM
kgb44 kgb44 is offline
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Location: Germany
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
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Mein Auto: ALPINA B5s
I've looked after my ALPINA B5s Adaptions:

Adaption Exhaust Bank 1: 72,20
Adaption Intake Bank1: 130,50

Adaption Exhaust Bank 2: 70,50
Adaption Intake Bank 2: 126,50

I've used the "pm restore" mode and got clear 71 / 71 and 127 / 127 - but they changed to the old ones.

Is that a problem?
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  #11  
Old 05-23-2015, 02:54 AM
Pasi_K Pasi_K is offline
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Location: Finland
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1
Mein Auto: E65 735 2004
First of all i apologize my english writing, this is not my native language.

I have maybe same fault: 2732 CDKENWS2 - NW-Steuerung Einlass Bank2
P0021 Nockenwellensteuerung Einlass (Bank 2) - Adaptionswert Spätposition unplausibel oder Leistungsproblem.

Car doesnt run or idle very well when engine is cold, there is hesitation and vibrations. Sometimes car becomes luggish during a ride when engine is warm. I think thats because valvetronic goes failsafe mode. When i turn off engine and start again car is okay most of times.

Look attachment.

-VANOS adaptation, inlet cyl 5-8 161.30 which is over limit. When i reset adaptations with tool32 this goes back to ~160 when engine is on couple of minutes.

Sometimes when i remove fault codes with example when engine is warm and drive ~20km that fault code doesnt come back immediately.

When i drive couple days and read fault codes there will be these:

-2732 CDKENWS2 - NW-Steuerung Einlass Bank2
P0021 Nockenwellensteuerung Einlass (Bank 2) - Adaptionswert Spätposition unplausibel oder Leistungsproblem
-2738 CDKKAT - Katalysator-Konvertierung
P0420 Katalysatorsystem (Bank 1) - Wirkungsgrad unter Schwellwert
-274E CDKMD - Aussetzererkennung, Summenfehler
-2746 CDKMD04 - Aussetzererkennung Zyl.6
-2748 CDKMD06 - Aussetzererkennung Zyl.7
-2745 CDKMD03 - Aussetzererkennung Zyl.8
-2743 CDKMD01 - Aussetzererkennung Zyl.5

But is it possible that 2732 code is causing other codes or if those other codes refers to valvetronic fault so if i have valvetronic fault can that causing 2732 code?

Btw. I tried change minimum lift from 0.3mm to 0.8mm. After that i tried to do eccentric shaft calibration without success. DIS says that calibration angle is 5 and it should be calibrated but when i try calibrate DIS says that automatic calibration can not be done because diff. pressure sensor is faulty. There is no fault codes from that in DME. When i change lift back 0.3mm and do eccentric shaft calibration DIS says that angle is 1 and there is no need to calibrate. Can this have anything to do with my car other faults?
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Last edited by Pasi_K; 05-23-2015 at 10:01 AM.
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