2013 Cadillac ATS GM Takes Aim at BMW. No, Seriously.

Originally Posted by captainaudio

I drove a CTS-V with the magnetic ride technology. It was very impressive and light years ahead of the OEM shocks on my 2007 335i.

CA

I believe the magnetic ride control are only available if you get the FE3 sport suspension.

Originally Posted by justinnum1

First of all, the fact that its american, means i would not consider it. Second, only people that should be driving Cadillacs are those with white hair. imo

I've got white hair and have never considered a Cadillac. On occasion I've been forced to drive my parent's Caddy and hated it. That said, I'd still be willing to test drive their new attempt at attracting BMW owners. The fact that it is American makes me more willing to give it a test since I'd love for the American car companies to finally build a car that I'd enjoy owning and driving. I just won't set my expectations very high and it is very unlikely that I will be swayed.

Originally Posted by Michael Schott

I believe the magnetic ride control are only available if you get the FE3 sport suspension.

If GM is dead serious, as they say they are, they need to make all performance options added together, and still be very competitive in pricing with the new 3 without similar options.

My speculation is they will try to fine tune the ATS while evaluating the new F30 side by side, so the summer release may be a plus.

Originally Posted by dtc100

If GM is dead serious, as they say they are, they need to make all performance options added together, and still be very competitive in pricing with the new 3 without similar options.

My speculation is they will try to fine tune the ATS while evaluating the new F30 side by side, so the summer release may be a plus.

I agree with that, but they have also been very vocal that the E46 was their dynamic target. Hopefully that means a NEW E46 as the target, not a 10 year old E46 with sloppy 100,000-mile suspension

I must admit that if BMW were to make a new E46 today essentially unchanged from back then, I would be all over that car. While I like the new tech and luxury, and I also like the rather more raw E30, the E46 was just the perfect balance between those two to me. The E9x was just a smidgen too soft for me, and I'm not encouraged that the F3x is going to be significantly improved over that. Still, going to see what it's like when I get to drive one before I make any snap judgments.

Same is true of this Caddy. I will drive it first and if it feels like an E46 did when it rolled off the showroom floor I'm going to have a tough time choosing between this and the F3x or F2x.

Originally Posted by thumper_330

I agree with that, but they have also been very vocal that the E46 was their dynamic target. Hopefully that means a NEW E46 as the target, not a 10 year old E46 with sloppy 100,000-mile suspension

I must admit that if BMW were to make a new E46 today essentially unchanged from back then, I would be all over that car. While I like the new tech and luxury, and I also like the rather more raw E30, the E46 was just the perfect balance between those two to me. The E9x was just a smidgen too soft for me, and I'm not encouraged that the F3x is going to be significantly improved over that. Still, going to see what it's like when I get to drive one before I make any snap judgments.

Same is true of this Caddy. I will drive it first and if it feels like an E46 did when it rolled off the showroom floor I'm going to have a tough time choosing between this and the F3x or F2x.

Yep will definitely look.

And yes if BMW sold a brand new 2012 e46 ZHP for the same price as comparably equipped 2012 F30 335i, I'd take the e46. Without pause. A hypothetical 2012 e90 335i ZSP wouldn't really get my eye until the price gulf new-for-new was over 6-7k. Just wasn't a fun car compared to the e46. Didn't feel special.

So wish the e46 were still made... sigh.

To the purists, Caddy needs to add an N/A I6 engine option if they are dead serious.

Originally Posted by blueguydotcom

Yep will definitely look.

And yes if BMW sold a brand new 2012 e46 ZHP for the same price as comparably equipped 2012 F30 335i, I'd take the e46. Without pause. A hypothetical 2012 e90 335i ZSP wouldn't really get my eye until the price gulf new-for-new was over 6-7k. Just wasn't a fun car compared to the e46. Didn't feel special.

So wish the e46 were still made... sigh.

I'd buy a brand new E30 M3 if they made one.

Originally Posted by Chris90

I'd buy a brand new E30 M3 if they made one.

Sadly, I need/want 4 doors. I do adore the size of the e30 sedans though. The e30 M3 is just kinda holy grail.

Too bad it won't happen for either of us though.

Originally Posted by blueguydotcom

Sadly, I need/want 4 doors. I do adore the size of the e30 sedans though. The e30 M3 is just kinda holy grail.

Too bad it won't happen for either of us though.

You could easily buy a low mileage 2005 ZHP that would feel like new. Mine doesn't feel much different even at 86k miles.

I've tried the Cadillac before and I'll try it once again since it's been completely re-done. Curious to see where ATS is made and the warranty. If they can make a more reliable car and compete with performance I'm open to changing brands.

Originally Posted by Chris90

You could easily buy a low mileage 2005 ZHP that would feel like new. Mine doesn't feel much different even at 86k miles.

I considered that one myself before I got my 1'er. There was a lovely ZHP that I test drove and really liked, but at the end of the day the call of the warranty is what got me. I sometimes have to remind myself that I ended up spending about $3500 on my 330i mere months after I got it because the head gasket decided to exit out of the exhaust pipe in chunks on a drive from Chicago to St. Louis. I still never regretted owning that car, and it ran like a top after the repairs... I do regret selling it sometimes though. At the time though I thought I was getting an E92 M3, but that's another story.

The whole "BMW out of warranty" thing scares me... the day I got my 545i I had a water leak that almost caused on overheat if I hadn't stopped and killed the engine in an hurry. I started getting terrified of the repair costs after I had done some research before buying the car and read all about the "valley pipe" problem and the associated costs... but thankfully it turned out to be an improperly installed water pump that had split the outlet pipe. When I started to get a squeak in the clutch pedal on that car that could also be potentially expensive (it was coming from inside the transmission) I decided that enough was enough and I was going to get out of the "un-warrantied BMW" thing.

YMMV... and my experiences are by no means indicative of BMW's quality but rather what BMW's go through with their owners I think... plus they're not the most reliable cars once you get up to triple digit mileage. Still, I have consistently come back to the marque as evidenced by my signature... there's just something about a BMW that is unique in the automotive world. At least so far

Originally Posted by Chris90

You could easily buy a low mileage 2005 ZHP that would feel like new. Mine doesn't feel much different even at 86k miles.

Wow, I'd never be comfortable buying a car with 40k miles, let alone 80. 80 to me that car is near dead. Sounds romantic but even after perusing ZHPMafia I just couldn't get into the idea of buying a long-used car and replacing parts on it all the time. In theory it could work out... but man used BMW that are owned by just people beating on them...scare me.

3 BMWs and all of them had major issues within warranty so out of warranty...well that reminds me of the thousands we sink into my wife's Audi for preventative maintenance and parts issues.

Originally Posted by blueguydotcom

Wow, I'd never be comfortable buying a car with 40k miles, let alone 80. 80 to me that car is near dead. Sounds romantic but even after perusing ZHPMafia I just couldn't get into the idea of buying a long-used car and replacing parts on it all the time. In theory it could work out... but man used BMW that are owned by just people beating on them...scare me.

3 BMWs and all of them had major issues within warranty so out of warranty...well that reminds me of the thousands we sink into my wife's Audi for preventative maintenance and parts issues.

It's ok anyway, cause then we'd have to listen to you constantly complaining about your ZHP again.

Originally Posted by Chris90

It's ok anyway, cause then we'd have to listen to you constantly complaining about your ZHP again.

They never could fix that WOT issue. Not like it was my fault the car swallowed an ECU or came with ebrake problems and the doors wouldn't lock.

What do you guys think of the sound they are working on?

http://link.brightcove.com/services/...=1432070720001

You can also listen to the ATS interior and exterior sound on the road.

Originally Posted by dtc100

What do you guys think of the sound they are working on?

http://link.brightcove.com/services/...=1432070720001

You can also listen to the ATS interior and exterior sound on the road.

meh

Originally Posted by justinnum1

meh

Whether one cares for the more aggressive exhaust note or not, so far GM seems to try to prove they are serious about the performance aspect of the ATS.

While I like it, I can see how it may actually turn many people off too. Most people today, having to choose between performance or comfort, will pick the latter.

Originally Posted by dtc100

Whether one cares for the more aggressive exhaust note or not, so far GM seems to try to prove they are serious about the performance aspect of the ATS.

While I like it, I can see how it may actually turn many people off too. Most people today, having to choose between performance or comfort, will pick the latter.

I'll judge it in person, not in some sound studio at GM pre preproduction. But from what i hear, its nothing special.

Originally Posted by justinnum1

I'll judge it in person, not in some sound studio at GM pre preproduction. But from what i hear, its nothing special.

I pointed to two other street sound clips in that link, one in cabin, one outside. They sounded more like an M3.

Hopefully GM dots all the i's and crosses all the t's with this one. My 2005 CTS-V (POS-V) was a disaster.

Originally Posted by AK

Hopefully GM dots all the i's and crosses all the t's with this one. My 2005 CTS-V (POS-V) was a disaster.

I assume you are talking about the woefully under-designed rear diff?

Could be worse. The GTO has an under-designed rear (half-shafts, diff) and the whole suspension is crap! I mean stuff is fixable, but I know what you mean OEM's should get it right the first time.

Originally Posted by LS2 MN6

I assume you are talking about the woefully under-designed rear diff?

Could be worse. The GTO has an under-designed rear (half-shafts, diff) and the whole suspension is crap! I mean stuff is fixable, but I know what you mean OEM's should get it right the first time.

I've posted about my CTS-V to this forum before. Nothing worked right on it. The rear end howled like a wolf at a full moon but it also had an incurable driveline vibration that would make the whole car rumble at freeway speeds. It was so bad you couldn't see clearly through the rearview mirror because of the vibration. The transmission, driveshaft and rear end were all replaced and nothing fixed it. After hiring a lemon law attorney I had the car bought back.

Originally Posted by AK

I've posted about my CTS-V to this forum before. Nothing worked right on it. The rear end howled like a wolf at a full moon but it also had an incurable driveline vibration that would make the whole car rumble at freeway speeds. It was so bad you couldn't see clearly through the rearview mirror because of the vibration. The transmission, driveshaft and rear end were all replaced and nothing fixed it. After hiring a lemon law attorney I had the car bought back.

Shrug. Didn't have to hire attorney but BMW bought back my 335i. Still plan on getting another BMW.

And no, that wasn't my first bad BMW. I've had three with problems from the factory. Still fun.

True.

Even with all the problems I've had with my GTO I'd buy another one.

read somewhere they think the ATS-V will get the V8, not turbo V6. That would be pretty awesome.