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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #51  
Old 04-20-2012, 06:24 PM
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krash krash is offline
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Seems sort of silly to me to buy a car with a base price $35,000 and not spend an additional $2k for a Nav.
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  #52  
Old 04-20-2012, 11:03 PM
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Snareman Snareman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weaselboy View Post
I don't lease. The car was two years old and I wanted to try out the F30. No regrets.



I have not noticed the distance to be as bad as half off, but it is off some and add to that the time lag of distance updates and it can cause you to overshoot. Especially in areas there the streets are close together.
Yep, its caused me to overshoot quite a few times. I'm better with it not that I know it sucks like that, but when I first got it and was driving around Munich where I didn't know the roads anyway, I missed quite a few turns. "Take the 2nd right" was SOOOOOoooooo much better. I don't know why they changed something that wasn't broken.
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  #53  
Old 04-23-2012, 08:06 PM
VaRanger VaRanger is offline
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My experience with the navigation system has not been good. In fact, it is the worst item on the car.

The Navigation screen is beautiful - no complaints. The controls are easy to understand - no complaints. The maps seem accurate enough.

But.....The directions that the system calculates are horrible. The 3 optional methods to calculate a route are all consistently bad. For example, in one trip that was 240 miles, it tried to get me to go over 100 miles out the way. That is almost 50% longer, and the setting was on "shortest route". Nothing I could do would get the system to change its mind. On another trip, it actually routed me through a shopping center parking lot. On another trip, it routed me down several highways with dozens upon dozens of stop lights, when I later learned other routes had almost none and were significantly quicker. Bottom line - it will get you where you want to go, but not the fastest, not the shortest, and not the most efficient route. My estimate is that it provides illogical routes about 50% of the time. I cannot trust it anymore.

Also, the voice commands are such that, in a city, it will tell you to turn after you are already in an intersection and its too late to turn.

I have used the system while driving in Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, and Florida. So from my experience, it is effectively useless as a method to provide good directions in these states. The alternative is to plot a route using google, print it out, and carry it with you. Then you can use the interactive map to provide local details as you drive. Alternatively, carry a $60 Garmin with you - it is always accurate (at least in these States).
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  #54  
Old 04-23-2012, 08:10 PM
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Snareman Snareman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VaRanger View Post

But.....The directions that the system calculates are horrible. The 3 optional methods to calculate a route are all consistently bad. For example, in one trip that was 240 miles, it tried to get me to go over 100 miles out the way. That is almost 50% longer, and the setting was on "shortest route". Nothing I could do would get the system to change its mind. On another trip, it actually routed me through a shopping center parking lot. On another trip, it routed me down several highways with dozens upon dozens of stop lights, when I later learned other routes had almost none and were significantly quicker. Bottom line - it will get you where you want to go, but not the fastest, not the shortest, and not the most efficient route. My estimate is that it provides illogical routes about 50% of the time. I cannot trust it anymore.

Also, the voice commands are such that, in a city, it will tell you to turn after you are already in an intersection and its too late to turn.
Yes!! That annoys me to no end!

Another thing that pisses me off about it is that I'll put in a destination that I sort of know the route to. It tells me I'll be there at 7:00 but I know that there is a shorter way than it wants to take me so I start driving in that direction. And then it adjusts the ETA earlier and earlier as I'm going my route instead of its. Well, if it can calculate that that time is going to be shorter and I have it set to fastest route, why the heck didn't it route me that way in the first place!!!
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  #55  
Old 04-24-2012, 06:56 AM
OBS3SSION OBS3SSION is offline
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Is the F30 nav a step backwards from the E90 nav? I'm curious if we're looking at a new model with completely new nav software and the BMW programmers need to work out the bugs. If BMW nav programming is just consistently sh!tty, then is there any hope? How is BMW getting away charging heaps of money for tech that doesn't work as well as a $100 portable unit (or a free version included on your smartphone)!?

MY 2003 E46 had the nav, and I recall that it worked okay. It did a couple wonky routing errors that I can recall, but 10 years ago portable units were much more expensive and had some of the same issues too.

Has anyone successfully gotten a refund on the cost of the nav/tech package due to misrepresentation of the product? Generally I hate the sue-happy nature of this country, but maybe a class action is required to wake BMW up about selling shoddy software to consumers for a premium.
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  #56  
Old 04-24-2012, 07:36 AM
1.fresh.f30.335 1.fresh.f30.335 is offline
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I was playing with the Nav during both my test drives and IMO its still the old system, the new systems are all google based (audi has this platform currently) and will require no discs but on the F30 its the old disc style... Sucks that I got the Nav but I can live with it, and I am sure there will be an update or an add-on which will enhance the responsiveness and accuracy.
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  #57  
Old 04-24-2012, 07:47 AM
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voip-ninja voip-ninja is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1.fresh.f30.335 View Post
I was playing with the Nav during both my test drives and IMO its still the old system, the new systems are all google based (audi has this platform currently) and will require no discs but on the F30 its the old disc style... Sucks that I got the Nav but I can live with it, and I am sure there will be an update or an add-on which will enhance the responsiveness and accuracy.
The software might be the same, but the BMW NAV system in 2012 is not disc based, the map data is stored on a hard drive.
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  #58  
Old 04-24-2012, 08:07 AM
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laser laser is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OBS3SSION View Post
Is the F30 nav a step backwards from the E90 nav? I'm curious if we're looking at a new model with completely new nav software and the BMW programmers need to work out the bugs. If BMW nav programming is just consistently sh!tty, then is there any hope? How is BMW getting away charging heaps of money for tech that doesn't work as well as a $100 portable unit (or a free version included on your smartphone)!?

MY 2003 E46 had the nav, and I recall that it worked okay. It did a couple wonky routing errors that I can recall, but 10 years ago portable units were much more expensive and had some of the same issues too.

Has anyone successfully gotten a refund on the cost of the nav/tech package due to misrepresentation of the product? Generally I hate the sue-happy nature of this country, but maybe a class action is required to wake BMW up about selling shoddy software to consumers for a premium.
The step backward occurred with the 2009 model year when BMW switched from the excellent NavTeq maps which were CD or DVD based to a hard drive based TeleAtlas map system.

There are legions of well documented complaints about bizarre routing with the new system.

I love the elegant way the NAV is integrated into the car but having had a couple of the old NavTeq systems on previous cars it is disappointing to see that BMW fixed something that wasn't broken (and broke it in the process).

Whatever you do don't pay the dealer for a $400 - $500 map update that will not fix the issues you will observe.
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  #59  
Old 04-24-2012, 11:30 AM
lsbuffs lsbuffs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VaRanger View Post
My experience with the navigation system has not been good. In fact, it is the worst item on the car.

The Navigation screen is beautiful - no complaints. The controls are easy to understand - no complaints. The maps seem accurate enough.

But.....The directions that the system calculates are horrible. The 3 optional methods to calculate a route are all consistently bad. For example, in one trip that was 240 miles, it tried to get me to go over 100 miles out the way. That is almost 50% longer, and the setting was on "shortest route". Nothing I could do would get the system to change its mind. On another trip, it actually routed me through a shopping center parking lot. On another trip, it routed me down several highways with dozens upon dozens of stop lights, when I later learned other routes had almost none and were significantly quicker. Bottom line - it will get you where you want to go, but not the fastest, not the shortest, and not the most efficient route. My estimate is that it provides illogical routes about 50% of the time. I cannot trust it anymore.

Also, the voice commands are such that, in a city, it will tell you to turn after you are already in an intersection and its too late to turn.

I have used the system while driving in Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, and Florida. So from my experience, it is effectively useless as a method to provide good directions in these states. The alternative is to plot a route using google, print it out, and carry it with you. Then you can use the interactive map to provide local details as you drive. Alternatively, carry a $60 Garmin with you - it is always accurate (at least in these States).
The above issue (in bold) is exactly my experience. The routing I've been getting is just horrible. If I would have followed the provided directions from my house in the southern metro area to the Denver airport, I'd have missed my flight. It kept telling me to do a U turn when able despite the fact I was on the most efficient route possible. Some of the routing it was giving me was mind boggling. Really not sure where it comes up with some of the routing I've been provided. I'll stick with the Garmin USA app. on my iPhone for critical navigation needs.
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  #60  
Old 04-24-2012, 11:36 AM
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Snareman Snareman is offline
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And no one can get any form of decent answer from BMW and/or teleatlas on this issue as they both seem to point the finger at the other person. Has anyone called either to complain?
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  #61  
Old 04-24-2012, 11:50 AM
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voip-ninja voip-ninja is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lsbuffs View Post
The above issue (in bold) is exactly my experience. The routing I've been getting is just horrible. If I would have followed the provided directions from my house in the southern metro area to the Denver airport, I'd have missed my flight. It kept telling me to do a U turn when able despite the fact I was on the most efficient route possible. Some of the routing it was giving me was mind boggling. Really not sure where it comes up with some of the routing I've been provided. I'll stick with the Garmin USA app. on my iPhone for critical navigation needs.
Man, that's not good news, especially as I am also in Highlands Ranch, Colorado! I will probably still bite and get the Nav as I plan on leasing and it doesn't really affect the payments too much.

I wonder why car makers can't get this stuff right.

Also, I hope you do okay with your RWD 328i this coming winter!
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  #62  
Old 04-24-2012, 12:10 PM
lsbuffs lsbuffs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
Man, that's not good news, especially as I am also in Highlands Ranch, Colorado! I will probably still bite and get the Nav as I plan on leasing and it doesn't really affect the payments too much.

I wonder why car makers can't get this stuff right.

Also, I hope you do okay with your RWD 328i this coming winter!
Since you're from Highlands Ranch, you will appreciate that the navigation system wanted me to get off C470 at Quebec and cut over to I25 northbound as the shortest route to the airport. You should have seen the fits it threw when I got onto E470.

Will get some Blizzaks for the winter as I just need to get by until I move to Phoenix in next few years. Going from AWD (Acura RL) to RWD could be an adventure, but am a big fan of what Blizzaks can do to overcome.
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  #63  
Old 04-24-2012, 12:16 PM
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voip-ninja voip-ninja is offline
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Originally Posted by lsbuffs View Post
Since you're from Highlands Ranch, you will appreciate that the navigation system wanted me to get off C470 at Quebec and cut over to I25 northbound as the shortest route to the airport. You should have seen the fits it threw when I got onto E470.

Will get some Blizzaks for the winter as I just need to get by until I move to Phoenix in next few years. Going from AWD (Acura RL) to RWD could be an adventure, but am a big fan of what Blizzaks can do to overcome.
Ha ha. Nice. I actually think I have an explanation for what happened. The BMW navigation probably has an option for toll roads and it is probably currently set to forbid them, which is why it didn't recognize that route and wanted you to get off of it when you were on it.

Have you found the traffic feature to be of any use driving around Denver?

I have Dunlop Wintersports that I throw on my A4 Quattro in the winter time and expect I will have to do something similar with the 3-series even if I get the xi version.
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  #64  
Old 04-24-2012, 12:21 PM
lsbuffs lsbuffs is offline
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Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
Ha ha. Nice. I actually think I have an explanation for what happened. The BMW navigation probably has an option for toll roads and it is probably currently set to forbid them, which is why it didn't recognize that route and wanted you to get off of it when you were on it.

Have you found the traffic feature to be of any use driving around Denver?

I have Dunlop Wintersports that I throw on my A4 Quattro in the winter time and expect I will have to do something similar with the 3-series even if I get the xi version.
There is a nav setting for toll roads and it is set to allow them. Wish it was that easy! Toll roads aside, crazy that for 'shortest route' it would want you to go C470 to County Line Road to I25N. It has a mind of its own for sure. Haven't seen the traffic features in use yet, but will keep an eye out for that component.

I too had Dunlop Wintersports on my Acura RL. Great tire! And even though that car was AWD, I felt I needed them.

Last edited by lsbuffs; 04-24-2012 at 12:22 PM. Reason: spelling error
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  #65  
Old 04-24-2012, 02:46 PM
sr5959 sr5959 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
Man, that's not good news, especially as I am also in Highlands Ranch, Colorado! I will probably still bite and get the Nav as I plan on leasing and it doesn't really affect the payments too much.

I wonder why car makers can't get this stuff right.

Also, I hope you do okay with your RWD 328i this coming winter!
Routing on mine has been very good so far. I am in the Seattle area. Anyone have bad experiences with the Nav around Pacific NW???
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  #66  
Old 04-24-2012, 02:50 PM
snowboardjoe snowboardjoe is offline
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Routing on mine has been very good so far. I am in the Seattle area. Anyone have bad experiences with the Nav around Pacific NW???
That's good to hear. I'm awaiting delivery of 2013 X3 28i and got the tech package w/HUD. I'm hoping the NAV is not too much of a disappointment. Roads change all the time here as we know, so I know that will be an issue down the road (pun totally intended).

I would be interested to hear what others have experienced in the Seattle area particular when it comes to route calculations.
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  #67  
Old 04-24-2012, 03:19 PM
sr5959 sr5959 is offline
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Originally Posted by snowboardjoe View Post
That's good to hear. I'm awaiting delivery of 2013 X3 28i and got the tech package w/HUD. I'm hoping the NAV is not too much of a disappointment. Roads change all the time here as we know, so I know that will be an issue down the road (pun totally intended).

I would be interested to hear what others have experienced in the Seattle area particular when it comes to route calculations.
Make sure you get the BMW Assist with Apps also. The two best features on the NAV are:

1. Directions in HUD

2. Ability to send addresses to NAV from Google Search on your iPhone or from your computer.
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  #68  
Old 04-24-2012, 03:22 PM
labeng labeng is offline
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I have a 50 thousand dollar car with a navigation system that is substandard to my smart phone.

Way to go BMW...

Are you kidding me!?!

If the German engineers weren't so frigging arrogant....they would be and should be embarrassed.

The ultimate driving machine.....unless of course you need navigation!

unbelievable.....
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  #69  
Old 04-24-2012, 04:31 PM
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voip-ninja voip-ninja is offline
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I can sympathize as I am frequently frustrated by the horrendous quality of navigation in these luxury automobiles. However, I am not convinced that BMW is any worse than any other vendor in this area. honestly, it is just a matter of time before what we pay for are the fancy factory interface kits to our phones, and the phone will do the navigation/traffic/etc with whatever the best app is at that point in time.
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  #70  
Old 04-24-2012, 07:42 PM
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Snareman Snareman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
I can sympathize as I am frequently frustrated by the horrendous quality of navigation in these luxury automobiles. However, I am not convinced that BMW is any worse than any other vendor in this area. honestly, it is just a matter of time before what we pay for are the fancy factory interface kits to our phones, and the phone will do the navigation/traffic/etc with whatever the best app is at that point in time.
They apparently are compared to other brands that use Navteq as the used as compared to the crappy Teleatlas that they switched to in 2009.
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  #71  
Old 04-25-2012, 06:20 AM
chuckster chuckster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
Man, that's not good news, especially as I am also in Highlands Ranch, Colorado! I will probably still bite and get the Nav as I plan on leasing and it doesn't really affect the payments too much.

I wonder why car makers can't get this stuff right.

Also, I hope you do okay with your RWD 328i this coming winter!
By my calculations and I am using ED pricing on a 36 month 335 lease it would run another $30/mo. Now I know we all make great money here, but that is just over $1,000 for 3 years. My iphone doesn't cost that and when I get the I5 with larger screen it won't cost me anywhere near $1000. In fact I can just buy an unlocked one and use overseas and take it anywhere with me. As others have said as I have a NAV in my current BMW and have had it in 3 others-going on my 6th ED delivery-that it is way overpriced, just as the quality of the stereo system has been in other posts. BMW's are great to drive, but when it comes to the NAV and stereo-now I have to get Sirius and they charge me for it to upgrade to the Premium stereo. I bit the bullet on that as the normal stereo for a $40,000+ car sucks, but that is BMW, that they make these special deals with the suppliers and they don't care about us bitching about it, as this has been going on for years! I still drive their cars, because the way they drive.
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  #72  
Old 04-25-2012, 07:14 AM
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voip-ninja voip-ninja is offline
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I have been using a variety of GPS and traffic applications in my Audi that are run on an iPhone 4.

Guess what? It sucks. There's nothing more frustrating (for me) than fiddling with a tiny iPhone touch screen trying to input crap or switch applications (not to mention how dangerous it is as it results in a very distracted driver). Adding .5" or so to the screen size is not going to improve things in this area. I even looked at purchase/install of Pioneer's "app radio" unit that basically gives you access to some iPhone apps on a large touch screen. Guess what? Still sucks. Unfortunately, for the moment, auto makers have us by the balls in this area.

I'm willing to pay the $30 a month just to have the navigation fully integrated into the vehicle. I would like to see BMW Apps add support for Inrix traffic. If you purchase the top tech package that is at least a possibility, at some point down the road.

Last edited by voip-ninja; 04-25-2012 at 07:15 AM.
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  #73  
Old 04-25-2012, 07:37 AM
sr5959 sr5959 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
I have been using a variety of GPS and traffic applications in my Audi that are run on an iPhone 4.

Guess what? It sucks. There's nothing more frustrating (for me) than fiddling with a tiny iPhone touch screen trying to input crap or switch applications (not to mention how dangerous it is as it results in a very distracted driver). Adding .5" or so to the screen size is not going to improve things in this area. I even looked at purchase/install of Pioneer's "app radio" unit that basically gives you access to some iPhone apps on a large touch screen. Guess what? Still sucks. Unfortunately, for the moment, auto makers have us by the balls in this area.

I'm willing to pay the $30 a month just to have the navigation fully integrated into the vehicle. I would like to see BMW Apps add support for Inrix traffic. If you purchase the top tech package that is at least a possibility, at some point down the road.
Don't forget you get the HUD with the NAV, which is a fantastic feature probably more useful than the NAV as you use it all the time.
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  #74  
Old 04-25-2012, 07:55 AM
OBS3SSION OBS3SSION is offline
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I'm not convinced the issue is with the Tele Atlas maps/data itself. Tele Atlas is now owned by TomTom and my 5+ year old TomTom with map updates as late as Dec '11 works fine. I'm willing to believe that the BMW engineers who designed the nav system just didn't do a good job working with those maps.

They must have had the software working pretty well when they used NavTeq, and had to start over with the switch. Hence the step backwards.

And my biggest gripes with BMW are in agreement with everyone else: Having to pay through the nose to get options and features found standard or for much less money elsewhere. And to make matters worse, BMW's reputation for none of these features you pay through the nose for working correctly! But BMW will never change as long as people buy them anyway, either because they want the prestige that comes with the badge, or they are hooked on the Cool-aid of the driving dynamics (which seems to get a little more watered down each year.)
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  #75  
Old 04-25-2012, 09:43 AM
snowboardjoe snowboardjoe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr5959 View Post
Make sure you get the BMW Assist with Apps also. The two best features on the NAV are:

1. Directions in HUD

2. Ability to send addresses to NAV from Google Search on your iPhone or from your computer.
Yep, those are included already and looking forward to it.

Here were the pro's can con's for me in choosing to get it or not (and this is before I've experienced it first hand other than the 10 minutes in the car):

+ It's built in and integrated into car
+ Don't have to remove mobile GPS between trips
+ Very large screen (for more than just navigation)
+ Enhanced combo meter display (below the tach)
+ Integration into HUD

- Does not speak street names
- Lots of reports of bad/annoying route calculations (biggest fear for me)
- Updates are not frequent and pricey

From what I understand, the NAV system was much better before 2009 when they switched from Navteq to Tele-Atlas. I'm still floored that BMW has not responded to the complaints.
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