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E36/7 Z3 (1996-2002)
E36/7 Z3 Roadster, Z3 coupe, Z3 M Roadster and Z3 M Coupe talk with our gurus here.

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  #1  
Old 05-02-2012, 03:07 PM
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CJ645Bern CJ645Bern is offline
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Z3 Tire problem?

Hey all. I have 4 tires for my z3 with stock rims. 2 are 245/40/ZR17 and 2 are 245/40/R17. Which ones would go in the back/front? Does it really matter?

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Last edited by CJ645Bern; 05-02-2012 at 03:55 PM.
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  #2  
Old 05-02-2012, 03:54 PM
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What sizes are the other two?
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  #3  
Old 05-02-2012, 03:55 PM
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CJ645Bern CJ645Bern is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeemerMikeTX View Post
What sizes are the other two?
I meant to say that both those sizes are two each

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  #4  
Old 05-02-2012, 04:49 PM
comsult comsult is offline
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Mismatched tires.
I have a 2001 Z3 with Style XX Wheels.
I got the car with 245 40 R17 wheels all round.
The correct setup is 225 45 R17 on the front and 245 40 R17 on the rear.
Greg
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  #5  
Old 05-02-2012, 04:54 PM
comsult comsult is offline
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forgot to post this
Front wheels are 17 X 7.5 inches
Rear wheels are 17 X 8.5 inches.
You may have them switched as I did when I bought the car.
The tire shop did this get the front tires to stop rubbing.
Greg.
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  #6  
Old 05-02-2012, 06:18 PM
ronpolley ronpolley is offline
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rear tires

What you have are 2 sets of rear tires.and these should be mounted on the 8.5 rims.
Ron
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  #7  
Old 05-02-2012, 06:20 PM
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CJ645Bern CJ645Bern is offline
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Appreciate the answers guys

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2001 BMW z3 3.0i vert' (TOTALED RIP)
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  #8  
Old 05-02-2012, 06:21 PM
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CJ645Bern CJ645Bern is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronpolley View Post
What you have are 2 sets of rear tires.and these should be mounted on the 8.5 rims.
Ron
Which one is the rear set? The r or zr?? Thanks

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2001 BMW z3 3.0i vert' (TOTALED RIP)
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2007 BMW z4 (traded for 6er)
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  #9  
Old 05-02-2012, 06:33 PM
comsult comsult is offline
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The Z is the speed rating.
most common are
H 130mph 210kph
V 149mph 240kph
Z over 149mph over 240kph
Not sure what the mean by "Over" How much over.
W 168mph 270kph
Y 186mph 300kph
Please remember these are SUSTAINED speed ratings.
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  #10  
Old 05-03-2012, 05:25 PM
TommyZ3 TommyZ3 is offline
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CJ645Bern said the tires (all four of them) are 245/40. I think the question is (regardless of staggered wheel sizes and proper setup for the car) which speed rating "ZR" or "R" is best on the front or rear? I do not have a answer but am trying to clarify the question.
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  #11  
Old 05-03-2012, 09:30 PM
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CJ645Bern CJ645Bern is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TommyZ3 View Post
CJ645Bern said the tires (all four of them) are 245/40. I think the question is (regardless of staggered wheel sizes and proper setup for the car) which speed rating "ZR" or "R" is best on the front or rear? I do not have a answer but am trying to clarify the question.
This is correct. But I called the dealership and had it answered. Thank you!

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2010 Acura TL (daily driver)
2005 BMW 645ci Coupe (traded for TL)
2001 BMW z3 3.0i vert' (TOTALED RIP)
1991 NISSAN 300zx 2+2 (gave to brother)
2007 BMW z4 (traded for 6er)
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  #12  
Old 05-04-2012, 02:54 AM
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BeemerMikeTX BeemerMikeTX is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ645Bern View Post
This is correct. But I called the dealership and had it answered. Thank you!
I'm curious. What did the dealership tell you, since you have "rear" tires mounted on the front?
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2001 Z3 3.0i Roadster (Topaz Blue Metallic, 5-speed manual, Sport Package, CD radio, heated seats and mirrors, non-power top via special order)
"Beemer" is for my BMW motorcycles - '13 K1300S, '95 R1100RS, '88 K75S, '75 R90S (gone, but not forgotten).
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  #13  
Old 05-04-2012, 07:41 PM
Z3Papa Z3Papa is offline
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He is running a square setup with mismatched tires. That's it. Let's not make to much of this. I doubt he will be cruising for sustained periods at the speed necessary to make this much of an issue.
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  #14  
Old 05-05-2012, 03:45 AM
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Pinecone Pinecone is offline
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I differ.

Running mismatched tires is NOT a good idea. It can lead to severe understeer (not that bad) or severe oversteer (VERY bad). And you won't know what it will do until it does it.
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  #15  
Old 05-05-2012, 06:04 AM
dkindig dkindig is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecone View Post
I differ.

Running mismatched tires is NOT a good idea. It can lead to severe understeer (not that bad) or severe oversteer (VERY bad). And you won't know what it will do until it does it.
This... Speed ratings aren't just an indicator of a tire's ability to maintain sustained high speeds. Tires with a higher speed rating have stiffer sidewalls which reduce tire roll and therefore, reduce heat buildup. It can definitely affect the way the car handles.
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  #16  
Old 05-05-2012, 06:09 AM
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BeemerMikeTX BeemerMikeTX is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecone View Post
I differ.

Running mismatched tires is NOT a good idea. It can lead to severe understeer (not that bad) or severe oversteer (VERY bad). And you won't know what it will do until it does it.
I tend to agree. My concern was not so much the R and the ZR ratings, but rather a 7.5" rim width is probably too narrow for a 245/40 tire.
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  #17  
Old 05-05-2012, 09:12 AM
Z3Papa Z3Papa is offline
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Without knowing the tires he is running or his driving habits, it is a gross overstatement there would be substantial understeer or oversteer based solely on mismatched tires. I could literally cite well over 20 examples of former Nat'l Solo champions or trophy winners (in fact in some instances entire classes) in the last five years, where ultimate grip/performance is at an absolute premium, who purposefully use mismatched tires. I would hope anyone who pushes their car to 10/10's or more has figured out whether it will understeer or oversteer in a safe environment first. Finally, in terms of whether you can run 245's on a 7.5" wheel, while it is not optimal, I've seen 275's run on a 6.5" wheel although admitted it was r-comps which tolerate the mis-sizing far more readily. Take everything I said with a grain of salt but generalizations are often overstated.
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  #18  
Old 05-06-2012, 06:15 AM
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Yes, many solo drivers mismatch tires. But they TEST under CONTROLLED conditions to determine the effects of their choices.

Doing this by just buying two new tires and then driving will find you doing those tests when making an emergency manuever under less than ideal occasions.

A BIG difference find out you have massive snap oversteer in the middle of a large expanse of asphalt, when you only hit some cones, versus doing it with your family on board and trees to hit.

YOUR choice, but unless you want to take the time to test properly, you are taking a BIG risk.
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  #19  
Old 05-06-2012, 06:58 AM
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BeemerMikeTX BeemerMikeTX is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecone View Post
YOUR choice, but unless you want to take the time to test properly, you are taking a BIG risk.
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  #20  
Old 05-06-2012, 07:16 AM
tohbi tohbi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecone View Post
Yes, many solo drivers mismatch tires. But they TEST under CONTROLLED conditions to determine the effects of their choices.

Doing this by just buying two new tires and then driving will find you doing those tests when making an emergency manuever under less than ideal occasions.

A BIG difference find out you have massive snap oversteer in the middle of a large expanse of asphalt, when you only hit some cones, versus doing it with your family on board and trees to hit.

YOUR choice, but unless you want to take the time to test properly, you are taking a BIG risk.
actually, i prefer a little oversteer. i'm running the staggered setup and don't like it. the car pushes badly. i mean, it works okay when i turn off the asc and run hard into the turns. then, i can do a little throttle steer. moreover, not being able to properly rotate tires gets expensive.

i'm thinking the 225/45 setup all the way around might work best for the street but i'm not sure how 225s will look on the wider rims or what difference it will make in the handling when those rims are moved to the front in rotation. anyone have experience with this?
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Old 05-06-2012, 01:28 PM
Z3Papa Z3Papa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecone View Post
Yes, many solo drivers mismatch tires. But they TEST under CONTROLLED conditions to determine the effects of their choices.

Doing this by just buying two new tires and then driving will find you doing those tests when making an emergency manuever under less than ideal occasions.

A BIG difference find out you have massive snap oversteer in the middle of a large expanse of asphalt, when you only hit some cones, versus doing it with your family on board and trees to hit.

YOUR choice, but unless you want to take the time to test properly, you are taking a BIG risk.
I guess you missed one of my important points. Before anyone has to explore what their car does at 10/10's in unknown conditions/location, my suggestion is to do exactly that in a known condition. There is not a car I drive on snow without first jabbing at the brakes or hitting the accelerator purposefully to know where the limit is. Similarlly, when I get new tires (just mounted a set of Michelin Pilot Super Sports on my DD/wet wheel set), I go out in a safe location and explore what the tire will do in terms of emergency braking, hard accel especially in a corner and hard cornering. That way, there are no surprises. If the tires produce a snap anything, I know it before the time comes to react. I would have thought with your signature photo, you would too but I must be mistaken.
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  #22  
Old 05-06-2012, 03:07 PM
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The point is, very few street drivers THINK they will push their car 10/10s. And when they do, they really don't need to be surprised.

You might go out and test. I know I would, if I ever ran different tires front and rear. But the vast majority would NOT. And what I see they reading and taking away from your post is that National Solo Champions do it, so it must be OK.
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  #23  
Old 05-06-2012, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tohbi View Post
actually, i prefer a little oversteer. i'm running the staggered setup and don't like it. the car pushes badly. i mean, it works okay when i turn off the asc and run hard into the turns. then, i can do a little throttle steer. moreover, not being able to properly rotate tires gets expensive.

i'm thinking the 225/45 setup all the way around might work best for the street but i'm not sure how 225s will look on the wider rims or what difference it will make in the handling when those rims are moved to the front in rotation. anyone have experience with this?
Well, I run non-staggered wheels and tires on my E46 M3 both street and track. My M3 LTW runs non-staggered wheels and tires for autocross.
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  #24  
Old 05-06-2012, 04:43 PM
tohbi tohbi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecone View Post
Well, I run non-staggered wheels and tires on my E46 M3 both street and track. My M3 LTW runs non-staggered wheels and tires for autocross.
i'm thinking i should run the non-staggered too but, i guess, i'm trying to avoid buying smaller rims. i should probably just pony up and buy them so all rims match? otherwise, there might be handling issues even with matching tires.
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Old 05-07-2012, 05:56 AM
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There can be a bit with staggered wheels and non-staggered tires. But less of a issue than with staggered wheels and tires.

What these cars really need is more negative camber. The camber curves are not sufficient with the body roll. That is why virtually every racing BMW picutre you see shows the front wheel off the ground at the apex of the corner.
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