****SPOILER****2004 Grand Prix of Europe

Originally Posted by WILLIA///M

As I posted in the other thread they are testing a 3/4 scale single keel front in the new wind tunnel now. I think that's pretty much an admission that this experiment with the twin keel and the tusks has been a flop. I'm starting to think that BMW would be better off having a go at doing it all themselves like Renault.

They might find the conclusions they came to that lead them to the twin keel were based on flawed measurements. I don't think it's so unusual in the calibration process of a new wind tunnel to test a number of known concepts. You would also want to see how different the characteristics of the twin keel are from the single keel. The only way to do that is to measure each in the new tunnel. I don't know what scale they used to work in, I suspect the new tunnel is a different size so they need to redo some measurements.

Originally Posted by SteveT

They might find the conclusions they came to that lead them to the twin keel were based on flawed measurements. I don't think it's so unusual in the calibration process of a new wind tunnel to test a number of known concepts. You would also want to see how different the characteristics of the twin keel are from the single keel. The only way to do that is to measure each in the new tunnel. I don't know what scale they used to work in, I suspect the new tunnel is a different size so they need to redo some measurements.

Steve Matchett mentioned on Saturday that they thought the new tunnel was 30% to 40% more accurate than the old one. Flawed measurements might be putting it mildly. Too bad they probably won't get it straightened out before next year though.

Originally Posted by WILLIA///M

Steve Matchett mentioned on Saturday that they thought the new tunnel was 30% to 40% more accurate than the old one. Flawed measurements might be putting it mildly. Too bad they probably won't get it straightened out before next year though.

Similarity analysis is not an exact science and Computational Fluid Dynamics (the other modeling technique they use) is not an absolute either. There have been other articles about the large errors the teams have encountered with aerodynamic development. It's the chase for the "unfair advantage"... if you go back to Mark Donohue.

Ouch. I guess Sam isn't happy this evening.

And neither is Mario:
Mario Theissen (BMW Motorsport Director): "Start positions 8 and 9 were of course not the best to start a race from, and the accident right after the start proved it.* Such a situation is annoying for the team. This is happening for the second time after Indianapolis, and this is two times too much. Anyway, it is clear that this is exactly what happens having a hairpin as first corner, since it allows four, even five different lines in and out but in the narrowest part there’s room just for two cars."

Originally Posted by Alex Baumann

Now I am waiting for his post race comments like 'Yeah, but they all braked too early'

http://www.planetf1.com/news/story_15821.shtml

When I made it to the first corner Rubens Barrichello, who was in front of me, braked quite early ....

Alex, come on, I understand that JPM is the guy to bash because he took off Michael after Michael's boneheaded move in the tunnel ... right Michael's boneheaded move. The tunnel is just a stupid place to be warming the tires like that. However, look at today's start a few times, it's typical of a start into an acute corner. Raikkonnen brakes very hard going into the corner forcing Rubens to do the same, then Button comes in towards the apex squeezing Ralf into Juan who is locking his brakes. They are all funneling into one space and something has to give. The problem is both Williams cars ended up down the grid more or less next to one another and came to that spot at the same time. Sure it's very frustrating, but not indicative of some mistake by anyone.

Originally Posted by SteveT

Alex, come on, I understand that JPM is the guy to bash because he took off Michael after Michael's boneheaded move in the tunnel ... right Michael's boneheaded move. The tunnel is just a stupid place to be warming the tires like that. However, look at today's start a few times, it's typical of a start into an acute corner. Raikkonnen brakes very hard going into the corner forcing Rubens to do the same, then Button comes in towards the apex squeezing Ralf into Juan who is locking his brakes. They are all funneling into one space and something has to give. The problem is both Williams cars ended up down the grid more or less next to one another and came to that spot at the same time. Sure it's very frustrating, but not indicative of some mistake by anyone.

Steve,

I've already forgotten the Monaco incident. That is something noone can change anymore.

The driver, who drives faster than others and makes less mistakes wins the game.

Originally Posted by Alex Baumann

Steve,

I've already forgotten the Monaco incident. That is something noone can change anymore.

The driver, who drives faster than others and makes less mistakes wins the game.

Alex,

I saw your earlier comment, but what happened today was about what a lot of people did not about mistakes. Today it was a huge advantage to be first to that first corner and as such to have been on pole. It's always true that who's fastest and makes the fewest mistakes should win. For all his excellence Michael makes mistakes too. Just not very frequently.

Originally Posted by Alex Baumann

Extremely embarrasing for Mclaren.

Kimi and Coulthard are driving very well. What a pisser for them. Poor guys.

Originally Posted by The Roadstergal

Kimi and Coulthard are driving very well. What a pisser for them. Poor guys.

The new car is probably going to be ready at Silverstone.

Originally Posted by richard

What's the chance that Mercedes can get their act together in 2 weeks?

Zero.

Hope for BAR and Renault to up it a few notches.

And for Sato to realize that he isn't playing bumper cars.

Originally Posted by Alex Baumann

The new car is probably going to be ready at Silverstone.

It's the engine that keeps blowing up, not the chassis.

Oh, and Montoya did two things that I enjoyed watching - saving the car when it started to go sideways on cold tires, and passing Klien. It really does look like the car is the issue at the moment.

Originally Posted by The Roadstergal

It's the engine that keeps blowing up, not the chassis.

They did talk about the possibility that the chassis/bodywork might be so compact and close to the engine that not being cooled enough and there was some mention of chassis flex. It's supposed to be very light. Although there was a recent news item that Werner Laurenz, who left BMW to go work on the Mercedes F1 program, is no longer part of the F1 program. This is somewhat surprising, he's known to have done an excellent job at Audi (R8 engine) as well as BMW's F1 program.

Ja, the commentators mentioned that. I hope that solves the issue, because it boggles the mind how consistantly the Mercedes have been blowing.

Patience is everyone's problem. Ferrari didn't get where they are quickly. There is a saying that in order to go forward, you have to take a step back first. In other words, you can't be afraid to fail.

Originally Posted by The Roadstergal

Zero.

Hope for BAR and Renault to up it a few notches.

And for Sato to realize that he isn't playing bumper cars.

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeez, I think you mirrored two of my comments here.

Originally Posted by Alex Baumann

I've already forgotten the Monaco incident. That is something noone can change anymore.

Not judging from the comments elsewhere.

Two weeks in a row, Sato bumps a red car, then his engine blows up... coincidence?

Originally Posted by Plaz

Two weeks in a row, Sato bumps a red car, then his engine blows up... coincidence?

How do you say kamakazi pilot.

Originally Posted by Plaz

Two weeks in a row, Sato bumps a red car, then his engine blows up... coincidence?

To defeat the top secret engine destruct wireless telemetry virus that they use you have to bump them hard enough to knock them out of the race so it's disabled.

Originally Posted by SteveT

Patience is everyone's problem. Ferrari didn't get where they are quickly. There is a saying that in order to go forward, you have to take a step back first. In other words, you can't be afraid to fail.

Exactly, the 80s and 90s were VERY painful for the Ferrari fans.

Originally Posted by Pinecone

Exactly, the 80s and 90s were VERY painful for the Ferrari fans.

I've been telling this the whole time, but noone cares to listen.

Originally Posted by Alex Baumann

I've been telling this the whole time, but noone cares to listen.

Being a Yankees fan, I can empathize. I don't feel sorry for you though.

Originally Posted by Plaz

Being a Yankees fan, I can empathize. I don't feel sorry for you though.

Them Yankees must be a boring team...