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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
The new chapter in the highly successful story of the BMW 5 Series Sedan (F10) and wagon (F11)

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  #26  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:12 AM
highyo highyo is offline
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Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Wow, this thread oozes of sore loser. I would think this car will smack the 550 in the face hard performance wise given that Audi need to put significant distance between it and the 3.0T. Does that make me want one? No, since handling seem to possibly be as bad or worse than the F10 in terms of feel and cornering grip plus it's very boring looking. As usual we need to drive the car to know for sure but I'm not hopeful given the skidpad number that is very close to the F10.
i just don't believe the number, also i would not drive this car because it's ugly and looks cheap.

is that being sore?
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  #27  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:16 AM
elitex elitex is offline
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Launch control along with AWD, it may be possible to get those numbers. But comparing it to the M5? c'mon now, look at the 5-60 numbers. It may be faster than the 550I, so are many other cars, who cares. I bought the 550i because of the overall package. I find the 550I with m-sport package very sexy.
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  #28  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:18 AM
elitex elitex is offline
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Originally Posted by highyo View Post
i just don't believe the number, also i would not drive this car because it's ugly and looks cheap.

is that being sore?
Agreed.
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  #29  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:23 AM
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dunderhi dunderhi is online now
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Originally Posted by jjsC6 View Post
Okay, I used the "nobody" term too loosely. I've owned many fast cars and motorcycles, and I have occasionally, but not very often. But we are just not "right"
You just reminded me of an event that happened during my youth. I pulled up beside a red Corvette with a beautiful well dressed blonde in the passenger seat. Well the driver thought he would impress her by challenging me to a race by revving his engine a few times. I knew I had no chance to beat him, so I new I had to go big or go home. When the light changed to green, he started squealing his tires, but I commited 100% and quickly pulled ahead of him. He backed off before he was halfway across the intersection. He looked P-O'd, but she had a good laugh.

BTW, I was on a Yamaha XT600 Enduro bike and took off doing a wheelie.
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  #30  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:50 AM
The X Men The X Men is offline
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The S6 is a nice looking car. Personally, I think it more of a looker than the F10. If the F10 has the M-sport package, then I would say its about a tie. Accelaration wise, the 550i is about the same as S6, but the BMW handles better. I like the S6's interior better than 550i, so basically, its a toss up. I think the price is pretty similar too if you option a 550i up to the option level of the S6.
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  #31  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:54 AM
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AutoUnion AutoUnion is offline
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Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
The S6 is a nice looking car. Personally, I think it more of a looker than the F10. If the F10 has the M-sport package, then I would say its about a tie. Accelaration wise, the 550i is about the same as S6, but the BMW handles better. I like the S6's interior better than 550i, so basically, its a toss up. I think the price is pretty similar too if you option a 550i up to the option level of the S6.
Nope... If anything the F10 is one of the worst handlers in this class. Audi and Lexus are better
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  #32  
Old 05-10-2012, 09:06 AM
highyo highyo is offline
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Originally Posted by AutoUnion View Post
Nope... If anything the F10 is one of the worst handlers in this class. Audi and Lexus are better
have you driven the s7?
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  #33  
Old 05-10-2012, 09:13 AM
solstice solstice is offline
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The M3 has been measured sub 4s 0-60 with similar hp. The S6 weighs a bit more but has awd and much more torque. I doubt the 3.7s is an easily obtainable number that can be put down consistently but it doesn't seem impossible that it's a best of many figure. It could of course also be fudged or a typo, we'll know better as more tests are released.

Last edited by solstice; 05-10-2012 at 09:14 AM.
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  #34  
Old 05-10-2012, 09:31 AM
highyo highyo is offline
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Originally Posted by solstice View Post
The M3 has been measured sub 4s 0-60 with similar hp. The S6 weighs a bit more but has awd and much more torque. I doubt the 3.7s is an easily obtainable number that can be put down consistently but it doesn't seem impossible that it's a best of many figure. It could of course also be fudged or a typo, we'll know better as more tests are released.
does the 0-60 and 5-60 # square with you though?
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  #35  
Old 05-10-2012, 09:54 AM
solstice solstice is offline
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Originally Posted by highyo View Post
does the 0-60 and 5-60 # square with you though?
Hard to say. With launch control you have a coiled snake ready to strike but if you are plodding along at 5mph with an auto box at 800rpm and then step on it you need to c*ck the gun and then shoot. How much difference does that make in this car? Not sure but 1s seems plausible.
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  #36  
Old 05-10-2012, 10:35 AM
The X Men The X Men is offline
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Nope... If anything the F10 is one of the worst handlers in this class. Audi and Lexus are better
Let me correct myself, BTW, I am comparing the A6 to the 535xi, the A6 handles better in the city and the F10 is better on the highway. The GS350 does handle nicely, but it doesnt feel as solid and planted as the Audi and BMW.
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  #37  
Old 05-10-2012, 10:42 AM
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Needsdecaf Needsdecaf is offline
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Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Wow, this thread oozes of sore loser. I would think this car will smack the 550 in the face hard performance wise given that Audi need to put significant distance between it and the 3.0T. Does that make me want one? No, since handling seem to possibly be as bad or worse than the F10 in terms of feel and cornering grip plus it's very boring looking. As usual we need to drive the car to know for sure but I'm not hopeful given the skidpad number that is very close to the F10.
Maybe it might, but for my part, it's not. I've always been one to say that the 3.0T in the A6 is the stronger of the two powerplants by a good margin. I am certainly not a brand loyalist or BMW apologist. But that 0-60 number sounds like bunk to me. Compare to Dunderhi's S3 xDrive, which posts similar numbers and is rated north of 500 HP. It too has the AWD launch advantage. So either Audi's WAY underestimating the HP or there is something screwy there.

Consider the same engine in the Conti GT, rated at 500 HP takes 4.6 seconds and hits the quarter in 13 flat. Granted, it is about 900 lbs heavier.

The same power train in the S7 managed 4.0 and 12.4.

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t-drive-review

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t-drive-review

Personally, I am thinking that it's all down to the DSG and it's associated launch control. The 5-60 number doesn't lie.
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Last edited by Needsdecaf; 05-10-2012 at 10:45 AM.
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  #38  
Old 05-10-2012, 10:45 AM
sdg1871 sdg1871 is online now
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I do!
+1 brother
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  #39  
Old 05-10-2012, 10:54 AM
ND40oz ND40oz is offline
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Originally Posted by Joe-BMW View Post
Good catch. Has to be a typo although I am not an expert on this. My first thought was where the tranny is at in terms of gear at 5MPH may hurt the performance as it has to downshift first when you bang it and maybe this hurts the time?
I'm sure it's launch control, the TT RS did 0-60 in 3.6 seconds but it's rolling 5-60 was 5.2 seconds. Not much boost at 5 mph unless you start standing on the brake pedal as your rolling.
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  #40  
Old 05-10-2012, 10:56 AM
solstice solstice is offline
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Decaf, I think dunderhi's car is almost 500 lbs heavier and is lacking launch control. Those are big disadvantages. Than add Audi's quattro that I think could be superior in this type of launches. Also take a look at the GT-R's weight and power and the 2.9s it achieves with launch control. I'm not saying that the 3.7s is clean just that it's not for sure it's wrong.
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  #41  
Old 05-10-2012, 11:13 AM
TahoeM3 TahoeM3 is offline
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That 0-60 is definitely a product of the launch control....works well on cars with AWD and forced induction. It's the same thing that happened when the TTRS was tested using the Euro-spec launch control and DSG that isn't available in the US...the 0-60 was shockingly low but the car wasn't any faster than its competitors on the track or with rolling runs.

For this S6, the 5-60 and 60-100 times of 4.9 and 5.5 seconds shows us exactly where its real-world performance will be: slightly faster than a stock 550i, as expected given the power and weight.
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  #42  
Old 05-10-2012, 11:52 AM
SuperTerp SuperTerp is offline
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Originally Posted by TahoeM3 View Post
For this S6, the 5-60 and 60-100 times of 4.9 and 5.5 seconds shows us exactly where its real-world performance will be: slightly faster than a stock 550i, as expected given the power and weight.
its also 2 years late to the party.
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  #43  
Old 05-10-2012, 12:33 PM
jjsC6 jjsC6 is offline
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Originally Posted by Needsdecaf View Post
Maybe it might, but for my part, it's not. I've always been one to say that the 3.0T in the A6 is the stronger of the two powerplants by a good margin. I am certainly not a brand loyalist or BMW apologist. But that 0-60 number sounds like bunk to me. Compare to Dunderhi's S3 xDrive, which posts similar numbers and is rated north of 500 HP. It too has the AWD launch advantage. So either Audi's WAY underestimating the HP or there is something screwy there.

Consider the same engine in the Conti GT, rated at 500 HP takes 4.6 seconds and hits the quarter in 13 flat. Granted, it is about 900 lbs heavier.

The same power train in the S7 managed 4.0 and 12.4.

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t-drive-review

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t-drive-review

Personally, I am thinking that it's all down to the DSG and it's associated launch control. The 5-60 number doesn't lie.
The performance times in the second link are C&D estimates.
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  #44  
Old 05-10-2012, 01:54 PM
Michael Schott Michael Schott is offline
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Originally Posted by solstice View Post
The M3 has been measured sub 4s 0-60 with similar hp. The S6 weighs a bit more but has awd and much more torque. I doubt the 3.7s is an easily obtainable number that can be put down consistently but it doesn't seem impossible that it's a best of many figure. It could of course also be fudged or a typo, we'll know better as more tests are released.
Most M3 numbers I've seen are low 4 seconds not under and it weighs 700 pounds less than the S6. Either this car makes way more than 420 hp or something is wrong with these numbers.
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  #45  
Old 05-10-2012, 02:14 PM
solstice solstice is offline
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Most M3 numbers I've seen are low 4 seconds not under and it weighs 700 pounds less than the S6. Either this car makes way more than 420 hp or something is wrong with these numbers.
Isn't the weight difference 500 lbs and not 700? The S6 hp is more than likely underrated as most cars are nowadays. Keep in mind though that it's not only hp that matters in these runs, torque plays a role as well and the S6 dominates the M3 in this aspect.
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  #46  
Old 05-10-2012, 02:20 PM
FastMarkA FastMarkA is offline
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While the number is only estimated at $71,000, I feel like the MSRP of the C6 S6 was closer to the $75-80k mark? Am I imagining things?
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  #47  
Old 05-10-2012, 02:26 PM
solstice solstice is offline
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While the number is only estimated at $71,000, I feel like the MSRP of the C6 S6 was closer to the $75-80k mark? Am I imagining things?
I bet that Lambo derived V10 is way more expensive to build than the FI V8.
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  #48  
Old 05-10-2012, 02:27 PM
FastMarkA FastMarkA is offline
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I bet that Lambo derived V10 is way more expensive to build than the FI V8.
I bet you're right. I bet it's also way more expensive to fix, too, but I don't expect Audi to change its shop labor rates anytime soon.
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  #49  
Old 05-10-2012, 06:06 PM
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  #50  
Old 05-10-2012, 06:06 PM
jjsC6 jjsC6 is offline
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Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Isn't the weight difference 500 lbs and not 700? The S6 hp is more than likely underrated as most cars are nowadays. Keep in mind though that it's not only hp that matters in these runs, torque plays a role as well and the S6 dominates the M3 in this aspect.
Most cars actually are not under (or over) rated today. Google "SAE certified horsepower". There are many factors that make up how fast a car is. Peak horsepower is but one of them. Actually, BMW has always been one of the best at getting the most out of the peak hp they put out.
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