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Motorsports, Racing & Track
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  #51  
Old 06-03-2004, 06:06 AM
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Clyde, did you ever look into removing that speaker grill on the rear deck? Maybe there is access from the top side....
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  #52  
Old 06-03-2004, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bren
Clyde, did you ever look into removing that speaker grill on the rear deck? Maybe there is access from the top side....
Not yet.
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  #53  
Old 06-03-2004, 10:37 AM
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yeah, I was thinking the same thing
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  #54  
Old 06-03-2004, 05:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamZ4
what your diagram doesn't show is that where the top of that "tower" bolted to the shock slides up through a tight fitting hole in a plate across the upper portion of the chassis' inner shock tower area, trapping the top of the shock in what appeared to be an enclosed chamber at the very top of the chassis tower, I'm not sure if there are any access holes in that upper chamber area to route the cable adjuster you're proposing
Well, I still don't know if I can get to it by removing the speaker grills. If you cna imagine, removing the speaker grills is not a simple task. The rear seats have to come out (which only takes a minute, actually) and a bunch of stuff on the side around the doors has to come out. I had a bit too much toddler action in the front yard to keep running inside to look at the manual on the computer (and some idiot let the battery in his powerbook run out...and didn't think of plugging it into an inverter and running it off the lighter until just now ) to find out how everything was supposed to come apart.

OTOH, I took out the passenger side trunk trim again and poked around in some holes with flashlights and fingers. Long story short...there's plenty of room around the adjustor tab on that side. I can get A finger on it with the shock in place. You can't see the holes in the image above (they are higher than the pic goes), but they are big enough that I *might* be able to get some needlenose pliers (or similar) on it, but I don't think I would be able to turn it much before the angle made further adjustment possible. I'm sure there is a tool out there that would work, but I don't know my tools well enough to know what it might be.

From a packaging and fittment standpoint, though, my gear idea should work pretty well. There is a LOT of room up there. Whether they could transmit enough force is another question.
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  #55  
Old 06-03-2004, 05:41 PM
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Sounds like you need to wander around the tool dept. in Sears.

What does the adjustment knob look like? Could you get a ratchet and socket on it? Or one of those ratchet wrenches?
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  #56  
Old 06-03-2004, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bren
Sounds like you need to wander around the tool dept. in Sears.

What does the adjustment knob look like? Could you get a ratchet and socket on it? Or one of those ratchet wrenches?
The tab looks like this (the thing the arrow is pointing to):



it's a lot thinner than it is wide, kind of like a paper match. I might be able to get a socket on it, but I don't think the angle is right to get a ratchet to mate with it (and I don't think that a ratchet and socket arrangement would work to adjust it anyway). You need to grab onto the tab in one way or another.
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  #57  
Old 06-03-2004, 06:27 PM
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I thought maybe the adjustment tab would be square and a socket would fit over it. I had the idea to use a ratchet because I figure space is at a minimum to fit pliers and still be able to turn them. I assumed, perhaps incorrectly that the openings you found were next to the top of the shock. If you have (or can get) extras of that adjustment knob tool I'm sure we could figure something out....like some sort of extension pole with that knob on the end.
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  #58  
Old 06-03-2004, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by bren
I assumed, perhaps incorrectly that the openings you found were next to the top of the shock. If you have (or can get) extras of that adjustment knob tool I'm sure we could figure something out....like some sort of extension pole with that knob on the end.
The openings a just a little lower than the tab (I think). The tab is about a finger length away from the holes. The holes are too small to get the knob in. They're a little bigger than the diameter of a D cell battery.
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  #59  
Old 06-03-2004, 06:57 PM
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You could just attach the knob to the shock and then bolt it all in place. Maybe secure a nut to the knob that you can get a wrench on. Or cut the knob down to accept the wrench. Of course the relationship of the opening to the knob would be critical.....
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  #60  
Old 06-03-2004, 07:11 PM
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You don't have much experience with the Koni knobs, do you? They don't work well enough for that to be a possibility.
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  #61  
Old 06-03-2004, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ·clyde·
You don't have much experience with the Koni knobs, do you? They don't work well enough for that to be a possibility.
Nope. I have adjustable shocks on the Jeep and the knobs are really easy to turn, plus the plastic knob part is already attached.

It's late and I'm bored....don't mind me
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  #62  
Old 06-04-2004, 04:31 AM
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I can't offer anything but my sympathies and what little brainpower I have at the next event to try to solve the problem.

Still, I can't help but think that once you get them adjusted how you like them you probably won't touch them anymore.
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  #63  
Old 06-04-2004, 05:46 AM
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Originally Posted by SoloII///M
I can't offer anything but my sympathies and what little brainpower I have at the next event to try to solve the problem.
Well, at worst, it's only a matter of jacking the rear of the car, removing the rear wheels, removing part of the trunk liner, removing 5 or 6 bolts per side holding the shocks in place, prying the shocks of their lower mounts, letting the shocks down as far as they will go, back into the trunk, turn the tab (yes, I'm sure that they can be adjusted without fully removing them from the car) and put everything back together. It shouldn't take more than 45 minutes, tops, to do both sides.

Quote:
Still, I can't help but think that once you get them adjusted how you like them you probably won't touch them anymore.
I mostly agree, but how many adjustments is it going to take until I get there? The other question is whether I'm ultimately going to want the same settings with the Hoosiers as I want with the street tires?
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  #64  
Old 06-04-2004, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloII///M
I can't offer anything but my sympathies and what little brainpower I have at the next event to try to solve the problem.

Still, I can't help but think that once you get them adjusted how you like them you probably won't touch them anymore.
Oh, come on...where is your adventurous spirit

Every once in a while us gov't employees need to wake up our brains with over complicated solutions to simple problems
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  #65  
Old 06-04-2004, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by bren
Oh, come on...where is your adventurous spirit
It's about what I'd expect from someone that lives in the hinterlands of Howard County...and likes it there.
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  #66  
Old 06-04-2004, 05:57 PM
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well my gut feeling is that 50% rebound setting will be a good compromise setting, as you go higher the rear ride quality will take a dump

since you use the same size tire front/rear on both street and race tires the race settings should still provide excellent handling with your street tires
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  #67  
Old 06-04-2004, 06:23 PM
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OK, if you can get to the top of the shock, you can use one of those ratchets that turn by turning a T handle at the end of the normal handle. Like this:

http://amos2.catalogcity.com/amos/cc...7122/ccsyn/260

You would need to either have a special socket made to fit the Koni blade (try Ron Stygar on teh Z forum here), or have a nut attached to the Koni adjuster.
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  #68  
Old 06-04-2004, 07:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecone
OK, if you can get to the top of the shock, you can use one of those ratchets that turn by turning a T handle at the end of the normal handle. Like this:

http://amos2.catalogcity.com/amos/cc...7122/ccsyn/260

You would need to either have a special socket made to fit the Koni blade (try Ron Stygar on teh Z forum here), or have a nut attached to the Koni adjuster.
See, Terry and I are on the same page....although neither of us has seen the trunk of the car
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  #69  
Old 06-05-2004, 03:36 AM
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post a picture of it, that's one of those retarded "cookies mustbe enabled" sites
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  #70  
Old 06-05-2004, 04:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamZ4
post a picture of it, that's one of those retarded "cookies mustbe enabled" sites


You turn the T- handle on the end and the ratchet turns. So you don't have to have space to swing the rathchet..
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  #71  
Old 06-05-2004, 08:18 AM
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Well, testing is the only way to find out if it will help.

My gut feeling (and past experience) says more rear rebound will *increase* trailing-throttle oversteer. But then again, that was for a mid-engined car.
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  #72  
Old 06-05-2004, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racerdave
Well, testing is the only way to find out if it will help.

My gut feeling (and past experience) says more rear rebound will *increase* trailing-throttle oversteer. But then again, that was for a mid-engined car.

having experienced the chassis dynamics firsthand I can assure you this isn't the case
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  #73  
Old 06-06-2004, 01:17 PM
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I don't doubt it... just relaying my *very* limited shock experiments on a mid-engined car.

I'm too busy now trying to figure out all the much lower-tech, but seemingly as limitless adjustments of my shifter kart.
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  #74  
Old 06-07-2004, 05:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racerdave
I don't doubt it... just relaying my *very* limited shock experiments on a mid-engined car.

I'm too busy now trying to figure out all the much lower-tech, but seemingly as limitless adjustments of my shifter kart.
It was pretty apparent from watching Mark and Clyde drive that there wasn't enough rebound in the back. The rear end jacked WAY up. I'm guessing that made it pretty tail happy entering the corners.

John
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  #75  
Old 06-07-2004, 06:46 AM
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yep, in certain situations but not in all turns, this is a case where adding rebound up to a point will actually keep the rear end planted better, IMO it felt like the the rear suspension was going toe-out when it jacked up like that and when you got into quick side-side transitions such as the slaloms is where would get pretty freaky, that's why I keep harping on you guys about tuning for the application at hand rather than using some general chart out of a book

still overall one of the best handling Stock cars I've ever driven, the styling was leaving me cold on those but now after driving it I've completely warmed up to it; the interior, seats, etc. are all nicely done, Mazda does know how to build a driving machine
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Last edited by TeamZ4; 06-07-2004 at 06:49 AM.
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