Oil..

Ok so most people say that as long as oil meets the LL01 spec its ok and it doesnt make any difference.

Well, after trying alot of different oils the 10 years that I have owned an E46 (M52TU 320i 1995 cc and M54 2171cc 320Ci) I must say that oil makes a big difference in the performance, economy and sound of the engine.

I have tried the following:
1. OEM BMW 5-30 LL01
2. OEM BMW 5-40 LL04
3. Castrol 0-30 LL04
4. Valvoline 5-30 LL01 syntec
5. Mobil1 0-40 LL01
6. Agip synpower 5-40 LL01

the engine performed very different with each one of these oils.
For -1. Was more like a 5-40, thick oil, nice pull midrange, nice exhaust sound
-2. Similar with -1 but strangely thinner oil, lasted more before blackening.
-3. Horrible oil. I tried it only for 300km and changed it. Engine did not perform well, no pull on higher revs, and blackened really quick. Was watery and the car acted like a diesel car.
-4. Nice oil, similar with mobil1 but cheaper.
-5. excellent oil, both for durability, performance and engine sound.
-6. Very similar but abit thinner than OEM 5-30 LL01, this oil is my favourite, giving you excellent fuel economy, and pull.

Overall, I highly suggest Mobil1 for all climates, and agip 5-40 for hot climates.(like Cyprus)

Seriously? With all due respect, I'm highly skeptical that it's possible for any human being to discern the impact on engine performance, sound, economy, etc. between a group of top quality oils. Maybe if you put the engine on a dyno with the different oils, but even that seems unlikely. Again, no disrespect intended, but I've never seen anyone make a claim like this before.

I confirm there is the difference:
#1 is good
#3 is crap for BMW but Castrol 5W-40 is OK and similar to #1 OEM BMW 5W-30
#5 is very good

But my favorite not in the list is LubroMoly 5W-40 100% synthetic made in Germany.
However oil level in the engine makes huge difference as well. The lower level (close to low dipstick mark) the noisy engine and less pull.

Sorry, but I think you guys have very vivid imaginations (and I mean that in only the nicest possible way ).

It is true that in extreme applications (high end race motors), the type of oil will make a difference, but in a relatively (by modern standards) lightly stressed engine like ours, I don't think so. But then, I've only used the BMW branded stuff - not because I'm a snob for this type of thing, but because this is one of the few items the local dealer actually sells for a pretty decent price.

Originally Posted by Variocam

Sorry, but I think you guys have very vivid imaginations (and I mean that in only the nicest possible way ).

It is true that in extreme applications (high end race motors), the type of oil will make a difference, but in a relatively (by modern standards) lightly stressed engine like ours, I don't think so. But then, I've only used the BMW branded stuff - not because I'm a snob for this type of thing, but because this is one of the few items the local dealer actually sells for a pretty decent price.

Well, you are talking with assumptions here...I am talking about tested results.
And yes, the engine likes the oil to be topped up.

I'm not saying it's impossible that different oils, particularly across different viscoities, could produce a slight difference it peak horsepower. I'm just saying that the difference in a modest output engine like ours would be too small to notice, unless you've comparing across drastic differences in viscosity, like 0W30 vs. 20W50.

I would suspect that if you took a car and performed a series of acceleration tests (0-30, 0-60, 0-100 if you can get away with it, etc.) under controlled conditions in both directions, with the engine, transmission, and differential fluids warmed up to the same temperatures in all runs, with each of the oils you have listed, the differences in times would not be statistically significant to a 95% confidence level. I could be wrong, but that's my strong suspicion.

Originally Posted by Variocam

I'm not saying it's impossible that different oils, particularly across different viscoities, could produce a slight difference it peak horsepower. I'm just saying that the difference in a modest output engine like ours would be too small to notice, unless you've comparing across drastic differences in viscosity, like 0W30 vs. 20W50.

I would suspect that if you took a car and performed a series of acceleration tests (0-30, 0-60, 0-100 if you can get away with it, etc.) under controlled conditions in both directions, with the engine, transmission, and differential fluids warmed up to the same temperatures in all runs, with each of the oils you have listed, the differences in times would not be statistically significant to a 95% confidence level. I could be wrong, but that's my strong suspicion.

Well, you have left a 5% margin there, which is about correct.
To be honest, all these oils that I have wrote above perform very similarly, besides the 0W30 castrol that I have used:
So whatever you use, dont use this in an M54!

So, to cut the long story short, dont use a 0W30 oil in an M54. If you are living in an extremely cold climate, and must use a 0W- rated oil, better use 0W40 Mobil1 LL01.
It performs much better.

Fair enough.

I have to compliment you on not getting defensive or upset because I challenged your conclusions - all too often on forums like this one, legitimate differences of opinion turn into ugly personal attacks, which is why I was careful to be as respectful I could with my wording. You sound like a good guy.

And I promise to avoid Castrol 0W30 LL04!

Originally Posted by Variocam

Fair enough.

I have to compliment you on not getting defensive or upset because I challenged your conclusions - all too often on forums like this one, legitimate differences of opinion turn into ugly personal attacks, which is why I was careful to be as respectful I could with my wording. You sound like a good guy.

And I promise to avoid Castrol 0W30 LL04!

What's the point of an argument over oil? I am just stating my own personal experiences, and I can honestly say that all these oils bar the 0W30 LL04 performed very similarly..i.e. you cannot tell which is which when in the engine.

I am not a chemical engineer so I really cannot understand why this Castrol oil changed so much my engine's performance.
All I know is that it is one (if not THE first) LL04 oil. I still keep the bottle, in case I can find an answer to my question.

So, here it is again:

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"" NEW REVOLUTIONARY OIL"" Castrol Introduces a New Revolutionary Oil for the BMW Group Text courtesy BP Lubricants edited 12-07-2004

‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’ Castrol, strategic partner of BMW, have developed a new lubricant with `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` in close cooperation with BMW, which sets new standards in the industry. Castrol SLX LL04 0W-30 is specially engineered to keep the engine and exhaust system clean, reducing harmful emissions to the environment. SLX LL04 is developed for the new generation of BMW’s with particulate filters and meets the latest specifications BMW Longlife-04. Due to its `Clean Performance TechnologyTM`, SLX LL04 reduces long term blocking of the particle filters and can be used in all BMW diesel and petrol engines (excluding M series). Castrol is the first lubricant manufacturer to bring a `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` oil onto the market. BMW have started fitting diesel particulate filters (DPF’s) to their cars. Initially the BMW 5 series will be offered with a DPF, other models such as the new 3 series will follow. These new diesel engines fitted with a DPF need an engine oil based on new lubricant technology. Together with the engine management system the DPF ensures long-term reduction of particle emissions. In order to prolong the durability of the DPF the so called ‘Low SAPS’ oils are required. Castrol’s `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` is a totally new ‘Low SAPS’ formulation containing lower levels of Sulphated Ash, Phosphorous and Sulphur compared with conventional oils. Castrol’s ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM‘ is specially engineered to keep the engine and exhaust system clean, reducing harmful emissions to the environment. High levels of metal-based additives in engine oil can contribute to long term blocking of exhaust filters and increased harmful emissions. ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’, from Castrol, uses low levels of these metal-based additives to prolong the life of the exhaust system. By keeping exhaust systems clear, Castrol’s ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’ provides superior power flow through the engine, maintaining vehicle performance and fuel economy. With Castrol’s revolutionary `Clean Performance TechnologyTM`, new Castrol SLX LL04 meets the requirements of the future generation of both diesel and petrol engines of the BMW Group. Key features and benefits of Castrol SLX LL04 0W-30: Features: New ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’ Special Fully Synthetic 0W-30 Low SAPS formulation Compatible with Diesel Particulate Filters Long drain capability Approved to BMW Longlife-04 (including Longlife-01) Benefits: Cleaner environment (reduced emissions of harmful particulates from the exhaust) Helps keep exhaust system clean Maintains engine performance and fuel economy Prolongs durability of the exhaust system Fast cold start properties through 0W viscosity Castrol SLX LL04 is the first engine oil, which fulfills the new BMW Longlife-04 specification. With the `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` it has a wide range of applications from the latest diesels fitted with DPF filters to new and existing petrol engine technology. The new product offers profitable opportunities for the BMW network. Castrol will support the dealers with tailor made marketing and communication concepts to exploit this new opportunity.

according to a guy named "charlie" at the bobistheoilguy.com forums, ll04 oils are inferior to ll01 oils since their low saps formulation contains low TBN values....
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...Number=1746122

Originally Posted by Fifty_Cent

according to a guy named "charlie" at the bobistheoilguy.com forums, ll04 oils are inferior to ll01 oils since their low saps formulation contains low TBN values....
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...Number=1746122

SLX Professional Powerflow BMW LL04 0W-30

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Applications

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Castrol SLX Professional Powerflow BMW LL04 0W-30 is co-engineered in partnership with BMW for latest generation engines. The fully synthetic formulation with Clean Performance Technology TM prolongs the life of today's complex emissions systems and helps reduce harmful emissions to the environment. Castrol SLX Professional Powerflow BMW LL04 0W-30 also helps sustain horsepower throughout the service interval.

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Features / Benefits

*******>********>

Castrol SLX Professional Powerflow BMW LL04 0W-30 provides the following benefits:- *Sustained horsepower through the service interval *Protection for the complex emissions systems Recommended by BMW

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Specifications / Performance

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ACEA A3/B3/B4 ACEA C3 API SM/CF BMW LL04

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Storage

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All packages should be stored under cover. Where outside storage is unavoidable drums should be laid horizontally to avoid the possible ingress of water and the obliteration of drum markings. Products should not be stored above 60°C, exposed to hot sun or freezing conditions.

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Health, Safety and Environment

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Health, safety and environmental information is provided for this product in the Materials Safety Data Sheet. This gives details of potential hazards, precautions and First Aid measures, together with environmental effects and disposal of used products. Castrol (UK) Ltd. or its subsidiaries will not accept liability if the product is used other than in the manner or with the precautions or for the purpose/s specified. Before the product is used other than as directed, advice should be obtained from the local Castrol office.

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Typical Characteristics
__________________________________________________ ______________________________

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Test Methods

Units

Value:

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

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SAE 0W-30

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Test	Method(s)	Unit	Typical
Density @ 15C, Relative	ASTM D4052		0.8383
Appearance	Visual		Bright and clear
Viscosity, Kinematic 100C	ASTM D445	mm²/s	12.3
Viscosity, Kinematic 40C	ASTM D445	mm²/s	71
Viscosity Index	ASTM D2270	None	170
Viscosity, CCS -35C (0W)	ASTM D5293	cP	5900
Calcium, % wt	ASTM D4951	% wt	0.151
Phosphorus, % wt	ASTM D4951	% wt	0.076
Zinc, % wt	ASTM D4951	% wt	0.083
Flash Point, PMCC	ASTM D93	°C	238
Ash, Sulphated	ASTM D874	% wt	0.64
Total Base Number, TBN	ASTM D2896	mg KOH/g	6.69
Pour Point	ASTM D97	°C	-57
Viscosity, HTHS 150C	ASTM D4683	cP	3.46

__________________________________________________ ______________________________ The above figures are typical of those obtained with normal production tolerance and do not constitute a specification.
*******>********>

This Data sheet and information it contains is considered to be accurate at the date of printing. No warranty or representation, expressed or implied, is made as to the accuracy or completeness of the data and information contained in this publication.

It is the User's obligation to evaluate and use products safely and within the scope advised in the data sheet and to comply with all applicable laws and regulations. No statement made in this publication shall be construed as a permission, recommendation or authorisation given or implied to practice any patented invention without a valid licence.

The Seller shall not be responsible for any loss or damage resulting from any hazards or risks identified in the data sheet and which are associated with petroleum products concerned (provided that this disclaimer shall not affect any statutory rights of the Buyer of the petroleum products concerned).

Castrol (UK) Ltd Wakefield House Lubricants Helpline: 01793 452222 Pipers Way Orders/Enquiries: 08459 123011 Swindon Wiltshire SN3 1RE

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

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Date Created: 27/11/2006 15:02:54Last Modified:19/03/2007

mobil1 0w40 characteristics:
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Mobil 1 0W-40	Value
Viscosity, cSt (ASTM D445)
@ 40º C	75
@ 100º C	13.5
Viscosity Index	185
MRV at -40ºC, cP (ASTM D4684)	31,000
HTHS Viscosity, mPa•s @ 150ºC, (ASTM D4683)	3.8
Total Base Number (ASTM D2896)	11.8
Sulfated Ash, wt% (ASTM D874)	1.3
Phosphorous, wt% (ASTM D4981)	0.1
Flash Point, ºC (ASTM D92)	230
Density @15.6 ºC, g/ml (ASTM D4052)	0.85

You can't get the 0W-30 LL04 in the USA. And BMW doesn't want us USA drivers to use it anyway; seems that the higher sulfur content in our fuel and low-ash formula doesn't work as well as the older LL01. A lower TBN is much less an issue with the low-sulfur diesel and gasoline - fewer acid-forming reactions.

Originally Posted by LX-biker

I confirm there is the difference:
#1 is good
#3 is crap for BMW but Castrol 5W-40 is OK and similar to #1 OEM BMW 5W-30
#5 is very good

But my favorite not in the list is LubroMoly 5W-40 100% synthetic made in Germany.
However oil level in the engine makes huge difference as well. The lower level (close to low dipstick mark) the noisy engine and less pull.

Anybody else have any experience with LubroMoly 5W40? The reason I ask is that autohausaz (my favorite parts house) sells it for a pretty reasonable price, and their shipping is free on orders over $50. I've been buying the BMW branded stuff from the local dealer, and while, shockingly, their price for is actually not bad (something like $6.70 a quart), it's a long drive, so it costs more in gas than it's worth. Thanks.