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European Delivery
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  #1  
Old 06-02-2012, 06:17 PM
pawarrant pawarrant is offline
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Lake Como or Lake Constance - Can only pick one

I am doing my 14 day ED in mid September. I will only have time to fit in my itinerary a two day stay on either Lake Constance (Lindau perhaps) or Lake Como (Bellagio). For those of you that have been there, which would you choose and why?
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  #2  
Old 06-02-2012, 07:42 PM
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These two are like chalk and cheese. I've enjoyed time at each with a great week at Como last September. I suggest you do some research outside of this forum to learn about the charms of each. After 10 prior ED's and #11 this fall with a new M5 I intend to spend 2 weeks in Siena and Tuscany (bypassing Como) and enjoy a third week at Lake Lucerne.

That said, there are lot of European lakes that are similar in nature to Constance but the Italian Lake District (especially Como and Garda) is unique.
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  #3  
Old 06-03-2012, 06:08 AM
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I would choose Bellagio on Lake Como over Lindau on Lake Constance. The view of the harbor and lighthouse in Lindau is spectacular but the rest of the lake is relatively uninteresting. Lake Como is much more compact and every village seems to have its own charm. The ferry ride around the Lake Como takes you to numerous interesting looking villages, any of which appears to be worth exploring. Bellagio is beautiful and worth a two day stay.

The road from Como to Bellagio is narrow and should not be driven at night, in fact I would not drive it again even in daylight, especially in a new Bimmer. My recollection is that there is not much parking available in Bellagio, but I could be wrong. Instead you can leave your car on the west bank and take the ferry over to Bellagio. You can also take your car on the ferry if you would like to have it nearby.
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Old 06-03-2012, 06:57 AM
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IMO go to Garda I've been to Como and its really a beautiful place with lots to do but the roads are very narrow and not a place to drive a new BMW IMO. In 2006 we went there with our X3 and had bumper and side view mirror damage while parked. We were at Garda a few weeks ago for 3 days and it just as beautiful as Como with just as much to take up your time. Enjoy what ever one you go to there both great places to visit.
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:29 AM
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havent been to constance but can highly recommend lake como if you haven't been. left the car safely in the underground parking for the duration of our stay and took public transport (ferries & busses) around.

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  #6  
Old 06-03-2012, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by vern View Post
IMO go to Garda I've been to Como and its really a beautiful place with lots to do but the roads are very narrow and not a place to drive a new BMW IMO. In 2006 we went there with our X3 and had bumper and side view mirror damage while parked. We were at Garda a few weeks ago for 3 days and it just as beautiful as Como with just as much to take up your time. Enjoy what ever one you go to there both great places to visit.
cheers
vern
I also found the roads around Garda to be very drivable with a minimum of uncomfortable or nerve-wracking moments. Great driving, in fact, in some sections-- the Quantum of Solace section not even being amongst the most interesting-- some great sections and scenery driving all 'round the lake.
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  #7  
Old 06-03-2012, 10:47 AM
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been in both places, very different feel
my choice will be Como
-more picturesque
-IMO better views/nature
-better food/if you like italian food/
- more places to explore around
Enjoy,Alex
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Old 06-03-2012, 11:33 AM
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been in both places, very different feel
my choice will be Como
-more picturesque
-IMO better views/nature
-better food/if you like italian food/
- more places to explore around
Enjoy,Alex
Agreed on all counts. If I was on a regular trip (arriving by plane, then taxi, etc.) I'd prefer Como, no doubt. On a "driving trip"-- to the extent that the trip is-- that's the only reason I'd recommend lake-other-than-Como to someone.
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  #9  
Old 06-03-2012, 02:34 PM
Challenge64 Challenge64 is offline
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Lake Como! And see if you can arrange a private tour of Villa del Balbianello. We did through our hotel in Bellagio and it was amazing!
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  #10  
Old 06-04-2012, 02:18 AM
pawarrant pawarrant is offline
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Thanks for all of the replies. I think I will go to Como. Anyone have suggestions on where to stay there?
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  #11  
Old 06-04-2012, 06:12 AM
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Thanks for all of the replies. I think I will go to Como. Anyone have suggestions on where to stay there?
If price is not an issue the Villa D'Este.
It's almost magical.
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  #12  
Old 06-04-2012, 06:32 AM
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Agreed - my second choice is Grand Hotel Villa Serbelloni. Both are extraordinary.

Dick
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  #13  
Old 06-04-2012, 07:23 AM
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For the reasons others have said, Lake Como.

The best reason I can think of for lake Constance is that it's more convenient to Munich and Lake Como would be easier to get to on another trip (say to Northern Italy).

If this is a once in a lifetime (or even once in a decade) trip, Como. If you go to Europe regularly, then Constance.
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  #14  
Old 06-04-2012, 08:29 AM
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I just got back from Italy recently.

It was our trip number four to Lake Como, and first visit to Lake Garda. I wrote some impressions down, here they are. As mentioned, we drove the ENTIRE perimeter of Lake Garda one day. I can attest that it is much less white knuckle than Lake Como.

I wouldn't necessarily stay in Bellagio though unless you do plan to stay at Villa Serbelloni. Albergo Lenno is on the western side, quaint/beautiful/quiet tiny village, and has underground garage parking.

************
We just got home from Italy (trip report and photos forthcoming, still digging out) and now I can at least somewhat compare Lake Como to Lake Garda, although our time on Garda was pretty short (three nights) and only one day was sunny. One day POURED buckets and because it was a Monday we couldn't even indulge in visiting the modern art museum in Rovereto (which I hear is wonderful). We spent that rainy day driving the entire perimeter of the lake (the whole way), stopping only in Riva very briefly to walk along the shore (umbrella in hand) and then spent a few hours at Il Vittoriale, wandering the grounds.

My impression of Lake Garda is that it is quite built up (as is Lake Como) but that it has newer buildings than on Lake Como. Does this mean that it was fairly wild and undeveloped a century ago; it would seem so. Lake Como seems much more Italian to me and Lake Garda seemed somewhat more Teutonic (which makes sense given its history). Lake Garda had better wider roads for instance.

I get the sense of old money and old world grandeur (a Grand Tour stop) when I visit Lake Como... and Lake Garda seems more like an egalitarian vacation region by comparison (barring Il Vittoriale of course!). I also felt that Lake Garda is much more geared to outdoor pursuits - more infrastructure around hiking/biking/wind surfing/etc and Lake Como is geared more to strolling among stately villas, sitting outdoors and eating or sipping coffee, and seeing and being seen. Also due to this I felt that Lake Garda had a younger crowd - both for the outdoor pursuits as well as a lot of families on vacation. Lake Como seems to have more of a middle aged or older crowd.

These are generalizations of course as I actually saw more pleasure cyclists on Lake Como but that could well be due to the fact that we were there 5 nights and it was sunny and pleasant the whole time - so that isn't necessarily a fair comparison. And of course there were families as well - but it didn't seem as many as on Lake Garda.

We stayed in Malcesine on Lake Garda and visited Limone sul Garda one morning but didn't see much of it as our visit was devoted to watching the start of the Giro.

By contrast this was trip number four to Lake Como which means we are now clocking almost three weeks "on the ground time" at Lake Como.
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  #15  
Old 06-04-2012, 12:17 PM
gekisai29 gekisai29 is offline
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is driving/parking on western side of como better than eastern?
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  #16  
Old 06-04-2012, 01:04 PM
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is driving/parking on western side of como better than eastern?
I'm surprised by the amount of apprehension driving the Como>Bellagio or Como>Lenno roads. I've made these excursions on 5 different ED's and had one minor issue with a wild Fiat Punto and my driver side rear view mirror.

once in an e39 540
once in an e39 M5
once in an e46 330 vert
once in a Porsche 997
once in a f12 650 vert

The 997 and 650 are wide cars, but if you are conscious of where the sides of your car is relative to the road you won't have any trouble. I've never had any parking issues on either side of Lake Como or anywhere on Garda.

Dick
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Old 06-04-2012, 01:30 PM
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The apprehension relates to having a spiffy new car you don't want to bung up. Driving in a rental is much less worrisome.
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  #18  
Old 06-04-2012, 02:58 PM
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The apprehension relates to having a spiffy new car you don't want to bung up. Driving in a rental is much less worrisome.
That's a major factor alright. But I drove a rental from Como to Bellagio at night and really did not enjoy that drive. That road is really narrow. I drove south from Cernobbio on the west bank of Lake Como, in daylight, and found that road quite pleasant to drive. You could say the roads were "night and day" for me.

By the way I consider a 20% accident rate quite high even if the one incident is the loss of a mirror.

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Old 06-04-2012, 06:32 PM
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i suggest GHT- Grand Hotel Tremezzo- excellent hotel and very convinient location
Pricewise less expansive than Villa d Este and GHS, but still around 500-600 Euro/night in July/August
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Old 06-04-2012, 11:15 PM
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As usual, Beth and I are on the same page: Lago di Como, but not Bellagio. Stop there on a ferry trip - maybe even spend most of the day. But there are better places to stay. Among them: Cernobbio, Lenno, Menaggio, Varenna, Tremezzo. More flavorful, less costly, fewer people just like you trying to get a table for dinner. Spend a day riding the vaporetti, and hop off at the places listed, and then back on for the next one. Half the fun will be deciphering the boat schedule. Enjoy..
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  #21  
Old 06-05-2012, 03:09 AM
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Originally Posted by dkreidel View Post
I'm surprised by the amount of apprehension driving the Como>Bellagio or Como>Lenno roads. I've made these excursions on 5 different ED's and had one minor issue with a wild Fiat Punto and my driver side rear view mirror.

once in an e39 540
once in an e39 M5
once in an e46 330 vert
once in a Porsche 997
once in a f12 650 vert

The 997 and 650 are wide cars, but if you are conscious of where the sides of your car is relative to the road you won't have any trouble. I've never had any parking issues on either side of Lake Como or anywhere on Garda.

Dick
Funny story...I've driven to Bellagio twice. Once in a rental and another in a Ferrari F355 GTS I used to own (kept it in Munich). On this particular trip, I picked it up from the Ferrari dealer when I arrive from the airport - as it had just come from the paint shop to fix a foot long scratch I put into the car on the driver side parking in an underground garage from my last trip.

My wife and I pick up the car at the dealer early in the morning and headed straight to Lake Como. Wonderful drive over Splugen Pass to Bellagio. The late afternoon arrival time meant that there was a lot of traffic on that last bit from Como to Bellagio. Pretty white knuckle driving even for me. But we made it to the hotel Splendide. Perfect. Except when I tried to pull into their driveway at an angle, I put ANOTHER identical foot long scratch in the PASSENGER side of the Ferrari.

It would have been a perfect match for the newly repainted driver side scratch now gone. My wife thought it was funny and took pictures of my having a bit of a temper tantrum while the bell staff looked on. The Ferrari dealership thought it was funny too.
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Old 06-05-2012, 02:13 PM
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Another vote for Como. It seems most of the driving stress is related to Bellagio, we drove most of the Western side and had no problems. I would highly recommend hotel villa marie in Tremezzo. It has an underground garage, the rates are great and the newer rooms have an excellent view that overlooks the pool and lake. It's family run, they put out a good breakfast and even serve you drinks by the pool.

Then walk to the ferry and ride over to Bellagio. Also, don't forget to make a reservation at the island kitchen (locanda dell isola comacina), which is a very short and easy drive from Tremezzo. It was one of the highlights of our trip.

Good luck
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Old 06-05-2012, 02:22 PM
Nefilim Nefilim is offline
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It would have been a perfect match for the newly repainted driver side scratch now gone. My wife thought it was funny and took pictures of my having a bit of a temper tantrum while the bell staff looked on. The Ferrari dealership thought it was funny too.
so... where's the picture?
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Old 06-05-2012, 02:24 PM
Nefilim Nefilim is offline
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Thanks for all of the replies. I think I will go to Como. Anyone have suggestions on where to stay there?
yes, albergo lenno in the town of lenno. they have exceptional care free parking by european standards. just make sure to reserve ahead of time.

http://www.myeuropeandelivery.com/u/peter/log/16
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Old 06-05-2012, 02:50 PM
pawarrant pawarrant is offline
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I think the consensus is that I not stay in Bellagio. I will be researching and checking rates and parking availability of the many places you all have recommended. From what I have seen so far online, all of these places look amazing. I just got off the phone with Lufthansa, and booked my flights. (PIT-CLT-MUN September 9, MUN-CLT-PIT September 21). I was able to save $100 using the Lufthansa-BMW ED program, which I found out is no longer a two for one deal, but about 10% off the airfare. I was able to get the flights I wanted at a cheaper price than I was able to find anywhere online (apx. $1100 per person round trip). Now the hard part comes...booking the hotels for my first trip to Europe!
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