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E60 (2004 - 2010)
BMW 5-Series (E60 chassis) was first seen in the Unites States in the fall of 2003 with a 2004 Model Year designation. The E60 is now available as a 528i, 528xi, 535i, 535xi, 550i and a 535xi sports wagon! -- View the E60 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 07-12-2012, 09:49 PM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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HELP SICK 545I n62...misfire and smoke

Looking for ideas or suggestions, with todayís events I am at a total loss.

I have a 2005 545I 4.4 V8 N62.

Recently drove from California to Wisconsin. Car had a slight water leak that upon my arrival to Wisconsin, found it to be the water pump (OMG what were they thinking with the a/c belt design, and that one stupid bolt under the crank pulley). Changed the water pump, both belts, and the idler and tensioner pulleys due to noise and age.

Fired the car up and it ran like crap, wont idle unless the a/c is on, and started blowing smoke out the exhaust after sitting and idling(I say this is a new issue that started with the water pump replacement, while on my trip I stopped in Kansas to pick up my girlfriend and at one point, left the car in a mall parking lot idling for 6 hours with not a single issue, and this was due to my four legged daughter being left in the car in 90deg weather, yes, I love my dog more than my car), but only after starting to drive away, not the instant you start to accelerate (this is important because everyone is telling me itís the valve guides, itís not), also there is a whistle like a vacuum leak which I canít seem to find, shocking as these engines donít produce engine vacuum like a standard engine, hence the need for a vacuum pump.

First round of repairs, changed the CCV valves, as to my knowledge this is the only thing that would allow oil to get into the intake manifold (which I have determined by round two repair, there was a TON of oil in the manifold, and Iím sure there still is some, ant ideas on how to take apart the intake and clean it). The ccv valves on my car came with the vacuum nipple on them that attaches to a hose that tees into the air intake hose right in from of the throttle body. One of the valve caps for the ccv valve broke during the repair, and the replacement caps that come in the kit do not have this vacuum nipple on them, is it important, is it needed, how can you eliminate these lines and cap off the fittings, as I have been told by one dealer (who I trust, but just donít feel Iím getting the right answer this time).

Second round of repairs, pulled the intake to determine if the whistle was cause by a leaking air injection hose under the intake. Upon removal of the intake, found a broken connector for the air injection hose, most likely from when I put the water pump on I reinstalled the retaining clamp incorrectly and it pulled on the old brittle connection and broke it. Noticed large amounts of oil running out of the intake manifold ports upon removal. Did a large amount of research on the CCV valves to no avail, still donít know what to do. So I took on of the new nipple less caps, opened up the hole a little and installed a nipple and super glued it into place. Parts replaced, intake manifold gasket, throttle body gasket, air injection hose, both the piece running under the intake and the flexible part going to the air pump itself, upper and lower injector o rings, new design ccv vent hoses to connect the valve covers to the ports on the intake. Also order but not yet installed are new plugs and the coils. I have had multiple issues over the years with misfires, and have read countless forums about the coil problem, and the dealer has replaced 4 for the coils about 100k miles ago, so Iím just biting the bullet and doing it. Got everything buttoned back up today, fired up the car, and poof....runs like crap and still smokes, still whistles. The most interesting thing is, upon COLD start up, it runs fine, itís like once it reaches operating temperature something in the electronics switches, and the whistle starts and the rough idle and the SES light appears and sets codes P0300-P0308....all for misfires on the cylinders

The reason I say itís not the valve guides, I had the intake off for 5 days while waiting for the parts to arrive, and used a solvent to clean the intake ports and the tops of the valves as I wanted to make sure, that there was no oil leaking down the valve stems. There was NOTHING on the upper part of the valves, barely even any residue, and none of the intake deposits that plagued BMWs of years past.
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  #2  
Old 07-13-2012, 09:31 AM
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borderchris borderchris is offline
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Did you transplant the old thermostat? If the connection or sensors are aged, they can cause horrible run-issues, due to so much of the car's systems being based on thermostat position and temp. If so, replace it, and also make sure to clear all adaptatons and codes in the car- If you don't have access to an INPA program, pay an indy to do it.
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  #3  
Old 07-13-2012, 09:42 AM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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Thermostat was replaced a few months ago, as i was getting the ses for that, which with the change and a clear of the codes that problem was fixed.
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  #4  
Old 07-13-2012, 11:12 AM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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so I'm back to playing around with stuff.....disconnecting and what not.....pulled off the ccv valve cover and started the motor, what i thought was my intake leak whistle sound, turns out to be the ccv valve......removed the valve while the engine was running and pulled the spring located under the valve, whistle went away and the engine idled....PERFECT.....put the spring back in and it runs like crap and whistles, put in one of the original valves that was still ok, and the same condition exists.....WTH?????
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  #5  
Old 07-13-2012, 07:29 PM
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dolfan13 dolfan13 is offline
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Sounds like you still have a major vacuum leak.Those small hoses to the caps aren't important as the big ones under .From what I've read doing away with these smaller hoses was an update.I just capped them off 10k ago.Taking the spring out should cutoff vacuum from intake?Maybe bad oil fill cap or dipstick o-ring?

Last edited by dolfan13; 07-13-2012 at 07:37 PM.
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  #6  
Old 07-16-2012, 07:17 PM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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Installed another set of ccv valves today, along with new plugs and coils (plugs because i figured they would be junk with all the oil going through the motor, and coils because this car has had a mysterious gremlin with a misfire code every 6 months or so and a buddy at a dealership is hooking me up on parts right now, so what the heck, couldn't hurt). Again, car fires up and runs perfect when cold, then it starts to run horrible and the whistle appears, going to take a stop watch and time it tonight when cold, tomorrow in the am and tomorrow night, and see if the issue appears at the same or relatively the same time during warm up, like a system comes on line and that causes the problem.

Any idea where to look for a vacuum leak on this motor, as there are very few places it could be, both vent hoses are the new insulated style, and are firmly in place. The return line which attaches to the intake next to the throttle body is also firmly in place. When the air injection hose was replaced, the intake manifold gasket was replaced. the only other area it could be is in the valve covers, yet i have gone over them with a stethoscope and cant hear any sucking sound, and have sprayed bottles of carb spray over the intake and fittings and valve covers and not noticeable change, yet when you close the vacuum off to either valve cover by removing the spring under the ccv valve, the idle quality improves, and again, only codes being set are misfires on all 8 cylinders

Parts replaced so far.

Water pump and radiator hoses along with temp sensor in pump housing and lower rad hose, and degrease the engine, this is when all the problems started

Replaced the air injection hose assembly that runs under the intake manifold, clip broken on pass side valve
Replaced soft line from y hose to secondary air pump, precaution.
Replaced secondary air pump filter.

Replaced ccv valves TWICE.
Replaced both vent hoses to intake manifold.
Replaced upper and lower injector o-rings
Replaced throttle body gasket.
Replaced intake manifold gaskets.
Replaced Ign Coils and Plugs
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  #7  
Old 07-17-2012, 06:16 AM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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Did a test today, and started it cold and watched the temp, and time it took from a cold start to see the issue arise, granted not really cold out, 86 ambient, but it took 9 mins from start at only idle for rough idle to begin and the exact temp was 70c or 158f....will test again tomorrow and see if same results
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  #8  
Old 07-17-2012, 09:17 AM
pcy pcy is offline
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After starting the engine, until the engine warms up to operating temp, engine stays in open-loop mode. Once the engine reaches operating temp, engine goes in to closed-loop mode. In closed loop mode, data from various sensors like O2 sensors are used to regulate appropriate air/fuel mix ratio. During your 'degreasing of engine', is it possible the O2 sensors are messed up?
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  #9  
Old 07-17-2012, 09:22 AM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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im sure its entirely possible, but the only codes that have ever been set since this issue started is p0300-p0308, which are cylinder misfire codes, and as advanced as this engine is, you'd think it would throw a code. It seems like its vacuum related, but i cant figure out where, because there is a whisteling sound comeing from the upper engine area, but i have gone over it with carb spary, and nothing, and taking a hose and listened for the leak and nothing, but if i manually close the ccv valve on either side of the engine it smooths out, and the whistle goes away.
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  #10  
Old 07-17-2012, 10:40 AM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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second test, right at 70deg c water temp is when IT happens, what ever transitions in the motor, or solenoid switches and it starts to whislte and run like crap.
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  #11  
Old 07-17-2012, 11:47 AM
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borderchris borderchris is offline
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I'm starting to think that you may want to look at the vacuum pump.
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  #12  
Old 07-17-2012, 11:49 AM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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Vacuum pump only connects to the brake booster and either the blend doors for the ac or somewhere else in the chassis.....but other than it is powered by the motor, it the pump itself, doesnt provide vacuum to the motor
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  #13  
Old 07-17-2012, 11:51 AM
douglassimi douglassimi is offline
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Im starting to think it might be something back into the intake, as if i block off either ccv valve the problem goes away, so its not something that can have the finger pointed at one valve cover or another, when then points to somewhere from the heads back to the maf sensor....ill be pulling the intake off again on thursday and seeing whats going on, need to take a mental break, this is really starting to mess with my head
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  #14  
Old 08-01-2012, 01:09 AM
Damon54 Damon54 is offline
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Douglassimi,


Everything I have found regarding the 2 styles o CCV covers says that the newer non male cover works fine, just plug the line that used to connect to the old male plumbed cover. Your solution should also be working fine.

Found this old N62 info & hoped it might help.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/arc.../t-543798.html

Also good:
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...241&highlight=

Last edited by Damon54; 08-01-2012 at 01:28 AM.
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