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E36 (1991 - 1999)
The E36 chassis 3-Series BMW was a huge hit among driving enthusiasts from the first moment the car hit the pavement. The E36 won numerous awards over the years it was produced and is still a favorite of many BMW enthusiasts to this day! -- View the E36 Wiki

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  #26  
Old 08-14-2012, 07:12 PM
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I think the second part...
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  #27  
Old 08-14-2012, 07:25 PM
bigugly fab bigugly fab is offline
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put the cap on your dresser and go drive it for a day or two. see if it changes the issue.



thats the most simplistic way i can explain it lol
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  #28  
Old 08-14-2012, 07:33 PM
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oh.


what would that diagnose though?
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  #29  
Old 08-14-2012, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dino1394 View Post
Lol I just drove it with the cap off nothing changed


What I understood was.

Take gas cap off, start car, drive it

When I 1st took the cap off there was pressure


unless you mean leave cap on, drive car , wait till i know the problem exposes itself then take off gas cap and see if theres pressure?
when you drive your car, and have a return line to the fuel tank, then the returning fuel tends to warm up the fuel in the tank.

this is where pressure builds up, as fuel likes to evaporate. fuel vapors compress, fuel liquid does not.

i fail to see how the pressure build up in the tank relates to a hard start when hot, unless it's vapor lock, but then i have never actually come across a case of this.

in 15 years of wrenching.

but i doubt this is the case since apparently the condition still presents when the fuel cap is not present.

i'm still feeling a crank sensor, or some other major input that poops out at a specific temp.

did you ohm out the crank sensor when it is hot?? this is the best time to do it (i know, it's *hot*...)

especially since this is when it presents.

now if you had a power graphing meter, you could hook it to the crank sensor, 'see' the signal, and compare it to the signal (or lack thereof) wen it gets hot.


can you force replicate this condition without actually driving?? i'm thinking if you were to have said meter hooked up when cold, allow it to get to temp, shut it off and wait, keeping the meter hooked, you could then simply see the crank sensor signal yeah or nay and either rule it out or confirm it as the culprit.


or you could play musical parts.





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  #30  
Old 08-14-2012, 07:42 PM
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yeah the 638ohm was taken while it was hot and giving the not start condition
based off what ive read and from experience anything under 500ohms it doesnt work and the dme wont allow the engine to start
( my good the OFH was not my friend at that moment)
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  #31  
Old 08-15-2012, 07:34 AM
bigugly fab bigugly fab is offline
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Drivinfaster hit it on the head. I was seeing if fuel tank pressure was forcing vapors into the engine, causing it to "flood".....


I have seen vapor lock, tank pressure and charcoal canisters force fuel/vapors into the intake and create a long crank due to excessive fuel during start up.



Also, does this have the original style m52 crank sensor, or the updated (with harness) m54 crank sensor?
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  #32  
Old 08-15-2012, 09:08 AM
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nope m50 crank sensor ( i have a m50tu)


How would one know if the charcoal canister is junk?
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  #33  
Old 08-15-2012, 09:27 AM
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by smell I think...

From what I read a while go (iirc), you would be able to smell gas outside the car, but not find any leaks.

I think they can become plugged too. So, in theory- if driving with the gas cap off works, one might be able to think the charcoal canister is bad?
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  #34  
Old 08-19-2012, 10:49 AM
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Ok went to go remove the fpr off the other car but theres no bolt or anything and google and the bentley are no help on to remove the thing
all i can do is turn the regulator I didnt try pulling or prying it cause i didnt want to break the fuel rail


how does it come off?
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  #35  
Old 08-19-2012, 11:15 AM
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BMWfans.info shows there's a clamp that holds it in place on the fuel rail.

Edit - crap the site is blocking the link. Here's the diagram from bmwfans.info

Edit 2 - The M52 FPR has a different mount and there's a clamp spring that holds it in place.....
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Last edited by dc_wright; 08-19-2012 at 11:24 AM. Reason: Bad link
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  #36  
Old 08-19-2012, 11:39 AM
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thats weird the fuel rail from the parts car only has 6 , and that almost complete circle shaped clamp looking thing

but yet my car has everything in the diagram


Maybe messing with the wrong thing? , the parts car is a 94
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Last edited by BMRfanatic; 08-19-2012 at 11:42 AM.
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  #37  
Old 08-19-2012, 11:50 AM
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Items 7, 8, and 9 will be hidden from view until you remove the clamp. If they're missing maybe someone already did a swap out on the FPR that's in the parts car and didn't bother to replace any of the seals?
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  #38  
Old 08-19-2012, 12:01 PM
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Heres what was there

As you can see I tried prying the fpr
but no luck

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Bimmer App
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  #39  
Old 08-19-2012, 12:19 PM
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Maybe it's corroded in place? Try some PB Blaster and a strap wrench?
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  #40  
Old 08-19-2012, 01:39 PM
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You aren't trying to pry the center part out of the FPR are you? The entire FPR comes out of the fuel rail. It's not supposed to come apart where that snap ring was. It's just stuck in the rail.

Never mind....that type DOES come apart. The cup is part of the fuel rail. Never seen one like that before.
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Last edited by hornhospital; 08-19-2012 at 01:41 PM.
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  #41  
Old 08-21-2012, 05:24 PM
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heres a vid I took while testing fuel pressure



First fuel pump was jumped at the relay
Then I put the relay back in and started the car


I gotta watch the other video I found But I guess the FPR isnt working?
What you guys think?


Edit: Fuel pressure is about 7 PSI over what it should be (vid says it should be about 50-51 but that may be high cause of the fuel filter I guess (replaced last summer) However the video is from a 95 with a blue top. I have a white top with the vacuum line going into the second gas tank


50 PSI idle which is normal

Pressure goes up and down When blipping the throttle which seems normal

so that means the FPR is working


HOWEVER i noticed that in his vid he still gets pressure after he shuts the pump off. there is no pressure at all when my pump is off

but yet my pump is pushing enough pressure.. (100psi when i kinked the line)


And there are no fuel line leaks so only 2 causes left is the check valve on the pump or leaky injectors from what he says unno:
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Last edited by BMRfanatic; 08-21-2012 at 05:43 PM.
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  #42  
Old 08-21-2012, 05:50 PM
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Ok after what was said at the end of the vid. Im Leaning towards a bad check valve on the pump
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  #43  
Old 08-21-2012, 11:56 PM
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Those videos were INVALUABLE when troubleshooting a hard start issue on my M3. Ended up that the check valve in my fuel pump broke. Got that kit with the new check valve and solved the problem immediately.
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  #44  
Old 08-27-2012, 01:24 PM
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Any luck yet?!?!
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  #45  
Old 08-27-2012, 05:25 PM
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nah, Havent gotten the check valve yet
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  #46  
Old 09-09-2012, 04:39 PM
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you never notice how ugly something is until you get rid of it
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That's what my first wife said.
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  #47  
Old 09-09-2012, 06:04 PM
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Sorry my bad college move craziness


I switched out my fuel pump with the one from my parts car and all starting issues are gone


I still do believe it was the check valve since my pump was putting the right amount of pressure and the FPR was doing its job

It was just easier this way since i didnt have to drive to the dealer to order the part then go back to get it cause I had a confirmed new pump sitting in a gas tank
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  #48  
Old 09-09-2012, 06:07 PM
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that is good to hear. cause teh college ladies don't want to hear about a 'no start' while out on teh townz...




df
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  #49  
Old 09-09-2012, 06:22 PM
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that is good to hear. cause teh college ladies don't want to hear about a 'no start' while out on teh townz...




df


yeah i had a lady friend get nervous when i was continuously cranking my car after the movies lol
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  #50  
Old 10-17-2012, 11:12 AM
jwrape jwrape is offline
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I have this same issue with my Z3 with a S52 engine. Where is the Fuel Pump Check valve located? Picture???
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