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  #1  
Old 09-24-2012, 06:11 PM
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CycleFesters, Any Pinarello Horror Stories?

I've heard a few stories related to cracked frames, warranties, and customer service.

I know one guy who rides a Dogma, and so far he's good.

My legs aren't worth that frame, but I could rationalize a Paris.

My Madone is getting rather old.
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Ajax View Post
I've heard a few stories related to cracked frames, warranties, and customer service.

I know one guy who rides a Dogma, and so far he's good.

My legs aren't worth that frame, but I could rationalize a Paris.

My Madone is getting rather old.
That's code for what, and who is in your cell?
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:17 PM
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That's code for what, and who is in your cell?
Screw secession, the Québécois are invading the rest of Canada....UN sends in Detroit area Girl Scouts to restore The Peace.
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Old 09-24-2012, 10:02 PM
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Screw secession, the Québécois are invading the rest of Canada....UN sends in Detroit area Girl Scouts to restore The Peace.
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  #5  
Old 09-25-2012, 04:09 AM
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My shop sold Pinarello for about 10 years and I've seen some warranty horror stories. Other than the original magnesium Dogma, I wouldn't say they have a particularly high failure rate. The problem is they only have a two year warranty and the distributor is pretty strict about that. If you can afford a new Paris every four years then go for it, they're a great ride. If you want a longer life than that from your frame, then skip it.
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Old 09-25-2012, 07:24 AM
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I've had 4 Pins over the last 25 years. Original was an 1986 Treviso steel frame. I am now riding a 4 year old FP5 and love it. The frame is very stable at speed and I do not find it uncomfortable on long rides.

I know of several guys who ride Paris and Dogma2 frames. They ride much harder than I do and have had no issues with frame damage. My one friend who is on his 3rd Colnago CX frame, the previous two cracked. Thats the luck of the draw sometimes.

For parts and accessories, I have been dealing with Pinarello's factory store direct on line or by email and they are top notch. PM me if you want more details on the store contacts.
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  #7  
Old 09-25-2012, 07:35 AM
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At the price and projected life of a carbon frame, I personally have a hard time rationalizing a bike like that if I'm cycling for enjoyment and fitness. I've been on too many rallies with poor/unknown roads and you're bound to hit a pothole of sorts eventually. A carbon frame would have me worried about cracking every time I hit one of those.

For the hobby/amateur cyclist, I figure the weight savings of a carbon frame translate into hardly anything as far as real time goes, no?

(That being said, I looked at the Paris and it sure is a puuuurdy bike. )
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Old 09-25-2012, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by cwinter View Post
At the price and projected life of a carbon frame, I personally have a hard time rationalizing a bike like that if I'm cycling for enjoyment and fitness. I've been on too many rallies with poor/unknown roads and you're bound to hit a pothole of sorts eventually. A carbon frame would have me worried about cracking every time I hit one of those.

For the hobby/amateur cyclist, I figure the weight savings of a carbon frame translate into hardly anything as far as real time goes, no?

(That being said, I looked at the Paris and it sure is a puuuurdy bike. )
Even the lightest of Carbon Fiber frames don't "just break" from hitting holes, curbs or even the occasional criterium crash. Most failures I've seen are do to manufacturing defects or impacts hard enough that they would have damaged a metal frame also.

I personally ride a Cervelo R5. The frame weighs a claimed 850 grams. I'm not a big guy, but I ride A LOT of miles, pretty aggressively, and so far, no damage at all. Quality of construction is everything.

As to "the projected life of a carbon frame" carbon fiber does not corrode, does not fatigue under bicycle type loads, and there is a large number of exceedingly light frames which come with a lifetime warranty. What more do you want ?

Will an expensive, lightweight frame make you faster ? Maybe...maybe not. But for a lot of riders, it's simply about having the coolest toy they can afford. Nothing wrong with that.
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  #9  
Old 09-25-2012, 10:59 AM
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Thanks for the info.

My Madone is a 2006 5.2SL carbon with a LOT of miles on it. Aside from the weight advantage, carbon is a lot more comfortable than aluminum.

Last edited by Ajax; 09-25-2012 at 11:03 AM.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:19 AM
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Thanks for the info.

My Madone is a 2006 5.2SL carbon with a LOT of miles on it. Aside from the weight advantage, carbon is a lot more comfortable than aluminum.
What he said.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by jonathan2263 View Post
Even the lightest of Carbon Fiber frames don't "just break" from hitting holes, curbs or even the occasional criterium crash. Most failures I've seen are do to manufacturing defects or impacts hard enough that they would have damaged a metal frame also.

I personally ride a Cervelo R5. The frame weighs a claimed 850 grams. I'm not a big guy, but I ride A LOT of miles, pretty aggressively, and so far, no damage at all. Quality of construction is everything.

As to "the projected life of a carbon frame" carbon fiber does not corrode, does not fatigue under bicycle type loads, and there is a large number of exceedingly light frames which come with a lifetime warranty. What more do you want ?

Will an expensive, lightweight frame make you faster ? Maybe...maybe not. But for a lot of riders, it's simply about having the coolest toy they can afford. Nothing wrong with that.
+1

My boyfriend rides a lot & very hard. He has the Cervelo R3 frame and says its the best frame he's ever ridden on. His frame has a lifetime warranty.
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  #12  
Old 09-25-2012, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ajax View Post
I've heard a few stories related to cracked frames, warranties, and customer service.

I know one guy who rides a Dogma, and so far he's good.

My legs aren't worth that frame, but I could rationalize a Paris.

My Madone is getting rather old.
I was looking to get a new road bike, thinking pinerallo. I have a LOOK road (along w a couple Cannondales and QuintinaRoo tri bike)

Jonathan would know the answer to your question better than I.

Why not just get a new Madone?
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  #13  
Old 09-25-2012, 01:23 PM
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I was looking to get a new road bike, thinking pinerallo. I have a LOOK road (along w a couple Cannondales and QuintinaRoo tri bike)

Jonathan would know the answer to your question better than I.

Why not just get a new Madone?
Because lifes too short to ride a Trek.
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Old 09-25-2012, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan2263 View Post
Even the lightest of Carbon Fiber frames don't "just break" from hitting holes, curbs or even the occasional criterium crash. Most failures I've seen are do to manufacturing defects or impacts hard enough that they would have damaged a metal frame also.

I personally ride a Cervelo R5. The frame weighs a claimed 850 grams. I'm not a big guy, but I ride A LOT of miles, pretty aggressively, and so far, no damage at all. Quality of construction is everything.

As to "the projected life of a carbon frame" carbon fiber does not corrode, does not fatigue under bicycle type loads, and there is a large number of exceedingly light frames which come with a lifetime warranty. What more do you want ?

Will an expensive, lightweight frame make you faster ? Maybe...maybe not. But for a lot of riders, it's simply about having the coolest toy they can afford. Nothing wrong with that.
Fair enough, but I still can't justify the price.

Even entry-level alu bikes come with carbon forks that usually give enough comfort. That being said, I have yet to ride a carbon frame, so I also don't know what I'm missing. Unless price comes down I doubt I'll ever own one.

That R5 looks mighty nice, by the way. $5,000 for the frame to start with though? Whew!
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  #15  
Old 09-25-2012, 02:00 PM
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Fair enough, but I still can't justify the price.

Even entry-level alu bikes come with carbon forks that usually give enough comfort. That being said, I have yet to ride a carbon frame, so I also don't know what I'm missing. Unless price comes down I doubt I'll ever own one.

That R5 looks mighty nice, by the way. $5,000 for the frame to start with though? Whew!
Yeah, good bikes are pretty pricey, but I run a bike shop, so, I've got connections.
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Old 09-25-2012, 03:07 PM
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Yeah, good bikes are pretty pricey, but I run a bike shop, so, I've got connections.
From your experience, how would going from an entry level alu bike to a bike like the R5 feel? What would I gain?

I'm curious because I just did an incremental update. A huge update. I rode my old old Trek 850 Multitrek for a long time until I was ready to invest in a road bike. The Trek was 15 years old, needed new wheels, and had a steel frame (light steel it claimed, lol).

I bought a Specialized Secteur Triple and it was a HUGE upgrade. For one thing, the geometry of the road bike is much different and helps me take advantage of good, straight road to hit a good average. Uphill is easier because the bike is lighter. Going against wind is a bit easier because the seating position changed.

In short, I spend relatively little money as bikes go ($850) and felt like I really got a much much better bike. 15 years of technology improvements of course will do that.

Do you think if I rode a more expensive carbon bike costing, say $5,000 - $7,000, for 200-300 miles I'd feel the same way? Most days I hit about a 14-15 mph average and do around 30-50 miles. If I ever am able to find more time to ride I'll likely be back in the 60 mile category again, but there just never is enough time. I do about 1,000 miles a year.
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  #17  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:11 PM
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Why not just get a new Madone?
That was my initial plan, but just for grins I thought I would check on some other bikes too. I don't see myself on a Cervelo, but who knows.

For all the crap Trek gets, with the customization options and quality, Madones aren't bad bikes at all.
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Old 09-25-2012, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by cwinter View Post
Do you think if I rode a more expensive carbon bike costing, say $5,000 - $7,000, for 200-300 miles I'd feel the same way? Most days I hit about a 14-15 mph average and do around 30-50 miles. If I ever am able to find more time to ride I'll likely be back in the 60 mile category again, but there just never is enough time. I do about 1,000 miles a year.
If all you ride is 1,000 miles per year, then there is no reason to spend that sort of money.

If you're doing it every 2-3 months, it's a whole other story.
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Old 09-26-2012, 04:01 AM
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That was my initial plan, but just for grins I thought I would check on some other bikes too. I don't see myself on a Cervelo, but who knows.

For all the crap Trek gets, with the customization options and quality, Madones aren't bad bikes at all.
I looked at the project one, bc of the color customization options!

Cervelo..for a while it seemed like every other person was on a p3 w zipp wheels. It was almost like a joke.

Going to so ironman Australia in June, but I first signed up for ironman France. When I was planning on France I was thinking about getting a new road bike, was looking at pinerallo. Then I thought about getting another LOOK. I really love that bike.
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:24 AM
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Originally Posted by cwinter View Post
From your experience, how would going from an entry level alu bike to a bike like the R5 feel? What would I gain?

I'm curious because I just did an incremental update. A huge update. I rode my old old Trek 850 Multitrek for a long time until I was ready to invest in a road bike. The Trek was 15 years old, needed new wheels, and had a steel frame (light steel it claimed, lol).

I bought a Specialized Secteur Triple and it was a HUGE upgrade. For one thing, the geometry of the road bike is much different and helps me take advantage of good, straight road to hit a good average. Uphill is easier because the bike is lighter. Going against wind is a bit easier because the seating position changed.

In short, I spend relatively little money as bikes go ($850) and felt like I really got a much much better bike. 15 years of technology improvements of course will do that.

Do you think if I rode a more expensive carbon bike costing, say $5,000 - $7,000, for 200-300 miles I'd feel the same way? Most days I hit about a 14-15 mph average and do around 30-50 miles. If I ever am able to find more time to ride I'll likely be back in the 60 mile category again, but there just never is enough time. I do about 1,000 miles a year.
There are several very nice carbon fiber bikes in the $2000-$2500 range. You would feel a much larger difference going from your Secteur to one of those (Bianchi Sempre for example) than you would going from that point to $7000. You reach a point of diminishing returns and small improvements start to cost more.

I tell my customers, that as you spend more, the frameset aside, the big thing you're buying is durability of components. If you're like me, and ride over 320 days a year, it's worth spending for Dura-Ace. If you ride a few times a week when the weather is nice, 105 will last you a very long time.

You will feel a big difference going from an inexpensive aluminum frame to a good carbon fiber frame. The carbon fiber should be laterally and torsionally stiffer, so the bottom of the frame will flex less. That means more of your effort goes into forward motion
And the bike will feel like it climbs and accelerates with less effort. Also, torsionally stiffer means less flex in the front end, so the bike will not only steer better, it will also stop better.

Finally, carbon fiber is the only material that can be made to behave differently depending on how it's "layed up." (Isotopic vs anisotropic) that means that even though it may be stiffer than a metal frame, it should also be more vertically compliant. Therefore, on long rides, it won't beat you up.

So in review, a carbon fiber frame should be lighter, more efficient, and more comfortable to ride than a metal frame. (Any metal) If you've never ridden a carbon frame, and can borrow one from a friend that fits you, or test ride one at a local bike shop, you should feel an immediate and large difference between it and your bike.

And the best part is all that doesn't cost $7000 dollars. If you go into a reputable local bike shop and ask to look at carbon fiber road bikes with Shimano 105 components, you should be able to get out the door for under $2500.
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Old 09-26-2012, 06:21 AM
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Wouldn't tire selection, especially a wide tire if it fits, combined with a lower pressure contribute to a smoother ride?
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by jonathan2263 View Post
There are several very nice carbon fiber bikes in the $2000-$2500 range. You would feel a much larger difference going from your Secteur to one of those (Bianchi Sempre for example) than you would going from that point to $7000. You reach a point of diminishing returns and small improvements start to cost more.

I tell my customers, that as you spend more, the frameset aside, the big thing you're buying is durability of components. If you're like me, and ride over 320 days a year, it's worth spending for Dura-Ace. If you ride a few times a week when the weather is nice, 105 will last you a very long time.

You will feel a big difference going from an inexpensive aluminum frame to a good carbon fiber frame. The carbon fiber should be laterally and torsionally stiffer, so the bottom of the frame will flex less. That means more of your effort goes into forward motion
And the bike will feel like it climbs and accelerates with less effort. Also, torsionally stiffer means less flex in the front end, so the bike will not only steer better, it will also stop better.

Finally, carbon fiber is the only material that can be made to behave differently depending on how it's "layed up." (Isotopic vs anisotropic) that means that even though it may be stiffer than a metal frame, it should also be more vertically compliant. Therefore, on long rides, it won't beat you up.

So in review, a carbon fiber frame should be lighter, more efficient, and more comfortable to ride than a metal frame. (Any metal) If you've never ridden a carbon frame, and can borrow one from a friend that fits you, or test ride one at a local bike shop, you should feel an immediate and large difference between it and your bike.

And the best part is all that doesn't cost $7000 dollars. If you go into a reputable local bike shop and ask to look at carbon fiber road bikes with Shimano 105 components, you should be able to get out the door for under $2500.
Thanks, great info!
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  #23  
Old 09-26-2012, 09:23 AM
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Wouldn't tire selection, especially a wide tire if it fits, combined with a lower pressure contribute to a smoother ride?
Yes. But if you can gain ride comfort through vertical compliance, you don't need to sacrifice rolling resistance.
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:44 PM
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Yes. But if you can gain ride comfort through vertical compliance, you don't need to sacrifice rolling resistance.
Also, yes, but if you start with a frame that's already more comfortable, and then ad a wider tire, you'll be even that much more comfortable.
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